B.O.B. interview...

[Judge Smails]

I know everyone wants to have the warm and fuzzies over O'Brien, but the interview he had with Dave Jones where he blasted "the Paterno people" helped extend the media narrative that Penn State had a "fractured fan base" that didn't support a new coach. Which was 100% wrong. Everyone was lined up behind Billy. I think that was a calculated move on O'Brien's part so that leaving "wasn't his fault".

All this flowers and roses stuff from him is great when it no longer matters. When it did matter, and we were still up against it, that interview with Jones made PSU seem like a terrible place who "is going to be looking for a new football coach soon". So....I'm not as forgiving as some.

 

[LaJolla Lion]

For the most part I think that is true but I do remember Jay making some back handed comments in a couple articles he wrote.
I think he may have even said something snarky about the offense we were running this year.

You are correct. It was no big wins right before the OSU Game and a few other things. He had been exceptional for the school up until that point, but it's not a big deal as Franklin won and won big. I was just surprised Jay would add to the hot seat fire coming where he came from.

OB did a great job and this wasn't his dream job...oh well. Thanks for keeping it together and handing the keys off to a true college coach.

 

[NittPicker]

I know everyone wants to have the warm and fuzzies over O'Brien, but the interview he had with Dave Jones where he blasted "the Paterno people" helped extend the media narrative that Penn State had a "fractured fan base" that didn't support a new coach. Which was 100% wrong. Everyone was lined up behind Billy. I think that was a calculated move on O'Brien's part so that leaving "wasn't his fault".

All this flowers and roses stuff from him is great when it no longer matters. When it did matter, and we were still up against it, that interview with Jones made PSU seem like a terrible place who "is going to be looking for a new football coach soon". So....I'm not as forgiving as some.

Jones being Jones, he baited O'Brien in that interview which was conducted via telephone. Davey fed the "Paterno people" line to O'Brien in a loaded question. Jones implied "Paterno people" weren't happy with O'Brien as if support for both coaches wasn't a possibility. O'Brien made a frustrated response and repeated Jones' "Paterno people" fantasy. I cut O'Brien some slack in that interview considering the circumstances under which it was conducted and the jackass who was conducting it. That interview aside, I never heard O'Brien be the slightest bit critical of anyone associated with Penn State.

I consider myself a Paterno person. I was also 100% behind O'Brien. I'm now 100% behind Franklin. Jones' fantasy of mutual exclusion is ridiculous.

 

[Obliviax]

Jones being Jones, he baited O'Brien in that interview which was conducted via telephone. Davey fed the "Paterno people" line to O'Brien in a loaded question. Jones implied "Paterno people" weren't happy with O'Brien as if support for both coaches wasn't a possibility. O'Brien made a frustrated response and repeated Jones' "Paterno people" concoction. I cut O'Brien some slack in that interview considering the circumstances under which it was conducted and the jackass who was conducting it.

I consider myself a Paterno person. I was also 100% behind O'Brien. I'm now 100% behind Franklin. Jones' fantasy of mutual exclusion is ridiculous.

I totally agree. BOB was put in a tough spot trying to thread the needle in not offending those that credit JVP and the BOT (that was trying to pin JS on him). That's not a fight BOB should have been involved in. But people kept trying to bring him into that conversation. he was trying to coach and keep the program together. His bosses wanted him to stick JVP. not a great position to be in. But he did a pretty darn good job of it. If he bucked the BOT, he simply would have been fired.

 

[BBrown]

Jones being Jones, he baited O'Brien in that interview which was conducted via telephone. Davey fed the "Paterno people" line to O'Brien in a loaded question. Jones implied "Paterno people" weren't happy with O'Brien as if support for both coaches wasn't a possibility. O'Brien made a frustrated response and repeated Jones' "Paterno people" fantasy. I cut O'Brien some slack in that interview considering the circumstances under which it was conducted and the jackass who was conducting it. That interview aside, I never heard O'Brien be the slightest bit critical of anyone associated with Penn State.

I consider myself a Paterno person. I was also 100% behind O'Brien. I'm now 100% behind Franklin. Jones' fantasy of mutual exclusion is ridiculous.

I will never, to this day, understand why you couldn't support both O'Brien and Joe. The 2 weren't mutually exclusive but there was a chasm on this board as wide as the Grand Canyon for some. And Jones being Jones and getting half his material from message boards saw that and played it up.
I think in the end I was more disappointed in O'Brien for not being able to see through Jones.

