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Tough loss for the Eagles

Game was not decided by the officials. It was a clear hold as the defender knew he was in trouble and even admitted the hold. If he does not grab him it may be a td. Overall it was actually one of the better officiated games of the playoffs.

The only negative of this game was the field conditions which were pathetic and killed both defenses.
It was clearly a controversial call. There are tons of articles discussing that very point. You may think differently but obviously millions upon millions think it was controversial and it absolutely ended a very exciting high scoring game there at that point.
 
It was clearly a controversial call. There are tons of articles discussing that very point. You may think differently but obviously millions upon millions think it was controversial and it absolutely ended a very exciting high scoring game there at that point.
Agreed. Certainly, it was controversial. But, IMHO, within the realm of understanding. It wasn't a missed or bad call, it is just a call that isn't always made. A lot comes down to the notion of a) should refs loosen up and make less calls late in the game or b) should they call the game the same way from kickoff to conclusion. I like consistency and expect to make the refs call the game as they see it all the way through.
 
Agreed. Certainly, it was controversial. But, IMHO, within the realm of understanding. It wasn't a missed or bad call, it is just a call that isn't always made. A lot comes down to the notion of a) should refs loosen up and make less calls late in the game or b) should they call the game the same way from kickoff to conclusion. I like consistency and expect to make the refs call the game as they see it all the way through.
To me it boils down to a ticky tack call that often is not made and it absolutely ended an otherwise very exciting shootout of a Super Bowl. It's just much less satisfying seeing a great game like that with so much riding on the outcome and the refs decided the outcome at that point.
 
To me it boils down to a ticky tack call that often is not made and it absolutely ended an otherwise very exciting shootout of a Super Bowl. It's just much less satisfying seeing a great game like that with so much riding on the outcome and the refs decided the outcome at that point.
On the other hand, you don't want to see a game marred because DBs know they can hold late in the game which results in killing the offense's passing game. At some point, you have to throw a flag. My opinion is that refs should be consistent.

I also will reiterate that the TV replays missed the real view when the DB pulled the shirt of the WR after he reversed his field in the "dig" route. The TV replay showed an angle that missed that tug and commented the call was later in the play when the DB put his arm around the receiver.
 
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To me it boils down to a ticky tack call that often is not made and it absolutely ended an otherwise very exciting shootout of a Super Bowl. It's just much less satisfying seeing a great game like that with so much riding on the outcome and the refs decided the outcome at that point.
When the Ref sees the jersey stretch away from the body it is almost always called. The problem was Olsen going on and on about the left hand on the waist. The penalty occurred before that happened.

The refs not calling penalties control the outcome just as much if not more than calling a penalty. Think back to the Saints v Rams game to go to the Super Bowl. No call and the Saints stay home the Rams go to the Super Bowl. I know you will say that was an obvious call but the point remains the same.
 
On the other hand, you don't want to see a game marred because DBs know they can hold late in the game which results in killing the offense's passing game. At some point, you have to throw a flag. My opinion is that refs should be consistent.

I also will reiterate that the TV replays missed the real view when the DB pulled the shirt of the WR after he reversed his field in the "dig" route. The TV replay showed an angle that missed that tug and commented the call was later in the play when the DB put his arm around the receiver.
The NFL should just be a flag football league. So many joke rules.
 
The NFL should just be a flag football league. So many joke rules.
I understand the frustration. We've seen a ton of key games be substantially affected by bad or missed calls, especially at PSU. The problem with football is that the arbitrary nature of sports makes a single-game elimination a problem. In baseball, hockey and basketball, you've got seven-game series. In football, you can't play best of three. So a bad bounce (Hurts fumble), a key injury (Mahomes) or a controversial call changes the game. In fact, this last SB had the two best teams but my Bills friends will argue that a key injury took the guts out of the team and they played like crap in every game after. My Bengals friends still rail at a key non-call for blocking in the back on the punt return that sealed the game for the Chiefs and a bonehead roughing penalty on a really good player who isn't often penalized (although nobody is upset about the call itself).
 
To me it boils down to a ticky tack call that often is not made and it absolutely ended an otherwise very exciting shootout of a Super Bowl. It's just much less satisfying seeing a great game like that with so much riding on the outcome and the refs decided the outcome at that point.
No the Eagles lost the game by blowing a 10 point half time lead, failing to prevent the Chiefs from scoring on any possession in the second half and giving up 2 TDS on short passes on the same play on each side of the field where no DB was in the same zip code as the receiver. Once was bad enough but twice is inexcusable. Bradberry admitted he held the WR. Your argument is what that the refs wouldn’t be deciding the game if they don’t call the penalty there? Eagles got some favorable calls such as the Sanders non-fumble (which I thought was correct) and the Goddert catch.
 
