2021 National Duals Results & Discussion

[AndEEss]

I agree with you. Especially with a guy like RBY who is known for his offense, not his top work. I will never second guess Cael, he seems to let the wrestlers figure out how the flow of the match is going and where/what they want to work. But, I think a guy like RBY should go takedown and a 15ish second ride, release, repeat. After 5 takedowns, not only are you up by 5, but your riding time is over a minute as well. I think with Nick Lee's motor, he would be a good one to follow this as well. Although Nick is known to get some back points.

I was speaking with a past team mate of mine last night about this. When we wrestled, we secured the bonus points we thought we needed/thought we could at least get, and then went to work for a pin. I found it odd last night that our guys didn't seem to have that sense of urgency to get that next bonus point. I'm not bad mouthing them, or knocking them, the majority of the team put together 2 excellent matches back to back.

Looking forward to tonights dual, should be a great back and forth

Yeah. Many/most of RBY's relatively few pins are in scrambles. Like the suck back he had against UNI; it wasn't like he was on top of the dude cranking on him in a Bow and Arrow for 30 seconds before the second shoulder hit the mat. He has the ability to get the TDs AND the motor to do it the entire match. And potentially catch people in hairy situations when they are about to keel over.

 

[Junglekitty]

Quick prediction:

125 - Courtney doesn't put up a ton of points. From what I've seen, he's only been in the double digits twice. For the team purpose, I think he really gets after it. But I don't think he gets more than a major. 4-0 ASU

133 - McGee took a bad loss earlier in the year but just took out Myers so he's riding a confidence wave. I think he's athletic enough to keep RBY to a decision. 4-3 ASU

141 - Vasquez I believe was a 4xer in California? He's athletic and I think could give Lee a few issues early. The problem with Vasquez is his gas tank, and that's the worst thing to have an issue with wrestling Lee. Lee pushes for 7 straight minutes knowing this, gets a few stall calls and the major. 7-4 PSU

149 - Parco has a few good wins, and his losses to top competition were pretty close. Today is BB's day. His positioning and gas tank make the difference. 10-4 PSU

157 - I have absolutely no idea who we see here. Joe had a chance last night to cement starting tonight, and that didn't happen. If I had to guess, I think we see Negron. Teemer went to OT yesterday against Brady VT. While I don't think its that close, I don't think Negron gives up bonus either. 10-7 PSU

165 - Valencia showed against VT that his gas tank isn't full. We know Edsell will wrestle hard for 7 minutes. I don't think he has quite enough to beat Valencia, but if he keeps hands on him, and doesn't let Valencia tee off his shots, Edsell keeps it to a decision. 10-10

174 - I would not want to be Rochford today. I think Starocci comes out wanting to prove that yesterdays match shouldn't have been that close. With Rochford giving up a ton of back points to Lewis, and with how good Starocci is on top, I'm saying he gets the fall. 16-10 PSU

184 - My guess is Brooks comes out firing. Not sure if he gets enough for the tech, but it'll be close, I'll be reserved, and only give him the major. 20-10 PSU

197 - Norfleet has improved a lot during his college career. I just think Dean's mat game is the deciding factor. 23-10

285 - The grand finale. Kerk and Schultz will be a great ending to this dual. There's positives and negatives wrestling Schultz. The negative side is, he makes the match very uncomfortable. There aren't a lot of guys that get that greco feel very often. He'll dig and dig for his hooks and push guys around the mat. The positive, Kerk has already felt it. Not only does Kerk know what to expect, I think he's a tad healthier this time around. 26-10

We Are!

 

[jack66]

It's hard to get a TF on just TD and release.

 

[Str8DBLz]

Care to explain your reasoning? That Dual could be hanging in the balance at heavyweight and, if healthy, I’m sure Kerk would like an opportunity to avenge his loss at NCAAs.

I'm not sure kerk is 100% yet and we unfortunately seen what a not 100% kerk can do against guys the size and ability of Shultz.

 

[tbay165]

I'm not sure kerk is 100% yet and we unfortunately seen what a not 100% kerk can do against guys the size and ability of Shultz.

Your assumption is based on what?

 

[Junglekitty]

It's hard to get a TF on just TD and release.