 

[Judge Smails]

Jones being Jones, he baited O'Brien in that interview which was conducted via telephone. Davey fed the "Paterno people" line to O'Brien in a loaded question. Jones implied "Paterno people" weren't happy with O'Brien as if support for both coaches wasn't a possibility. O'Brien made a frustrated response and repeated Jones' "Paterno people" fantasy. I cut O'Brien some slack in that interview considering the circumstances under which it was conducted and the jackass who was conducting it. That interview aside, I never heard O'Brien be the slightest bit critical of anyone associated with Penn State.

I consider myself a Paterno person. I was also 100% behind O'Brien. I'm now 100% behind Franklin. Jones' fantasy of mutual exclusion is ridiculous.

I agree, mostly, with your characterization. However it was framed, though, Bill still implied that something that he didn't like about PSU/the fanbase/whatever was why "they will be looking for a new head coach soon". Our fault, not his for wanting the NFL all along.

 

[getmyjive11]

"He succeeded the legendary Joe Paterno and inherited the most precarious coaching position in the history of American sports."

Love how these guys can't avoid the hyperbole! Jack Lengyel had to replace almost an entire football team at Marshall after the tragic plane crash that killed 37 players and nine coaches. Forrest Gregg had to rebuild an SMU football team from scratch after they received the "death penalty". I agree that BOB was put into a difficult situation, but come on!

So only the third most precarious job?

 

[getmyjive11]

To you, backhanded. I feel like Jay was trying to be an analyst and people took him as being critical of the program. Having said that, if Jay was critical of the program, who could blame him? I don't recall any comments being striking or stinging....they were soft touches along the lines of "its not as easy as it looks, amIright?"

Jay was being a bitch, plain and simple.

 

[Obliviax]

Jay was being a bitch, plain and simple.

For good reason.

 

[PSUSignore]

Said it before and strongly believe..... There should be some sort of recognition towards Bill O'Brien at Beaver Stadium. Put his name up on the luxury boxes, or a statue outside the stadium, because IMO if we had a lesser coach and a lesser man back in 2012 our program might have imploded.

I'd argue that the inclusion of "2012" on the luxury boxes is a tribute not only to the players, but also to OB.

 

[getmyjive11]

For good reason.

Not really. His beef should have been with the administration, not the football team.

 

[michnittlion]

For good reason.

What reason was there for Jay to be a bitch towards Bill O'Brien?

Jay's "beef" (as it is) was with Old Main and the administration. Yet he was out there taking thinly veiled pot-shots at our football coach (and by extension, the football team).

One question I'm going to ask when I get to the afterlife --- "who was the source for that SI article in May 2013?" It's an even-money shot in my mind that the source was Jay (yes, I know he's publicly said he wasn't a source).

 

[michnittlion]

I'd argue that the inclusion of "2012" on the luxury boxes is a tribute not only to the players, but also to OB.

2012 doesn't belong there. That should exclusively be for our undefeated and Championship (MNC or conference) teams.

Much as I liked the 2012 team, they were neither.

 

[getmyjive11]

2012 doesn't belong there. That should exclusively be for our undefeated and Championship (MNC or conference) teams.

Much as I liked the 2012 team, they were neither.

Disagree. They deserve to be there just as much as any of those other ones. That was a magical season by a team full of guys who played for PSU's namesake.

 

[michnittlion]

I know everyone wants to have the warm and fuzzies over O'Brien, but the interview he had with Dave Jones where he blasted "the Paterno people" helped extend the media narrative that Penn State had a "fractured fan base" that didn't support a new coach. Which was 100% wrong. Everyone was lined up behind Billy. I think that was a calculated move on O'Brien's part so that leaving "wasn't his fault".

All this flowers and roses stuff from him is great when it no longer matters. When it did matter, and we were still up against it, that interview with Jones made PSU seem like a terrible place who "is going to be looking for a new football coach soon". So....I'm not as forgiving as some.

Not everyone --- more like 95%. The 5% were pretty powerful. The 5% were able to get an anti-Bill O'Brien article planted in Sports Illustrated, for instance.

Whoever planted that Sports Illustrated article should be shot out of a cannon into the sun.

 

[michnittlion]

Disagree. They deserve to be there just as much as any of those other ones. That was a magical season by a team full of guys who played for PSU's namesake.

Fair enough. 2012 definitely deserves some recognition - I'd just prefer in a different spot.

