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Did Eiermann transferring to Iowa cost him a championship?

RB-Old

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Jan 22, 2020
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After watching PSU's guys win with superior strategies it seems to me wrestling Nick Lee two weeks before nationals might have cost Eiermann. I know they'd met before but that fresh look at him had to be a big help for Nick and the coaching staff.
 
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Not sure if he would have still taken an olympic redshirt if he wasn't planning to transfer but had he wrestled at Missouri last year he never would have even made it to the championship finals since the tournament didn't happen.
 
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After watching PSU's guys win with superior strategies it seems to me wrestling Nick Lee two weeks before nationals might have cost Eiermann. I know they'd met before but that fresh look at him had to be a big help for Nick and the coaching staff.

I don't think the first match benefited Lee that much. Lee's endless gas tank was the biggest reason he won the rematch. Oddly, Eierman brought a different strategy at the NCAA final and actually initiated some offense, especially in the 1st period. He couldn't sustain initiating offense plus defending against Lee's constant pressure and gassed out.

Edit: on second thought, perhaps Eierman underestimated Lee in the rematch. He was on a bonus point roll coming into the final so maybe he thought he could also steam roll through Lee.
 
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I don't think the first match benefited Lee that much. Lee's endless gas tank was the biggest reason he won the rematch. Oddly, Eierman brought a different strategy at the NCAA final and actually initiated some offense, especially in the 1st period. He couldn't sustain initiating offense plus defending against Lee's constant pressure and gassed out.

Edit: on second thought, perhaps Eierman underestimated Lee in the rematch. He was on a bonus point roll coming into the final so maybe he thought he could also steam roll through Lee.
I respectfully disagree. Nick learned a lot from the first match and in case anyone wasn’t noticing he was consistently using his hand to palm contact the other side of Eirmanns head and headgear, seemingly to create both imbalance and a lot of distraction. (Left hand, inverting across Eiermans face to palm his left ear, for example). This was a constant feature of the match and Eierman even seemed to complain about it after he got his own finger in Nicks headgear.
Everyone has noted that Jaydin shot considerably more than in the first match. I suspect there was concern on their part that Nick controlled the first match on the feet and exposed Jaydin enough. They also assumed (correctly) that Nick would not choose down in the final. That meant Jaydin would have to create opportunity on the feet.
I think the Big Ten final played an enormous part in Nicks win.
 
I respectfully disagree. Nick learned a lot from the first match and in case anyone wasn’t noticing he was consistently using his hand to palm contact the other side of Eirmanns head and headgear, seemingly to create both imbalance and a lot of distraction. (Left hand, inverting across Eiermans face to palm his left ear, for example). This was a constant feature of the match and Eierman even seemed to complain about it after he got his own finger in Nicks headgear.
Everyone has noted that Jaydin shot considerably more than in the first match. I suspect there was concern on their part that Nick controlled the first match on the feet and exposed Jaydin enough. They also assumed (correctly) that Nick would not choose down in the final. That meant Jaydin would have to create opportunity on the feet.
I think the Big Ten final played an enormous part in Nicks win.

That makes sense.
 
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I respectfully disagree. Nick learned a lot from the first match and in case anyone wasn’t noticing he was consistently using his hand to palm contact the other side of Eirmanns head and headgear, seemingly to create both imbalance and a lot of distraction. (Left hand, inverting across Eiermans face to palm his left ear, for example). This was a constant feature of the match and Eierman even seemed to complain about it after he got his own finger in Nicks headgear.
Everyone has noted that Jaydin shot considerably more than in the first match. I suspect there was concern on their part that Nick controlled the first match on the feet and exposed Jaydin enough. They also assumed (correctly) that Nick would not choose down in the final. That meant Jaydin would have to create opportunity on the feet.
I think the Big Ten final played an enormous part in Nicks win.
Eierman may have shot more, but they were straight on from space. Maybe his nick name should be predictable rather than the Riddler. Chasing Nick Lee is a foolish strategy.
 