100% Agree. But lets break down a match with someone as good on their feet as RBY. I believe RBY can average 4 takedowns a period. That's a takedown every 45 seconds in the first, and one every 30 seconds in the second and third. That alone is 24 points. If you eliminate the escape at the end of the period that is 24 - 9 just with takedowns. Give opponent an extra escape for him choosing down, but give RBY a riding time point. That's 25-10. If RBY stays on his offense, I would bet a stall point could be added as well. Is that a tall task, absolutely. I think there are maybe a handful of wrestlers in the nation that could do it, and RBY is one of them. Desanto is another, but with his barrel roll, he usually racks up back points as well. Again, and I can't stress this enough, it is difficult. But RBY is one that I believe can do this.

 

[a_mshaffer]

Yeah. Many/most of RBY's relatively few pins are in scrambles. Like the suck back he had against UNI; it wasn't like he was on top of the dude cranking on him in a Bow and Arrow for 30 seconds before the second shoulder hit the mat. He has the ability to get the TDs AND the motor to do it the entire match. And potentially catch people in hairy situations when they are about to keel over.

wasn't his first match an arm bar and cranked the kid over for a fall? At rec hall

 

[Chris Watts]

100% Agree. But lets break down a match with someone as good on their feet as RBY. I believe RBY can average 4 takedowns a period. That's a takedown every 45 seconds in the first, and one every 30 seconds in the second and third. That alone is 24 points. If you eliminate the escape at the end of the period that is 24 - 9 just with takedowns. Give opponent an extra escape for him choosing down, but give RBY a riding time point. That's 25-10. If RBY stays on his offense, I would bet a stall point could be added as well. Is that a tall task, absolutely. I think there are maybe a handful of wrestlers in the nation that could do it, and RBY is one of them. Desanto is another, but with his barrel roll, he usually racks up back points as well. Again, and I can't stress this enough, it is difficult. But RBY is one that I believe can do this.

I'm also confident RBY can do it. Mainly because he's already done it this season.

 

[STAND with PRIDE]

I'm not sure kerk is 100% yet and we unfortunately seen what a not 100% kerk can do against guys the size and ability of Shultz.

I thought the same thing when I knew who we’d have tonight. Wouldnt be one bit surprised to see Snax.
Not worth a dual win, even if it is in front of 250+.

 

[McScoreley]

I find it odd that Kerk has been weighing in at 230. Just a bit concerned since he was 228 after his layoff last year and was rumored to have gotten to 250 in the offseason. Idk maybe it’s part of the plan, who knows

 

[jack66]

100% Agree. But lets break down a match with someone as good on their feet as RBY. I believe RBY can average 4 takedowns a period. That's a takedown every 45 seconds in the first, and one every 30 seconds in the second and third. That alone is 24 points. If you eliminate the escape at the end of the period that is 24 - 9 just with takedowns. Give opponent an extra escape for him choosing down, but give RBY a riding time point. That's 25-10. If RBY stays on his offense, I would bet a stall point could be added as well. Is that a tall task, absolutely. I think there are maybe a handful of wrestlers in the nation that could do it, and RBY is one of them. Desanto is another, but with his barrel roll, he usually racks up back points as well. Again, and I can't stress this enough, it is difficult. But RBY is one that I believe can do this.

I'm not saying it can't be done, but what you are describing is the perfect scenario with a ride out at the end of each period.

I like Nolf's strategy better ... wear a guy out for 2 periods with TD/release then go to work on top.

 

[AndEEss]

I find it odd that Kerk has been weighing in at 230. Just a bit concerned since he was 228 after his layoff last year and was rumored to have gotten to 250 in the offseason. Idk maybe it’s part of the plan, who knows

I almost posted the exact same thing just now.

Bulk helps when you're wrestling a truly big guy like Schultz or Wood.

 

[Rhino80]

Pretty sure he just got over a stomach flu. Probably has a little to do with it.

 

[McScoreley]

He was 231 against Army I believe so maybe it was a prolonged thing … either way thankfully we have 3 months to go instead of one month this time around

 

[AndEEss]

I'm not saying it can't be done, but what you are describing is the perfect scenario with a ride out at the end of each period.

I like Nolf's strategy better ... wear a guy out for 2 periods with TD/release then go to work on top.

This is what I'd do if I were a Nick Lee type of wrestler. You've got technique, skill and gas tank on your side. Bludgeon the other guy for 5 minutes, building up an MD sort of lead, then go for the kill in the last two minutes. I never understand why I see AA-level guys coming out of the first period with a 2-0 lead and 1:47 in riding time.

 

[Junglekitty]

I'm not saying it can't be done, but what you are describing is the perfect scenario with a ride out at the end of each period.

I like Nolf's strategy better ... wear a guy out for 2 periods with TD/release then go to work on top.