 

[Obliviax]

What reason was there for Jay to be a bitch towards Bill O'Brien?

Jay's "beef" (as it is) was with Old Main and the administration. Yet he was out there taking thinly veiled pot-shots at our football coach (and by extension, the football team).

One question I'm going to ask when I get to the afterlife --- "who was the source for that SI article in May 2013?" It's an even-money shot in my mind that the source was Jay (yes, I know he's publicly said he wasn't a source).

I never saw one quote from Jay that was negative toward BOB. Do you have examples?

 

[michnittlion]

I never saw one quote from Jay that was negative toward BOB. Do you have examples?

Let's not forget --- Jay sued the University because he was not kept on as a coach for 2012. If that isn't acting like someone who felt he was entitled to a job (and with an axe to grind against the guy who prevented him from having a job) --- I don't know what is.

In his initial complaint --- Jay referred to comments Bill O'Brien made in February 2012 as being stigmatizing toward him. The comments from O'Brien were: "This is a staff made up of men who care about the mission of Penn State University and being successful on and off the field. It is also a staff of winners."

Really? That was stigmatizing? Apparently to Jay it was. I'm not making this up, that was in the initial complaint.

When the PA courts dismissed Jay's lawsuit this past spring, they specifically referred to arguments like that as being non-worthy of complaint.

Also his comments to Dennis Dodd in May 2013 when Dodd asked a simple question ("what is your relationship with Bill O'Brien) were telling. There was a lot of minimizing the accomplishments of the 2012 team (the league was down, wait til Urban changes the dynamic), while talking up his Dad and talking down our administration. Why is he saying all that?

And again, the source for the Sports Illustrated article in 2013. Somebody was the source. Who do you think it was?

I'll give Jay credit for one thing --- he has a decent political sense. Thus why he sometimes does things indirectly vs. saying them directly. But I'm fairly confident that Jay strongly dislikes Bill O'Brien and is resentful of the relative success O'Brien had here.

 

[voltz99]

Jones being Jones, he baited O'Brien in that interview which was conducted via telephone. Davey fed the "Paterno people" line to O'Brien in a loaded question. Jones implied "Paterno people" weren't happy with O'Brien as if support for both coaches wasn't a possibility. O'Brien made a frustrated response and repeated Jones' "Paterno people" fantasy. I cut O'Brien some slack in that interview considering the circumstances under which it was conducted and the jackass who was conducting it. That interview aside, I never heard O'Brien be the slightest bit critical of anyone associated with Penn State.

I consider myself a Paterno person. I was also 100% behind O'Brien. I'm now 100% behind Franklin. Jones' fantasy of mutual exclusion is ridiculous.

Ob being OB took the bait and did not dispute the quote. I cut Obrien zero slack. BOT did not leak the story or the quote to Jones.

 

[psugisher]

Not everyone --- more like 95%. The 5% were pretty powerful. The 5% were able to get an anti-Bill O'Brien article planted in Sports Illustrated, for instance.

Whoever planted that Sports Illustrated article should be shot out of a cannon into the sun.

I'd include the responsible party/parties involved in the leaking of the partial Grand Jury report on that cannon..

 

[MtNittany]

Let's not forget --- Jay sued the University because he was not kept on as a coach for 2012. If that isn't acting like someone who felt he was entitled to a job (and with an axe to grind against the guy who prevented him from having a job) --- I don't know what is.

In his initial complaint --- Jay referred to comments Bill O'Brien made in February 2012 as being stigmatizing toward him. The comments from O'Brien were: "This is a staff made up of men who care about the mission of Penn State University and being successful on and off the field. It is also a staff of winners."

Really? That was stigmatizing? Apparently to Jay it was. I'm not making this up, that was in the initial complaint.

When the PA courts dismissed Jay's lawsuit this past spring, they specifically referred to arguments like that as being non-worthy of complaint.

Also his comments to Dennis Dodd in May 2013 when Dodd asked a simple question ("what is your relationship with Bill O'Brien) were telling. There was a lot of minimizing the accomplishments of the 2012 team (the league was down, wait til Urban changes the dynamic), while talking up his Dad and talking down our administration. Why is he saying all that?

And again, the source for the Sports Illustrated article in 2013. Somebody was the source. Who do you think it was?

I'll give Jay credit for one thing --- he has a decent political sense. Thus why he sometimes does things indirectly vs. saying them directly. But I'm fairly confident that Jay strongly dislikes Bill O'Brien and is resentful of the relative success O'Brien had here.

