Ivey?
Aire and Gudmundsson were the obvious ones...there are some questions on Brown and Lilley as to how strong the encouragement was to move along.
Carey Booth enters transfer portal.
- Thread starter PSUWrestlingFanSince2011
- Start date
Aire and Gudmundsson were the obvious ones...there are some questions on Brown and Lilley as to how strong the encouragement was to move along.
Yep, Rhoades getting his people in place. Obviously the previous holdovers didn’t cut it. He just has to hold onto Ace and get three more in the portal to go with 4 enrolling frosh.
I don't think we know which players are leaving voluntarily and which players were shown the door.
I also don't think we know what players Rhoads is "getting in place". Most didn't even enter the portal until recently.
It is not the same. Different coach. Penn State hoops is not Penn State football. He is not going to be at PSU but you can think he will be if you want to.
He should go to UCLA. Cronin probably can use him judging from this past season's results.
Think he'd fit in well with what Rhoades' style...although I'm sure he'll land somewhere higher up the food chain.
I’ve seen some names of lower programs in the mix. Duquesne and Pepperdine
At this point, unless you are his agent or his Mom, it's not "will be" or "won't be".
Yes each situation is different, which is why you saying he won't is B.S. And I'm not saying he will, just that it's not over until it's over. Obviously he'll have many opportunities and PSU is not likely to be a favorite over a large number of those schools, so the odds are not with PSU. We all know that. But until he enrolls somewhere the past ties his family has with PSU does give some glimmer of hope.
I'm sure any Duquesne speculation is due to Lebron's ties to Dru Joyce. I'd be shocked if he actually dropped to a school at that level.
There were two other true freshmen starters on that team, and I'd take either/both over him. Shrews gave him a good shot, but he wasn't ready. Good luck to him in his travels.
Those days have been LONG gone, and the people complaining about today's situation were cheering on all the steps we took toward college sports becoming full-time employment as we rolled down that hill. Now they're looking around at what they helped create and saying "Wow! Someone messed up! Wasn't me! I'm outta here!"
Right. It must make you "feel good" to try and do this young man's thinking for him........
I agree why recruit save all the recruiting money and just buy what you need. This model without some well intended structure and a leveling of the playing field will fracture the sport. College will lose the fan that is about the school more than football. There are a lot of those
The players have been "employees" for a very long time. Now they're just better paid (in some situations). Playing football for a major program (and even lesser programs) was a full-time job for these kids. They realistically didn't have much time for a "real" education ... only the exceptions bucked that trend. Most were processed through with throwaway degrees, and their hand was held the entire way. I don't blame the kids ... that's how the system was set up. Focus on football ... even when you're technically not allowed to be "practicing," you're training for, and learning, football.
Prior, their renumeration for this was artificially reduced to free tuition (for that throwaway education) and board. And they were restricted in how they could move about in between employers. Meanwhile, everyone else was getting rich off their work.
Now they can move more freely from institution to institution, like any other student, and they can actually share in some of the spoils of their work ... and that's unappealing to you?
You wanted indentured servants for your amusement, not football players to cheer for.
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This sounds like lawyer talk to me. Indentured servants? There you go again. You’re a logical fallacy generating machine. I had friends on the Penn State football and baseball teams. None of them or their teammates had a throw away education. Just because money governs your life doesn’t mean the rest of the world looks at it that way.
PS check the other post with the story about college football is doomed and headed for bankruptcy. Looks like Kasparaitis right again!
I disagree. Regular students are paying customers who should be allowed to move about as they want. Scholarship players don't pay. I don't see a problem if schools offer a 4 year scholarship in exchange for 4 years of football. That's the contract between the school and the player and both sides are obligated to abide by the contract. That would be just like a professional sports contract.
Of course! But that’s not how the ambulance chasing lawyers see it. Why, don’t you realize these players who get free tuition, books, lodging, nutrition, health care, and the best professional athletic instruction for those very few who have the potential to make it a career in exchange for playing a game are really just indentured servants? I know, I know, we’ll just change the definition of indentured servants. Voila!
A general question in all of this is: How many "regular" students transfer 3,4 or 5 times during their academic journey?