I liked Nolf's strategy as well. But in my opinion, Nolf had more of a top game. RBY can definitely ride as we seen with Fix and Pletcher. Maybe he can turn guys and chooses to work from his feet? Fix and Pletcher aren't exactly the caliber of wrestlers that are gonna get turned by just anyone, their opponent's top game would have to be that of Spencer, probably better.

Point being, guys like Nolf, Zain, Dean, Taylor and Ruth were guys that you almost assumed at some point in the match, back points were coming. I don't see that with RBY.

I just want to point out that I am in no way shape or form trying to knock RBY. He's a phenomenal wrestler and I'm glad he wears the blue and white. This is a nice problem to have to be able to nit pick one ( possibly only ) area that can be nit picked.

 

[AndEEss]

I wouldn't mind seeing Starocci, Lee or Brooks stall their opponent out of the match.

Aaron was getting pretty mad at the ref during the Loew match. You could see him complaining to Casey during injury time, and Casey trying to calm him down. Loew was just backing out of bounds, every time. I'd like to see that kind of pressure from neutral again tonight.

 

[jack66]

I liked Nolf's strategy as well. But in my opinion, Nolf had more of a top game. RBY can definitely ride as we seen with Fix and Pletcher. Maybe he can turn guys and chooses to work from his feet? Fix and Pletcher aren't exactly the caliber of wrestlers that are gonna get turned by just anyone, their opponent's top game would have to be that of Spencer, probably better.

Point being, guys like Nolf, Zain, Dean, Taylor and Ruth were guys that you almost assumed at some point in the match, back points were coming. I don't see that with RBY.

I just want to point out that I am in no way shape or form trying to knock RBY. He's a phenomenal wrestler and I'm glad he wears the blue and white. This is a nice problem to have to be able to nit pick one ( possibly only ) area that can be nit picked.

Yeah, point taken.

Frankly, I'll be happy with a 3 point decision. McGee is no slouch.

 

[STAND with PRIDE]

Any results from early action?

 

[McScoreley]

Kind of reminds me of the time Zain was on top against Micah in the Big Ten finals and raised his hands to the refs basically like "He's not wrestling"

 

[bowandarrow]

Vito looking great.

 

[donboy6499]

I think we see nevills vs shultz

I hope to see Kerk wrestle him. If he sits out, always nice to have the reminder in December to not take anything seriously until March.

I'm not sure kerk is 100% yet and we unfortunately seen what a not 100% kerk can do against guys the size and ability of Shultz.

Old enough to remember when guys wrestled less than 100%.

 

[KCLion]

I wouldn't mind seeing Starocci, Lee or Brooks stall their opponent out of the match.

Aaron was getting pretty mad at the ref during the Loew match. You could see him complaining to Casey during injury time, and Casey trying to calm him down. Loew was just backing out of bounds, every time. I'd like to see that kind of pressure from neutral again tonight.

Loew copying Hidlay strategy to keep it close by constantly backing to the edge??

 

[so cal hawkfan]

Vasquez looks really good early, but he faded badly both matches. He is slick and has good technique, so maybe he can get an early TD on Lee. Even if he does though Lee will win comfortably as his pace will make it an ugly 3rd period for Vasquez.

I’ve watched quite a bit of Vasquez when he was in HS. Hawks courted him a bit, personally I don’t think he’s ready for the pace Nick Lee brings to the table. Maybe Jessie presents himself well in the first and keeps it close, but he’s not yet gone to war with someone that puts the consistent pressure that Lee does. Bonus likely IMHO.

 

[AndEEss]

Loew copying Hidlay strategy to keep it close by constantly backing to the edge??

It's hard to score if you plant yourself 6" outside the circle.

Also: Josh Edmond and Manzona Bryant are trying to kill each other out there. Not in a mean spirited way, but these two are just bombing each other. Left and right. Often with no points because someone rolls through or it's OOB.

 

[jmadden1998]

Vito looking great.

He looked “rusty”, only got a major against Latona.

 

[dmm53]

Foca just lost another close one to a second national champ (M. Lewis). I think he had a brain fart in OT and chose top first (thinking he could chose bottom after that). Lewis escaped quickly both times to win 3-1. So much for an Ivy League education. Guess he was in the Poison Ivy League this weekend. Unable to do anything from bottom with CStarr and then twice being on top in OT ... by mistake I think.

 

[GantryZ]

Good gravy that was a head scratcher

 

[SJP80]

I almost posted the exact same thing just now.

Bulk helps when you're wrestling a truly big guy like Schultz or Wood.

