ADVERTISEMENT

"How the Battle of Saipan Ended the Japanese Empire" article. Tom?

Care to weigh-in sir?

Any other historian affectionato's (sp?)

Thank you all in advance.

https://nationalinterest.org/blog/buzz/how-battle-saipan-ended-japanese-empire-66742
I was stationed on Guam from 1992 - 1994 and I am familiar with topography of the Marianas Islands. Rough terrain to attack, gain ground and hold. You're talking about smallish islands that are not easy to move on, so be even today. By the way, the indigenous Chammorro people - very few who are still living on Guam - still do not look fondly on America even though they are U.S.citizens. Guam was in many ways a great assignment but you are way out there (about 7 hrs by air from Hawaii) @ the end of the supply chain. Today, Guam and the Marianas Islands remain strategically important because of the Communist Chinese and North Korean threats. Let me also mention we experienced 2 major typhoons and an 8.2 earthquake while stationed there. Also still electrical load shedding going on on the islands. That region is home to the 'Marianas Trench', deepest part of the Pacific Ocean. There is one location in the island chain with about 150 sunken Japanese naval vessels.
 
Last edited:
I was stationed on Guam from 1992 - 1994 and I am familiar with topography of the Marianas Islands. Rough terrain to attack, gain ground and hold. You're talking about smallish islands that are not easy to move on, so be even today. By the way, the indigenous Chammorro people - very few who are still living on Guam - still do not look fondly on America even though they are U.S.citizens. Guam was in many ways a great assignment but you are way out there (about 7 hrs by air from Hawaii) @ the end of the supply chain. Today, Guam and the Marianas Islands remain strategically important because of the Communist Chinese and North Korean threats. Let me also mention we experienced 2 major typhoons and an 8.2 earthquake while stationed there. Also still electrical load shedding going on on the islands. That region is home to the 'Marianas Trench', deepest part of the Pacific Ocean. There is one five location with about 150 sunken Japanese naval vessels.

Thank you sir!

very good stuff.

Thanks for serving!!!
 
Let me preface this be admitting that hindsight is easy-

I would argue that we should have made the Pacific even more of a Navy war than it was, and skipped many of the island invasions entirely. Once we won at Midway, Japan's fate was sealed- they could not replace their lost carriers OR pilots quickly enough to stop us at that point, and our shipbuilding was at a volume that even now is difficult to grasp. We could have (in fact we did) destroy virtually their entire navy and strangled the Home Islands. Yes, we needed some airbases for heavy bombers, but we took islands that could have been bypassed- and those islands were taken at a dreadful cost
 
Let me preface this be admitting that hindsight is easy-

I would argue that we should have made the Pacific even more of a Navy war than it was, and skipped many of the island invasions entirely. Once we won at Midway, Japan's fate was sealed- they could not replace their lost carriers OR pilots quickly enough to stop us at that point, and our shipbuilding was at a volume that even now is difficult to grasp. We could have (in fact we did) destroy virtually their entire navy and strangled the Home Islands. Yes, we needed some airbases for heavy bombers, but we took islands that could have been bypassed- and those islands were taken at a dreadful cost

Admiral Nimitz disagrees.
I was stationed on Guam from 1992 - 1994 and I am familiar with topography of the Marianas Islands. Rough terrain to attack, gain ground and hold. You're talking about smallish islands that are not easy to move on, so be even today. By the way, the indigenous Chammorro people - very few who are still living on Guam - still do not look fondly on America even though they are U.S.citizens. Guam was in many ways a great assignment but you are way out there (about 7 hrs by air from Hawaii) @ the end of the supply chain. Today, Guam and the Marianas Islands remain strategically important because of the Communist Chinese and North Korean threats. Let me also mention we experienced 2 major typhoons and an 8.2 earthquake while stationed there. Also still electrical load shedding going on on the islands. That region is home to the 'Marianas Trench', deepest part of the Pacific Ocean. There is one five location with about 150 sunken Japanese naval vessels.

Admiral Nimitz disagrees sir.

Wasn't THIS his battle plan who won-out over MacArthur's??
 
Nit1300.....you are absolutely correct, the shipbuilding (which had already started well prior to Pearl Harbor) was absolutely mind blowing.

