It baffles the brain how you could have no problem with what MM did. He was direct witness to a child being compromised, according to HIM. And you're okay with him getting out of the locker room instead of figuring out what was going on and making SURE the kid was okay before leaving? Good God, I pray some of you aren't parents, teachers or guardians.
Breaking from Pennlive Curley and Shultz plead guilty.
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It baffles the brain how you could have no problem with what MM did. He was direct witness to a child being compromised, according to HIM. And you're okay with him getting out of the locker room instead of figuring out what was going on and making SURE the kid was okay before leaving? Good God, I pray some of you aren't parents, teachers or guardians.
Are you really trying to suggest that MM was incapable of filing a police report for 9 years?
I don't believe for a second that Harmon didn't know about 2001. That's what makes this whole story so troubling. If Harmon knew then the state has ZERO case against CSS. If he knew, why isn't he the one getting strung up by the state, he was an actual uniformed officer/mandatory reporter (as opposed to Schultz) who was the one providing info to Schultz as 98 was looked into. Harmon had intimate knowledge of the 98 investigation and is the person who told Schultz that LE determined nothing criminal happened.
He's also the person who conveniently changed the title of the 98 report to 'admin'.
Pure gold.
This is up there with "fondling isn't sexual" and "professional help meant an HR firm".
Do you have the rest of this document? Without context as to what these percentages mean it's not very informative. For example, this could be the percent of people that disagree with the statement. Why was Centre county not included?
Exactly. Just imagine if this was YOUR child and Mr McQuearly calmly walked out of a locker room, leaving your child, naked, in a shower, with a 60 year old grown suspected pedophile.
because Im being honest and not an internet cop. if i saw that id be freaked the **** out. i hope that id do something, but i cant say for sure. reality is that unless you have been there, you dont know how you'd react. so i cant kill MM for that.
I do know however, that if that is what i saw & nothing was being done after i told them, id sure as hell go back to Joe, Schultz or whomever and say, maybe i wasnt clear, but i saw Jerry Sandusky raping a kid that night. I can kill MM for this ...
Over time I've come to believe that the only person who did what he was supposed to do was JVP. He was told something about an incident that he did not witness involving someone who no longer worked for him. He made sure that that the person who DID witness it spoke directly with the people that he thought it should be reported to. He did exactly what the newest NCAA guidelines would have him do today, in fact.
I think everyone else failed to one degree or another- but letting the ONLY person who actually saw anything off the hook? And letting everyone associated with TSM off the hook? Well, that itself it off the hook.
Is "justice" being done by prosecuting CSS? I don't see how.
I think everyone else failed to one degree or another- but letting the ONLY person who actually saw anything off the hook? And letting everyone associated with TSM off the hook? Well, that itself it off the hook.
Is "justice" being done by prosecuting CSS? I don't see how.
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People freeze in traumatic, violent situations, this has been proven in studies.
What is unforgiveable, is not calling police.
again, assuming Mike actually saw this. if it was a stranger, Id wager heavily that Mike would have physically stopped it. however, it was not a stranger, it was a local legend
so that makes it even harder to kill him, even for not calling the police that night. but again, no excuse at all for his actions down the road
It was 9:30 at night and they were naked in a shower. Jesus Christ, get a grip.
I don't give a damn who it is, I don't care if it's freaking Howdy Doody or Uncle Joe, you call the damn cops.
We know your thoughts , some just say it would not have mattered. Sit tight and see what you think in a week or two .
Disagree. One of my best friends in this town was very close to Gricar, and says that Ray was a consummate professional and a good man. I trust this source implicitly and he has earned it.
It looks like Misder2 hasn't been on the board since last month. Here's Lubrano's post from yesterday:
https://bwi.forums.rivals.com/threa...ed-there-was-no-cover-up.169363/#post-2691807
On Mike first and foremost. He wasn't a child witnessing something and running to tell the adult. He was the adult who witnessed. He'll never be excused. Never ever.
You've mentioned this a few times. Do you mind summarizing the changes for my benefit? Thanks.
I've said multiple times that TSM skated here. That has nothing to do with CSS screwing Penn State to a tune of a quarter of a billion dollars.
I agree with you that in the moment I'm not sure exactly how I'd react but I'd like to think I'd call 911 at a minimum. Some internet tough guys like to say they'd knock Sandusky's block off, get the kid out of there, etc. I'm not sure I'd do any of that, especially given that in MM's shoes I'd have a pre-existing relationship with Sandusky, but I'm fairly confident I'd call 911 and do whatever the 911 operator or police told me to do once I was speaking to them.