If what played out on the mat was the strategy going in...brands got out coached.

JE is in shape so maybe the moment of the evening zapped him.

Curious to see how he does at trials
 
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The biggest difference, IMO, was Nick not choosing down. Eierman did put a brutal ride on him at Big 10s and Nick learned to avoid that and that he is superior to Eierman on his feet, especially in the 3rd period with Eierman gassing like Cowboys around the campfire after a bean dinner. (credit to Mel Brooks).
 
I respectfully disagree. Nick learned a lot from the first match and in case anyone wasn’t noticing he was consistently using his hand to palm contact the other side of Eirmanns head and headgear, seemingly to create both imbalance and a lot of distraction. (Left hand, inverting across Eiermans face to palm his left ear, for example). This was a constant feature of the match and Eierman even seemed to complain about it after he got his own finger in Nicks headgear.
Everyone has noted that Jaydin shot considerably more than in the first match. I suspect there was concern on their part that Nick controlled the first match on the feet and exposed Jaydin enough. They also assumed (correctly) that Nick would not choose down in the final. That meant Jaydin would have to create opportunity on the feet.
I think the Big Ten final played an enormous part in Nicks win.
No doubt it helped Lee to have faced him. Avoiding down was a good move. But my perception is that, for the most part, Cael has his guys mentally and physically peaking at nationals. I don't know what his secret is. Iowa never seems quite as focused or confident at nationals. They tend to lose close matches or even lose to lower-seeded wrestlers. Now under Gable, that was a whole different deal. I've always felt that Iowa wasn't necessarily that much better than everyone (some definite exceptions) in that time period, but that Gable knew what made his wrestlers tick and was able to get them to believe they could win.
 
I think Eierman thought if he got a first period takedown, the match was basically over. He went after it when he was fresh, but didn't adjust when it didn't come and wore himself out. Lee did a great job of weathering that storm and staying out of danger early and then turning it on late.
 
No doubt it helped Lee to have faced him. Avoiding down was a good move. But my perception is that, for the most part, Cael has his guys mentally and physically peaking at nationals. I don't know what his secret is. Iowa never seems quite as focused or confident at nationals. They tend to lose close matches or even lose to lower-seeded wrestlers. Now under Gable, that was a whole different deal. I've always felt that Iowa wasn't necessarily that much better than everyone (some definite exceptions) in that time period, but that Gable knew what made his wrestlers tick and was able to get them to believe they could win.

I think the secret is always preaching the same message of relax, be aggressive and have fun. Iowa’s wrestler look miserable and tight. Penn State’s loose and happy.
 
Didn’t JE and Iowa’s coaching staff have a chance to see Nick and then game plan and make adjustments also? Perhaps they didn’t think they needed to make any adjustments. 🤔
 
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In the end, watching Nick kick Rivera’s butt and gas out the Riddler was one of my highlights.

Nick Lee has been consistently underrated and overlooked and he keeps taking big names down. I’d actually like to see him go up to 149 and try to take out Yianni and prevent him winning 4
 
I think it's clear that Nick and the coaches adjusted to Eierman since the B1Gs, but also think Eierman is near enough in skill to flip this result down the road. They're so closely matched.

Just rewatched this match and it was easily, I think, the most entertaining of the night. Both guys came really close to scoring multiple times, and both were chain wrestling. So many great sequences.

It's just speculation, but I have to think the match was basically over when Lee chose neutral in the third and got that first takedown. I get that the choice was made, in all likelihood, to prevent a repeat of the rideout at the B1Gs, but the decision also essentially required Lee to get two takedowns to win, instead of an escape plus a takedown. Lee got that takedown relatively easily, and Eierman was noticeably tired at that point. It seemed at that point that Lee's second TD was only a matter of time.