GFY

 

[michnittlion]

GFY

GDAOTAIMSMBTJPSDBOAIROFTSOHH

That translates to:

Go Dispute Any Of The Arguments I Made Supporting My Belief That Jay Paterno Strongly Dislikes Bill O'Brien And Is Resentful Of The Success O'Brien Had Here.

 

[MtNittany]

GDAOTAIMSMBTJPSDBOAIROFTSOHH

That translates to:

Go Dispute Any Of The Arguments I Made Supporting My Belief That Jay Paterno Strongly Dislikes Bill O'Brien And Is Resentful Of The Success O'Brien Had Here.

What you know about Jay's feelings towards B.O.B. would fit on the head of a pin and leave room for the Count Basie Orchestra to perform beside it.

 

[anon_xdc8rmuek44eq]

I know everyone wants to have the warm and fuzzies over O'Brien, but the interview he had with Dave Jones where he blasted "the Paterno people" helped extend the media narrative that Penn State had a "fractured fan base" that didn't support a new coach. Which was 100% wrong. Everyone was lined up behind Billy. I think that was a calculated move on O'Brien's part so that leaving "wasn't his fault".

All this flowers and roses stuff from him is great when it no longer matters. When it did matter, and we were still up against it, that interview with Jones made PSU seem like a terrible place who "is going to be looking for a new football coach soon". So....I'm not as forgiving as some.

And didn't O'Brien's attorney insist that sanctions were one of the big reasons he was wanting to get out at Penn State? As in, he took the job with the understanding that sanctions weren't on the table, and now he can't win/compete? Dunno. Most folks here don't care because things worked out (and they believe Jones baited OB), but there's a good chance he could have done irreparable damage by leaving when he did - recruiting class could have fell apart and administration could have just said f*** it and went with some unknown coach from Bucknell or wherever.

What doesn't jive is that Franklin spoke to OB about the Penn State job and OB said he should go for it. Who, after suffering the wrath of Paterno People and having to endure such an awful working environment, would recommend the job to someone like Franklin, who was being talked about for every HC job from the Redskins to the Longhorns?

 

[michnittlion]

What you know about Jay's feelings towards B.O.B. would fit on the head of a pin and leave room for the Count Basie Orchestra to perform beside it.

I referenced one of Jay's own arguments in his lawsuit against PSU. Those are Jay's words, not mine.

 

[anon_xdc8rmuek44eq]

I never saw one quote from Jay that was negative toward BOB. Do you have examples?

On the flip side, try to find a positive one....many think Jay and Co. were behind the SI hit piece concerning the team doctor:

http://www.pennlive.com/pennstatefootball/index.ssf/2013/05/sports_illustrated_investigati.html

Here is O'Brien's full statement:

Penn State coach Bill O'Brien, shown here with former PSU defensive back Adam Taliaferro, issued a statement in response to the upcoming Sports Illustrated article about PSU's football medical care, saying, "Nothing about our level or quality of athlete care has changed. These young men mean a great deal to me and our staff.''

"When I was hired as the head football coach at Penn State, I was asked to observe areas of the football program and then make recommendations. After observing our medical organization in the football program for a full year, I recommended that it would be in the best interests of our program, and most importantly our student-athletes, to make a change in the team physicians.

"Dr. Lynch and Dr. Seidenberg were identified as excellent doctors who could serve in this role. Dr. Seidenberg will attend our practices and Dr. Lynch will be here on game day. The same surgeons as last year are available to players who would need that level of attention. Nothing about our level or quality of athlete care has changed.

"These young men mean a great deal to me and our staff. They give their all to Penn State. I will always recommend what I feel is best for our student-athletes in every area of the football program.''

Bream was brought in by O'Brien to be the head trainer shortly after O'Brien took the PSU job in January 2012. He had been the Chicago Bears' head trainer since 1997 and is a PSU graduate.

 

[Obliviax]

Let's not forget --- Jay sued the University because he was not kept on as a coach for 2012. If that isn't acting like someone who felt he was entitled to a job (and with an axe to grind against the guy who prevented him from having a job) --- I don't know what is.

In his initial complaint --- Jay referred to comments Bill O'Brien made in February 2012 as being stigmatizing toward him. The comments from O'Brien were: "This is a staff made up of men who care about the mission of Penn State University and being successful on and off the field. It is also a staff of winners."