Eagles were a talented team but they benefited from one of the easiest paths to the Super Bowl in NFL history.

Who was their marquee win against this year? They beat San Fran with no QB, Dallas with their backup QB. Giants?
Well, they sure played the best team in football tough, for not having played anyone of quality. And had every opportunity to win.
 
When the Ref sees the jersey stretch away from the body it is almost always called. The problem was Olsen going on and on about the left hand on the waist. The penalty occurred before that happened.

The refs not calling penalties control the outcome just as much if not more than calling a penalty. Think back to the Saints v Rams game to go to the Super Bowl. No call and the Saints stay home the Rams go to the Super Bowl. I know you will say that was an obvious call but the point remains the same.
Not sure that is a TD without the slight hold. I liken it to a hand check in bball that is called as the guy is drivng to hoop. Without it, does Ju Ju get wide open? Would there have been any safety help? No one knows how that would have played out. Olsen saw the whole play. He thought it was ticky tack and unnecessary for what that is worth. On your consistency point, I don't think they were. This call came out of the blue. Letter of the law call, yes, but letter of the law calls are not always or probably not even made 50% of the time. Then you add in the situation and you get this huge controversy.

With all that said, what lost the game for the Eagles was; 1) Hurts fumble changed momentum. I think without that it could have been 31-7 Eagles at half. Right before that play I remember thinking that I really did not want the Eagles to score because that could signal blowout city and a boring game. I wanted the Eagles but a close game also so I am not a huge Eagles fan I guess; 2) The horrid defense of the Eagles in the second half. No pass rush and weak red zone D. Troy Aikman on the Dan Patrick show said the two plays that KC ran to free up the WR were really standard in the red zone. Nothing genius about it. His point, a well coached D would have been ready for the fake drag then pivot back move at least the second time for crying out loud.
 
On the other hand, you don't want to see a game marred because DBs know they can hold late in the game which results in killing the offense's passing game. At some point, you have to throw a flag. My opinion is that refs should be consistent.

I also will reiterate that the TV replays missed the real view when the DB pulled the shirt of the WR after he reversed his field in the "dig" route. The TV replay showed an angle that missed that tug and commented the call was later in the play when the DB put his arm around the receiver.
Blame Olsen for all of the controversy. JuJu was actually held twice on the play, the first being the jersey tug that altered the timing of the play and the second being the hand on the hip that Olsen was bitching about.
 
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That call is made against PSU in the Rose Bowl with the same implications and resulting game result you all are bitching about it for the next 30 years.
 
Surprised no one has commented on the clear facemask infraction on Hurts causing the fumble. I missed it, but it’s clear as day on clips in the past couple of days.
 
There is an art to being a great official. A great official absolutely does NOT make the same call in the first quarter of a regular season football game as they would in the final seconds of the Super Bowl with the game hanging in the balance. Nor should they. Was it holding? By the letter of the law, yes. Was it egregious enough to decide the outcome of the Super Bowl? Absolutely not. A great official does not make that call.

Again, all that being said, the Eagles defense was absolute garbage in the second half, so to make a claim they “were robbed” of a Super Bowl win is ludicrous.
 
There is an art to being a great official. A great official absolutely does NOT make the same call in the first quarter of a regular season football game as they would in the final seconds of the Super Bowl with the game hanging in the balance. Nor should they. Was it holding? By the letter of the law, yes. Was it egregious enough to decide the outcome of the Super Bowl? Absolutely not. A great official does not make that call.

Again, all that being said, the Eagles defense was absolute garbage in the second half, so to make a claim they “were robbed” of a Super Bowl win is ludicrous.
I don't agree at all. I think the ref should call the game consistently. You hear that all the time from players. They want to know what to expect. If the game is called differently there is no way to know. Is it OK with five minutes to go? two? Last two plays of the game?

No, call what is and what is not a foul. I get this was a borderline call and I'd be upset if I were an Eagles fan. But the hold, where he tugged the shirt, clearly qualifies as a penalty. The only argument is that it is a borderline call.
 
I don't agree at all. I think the ref should call the game consistently. You hear that all the time from players. They want to know what to expect. If the game is called differently there is no way to know. Is it OK with five minutes to go? two? Last two plays of the game?