Noteworthy too that in the semi vs Myers, RBY chose neutral in the third with the score tied, forcing him to get a takedown in the third. Mentally, that has to play a bit with the opponent, most of whom have already calculated that they're giving up an E1. It's a bit of a queen's gambit, sacrificing an easily gettable point because you're confident enough that you've got a takedown in you.
 
I think it's clear that Nick and the coaches adjusted to Eierman since the B1Gs, but also think Eierman is near enough in skill to flip this result down the road. They're so closely matched.

Just rewatched this match and it was easily, I think, the most entertaining of the night. Both guys came really close to scoring multiple times, and both were chain wrestling. So many great sequences.

It's just speculation, but I have to think the match was basically over when Lee chose neutral in the third and got that first takedown. I get that the choice was made, in all likelihood, to prevent a repeat of the rideout at the B1Gs, but the decision also essentially required Lee to get two takedowns to win, instead of an escape plus a takedown. Lee got that takedown relatively easily, and Eierman was noticeably tired at that point. It seemed at that point that Lee's second TD was only a matter of time.

Noteworthy too that in the semi vs Myers, RBY chose neutral in the third with the score tied, forcing him to get a takedown in the third. Mentally, that has to play a bit with the opponent, most of whom have already calculated that they're giving up an E1. It's a bit of a queen's gambit, sacrificing an easily gettable point because you're confident enough that you've got a takedown in you.
Disagree somewhat. If an opponent chooses Neutral it's because he sucks on bottom. Guys that are really good on top know that is a possibility going in.
 
No doubt it helped Lee to have faced him. Avoiding down was a good move. But my perception is that, for the most part, Cael has his guys mentally and physically peaking at nationals. I don't know what his secret is. Iowa never seems quite as focused or confident at nationals. They tend to lose close matches or even lose to lower-seeded wrestlers. Now under Gable, that was a whole different deal. I've always felt that Iowa wasn't necessarily that much better than everyone (some definite exceptions) in that time period, but that Gable knew what made his wrestlers tick and was able to get them to believe they could win.
Quentin Wright, national champion.
 
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I think Eierman's own ego did him in.

What was his quote? Something along the lines of, "It should have been way worse but it's a learning point." Was that it?

It's one thing if you're a transcendent wrestler like Zain Retherford who just puts it on everyone on the mat, who expects to pin or tech everyone (yet, would never say something like this, FWIW). A guy who isn't even thinking about doing it; it just happens. Sorry, but Eierman isn't that dude. The fact that he was even thinking that he needed to, or COULD, increase his offensive output against a wrestler that could have very easily beaten him makes me raise a quizzical eyebrow. I think he was so focused on trying to dominate a wrestler he simply can't that he exhausted himself in the process.
 
I respectfully disagree. Nick learned a lot from the first match and in case anyone wasn’t noticing he was consistently using his hand to palm contact the other side of Eirmanns head and headgear, seemingly to create both imbalance and a lot of distraction. (Left hand, inverting across Eiermans face to palm his left ear, for example). This was a constant feature of the match and Eierman even seemed to complain about it after he got his own finger in Nicks headgear.
Everyone has noted that Jaydin shot considerably more than in the first match. I suspect there was concern on their part that Nick controlled the first match on the feet and exposed Jaydin enough. They also assumed (correctly) that Nick would not choose down in the final. That meant Jaydin would have to create opportunity on the feet.
I think the Big Ten final played an enormous part in Nicks win.
Agreed. To my eye, Nick controlled that match from start to finish due to the lessons learned and adjustments made from the B1G match. And by "controlled that match" I mean that it looked to me like Eierman was compelled to change his strategy in real-time in response to what Nick was doing from the first whistle to the last. It almost looked like Eierman was confused by Nick's gameplan and started taking more shots and trying things that would work only against an inferior opponent.

But my question is slightly different than the OP. I wonder if PSU benefitted by only facing Iowa once before Nationals. Might Eierman and Kemerer have made successful adjustments last week if, for example, they had won the regular season dual but lost at B1Gs?
 