Really? That was stigmatizing? Apparently to Jay it was. I'm not making this up, that was in the initial complaint.

When the PA courts dismissed Jay's lawsuit this past spring, they specifically referred to arguments like that as being non-worthy of complaint.

Also his comments to Dennis Dodd in May 2013 when Dodd asked a simple question ("what is your relationship with Bill O'Brien) were telling. There was a lot of minimizing the accomplishments of the 2012 team (the league was down, wait til Urban changes the dynamic), while talking up his Dad and talking down our administration. Why is he saying all that?

And again, the source for the Sports Illustrated article in 2013. Somebody was the source. Who do you think it was?

I'll give Jay credit for one thing --- he has a decent political sense. Thus why he sometimes does things indirectly vs. saying them directly. But I'm fairly confident that Jay strongly dislikes Bill O'Brien and is resentful of the relative success O'Brien had here.

I think you are WAY TOO thin skinned. Jay's suit had zero to do with BOB and everything to do with PSU. Don't forget, the University fired his dad then said they didn't fire them (despite the fact that they used the word "fired") and others have won similar suits. Sometimes, in law, law suits are filed knowing they can't be won on the merits, but you win in other ways (embarrass, gain information, apply pressure).

The others you are reading into what you want. So they had a decent 2012. First, Jay acknowledged that. He was simply saying you need to sustain to be able to correctly assess. Besides, BOB hadn't recruited a single player at a that point.

You are just a trouble maker.

 

[Obliviax]

On the flip side, try to find a positive one....many think Jay and Co. were behind the SI hit piece concerning the team doctor:

http://www.pennlive.com/pennstatefootball/index.ssf/2013/05/sports_illustrated_investigati.html

Here is O'Brien's full statement:

Penn State coach Bill O'Brien, shown here with former PSU defensive back Adam Taliaferro, issued a statement in response to the upcoming Sports Illustrated article about PSU's football medical care, saying, "Nothing about our level or quality of athlete care has changed. These young men mean a great deal to me and our staff.''

"When I was hired as the head football coach at Penn State, I was asked to observe areas of the football program and then make recommendations. After observing our medical organization in the football program for a full year, I recommended that it would be in the best interests of our program, and most importantly our student-athletes, to make a change in the team physicians.

"Dr. Lynch and Dr. Seidenberg were identified as excellent doctors who could serve in this role. Dr. Seidenberg will attend our practices and Dr. Lynch will be here on game day. The same surgeons as last year are available to players who would need that level of attention. Nothing about our level or quality of athlete care has changed.

"These young men mean a great deal to me and our staff. They give their all to Penn State. I will always recommend what I feel is best for our student-athletes in every area of the football program.''

Bream was brought in by O'Brien to be the head trainer shortly after O'Brien took the PSU job in January 2012. He had been the Chicago Bears' head trainer since 1997 and is a PSU graduate.

The same Bream involved in the Frat scandal? Again, believe what you want. Lots of people were upset with BOB fired the team doctors, or whatever. Doesn't mean it came from Jay. Besides, we know the press takes what they want and blows it out of proportion.

Finally, so what if he didn't support the program? Would you? PSU is the BOT, by supporting the program you are (on some level) promoting the BOT. If you were Jay, would you want to support the BOT? I certainly wouldn't. So I have no problem with him staying at arms length at that time. I don't think it was about BOB, it was about PSU and PSU's leadership;

 

[anon_xdc8rmuek44eq]

The same Bream involved in the Frat scandal? Again, believe what you want. Lots of people were upset with BOB fired the team doctors, or whatever. Doesn't mean it came from Jay. Besides, we know the press takes what they want and blows it out of proportion.

Finally, so what if he didn't support the program? Would you? PSU is the BOT, by supporting the program you are (on some level) promoting the BOT. If you were Jay, would you want to support the BOT? I certainly wouldn't. So I have no problem with him staying at arms length at that time. I don't think it was about BOB, it was about PSU and PSU's leadership;

I don't really care to be honest. My opinion is that Jay was bitter and didn't do much to celebrate anything related to Penn State football after he was removed from the program. Never talked about the big wins or the future of the program. Maybe he just wasn't interested, but I doubt it. Again, just my opinion.

 

[NittPicker]

I don't really care to be honest. My opinion is that Jay was bitter and didn't do much to celebrate anything related to Penn State football after he was removed from the program. Never talked about the big wins or the future of the program. Maybe he just wasn't interested, but I doubt it. Again, just my opinion.