No, call what is and what is not a foul. I get this was a borderline call and I'd be upset if I were an Eagles fan. But the hold, where he tugged the shirt, clearly qualifies as a penalty. The only argument is that it is a borderline call.
Completely disagree. The moment was far bigger than the size of that infraction, which was quite minor.
 
I don't agree at all. I think the ref should call the game consistently. You hear that all the time from players. They want to know what to expect. If the game is called differently there is no way to know. Is it OK with five minutes to go? two? Last two plays of the game?

No, call what is and what is not a foul. I get this was a borderline call and I'd be upset if I were an Eagles fan. But the hold, where he tugged the shirt, clearly qualifies as a penalty. The only argument is that it is a borderline call.
Apparently it Was just reported on WIP (talk radio ) that this officiating crew had gone 576 consecutive snaps without calling defensive holding….
 
Apparently it Was just reported on WIP (talk radio ) that this officiating crew had gone 576 consecutive snaps without calling defensive holding….
That can't be true. In the playoffs you do not have regular crews. You have "All-Star" crews assembled based upon their individual evaluations during the season. So again Sports Talk Radio is trying to stir the pot.
 
Apparently it Was just reported on WIP (talk radio ) that this officiating crew had gone 576 consecutive snaps without calling defensive holding….
Well, that is part of preparation. You've gotta know the refs and their tendencies.

I do have to wonder how true that is, though

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I don't agree at all. I think the ref should call the game consistently. You hear that all the time from players. They want to know what to expect. If the game is called differently there is no way to know. Is it OK with five minutes to go? two? Last two plays of the game?

No, call what is and what is not a foul. I get this was a borderline call and I'd be upset if I were an Eagles fan. But the hold, where he tugged the shirt, clearly qualifies as a penalty. The only argument is that it is a borderline call.
They were not consistent. Never called it all game then out of the blue with the Super Bowl hanging in the balance, super ref whips out the flag on a marginal infraction. Dumb, dumb, dumb judgment.
 
That can't be true. In the playoffs you do not have regular crews. You have "All-Star" crews assembled based upon their individual evaluations during the season. So again Sports Talk Radio is trying to stir the pot.
He was referring to a tweet put out by the Athletic …. Maybe it was just that official who made the call
 
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That can't be true. In the playoffs you do not have regular crews. You have "All-Star" crews assembled based upon their individual evaluations during the season. So again Sports Talk Radio is trying to stir the pot.
Another thing I was told is that they have one extra zebra for the Super Bowl. And when you are the fifteen yard line like that play the refs have a much smaller field to cover. Hence they see more stuff and end up calling more.
 
Another thing I was told is that they have one extra zebra for the Super Bowl. And when you are the fifteen yard line like that play the refs have a much smaller field to cover. Hence they see more stuff and end up calling more.
But they didn’t call anything this game. That’s my issue. Not one holding call all game (offensive or defensive if memory serves me )

I actually think that , up until that call, every penalty in the game was a pre snap penalty other then the hands to the face by Suh
 
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But they didn’t call anything this game. That’s my issue. Not one holding call all game (offensive or defensive if memory serves me )

I actually think that , up until that call, every penalty in the game was a pre snap penalty other then the hands to the face by Suh
Maybe they didn’t see any holding until that play….just a thought. So from now on, all crews need to call one holding per quarter in the first three (even if they don’t see one) just in case there’s one in the fourth and they can be consistent.
 
When they threw the flag, my initial reaction was that I didn't like the call. Honestly, I think I still don't really like the call. But...

1. Huge props to James Bradberry for his response. You don't see a lot of players man up on stuff like this these days, and particularly in a context like this that had to be terribly painful.
2. As to those that do want to whine about it, honestly, this is the NFL today. How many times (especially late in games) do you see teams (ahem, Tom Brady) throw jump balls and advance down the field via DPI? More that I care to count. This is just a second cousin to that.
Bradberry hit it.

Field played apart -

The field conditions can be criticized without it being whining. It's ridiculous to me that in the Super Bowl you have guys sliding around like olympic curling because there's so much paint on the field. Yes both teams had to play on it. So what, does that make it ok that in the biggest game of the year the field is in terrible shape? The league is more worried about appearances and posturing than making sure the field is in top shape for the biggest game of the season and maybe they should concentrate more on the competition people are tuning in to watch. It's pretty ridiculous.
 
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There is an art to being a great official. A great official absolutely does NOT make the same call in the first quarter of a regular season football game as they would in the final seconds of the Super Bowl with the game hanging in the balance. Nor should they. Was it holding? By the letter of the law, yes. Was it egregious enough to decide the outcome of the Super Bowl? Absolutely not. A great official does not make that call.