... [Choosing neutral]'s a bit of a queen's gambit, sacrificing an easily gettable point because you're confident enough that you've got a takedown in you.
I thought the point of taking neutral is that the escape point is not easy to get against this opponent, and if the escape comes too late or never, then instead of an escape point, you get no point or lose a point due to riding time, and you don’t even have as much time to score from neutral to compensate.
 
Disagree somewhat. If an opponent chooses Neutral it's because he sucks on bottom. Guys that are really good on top know that is a possibility going in.

Lee doesn't suck on bottom. He had some difficulty his true freshman year but that was it. Like @apoharrow said, it was obvious that Lee would take neutral in the rematch after what happened at Bigs.
 
I think it's clear that Nick and the coaches adjusted to Eierman since the B1Gs, but also think Eierman is near enough in skill to flip this result down the road. They're so closely matched.

Just rewatched this match and it was easily, I think, the most entertaining of the night. Both guys came really close to scoring multiple times, and both were chain wrestling. So many great sequences.

It's just speculation, but I have to think the match was basically over when Lee chose neutral in the third and got that first takedown. I get that the choice was made, in all likelihood, to prevent a repeat of the rideout at the B1Gs, but the decision also essentially required Lee to get two takedowns to win, instead of an escape plus a takedown. Lee got that takedown relatively easily, and Eierman was noticeably tired at that point. It seemed at that point that Lee's second TD was only a matter of time.

Noteworthy too that in the semi vs Myers, RBY chose neutral in the third with the score tied, forcing him to get a takedown in the third. Mentally, that has to play a bit with the opponent, most of whom have already calculated that they're giving up an E1. It's a bit of a queen's gambit, sacrificing an easily gettable point because you're confident enough that you've got a takedown in you.

^^^^^This^^^^^
Eirman is a fantastic wrestler! One of the most dominant wrestlers this season and his whole career. Our Nick Lee wrestled perhaps his best folk match ever on Saturday night. Taking my blue white glasses off it was still the best match of the night.
 
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Disagree somewhat. If an opponent chooses Neutral it's because he sucks on bottom. Guys that are really good on top know that is a possibility going in.
Sure, in some situations that's true, with guys known to be top riders. But by and large, top tier guys can get out from bottom against almost anyone. Granted, that wasn't true with respect to Lee and Eierman in the B1Gs, but did anyone think RBY couldn't have gotten out from under Myers? And given Lee's gas tank vs Eierman going into the third last Saturday, it's more likely that Lee could've gotten that E1 soon enough. It's not so cut and dried that the decision to take neutral is only because a guy sucks on bottom (or an opponent is great on top), my only point was that it's unusual and can throw an opponent's expectations, and it's gutsy because you're (usually) leaving a point on the table.
 
Nick Lee has always had a great gass tank but what impresses me the most is how he has improved since a freshman to now.

His neutral defense is much better and his reshots just wear down and mentally break his opponents.

His bottom game is worlds better. He is much better staying on his base and doing that little hip heist for the escape. He now gets away from the best.

His ability to scramble is now amazing. This Big10 Semifinals against Rivera in the third period and overtime was fantastic. Best match of the tournament. He never yielded position and kept on Wrestling until he earned the points.

I like that he has taken over as a leader of this young team.
 
Nick Lee has always had a great gass tank but what impresses me the most is how he has improved since a freshman to now.

His neutral defense is much better and his reshots just wear down and mentally break his opponents.

His bottom game is worlds better. He is much better staying on his base and doing that little hip heist for the escape. He now gets away from the best.

His ability to scramble is now amazing. This Big10 Semifinals against Rivera in the third period and overtime was fantastic. Best match of the tournament. He never yielded position and kept on Wrestling until he earned the points.

I like that he has taken over as a leader of this young team.

It makes you excited to see him take the next step into Zain-style, bonus point machine doesn’t it?
 
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