Big JWood fan for a long time. That said, he is one big dude right now. Knowing his weight training background and regime, he must be pushing some big numbers.

 

[mcpat]

On the other side was Zain wearing guys out from on top. Depends on what kind of wrestler you are.

Nick Lee prob would have had a TF yesterday had he not cut his guy with a min to go. Ride out would have been a TF.

 

[mcpat]

Quick prediction:

You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

 

[backdrft76]

Foca just lost another close one to a second national champ (M. Lewis). I think he had a brain fart in OT and chose top first (thinking he could chose bottom after that). Lewis escaped quickly both times to win 3-1. So much for an Ivy League education. Guess he was in the Poison Ivy League this weekend. Unable to do anything from bottom with CStarr and then twice being on top in OT ... by mistake I think.

 

[mcpat]

157 - I have absolutely no idea who we see here. Joe had a chance last night to cement starting tonight, and that didn't happen. If I had to guess, I think we see Negron. Teemer went to OT yesterday against Brady VT. While I don't think its that close, I don't think Negron gives up bonus either. 10-7 PSU

I think I’ve seen the best wrestling from Negron at 157 and I’d like to see him get some more chances.

 

[zzs006]

Loew just beat Bolen. What has happened to Bolen?

 

[McScoreley]

Loew just beat Bolen. What has happened to Bolen?

Nothing, this is his first loss. Loew is very good, which just shows how good AB is.

 

[CSauertiegPSU]

Didn't have Loew over Bolen on my bingo card.

 

[McScoreley]

My guess is Barraclough is still the guy and will get the shot against Teemer today (which was always the biggest opponent of the weekend)

 

[johnstownsteel]

Quick prediction:

125 - Courtney doesn't put up a ton of points. From what I've seen, he's only been in the double digits twice. For the team purpose, I think he really gets after it. But I don't think he gets more than a major. 4-0 ASU

133 - McGee took a bad loss earlier in the year but just took out Myers so he's riding a confidence wave. I think he's athletic enough to keep RBY to a decision. 4-3 ASU

141 - Vasquez I believe was a 4xer in California? He's athletic and I think could give Lee a few issues early. The problem with Vasquez is his gas tank, and that's the worst thing to have an issue with wrestling Lee. Lee pushes for 7 straight minutes knowing this, gets a few stall calls and the major. 7-4 PSU

149 - Parco has a few good wins, and his losses to top competition were pretty close. Today is BB's day. His positioning and gas tank make the difference. 10-4 PSU

157 - I have absolutely no idea who we see here. Joe had a chance last night to cement starting tonight, and that didn't happen. If I had to guess, I think we see Negron. Teemer went to OT yesterday against Brady VT. While I don't think its that close, I don't think Negron gives up bonus either. 10-7 PSU

165 - Valencia showed against VT that his gas tank isn't full. We know Edsell will wrestle hard for 7 minutes. I don't think he has quite enough to beat Valencia, but if he keeps hands on him, and doesn't let Valencia tee off his shots, Edsell keeps it to a decision. 10-10

174 - I would not want to be Rochford today. I think Starocci comes out wanting to prove that yesterdays match shouldn't have been that close. With Rochford giving up a ton of back points to Lewis, and with how good Starocci is on top, I'm saying he gets the fall. 16-10 PSU

184 - My guess is Brooks comes out firing. Not sure if he gets enough for the tech, but it'll be close, I'll be reserved, and only give him the major. 20-10 PSU

197 - Norfleet has improved a lot during his college career. I just think Dean's mat game is the deciding factor. 23-10

285 - The grand finale. Kerk and Schultz will be a great ending to this dual. There's positives and negatives wrestling Schultz. The negative side is, he makes the match very uncomfortable. There aren't a lot of guys that get that greco feel very often. He'll dig and dig for his hooks and push guys around the mat. The positive, Kerk has already felt it. Not only does Kerk know what to expect, I think he's a tad healthier this time around. 26-10

We Are!

According to my KYPSUW, I have 21-16 PSU if the guys I think wrestle actually wrestle. I do like your result better.

 

[McScoreley]

I wonder if Joe feels he needs to get one of those low percentage double over throw to a pin to win back the coaches' trust. Almost like he's determined to prove to the coaches it works after he was told to stop doing it lol.

 

[js8793]

He looked “rusty”, only got a major against Latona.

latona has been a mess this year. way too big for 125. don't see returning aa's start the year 4-6 very often. he needs his weight to stabilize. myers coming back really messed up their timeline.