Even if the Japanese had pulled off their surprise at Midway, it probably would have extended the Pacific war by only maybe 6 months to a year. Japan really had only very minimal shipbuilding capacity to try to replace their losses as the war went along while the US was churning out warship after warship after warship.
 
Admiral Nimitz disagrees.


Admiral Nimitz disagrees sir.

Wasn't THIS his battle plan who won-out over MacArthur's??
I’m embarrassed to admit that I’ve forgotten the major details of the Pacific theatre after all I’ve read about WWII. FDR and Marshall divided the theatre with Nimitz given the Central Pacific and MacArthur the western Pacific. Nimitz’s island hopping strategy put Japan in range of American air power which ultimately led to the end of the war. MacArthur was fixated on the Philippines, a campaign that might not have been worth the cost, IMHO.
 
I was stationed on Guam from 1992 - 1994 and I am familiar with topography of the Marianas Islands. Rough terrain to attack, gain ground and hold. You're talking about smallish islands that are not easy to move on, so be even today. By the way, the indigenous Chammorro people - very few who are still living on Guam - still do not look fondly on America even though they are U.S.citizens. Guam was in many ways a great assignment but you are way out there (about 7 hrs by air from Hawaii) @ the end of the supply chain. Today, Guam and the Marianas Islands remain strategically important because of the Communist Chinese and North Korean threats. Let me also mention we experienced 2 major typhoons and an 8.2 earthquake while stationed there. Also still electrical load shedding going on on the islands. That region is home to the 'Marianas Trench', deepest part of the Pacific Ocean. There is one five location with about 150 sunken Japanese naval vessels.
Let me preface this be admitting that hindsight is easy-

I would argue that we should have made the Pacific even more of a Navy war than it was, and skipped many of the island invasions entirely. Once we won at Midway, Japan's fate was sealed- they could not replace their lost carriers OR pilots quickly enough to stop us at that point, and our shipbuilding was at a volume that even now is difficult to grasp. We could have (in fact we did) destroy virtually their entire navy and strangled the Home Islands. Yes, we needed some airbases for heavy bombers, but we took islands that could have been bypassed- and those islands were taken at a dreadful cost
True, looking back as you said.
 
I’m embarrassed to admit that I’ve forgotten the major details of the Pacific theatre after all I’ve read about WWII. FDR and Marshall divided the theatre with Nimitz given the Central Pacific and MacArthur the western Pacific. Nimitz’s island hopping strategy put Japan in range of American air power which ultimately led to the end of the war. MacArthur was fixated on the Philippines, a campaign that might not have been worth the cost, IMHO.
Because he lost the Philippines to Japan at the start of the war and wanted to undo that embarrassment.
 
I was able to travel to Saipan for work. Very unusual territory, culturally and economically.

If you are a history buff, and get the opportunity to go, I'd recommend it. There are lots of rusted out tanks all over the place, and you can tour the "Last Command Post" which is a cave/tunnel system that was the last hiding place for the Japanese leaders.

One of the more disturbing things is that when it became clear that the Japanese weren't going to hold the island, they were around telling the local civilians that the Americans were going to rape and torture everyone, so they would be better off killing themselves before the American force arrived. Hundreds (perhaps 1000) people killed themselves by jumping off a cliff into the ocean (now known as Bazai Cliff).

Speaking of naval activities during WWII, in the build up for the war in the Pacific, the US Navy thought that American Samoa was going to be very important because of how deep/safe Pago Pago harbor is. But because of the way the war went, nothing really happened in Samoa. However, there are two big gun batteries on the mountain above the harbor and almost every bay on the island has multiple cement machine gun bunkers guarding the bays. Pretty cool stuff.
 
My grandfather fought in the Battle of Saipan...can’t really give you details beyond that, since he never talked about it.

My father-in-laws father (wife’s grandfather) also fought in the Pacific. My FIL was reading a book on the Battle of the Bulge, looks at a random picture on one of the pages, and sure enough it was his father. He actually contacted the author to find out more about the photo, but it was just some random photo he came across while writing the book.

