You're right. Those Philly Catholic school coaches can recruit as well the best college coaches in the country.
Coquese Washington out
- Thread starter Evan Ceg
- Start date
Classic CYA move. Coach Blah Blah didn't turn out too hot, but So and So Search Firm said it was a great hire. Not my fault.
The over/under is 8 posts.Happy Friday to you, too, Barry.We can count down the clock waiting for you to turn any thread into a diatribe against ICA/BoT. I appreciate your consistency.
I've got no problem with what she's doing in this case. Seems silly and wasteful to use a search firm, but all ADs seem to do it. Maybe one day Barbour will break the mold and think for herself and then I'll cheer. On second thought.......
Maybe I'm dense but I don't understand why picking a new women's basketball coach is so hard that a search firm needs to be paid.
First, you open Excel and in column A you list all the head and assistant coaches in every college basketball program in the US. This would result in about 800 or so names. Then in column B you put an X beside the ones who would never take a job at PSU -- like Geno Auriemma. Also, in column B you put an X beside those you don't want (e.g. you don't want the lowest assistant at Western Michigan Tech). You are probably left with a few hundred names. Next you study them, make some phone calls, and put them in order from most desirable to least desirable. Finally, you call the top candidates and set up interviews.
Why is this so hard that it requires a consultant? Finally, what if you don't get the absolute optimum women's basketball coach? Is this really that important to the university that big bucks need to be paid to a consultant? I don't think so.
I’d go with Shea Ralph.. anyone who has gone through the UConn Women’s Basketball system knows what it takes to win Championships...
The bucks aren't that big. It's also more efficient to have a search firm make the calls (though I wonder if anyone ever checks how many and to whom). Let the AD have a security blanket..
Search firms do more than identify candidates. They screen them and add a layer of anonymity between the client and the candidate. Haven’t many on this board been contacted by a search firm looking to fill a position? Well on second thought .....
At any rate a few days ago people were criticizing Sandy for not (yet) firing Washington. She did the right thing. So you’ve got nothing better to criticize but the fact that she’s using a search firm? Chill out.
Btw I’ll go on record for wanting Banghart to get the job although I have no idea whether she’s even remotely interested. Princeton is a nice place after all as we know from that other thread. Maybe the search firm can make an inquiry.
At any rate a few days ago people were criticizing Sandy for not (yet) firing Washington. She did the right thing. So you’ve got nothing better to criticize but the fact that she’s using a search firm? Chill out.
Btw I’ll go on record for wanting Banghart to get the job although I have no idea whether she’s even remotely interested. Princeton is a nice place after all as we know from that other thread. Maybe the search firm can make an inquiry.
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Sandy could raise enough money to replace Beaver Stadium, name the field after him, put the statue back, hire Coach K to take over men’s basketball and Geno to coach the women, fire half the added Assistant ADs, keep the department out of debt, and they’d still be criticizing her about any and everything.
I am going against the grain here- I don't have an issue with going through a search firm. But, it's Sandy and Penn State, so that means the end of humanity as we know it.
Search firms do a lot less when it comes to hiring coaches and ADs than they do when filling a position in the business world. That should be pretty obvious by the fees they receive and why the sector is dominated by niche firms as opposed to divisions of the major (executive search) firms.
You left out hell freezing over, which is more likely to occur during Barbour's tenure than any of the items you listed.
And rather than 20 different schools repeating the same task, the search firm gathers all that info at once and then can have the info ready for anyone that needs it.
As someone that deals with outsourcing every day, I know how many efficiencies can be gained by leveraging others rather than trying to recreate the wheel yourself. In 2019, I'd expect most major schools to be using a search firm for this type of job (whether they publically state it or not). The number of AADs on staff is irrelevant to this subject.
I was trying to keep it reasonable.
If reasonable is a criterion, how about the men's basketball team making money on an operating basis (i.e without the allocation of Big Ten revenue sharing).
I agree. You make sense. Whether a search firm is hired depends totally on the cost. If the cost is $20K then you hire the firm. If the cost is $500K then you do the job yourself. My hunch is that these search firms are few in number (maybe only one for women's basketball coaches) and charge a ridiculously high fee because they can get away with it. Also, my hunch is that the college athletic directors don't care much about the fee since it isn't coming out of their pocket.