Sometimes "college students" pick the wrong fit and switch schools. On occasion they pick a place for a specific major and then leave when either they don't get into the program, fail out, or change their major altogether. Kids do run out of money too. While at PSU we had a number of kids from my town transfer in during their upper years from Lafayette, UVM and other expensive schools.
The Junior College route is not as popular/accepted in the East as it is out West, but that is another path that could rationalize multiple stops during undergrad years.
There is nothing "regular" about jumping around like so many current student athletes do. Are their credits matriculating towards a PSU or other degree? Does that even matter?
I am a huge college football fan who by marital contract had watched limited pro games over the years. I'm going to switch that out this year to PSU and the Eagles with another big college game (Tennessee, Army, Wake or a top ranked matchup).
#Student Athlete = thing of the past (yes there are exceptions but overall it is a money grab). Not my cup of tea.
Sometimes "college students" pick the wrong fit and switch schools. On occasion they pick a place for a specific major and then leave when either they don't get into the program, fail out, or change their major altogether. Kids do run out of money too. While at PSU we had a number of kids from my town transfer in during their upper years from Lafayette, UVM and other expensive schools.
The Junior College route is not as popular/accepted in the East as it is out West, but that is another path that could rationalize multiple stops during undergrad years.
There is nothing "regular" about jumping around like so many current student athletes do. Are their credits matriculating towards a PSU or other degree? Does that even matter?
I am a huge college football fan who by marital contract had watched limited pro games over the years. I'm going to switch that out this year to PSU and the Eagles with another big college game (Tennessee, Army, Wake or a top ranked matchup).
#Student Athlete = thing of the past (yes there are exceptions but overall it is a money grab). Not my cup of tea.
Yes, this is one of those topics where even Stevie Wonder sees what’s coming and most everyone agrees on the outcome except the lawyers, naturally.
Scholarship players "don't pay" - they provide services worth a lot more than their "free" tuition in the exchange. Put another way ... non-scholarship students hand money over to the university in order to attend ... scholarship athletes in revenue-producing sports provide revenue to the university through their work as an athlete in order to attend.
Of course schools are free to try to provide 4-year schollies in exchange for 4 years of "service," but good luck with that now. There's still nothing preventing an athlete from breaking the contract and moving on, with the repercussions handled via typical contract law (and that wouldn't do much to dissuade a student-athlete from moving on). And other competitors will present something better to the student-athlete, without restrictive covenants (which almost certainly are not enforceable, regardless)
Do you really think Juan Soto can simply walk away from the Yankees before the playoffs because he doesn't want to get hurt before negotiating next year's free agent contract?
Why does IMG Academy charge so much for kids to attend? I assume the kids who go there think they're getting a lot more than a high school education.
If you want to treat them as actual employees, who can have agents, and negotiate terms ... that's fine. But you're not getting only a 4-year schollie out of that in exchange for a 4-year commitment to the program. That won't end well for the schools. And that gets into a whole realm of issues ... they wouldn't attach a scholarship for education as the sole, or even primary, compensation in that case. The education would be fully divorced from employment with the football team.
This is an irrelevancy.
People take entry-level jobs because they think they'll get the training, experience and opportunities to get promoted, or get a better job elsewhere. That doesn't mean you don't pay them market rates because they're somehow benefitting from working for you.
I'd rather they sign a binding contract than the free for all that currently exists.
But you were arguing that without NIL the only benefit players were receiving was the scholarship.
I'd rather dissuade 17 and 18-year-olds from signing employment contracts that are 4 years in length. This is especially the case when you're trying to tie schooling into it, as it appears you're still attempting to do.
Just to be clear, my preferred situation ... which will never happen ... is to hit the reset button and make college athletics about college education, first and foremost. No one is admitted to a school based on athletic ability. You apply, and are accepted, to an institution, based on your academic transcript. Only then can a college coach reach out to you and try to "recruit" you.
However, that's not happening. Too many people are making far too much money exploiting these kids to allow that to happen. So the natural end result is to disassociate the athletics from the academics. None of these affiliated revenue-producing athletics programs need to have kids actually attend the school. They're football (or basketball) employees. That's what they're there to do. They get paid accordingly. If part of that compensation package is a "free" education (whether while they're playing the sport, or after), so be it. That's great for them. But that's not a necessity.