Great photos posted above by the way. The 2nd from the last photo...with a marine in the foreground, side profile...looks a lot like my grandfather. And he had the exact same huge crooked nose to match. Don’t think it’s him, but definitely a resemblance.
 
One of the more disturbing things is that when it became clear that the Japanese weren't going to hold the island, they were around telling the local civilians that the Americans were going to rape and torture everyone, so they would be better off killing themselves before the American force arrived. Hundreds (perhaps 1000) people killed themselves by jumping off a cliff into the ocean (now known as Bazai Cliff).

That was covered a good bit on page 4 of the link provided by the OP. They ended the segment on the civilians killing themselves with this statement:

"No one knows the exact count of the dead, but it was later estimated that 15,000 civilians lost their lives during the battle."

I actually found that sentence somewhat disappointing, in that the segment of the article in which it was contained focused exclusively on the civilians killing themselves, but the closing sentence dealt with the total estimated deaths of civilians during the battle for Saipan.
 
  • Like
Reactions: TheGLOV
I disagree with some of the points made above. 1. While the Battle for Saipan led to the downfall of Tojo and the naval battle led to the end of Japan's carrier force, Japan still had many surface ships to include the 2 huge battleships of the Yamato class. It was the invasion of the Philippines that led to the destruction of most of this surface fleet. 2. The invasion of the Philippines was required to restore US prestige in the islands and to cut Japanse access to the oil in the Dutch East Indies (Indonesia). This is not to take away from the battle of Saipan as it provided air bases to bomb Japan directly.
 
Somewhat related, but saw the new Spiderman movie and mine had a preview for "Midway" coming out in November and it looked good.
 
  • Like
Reactions: TheGLOV
I disagree with some of the points made above. 1. While the Battle for Saipan led to the downfall of Tojo and the naval battle led to the end of Japan's carrier force, Japan still had many surface ships to include the 2 huge battleships of the Yamato class. It was the invasion of the Philippines that led to the destruction of most of this surface fleet. 2. The invasion of the Philippines was required to restore US prestige in the islands and to cut Japanse access to the oil in the Dutch East Indies (Indonesia). This is not to take away from the battle of Saipan as it provided air bases to bomb Japan directly.
Yamato


Musashi



As events proved, battleships without air cover were sitting ducks. Even our superior Iowas, which had better fire control and antiaircraft guns, did not go without air cover.
 
My brother and I have a personal interest in the Philippines, following are sampling of some views from various historians refered to in a senior paper....the complete paper is found in the link below

The Bastards of Bataan:
General Douglas MacArthur’s Role in the
Fall of the Philippines during World War II
Link:
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...WMAh6BAgFEAE&usg=AOvVaw1LqcpzKKmRMecA7eCdWuB0


...Here, on Bataan, Kennedy argues, MacArthur made another mistake by doing nothing to help rally his men. In fact he saw them only once during the months they were on Bataan and he was on the small island fortress Corregidor. Feeling very much abandoned and desolate the soldiers on Bataan soon nicknamed MacArthur, “Dugout Doug”, and started referring to themselves as the “Battling Bastards of Bataan.”...


Stanley Falk addresses the effectiveness of War Plan Orange-3 in “The Army inthe Southwest Pacific.” Since the acquisition of the Philippines the United States government had struggled with how best to defend them.
Here then began War Plan Orange-3 which was the final plan for the Philippines defense.

In this plan the major portion of the Islands would be lost to the Japanese, but the American and Filipino forces would hold Manila Bay until the Navy could acquire the needed men and supplies to
retake the Philippines.

Falk, however, is very critical of this plan, pointing out that as
early as 1941 many believed this plan to be impossible, due to the unexpected strength of the Japanese Army. Thus, because of previous arrangements made by Roosevelt and Churchill of focusing their efforts on Europe first, the liberation of the Philippines from the Japanese would have to wait until Nazi Germany was defeated. Perhaps worse than War Plan Orange-3, Falk believes that MacArthur’s plan for the defense of the Philippines was unrealistic and overly optimistic. He even went as far as to argue
“…that the emphasis on the operations in the Southwest Pacific, in large part due to the ‘forceful presence’ of MacArthur, was a waste of resources.” Falk argues that MacArthur’s continual push for the defense of the Philippines was misguided and unwarranted. He believed that the Philippines were of no strategic significance to the United States, and that instigating War Plan Orange-3, although flawed, at the beginning of the war would have saved many lives. He argues that the Japanese would have surrendered the Philippines when they lost the war, and that building up of logistical
supplies on Bataan would have kept many of the men alive until help arrived.