Are former assistant coaches required to hit the talk show circuit to hype the past, present and future of the program they just left? Or is Jay getting singled out because his last name is Paterno? Why don't any of the other 2011 assistant coaches get the same criticism?

 

[Obliviax]

And didn't O'Brien's attorney insist that sanctions were one of the big reasons he was wanting to get out at Penn State? As in, he took the job with the understanding that sanctions weren't on the table, and now he can't win/compete? Dunno. Most folks here don't care because things worked out (and they believe Jones baited OB), but there's a good chance he could have done irreparable damage by leaving when he did - recruiting class could have fell apart and administration could have just said f*** it and went with some unknown coach from Bucknell or wherever.

What doesn't jive is that Franklin spoke to OB about the Penn State job and OB said he should go for it. Who, after suffering the wrath of Paterno People and having to endure such an awful working environment, would recommend the job to someone like Franklin, who was being talked about for every HC job from the Redskins to the Longhorns?

BOB wanted to coach in the NFL. Every head coach of every major program (college and pro) is going to have to eat a lot of crap sandwiches. BOB isn't swimming in praise right now, in Houston, despite some decent accomplishments relative to where they were when he went there. I think these issues were irritating to him, but blown out of proportion. His stock was peaking, the team was going to get worse (as sanctions hit) and he's not a college or PSU guy. It was a job.

 

[michnittlion]

I think you are WAY TOO thin skinned. Jay's suit had zero to do with BOB and everything to do with PSU. Don't forget, the University fired his dad then said they didn't fire them (despite the fact that they used the word "fired") and others have won similar suits. Sometimes, in law, law suits are filed knowing they can't be won on the merits, but you win in other ways (embarrass, gain information, apply pressure).

The others you are reading into what you want. So they had a decent 2012. First, Jay acknowledged that. He was simply saying you need to sustain to be able to correctly assess. Besides, BOB hadn't recruited a single player at a that point.

You are just a trouble maker.

I'm not causing trouble --- just pointing out that Jay is the one who included O'Brien's quote as "proof" (among other "proof" --- Jay's "case" got thrown out in court, of course) that he was negatively stigmatized in the 2011-2012 time span immediately following the Sandusky story breaking.

Jay was the one who brought up O'Brien. Jay was the one who thought O'Brien's quote was a negative stigmatization of him.

As for your 2nd paragraph - that Dennis Dodd article with Jay's quotes came out in May 2013. O'Brien had recruited an entire class by then.

 

[michnittlion]

Are former assistant coaches required to hit the talk show circuit to hype the past, present and future of the program they just left? Or is Jay getting singled out because his last name is Paterno? Why don't any of the other 2011 assistant coaches get the same criticism?

Jay and Bill Kenney are the only 2011 assistants who (1) sued Penn State and (2) referenced a Bill O'Brien quote among their "proof" that they were negatively stigmatized in the 2011-2012 time period.

If/when other coaches go suing the University --- while making silly arguments as part of their lawsuit --- I'll criticize them.

 

[MtNittany]

I'm not causing trouble --- just pointing out that Jay is the one who included O'Brien's quote as "proof" (among other "proof" --- Jay's "case" got thrown out in court, of course) that he was negatively stigmatized in the 2011-2012 time span immediately following the Sandusky story breaking.

Jay was the one who brought up O'Brien. Jay was the one who thought O'Brien's quote was a negative stigmatization of him.

As for your 2nd paragraph - that Dennis Dodd article with Jay's quotes came out in May 2013. O'Brien had recruited an entire class by then.

Do me a favor and put me on ignore. Every time you chime in on some otherwise innocuous thread I post, you leave it far worse than you found it.

 

[michnittlion]

Do me a favor and put me on ignore. Every time you chime in on some otherwise innocuous thread I post, you leave it far worse than you found it.

Why would I put you on ignore? I tend to disagree with you, but you post good content. That's a good article that you found.

I'm not sure what prompted your "GFY" --- maybe it was my comments regarding Jay Paterno --- but take note that I wasn't the first person (BBrown) who brought up Jay in this thread. Neither was I the second person (Obliviax). Neither was I the third person (LaJolla). Neither was I the fourth person (getmyjive).

 

[anon_xdc8rmuek44eq]

Are former assistant coaches required to hit the talk show circuit to hype the past, present and future of the program they just left? Or is Jay getting singled out because his last name is Paterno? Why don't any of the other 2011 assistant coaches get the same criticism?