But what isn't cool is the facade of claiming these kids are amateurs, and should be happy just getting a "free education" (that many of them don't get, and many more still get in name only), while everyone else profits off them like its big business. Because it is big business.
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I agree with you that kids should have to qualify for admission just like everybody else and that college sports should be played by college "students". As you say hit the reset button.
I disagree that these kids are being exploited. I think that the opportunity for a free education + free room & board + free clothing and supplies + free spending money + professional training in world class facilities and professional coaches is a pretty sweet deal. In fact most high school players would dream of being exploited like that and many would be willing to pay for the privilege. Have you ever been in the Lasch Building? The nutrition areas, gaming rooms, academic advisors, etc? Have you ever seen how these kids travel? The NFL has nothing on them.
Yes I know that the basketball and football programs profit but nearly all of that money is used to pay for low revenue sports like baseball, track, field hockey, etc.
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Plus a lot of the revenue goes to the intramural sports programs for all students, just not athletes. All the basketball courts, tennis, handball, volleyball, racket ball, weight rooms, swimming, and more.
At least…. It used to
I don't believe that Intercollegiate Athletics is funding any of that stuff.
Almost everything you listed as being a benefit is just stuff to make them happier as they go about being exploited at their full-time job of football, while they show up to their Sociology classes and get automatic passing grades. Yippee. That's the exploitation. It's supposed to be about an education. You're not unexploited because we feed you and give you clothes while you play/train for your game. And if it's not about education, pay them for what they do.
The fact that this revenue is used for other sports, if true, doesn't help the cause. Sports for sports. Something is missing there.
So Duke basketball would crumble before our eyes. The non athlete student who wants to go to Duke needs near a 4.0 GPA, way above a 4.0 like a 4.3 when looking at a weighted GPA with AP courses. 1500 SATs maybe 1450 and then some incredibly unique extracurricular activity that demonstrates leadership way beyond their age like founding a non profit. Pretty sure none of the Duke hoops players have a resume remotely approaching that so who knows what kind of team they would field. Take that example and just cascade it across every university for the most part. I know you said it would never happen and you are right. Heck if you did this by the letter of the law not sure what the collegiate sports landscape would look like but it would not resemble what it is today. These athletes are just green lighted into these schools and they are not subjected to any of the academic admissions standards that the non athlete student is.
In football's case many of them start collecting offers by summer after 9th grade or even earlier. Then I think it is just get a 2 0 if that and you are in. A football player in my son's school has an offer from Cal Berkeley among others, I think he has had it since before 10th grade. The funny thing is he hasn't even produced much on the field. Literally like 2 TD catches in his career as a Sophmore and Junior and that is against a bad team. Yet he has the measurables so, Wa Lah, here is an offer to one of the best academic institutions in the country and just finish out your high school career getting Cs. Meanwhile the non athlete needs a 4.0 or actually higher with a bunch of AP classes to get into Berkeley.
These kids are not remotely close academically to the regular student at least the majority of them who play football and basketball are not. Some are but it has to be a small minority. They don't meet the academic standards that the rest of the student body has to meet. So what do you do? That is the system and has been for years. Now we pay them on top of their scholarship. I think it is good they go to school but you could give them the option to not go then they don't have the scholarship but have their NIL. But I think if they want to go to the school then let them.
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Yup ... Duke would "crumble." I'm fine with that. You'd have students playing basketball, rather than basketball players being forced to take Rocks for Jocks to stay eligible. Those stud hoopers who have dreams of being a pro? That's up to the minor/developmental leagues. Your sport doesn't have those? Get them.
This is the problem. The folks in charge are making money hand over fist, so they're not going to let go of that. And the fan who cries about how this sport or that sport is now ruined ... well, all along they've been pushing for things that make the "college" sport more and more professional this whole time .. and now that they see where their desires naturally lead, they're crying about it.
Hell, you see it in baseball, which isn't a revenue sport in college. You have smart kids (or smart'ish) choosing to go to mediocre to poor academic schools just to play baseball. Idiots. Even with the current setup, 95% of college athletes should be using their sport as an opportunity to get into a better academic school than they'd otherwise qualify for (ignoring comparative cost and schollies).