Falk sees the defense of the Philippines as MacArthur’s “project” and not as any lasting significance in retrospect to the rest of the war, but as an unnecessary loss of life. Perhaps the most quoted and widely acknowledged MacArthur historian, Louis Morton, is often the most critical of the General. In such writings as The Decision to Withdraw to Bataan, The Battling Bastards of Bataan, Egotist in Uniform and The Fall of the Philippines, Morton divulges the controversy surrounding MacArthur. He even goes
as far as to say that “…with everything involving MacArthur we are faced with
contradiction.”
One of these contradictions centered on War Plan Orange-3. Morton
points out that War Plan Orange-3 was a joint Army and Navy plan, and much like Morton is very critical of MacArthur’s sudden enactment of War Plan Orange-3. Morton asserts that MacArthur waited too long to withdraw to Bataan and as a result did not leave himself sufficient time to gather the necessary supplies.

Like Anderson and Beck, Morton sees this as MacArthur’s biggest failure; arguing that there were more than enough signs to clue MacArthur into the fact that his men were unprepared and no match for the Japanese. However, Morton is also very critical of MacArthur when he does decide to retreat to Bataan after loosing drastically to the Japanese, he argues that without
acquiring the much needed food, water, medical and other military supplies the soldiers were being led to their doom.It then became the effects of disease and starvation which forced the men to surrender.

David Kennedy in Freedom from Fear argues that MacArthur had enough time
and resources to mount a counterattack on the Japanese at Formosa following the attack on Pearl Harbor. Kennedy calls MacArthur’s failure to do so incredible and unforgivable.45 The result was the elimination of the United States Air Force in the Far East and the sacrifice of the men, both American and Filipino on the Philippines. This Air Force was MacArthur’s “…claim to be able to defend the Philippines indefinitely.” With this much needed source destroyed MacArthur was forced to withdraw to Bataan.

Here, on Bataan, Kennedy argues, MacArthur made another mistake by doing nothing to help rally his men. In fact he saw them only once during the months they were on Bataan and he was on the small island fortress Corregidor. Feeling very much abandoned and desolate the soldiers on Bataan soon nicknamed MacArthur, “Dugout Doug”, and started referring to themselves as the “Battling Bastards of Bataan.”

This is significant because it shows the state of the soldiers at the time of the attacks by the Japanese. They were no match for the Japanese and unprepared to hold out against them on Bataan.

The fall of the Philippines will forever be remembered as “…the worse defeat yet
suffered by the United States, a source of national humiliation.”

Thousands of soldiers lost their lives at the hands of the Japanese as well as to the fatal affects of diseases. Their sacrifice goes beyond anything that can be comprehended and understood by those who didn’t experience it. It is their sacrifice and experiences which were the real consequences of the fall.

“We’re the battling Bastards of Bataan
No mama, no papa, and no Uncle Sam,
No aunts, no uncles, no nephews, no nieces,
No rifles, no planes or artillery pieces,
And nobody gives a damn!
“We are MacArthur’s bastards
A fighting in Bataan
With neither father nor mother
Nor their old Uncle Sam.”​
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: TheGLOV
Yamato

Ironically it was the Japanese demonstration of naval air power (carriers) at Pearl Harbor that marked the end of the era of battleships.

While Japan may have had some semblance of surface vessels remaining late in the war, fuel was in short supply. You can't win a war without fuel. Even Yamamoto knew that the longer the war carried on the more certain the US would win, just based on industrial capacity alone.

My stepfather was in the US Navy in WW2, he participated in the Nomandy invasion but also made it to the Pacific for the invasion planning. He was never a big fan of MacArthur and felt the Philippine campaign was more political than strategic. Then again, war and politics are inextricably linked.



Musashi



As events proved, battleships without air cover were sitting ducks. Even our superior Iowas, which had better fire control and antiaircraft guns, did not go without air cover.
 