If I'm an AD, I'd have more than a slight problem with a search firm I engaged doing that.
What is "that"? You'd have an issue with a search firm already having a database of every D1 head and assist coach with contact info, agent contact info, career trajectory, etc? I'm sure they've got a lot of that legwork already done, and it's a matter of them hitting up their database and tailoring the search criteria to that particular client to begin steering them in the right direction.
No sense in having someone at PSU start going from website to website for all 350 schools searching out who their coaches are and where they might fit in (like that poster that suggested it mentioned).
Laugh, but I’m not wrong. You’d be leading the charge bitching she hadn’t stopped it from raining on the stadium lots, or cured cancer.
There's a 25th anniversary festival in Mansfield, OH, this summer (where it was filmed).... I may go.
Female AD?
Lesbian?
Millionaire?
Some folks on here just can accept her and the diversity she represents. If you can play you can play.
Btw, from that earlier tweet about improvement being needed it sounded as if Chambers is on the hot seat too. It will be interesting to see how this all plays out with the Illinois and playoff games still remaining and the improvement in the team record during the past month. I was thinking he might be safe but perhaps not so much now.
If we replace Chambers I’d still be in favor of going after Earl Grant from the College of Charleston. It would be difficult to attract a big name here but he is sort of Franklin V2 in my opinion. We’ll see.
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Those data bases are readily available from professional organizations to which coaches and ADs belong. And, again, search firms are not identifying candidates for coaching jobs; they are running interference on the names that their clients give them. That's why the fees that firms who do this are a small percentage compared to those for searches in business. $52k to bring D J Durkin to Maryland. Pffftt!!
The last line ("Will be judged differently on trajectory") makes me think he's still okay, unless they go 0-2 in the next two. Then he might be done.
I once tried to dig up some info on those search firm fees ..... and except for BIG TIME Football Coaching hires, it was well under six figures, in most instances (that I found).
I can’t imagine anyone charging 1/2 that for a Women’s Hoops “Coaching Search”. Maybe $20-30,000-Ish? Something in that ballpark? - but that’s just my hunch based on the lack of importance of Women’s Hoops vs Football (not that they wouldn’t immediately double the rate, when they see its Barbour on the line
Maybe, sounds like a reasonable ballpark. Colleges would gag on what a major search firm would charge to bring someone in with a $5mm salary.
None of that is happening and Barbour is going on five years as AD. Maybe things just happen slower in the vicinity of State College.
I am not sure what CW is making now, but I saw in 2015 she was making $700K as a base salary, which at the time was tied for 2nd highest in the BIg 10. I imagine that was probably a result of when Michigan tried to hire her and her contract was re-negotiated so that she would stay here. Turns out that was a bad decision by PSU, but at the time it was looked at as the right thing to do.
Seeing that letter just brought a tear to my eye.I wonder if she received a letter like this one with the same instructions.
If Sandy had added $3M+ per year in the past 5 years to the b-ball budget to hire a better staff, improve budgets and facilities, people would be having a shit fit that she was spending money on a program that has rarely won, was turning a profit as is, and at a time when football has needed more resources/upgrades and athletic department finances were tenuous. Imagine telling Franklin he can’t get more money for assistants because we had to dump that money into basketball. No matter what she does, she’ll be wrong in some people’s eyes.
I think she was right to give Pat more time. He was slowly improving the play and the recruiting. Personally I fell off the Pat bandwagon last year, but his run at the end of the year had me with one foot back in. I pulled that foot off back in January. I think we’ve seen the best he can do. But to do it right in replacing him would cost millions more per year. It’s not just the head coach salary (which is going to be at least $1.5M above Pat), but that coach will demand a higher pool for better assistants, and improvements in other budgetary areas and facilities. Any coach not in a position to demand that or go elsewhere probably isn’t the kind of coach that can make a difference, unless we get lucky.
I want a bigger investment in basketball. But I understand why it hadn’t been done yet, if you look at the finances. I want to see Sandy figure out a way to make it work. But it might entail cutting a number of sports, and I dint know that the university would allow her to do that. We’ll see what happens.
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