Where you lose me is that you're stating you'd be more outraged and more motivated to take action in the weeks after the incident, than you would in the heat of the moment. That I don't agree with. If you wouldn't take action while actually witnessing child abuse, why do you think you'd be more motivated to take action afterwards, and after you already informed others that are supposed to take action? That doesn't make any sense, I expect that anyone's motivation would slowly fade as time passes and would never reach the peak it would be at in the heat of the moment.
ok then we are closer to being on the same page
however, I don't blame CSS 100% for the quarter of a billion dollars - think its not that simple - there appears to be some more blame to go around for that
huh, your 2nd paragraph makes no sense at all to me , people can freeze "in the moment". its not a matter of being "more outraged" or motivated at a later date. its simply being in a more clear state of mind to know what to do.
My point is that id have been willing to give C/S/S or whomever time to take care of the situation, and when it became clear nothing was being done, id have gone back to them. its not that hard to understand.
I'm not an internet cop but I am an adult and a parent, and a woman and I would've done more than MM did. I'm sorry that you can't say for sure what you'd do, but to me it's instinctive. It is a child we're talking about. It's not like he was trying to decide if a couple was play fighting or not. I'm not trying to be on a high horse here but damn he couldn't say "Hey Jerry, everything okay?" thereby getting a look at the kid's state? It might've given him the certainty that either all was good or something was not right.
So yes, I'm quite comfortable killing Mike for that.
This is a summary and my keyboard is acting up and it’s pissing me off so if the spelling is wrong I apologize (I’m actually an excellent typist)
Back then
The MR had to encounter the situation while in a work setting. So basically it wasn’t the PERSON that was the MR --- it was the PERSON plus the SITUATION
· That’s why Dr D was NOT a MR in that situation at that time (he was a MR but the situation did not align)
· Also none of CSS were MR’s at that time in that situation either
· The one person who absolutely was a MR was JR and TSM (again a little tangent but they failed miserably – they don’t get to determine how severe it was – if a report is made to them they must look into it)
From that point, if there was a report and it would go to Childline, etc
Maybe a side note or maybe not but if a report is made and it is deemed UNFOUNDED then the report will be expunged (like it never existed) – that is the damage that the 98 DPW ruling created !!
Again just for context there are two other options for a report
· INDICATED (meaning there is a more than 50% chance the accusation may be true)
· FOUNDED (your goose is cooked)
Now
They basically changed the law so that the EYE WITNESS who is a MR has an absolute requirement to report directly to Childline – NO TALKING TO ANYONE ELSE FIRST
· That is the part that would get MM in serious, serious trouble today
· MM is a MR by virtue of working for PSU – (the “situation” in this case does not matter)
Then, only AFTER that report is made, is a second “internal” report to be made. In this case this report is just to notify the agency/entity that a report has been made – nothing more.
In addition, today that would NOT be CSS and certainly not JVP
Does that help?
Well, then it's a shame that C/S/S cared so little about him and his legacy that they allowed the press to drag him through the mud instead of defend his actions based on what they were told and the law he supposedly followed.
Both you and I believe Elvis (apologies if it's not Elvis) have been reporting all along that you were aware that the incident was reported to Harmon. If Mike knew Harmon knew, then why are we even here? Why didn't Mike testify to that?
That would have stopped a lot of this mess right in its tracks. Harmon was the Chief of Police.
It's hard to defend someone elses legacy when you're worried about jail yourself.
Have you seen a lot of people who are under indictment making public statements? I haven't.
I will agree with you, but on this one, he blew it. I would not judge his entire career on this one case.
It lines up perfectly with quotes from Schultz and Curley. Except, they go further. They would have to make a complete 180 on the stand. And they used the words "horsing around" and "horseplay" with other witnesses. Not JUST Spanier.
Agree. He was in a nearly impossible situation and tried a move that had too high of a degree of difficulty.
or simply coming out and saying that directly to his dad, dranov, Joe, Tim, or Garry instead of beating around the bush and saying 10 years later that "I was sure I got my point across"
have you been in a similar situation? if the answer is no ... than you absolutely can not say what you would or would not have done for sure in the heat of that moment. you can say what you think you would do, but thats it
Have I been in a situation where I have questioned an adult about something suspect? Yes, absolutely have. And it involved another adult at that. Listen, there are folks who stand by and watch the train wreck and there are others who immediately react. I guess Mike is the former.
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If he pleas we will see various statements via FOIA requests. If there's a trial we get testimony. After any verdicts once it is final , the same thing applies .