  • Like
Reactions: TheGLOV
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guy_Gabaldon

Intersting movie about Saipan released in 1960 called "Hell to Eternity." Starring Jeff Hunter, it was about a Mexican boy who grew up in LA with a Japanese family and learned the language and culture. He enlisted with the marines and served in Saipan. Through his ability to speak the language, he convinced about 1,500 Japanese soldiers to surrender. In the movie he was portrayed as "Gabby" amd real name was Gabaldon. I believe he was awarded a Medal of Honor but not sure. He did get a Navy Cross. An interesting but minor movie.

Here is a link to the Wiki on him.
 
I’m embarrassed to admit that I’ve forgotten the major details of the Pacific theatre after all I’ve read about WWII. FDR and Marshall divided the theatre with Nimitz given the Central Pacific and MacArthur the western Pacific. Nimitz’s island hopping strategy put Japan in range of American air power which ultimately led to the end of the war. MacArthur was fixated on the Philippines, a campaign that might not have been worth the cost, IMHO.
Ian Toll has a fantastic trilogy that you should check out. The first two books are available and the final one is released next year.
 
My brother and I have a personal interest in the Philippines, following are sampling of some views from various historians refered to in a senior paper....the complete paper is found in the link below

The Bastards of Bataan:
General Douglas MacArthur’s Role in the
Fall of the Philippines during World War II
Link:
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...WMAh6BAgFEAE&usg=AOvVaw1LqcpzKKmRMecA7eCdWuB0


...Here, on Bataan, Kennedy argues, MacArthur made another mistake by doing nothing to help rally his men. In fact he saw them only once during the months they were on Bataan and he was on the small island fortress Corregidor. Feeling very much abandoned and desolate the soldiers on Bataan soon nicknamed MacArthur, “Dugout Doug”, and started referring to themselves as the “Battling Bastards of Bataan.”...


Stanley Falk addresses the effectiveness of War Plan Orange-3 in “The Army inthe Southwest Pacific.” Since the acquisition of the Philippines the United States government had struggled with how best to defend them.
Here then began War Plan Orange-3 which was the final plan for the Philippines defense.

In this plan the major portion of the Islands would be lost to the Japanese, but the American and Filipino forces would hold Manila Bay until the Navy could acquire the needed men and supplies to
retake the Philippines.

Falk, however, is very critical of this plan, pointing out that as
early as 1941 many believed this plan to be impossible, due to the unexpected strength of the Japanese Army. Thus, because of previous arrangements made by Roosevelt and Churchill of focusing their efforts on Europe first, the liberation of the Philippines from the Japanese would have to wait until Nazi Germany was defeated. Perhaps worse than War Plan Orange-3, Falk believes that MacArthur’s plan for the defense of the Philippines was unrealistic and overly optimistic. He even went as far as to argue
“…that the emphasis on the operations in the Southwest Pacific, in large part due to the ‘forceful presence’ of MacArthur, was a waste of resources.” Falk argues that MacArthur’s continual push for the defense of the Philippines was misguided and unwarranted. He believed that the Philippines were of no strategic significance to the United States, and that instigating War Plan Orange-3, although flawed, at the beginning of the war would have saved many lives. He argues that the Japanese would have surrendered the Philippines when they lost the war, and that building up of logistical
supplies on Bataan would have kept many of the men alive until help arrived.

Falk sees the defense of the Philippines as MacArthur’s “project” and not as any lasting significance in retrospect to the rest of the war, but as an unnecessary loss of life. Perhaps the most quoted and widely acknowledged MacArthur historian, Louis Morton, is often the most critical of the General. In such writings as The Decision to Withdraw to Bataan, The Battling Bastards of Bataan, Egotist in Uniform and The Fall of the Philippines, Morton divulges the controversy surrounding MacArthur. He even goes
as far as to say that “…with everything involving MacArthur we are faced with
contradiction.”
One of these contradictions centered on War Plan Orange-3. Morton
points out that War Plan Orange-3 was a joint Army and Navy plan, and much like Morton is very critical of MacArthur’s sudden enactment of War Plan Orange-3. Morton asserts that MacArthur waited too long to withdraw to Bataan and as a result did not leave himself sufficient time to gather the necessary supplies.