How many former assistant coaches had fathers who coached for a school for six decades and who are still actively involved in the community? It's not like Jay lived in San Francisco or something. When asked about the program (which is meaningful to him in more ways than it is to your average assistant coach), he was rarely excited or enthused. Don't get me wrong - he's not obligated to be either, but for someone who put so much of his life into a place, his comments, or lack thereof, were very revealing IMO.

 

[Obliviax]

I'm not causing trouble --- just pointing out that Jay is the one who included O'Brien's quote as "proof" (among other "proof" --- Jay's "case" got thrown out in court, of course) that he was negatively stigmatized in the 2011-2012 time span immediately following the Sandusky story breaking.

Jay was the one who brought up O'Brien. Jay was the one who thought O'Brien's quote was a negative stigmatization of him.

As for your 2nd paragraph - that Dennis Dodd article with Jay's quotes came out in May 2013. O'Brien had recruited an entire class by then.

That case had nothing to do with Bill O'Brian. BOB had no commitments, contractual or other wise, to Jay. Jay filed a lawsuit against PSU and lost. Why would, or should, BOB be upset about that? It would be like BOB being upset at how Jay coached MRob.

And yeah, BOB recruited a class but they hadn't played yet. Jay said nothing negative about that class, he was simply saying that to be a great coach, one year doesn't cut it. And, to Jay's point, BOB is NOT a great PSU coach, because he left. Jay was correct, in the context of being a great PSU coach.

 

[NittPicker]

How many former assistant coaches had fathers who coached for a school for six decades and who are still actively involved in the community? It's not like Jay lived in San Francisco or something. When asked about the program (which is meaningful to him in more ways than it is to your average assistant coach), he was rarely excited or enthused. Don't get me wrong - he's not obligated to be either, but for someone who put so much of his life into a place, his comments, or lack thereof, were very revealing IMO.

When Joe was coaching many people said he was being selfish and should retire. They also said Jay was incompetent and should be fired. Yet when Jay was off the staff he was criticized for not being front and center to enthusiastically cheer on Dear Old State. The funny thing is those same people would have still criticized him if he was out in public promoting Penn State. They would have said he was stepping on the toes of the new coach. He was in a no win situation because there were many people who were eager to criticize him regardless of what he did.

 

[kgilbert78]

Fair enough. 2012 definitely deserves some recognition - I'd just prefer in a different spot.

And I'm confused in that I thought it *had* to be a championship or undefeated season for you to be allowed to honor it like that in your stadium.

 

[anon_xdc8rmuek44eq]

When Joe was coaching many people said he was being selfish and should retire. They also said Jay was incompetent and should be fired. Yet when Jay was off the staff he was criticized for not being front and center to enthusiastically cheer on Dear Old State. The funny thing is those same people would have still criticized him if he was out in public promoting Penn State. They would have said he was stepping on the toes of the new coach. He was in a no win situation because there were many people who were eager to criticize him regardless of what he did.

Jay can do what he wants as far as I'm concerned - he doesn't owe anything to anyone. Jay is smart enough to separate success of the football program from university administration, but he didn't.

And don't for a second downplay the role PennLive/David Jones had in manipulating O'Brien's departure to fit their agenda. This is from a Jones article in May of 2013...coincidence?

I think Penn State has a whole bunch of good people right now as coaches. I don't mean just in the revenue sports but in all of them. They aren't just hard working but they exude positive vibes when you talk to them. They don't bother with turf battles or snipe about who has what. They cooperate and help each other.

And that includes the guy at the top.

I am still trying to gauge Bill O'Brien because my access to him has been understandably limited. He has had a job to do unlike any other.

But one thing I like about O'Brien, from what I think I can accurately perceive so far, is that he is low on pretense. He is a football coach. He pretends to be nothing more.

In order to be an effective football coach at his level, you must have help and coordination. Many in support must row in cadence.

That has not been happening at Penn State. Instead, a group of self-appointed experts and charlatans feeding off them has taken a cause -- what they feel was the unjust treatment of Joe Paterno -- and hopped aboard it. For some, the cause is a way to make them seem noble. Some genuinely believe in it. Some are merely using it and the people involved to further their own more cynical interests.

A Penn State grad I know came up with a word for them: The Joebots. He calls them that because, at this point, their zeal cannot be unplugged. It would threaten their very beings.