Again, all that being said, the Eagles defense was absolute garbage in the second half, so to make a claim they “were robbed” of a Super Bowl win is ludicrous.
a great official makes the call of a foul when it occurs, irrespective of what part of the game the foul occurs. the problem appears to be, there are not enough great officials.
 
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Bradberry hit it.

Field played apart -

The field conditions can be criticized without it being whining. It's ridiculous to me that in the Super Bowl you have guys sliding around like olympic curling because there's so much paint on the field. Yes both teams had to play on it. So what, does that make it ok that in the biggest game of the year the field is in terrible shape? The league is more worried about appearances and posturing than making sure the field is in top shape for the biggest game of the season and maybe they should concentrate more on the competition people are tuning in to watch. It's pretty ridiculous.
I don't listen to WIP a lot but they have had some very good post SB analysis.

They mentioned that the groundskeeping consultant hired by the NFL for the game (George Toma) is 94 years old, lives in Kansas City, is a Chiefs fan and was a former head groundskeeper for the Chiefs. So much for the appearance of impartiality. WIP also noted that the Eagles experienced something like 4X more slips in the game than the Chiefs and the field conditions significantly impacted their ability to rush the QB. The poor field conditions did not affect the two teams equally.

Despite all that, it was the Eagles defense that cost them the game.
 
I don't listen to WIP a lot but they have had some very good post SB analysis.

They mentioned that the groundskeeping consultant hired by the NFL for the game (George Toma) is 94 years old, lives in Kansas City, is a Chiefs fan and was a former head groundskeeper for the Chiefs. So much for the appearance of impartiality. WIP also noted that the Eagles experienced something like 4X more slips in the game than the Chiefs and the field conditions significantly impacted their ability to rush the QB. The poor field conditions did not affect the two teams equally.

Despite all that, it was the Eagles defense that cost them the game.
So why didn’t it affect the Chiefs ability to rush the QB?
 
Simple - the better team won. Calls went both ways - eagles fans can cry all they want about the late hold call. It was the ebb and flow and the birds lost End of discussion.
 
I don't listen to WIP a lot but they have had some very good post SB analysis.

They mentioned that the groundskeeping consultant hired by the NFL for the game (George Toma) is 94 years old, lives in Kansas City, is a Chiefs fan and was a former head groundskeeper for the Chiefs. So much for the appearance of impartiality. WIP also noted that the Eagles experienced something like 4X more slips in the game than the Chiefs and the field conditions significantly impacted their ability to rush the QB. The poor field conditions did not affect the two teams equally.

Despite all that, it was the Eagles defense that cost them the game.
Ah, to be fair, Toma has been the groundskeeper for nearly every Super bowl.

Edit - EVERY Super Bowl
 
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the word is that it was the paint and not the grass.
Agreed, but the post that I was addressing was the accusation of lack of impartiality due to Toma being responsible for the field conditions implying that their was some type of favoritism. I was just pointing out that George Toma has done every Super Bowl and I believe he is actually in the Hall of Fame.
 
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Agreed, but the post that I was addressing was the accusation of lack of impartiality due to Toma being responsible for the field conditions implying that their was some type of favoritism. I was just pointing out that George Toma has done every Super Bowl and I believe he is actually in the Hall of Fame.
I didn't accuse him of favoritism I said it isn't a good look for the NFL. In a big game like this, you need to avoid even the appearance of potential bias. Once KC made it to the SB, perhaps he should have been replaced. And at 94, he is more than likely a little past his prime. It's unfortunate that he will now be remembered for the abominable field conditions in this game. This was no way to end his career.
 
I didn't accuse him of favoritism I said it isn't a good look for the NFL. In a big game like this, you need to avoid even the appearance of potential bias. Once KC made it to the SB, perhaps he should have been replaced. And at 94, he is more than likely a little past his prime. It's unfortunate that he will now be remembered for the abominable field conditions in this game. This was no way to end his career.
I think only Eagles fans would have seen favoritism in the field.
 
I didn't accuse him of favoritism I said it isn't a good look for the NFL. In a big game like this, you need to avoid even the appearance of potential bias. Once KC made it to the SB, perhaps he should have been replaced. And at 94, he is more than likely a little past his prime. It's unfortunate that he will now be remembered for the abominable field conditions in this game. This was no way to end his career.

Gee, wonder why that damn George couldn’t help the Chiefs in Tampa against Brady or against Bart Starr or why the 49ers didn’t blame him for their loss.

BTW, I would imagine that at 94 he was probably was pretty much a figurehead regarding the field conditions.
 
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