Like Anderson and Beck, Morton sees this as MacArthur’s biggest failure; arguing that there were more than enough signs to clue MacArthur into the fact that his men were unprepared and no match for the Japanese. However, Morton is also very critical of MacArthur when he does decide to retreat to Bataan after loosing drastically to the Japanese, he argues that without
acquiring the much needed food, water, medical and other military supplies the soldiers were being led to their doom.It then became the effects of disease and starvation which forced the men to surrender.

David Kennedy in Freedom from Fear argues that MacArthur had enough time
and resources to mount a counterattack on the Japanese at Formosa following the attack on Pearl Harbor. Kennedy calls MacArthur’s failure to do so incredible and unforgivable.45 The result was the elimination of the United States Air Force in the Far East and the sacrifice of the men, both American and Filipino on the Philippines. This Air Force was MacArthur’s “…claim to be able to defend the Philippines indefinitely.” With this much needed source destroyed MacArthur was forced to withdraw to Bataan.

Here, on Bataan, Kennedy argues, MacArthur made another mistake by doing nothing to help rally his men. In fact he saw them only once during the months they were on Bataan and he was on the small island fortress Corregidor. Feeling very much abandoned and desolate the soldiers on Bataan soon nicknamed MacArthur, “Dugout Doug”, and started referring to themselves as the “Battling Bastards of Bataan.”

This is significant because it shows the state of the soldiers at the time of the attacks by the Japanese. They were no match for the Japanese and unprepared to hold out against them on Bataan.

The fall of the Philippines will forever be remembered as “…the worse defeat yet
suffered by the United States, a source of national humiliation.”

Thousands of soldiers lost their lives at the hands of the Japanese as well as to the fatal affects of diseases. Their sacrifice goes beyond anything that can be comprehended and understood by those who didn’t experience it. It is their sacrifice and experiences which were the real consequences of the fall.

“We’re the battling Bastards of Bataan
No mama, no papa, and no Uncle Sam,
No aunts, no uncles, no nephews, no nieces,
No rifles, no planes or artillery pieces,
And nobody gives a damn!
“We are MacArthur’s bastards
A fighting in Bataan
With neither father nor mother
Nor their old Uncle Sam.”​
2 things to keep in mind about MacArthur is he was he was self serving beyond belief and mostly concerned about his reputation and was a die hard colonialist who believed in American Empire and that we owned or should own the Philippines. So many of the things he did was meant to burnish his image and legend, likely with goal of presidency (and some would say military dictatorship). taking back Philippines allowed for changing the narrative of failure but also restoring the rightful ownership of Philippines. There were very strong colonialist elements in US government at that time, around restoring an expanding American colonial empire and restoring European colonies lost to Japan (one of the main antecedents to the Vietnam war)
 
2 things to keep in mind about MacArthur is he was he was self serving beyond belief and mostly concerned about his reputation and was a die hard colonialist who believed in American Empire and that we owned or should own the Philippines. So many of the things he did was meant to burnish his image and legend, likely with goal of presidency (and some would say military dictatorship). taking back Philippines allowed for changing the narrative of failure but also restoring the rightful ownership of Philippines. There were very strong colonialist elements in US government at that time, around restoring an expanding American colonial empire and restoring European colonies lost to Japan (one of the main antecedents to the Vietnam war)
MacArthur was a lot like British general Montgomery- more bravado than substance. Read about what he did to the veterans of the "Bonus Army" during the Depression.
 
I was stationed at Camp H.M. Smith in Hawaii for a few years at Marine Forces Pacific. I remember a quote in one of the board rooms from General Smith. (Paraphrasing) He thought Saipan was the most strategic part of the Pacific plan. Saipan was the military heart and brain of the Japanese defense strategy
 
2 things to keep in mind about MacArthur is he was he was self serving beyond belief and mostly concerned about his reputation and was a die hard colonialist who believed in American Empire and that we owned or should own the Philippines. So many of the things he did was meant to burnish his image and legend, likely with goal of presidency (and some would say military dictatorship). taking back Philippines allowed for changing the narrative of failure but also restoring the rightful ownership of Philippines. There were very strong colonialist elements in US government at that time, around restoring an expanding American colonial empire and restoring European colonies lost to Japan (one of the main antecedents to the Vietnam war)

No doubt MacArthur had a huge ego and always looked out for himself. But before the war we had promised the Philippine people that we would grant independence for the Philippines. So I disagree with your comment about a very strong colonialist element in the US. In fact the major issue between FDR and Churchill was the US supported independence for colonies and Churchill wanted to restore the British empire.
 
  • Like
Reactions: TheGLOV
No doubt MacArthur had a huge ego and always looked out for himself. But before the war we had promised the Philippine people that we would grant independence for the Philippines. So I disagree with your comment about a very strong colonialist element in the US. In fact the major issue between FDR and Churchill was the US supported independence for colonies and Churchill wanted to restore the British empire.
Good "Metal Mike", can I interest you in joining
the American Defenders of Bataan & Corregidor Memorial Society.

Our mission is to preserve and perpetuate the story of the men and women who defended the Philippines and other Allied outposts against overwhelming odds during the first months of World War II in the Pacific and later became prisoners-of-war.

The American Defenders of Bataan and Corregidor Memorial Society (ADBC-MS) is the only sanctioned successor to the original American Defenders of Bataan and Corregidor organization formed by surviving POWs of Japan in 1946. We have been entrusted with preserving the legacy of the POWs of the Pacific.
 
  • Like
Reactions: TheGLOV
Let me preface this be admitting that hindsight is easy-

I would argue that we should have made the Pacific even more of a Navy war than it was, and skipped many of the island invasions entirely. Once we won at Midway, Japan's fate was sealed- they could not replace their lost carriers OR pilots quickly enough to stop us at that point, and our shipbuilding was at a volume that even now is difficult to grasp. We could have (in fact we did) destroy virtually their entire navy and strangled the Home Islands. Yes, we needed some airbases for heavy bombers, but we took islands that could have been bypassed- and those islands were taken at a dreadful cost
For example. Tarawa. Needless island to take strategically.
 
  • Like
Reactions: TheGLOV
Good "Metal Mike", can I interest you in joining
the American Defenders of Bataan & Corregidor Memorial Society.

Our mission is to preserve and perpetuate the story of the men and women who defended the Philippines and other Allied outposts against overwhelming odds during the first months of World War II in the Pacific and later became prisoners-of-war.

The American Defenders of Bataan and Corregidor Memorial Society (ADBC-MS) is the only sanctioned successor to the original American Defenders of Bataan and Corregidor organization formed by surviving POWs of Japan in 1946. We have been entrusted with preserving the legacy of the POWs of the Pacific.

Step.eng69, Thank you for your invitation to join the American Defenders of Bataan and Corregidor Memorial Society. I gratefully accept your invitation and ask how do I join? I do not consider myself to be an expert of this phase of the war. I am familiar with this phase thru reading John Toland's "But not in Shame" and US Army History "The Fall of the Philippines" Also I wonder how you and your brother have a personal connection? Did a relative serve in the US forces that defended the islands? Thank you.
 
  • Like
Reactions: TheGLOV
Step.eng69, Thank you for your invitation to join the American Defenders of Bataan and Corregidor Memorial Society. I gratefully accept your invitation and ask how do I join? I do not consider myself to be an expert of this phase of the war. I am familiar with this phase thru reading John Toland's "But not in Shame" and US Army History "The Fall of the Philippines" Also I wonder how you and your brother have a personal connection? Did a relative serve in the US forces that defended the islands? Thank you.
I took a day off from work today, problems arouse, and decided to nip the problems in bud...and went into work t o resolve for the contractor. If you want to join, we can talk. Having supper now.
 
I took a day off from work today, problems arouse, and decided to nip the problems in bud...and went into work t o resolve for the contractor. If you want to join, we can talk. Having supper now.
I have to admit I do not know how to talk to someone other than posting a reply. Please inform me. Thanks
 
  • Like
Reactions: step.eng69
Admiral Nimitz disagrees.


Admiral Nimitz disagrees sir.

Wasn't THIS his battle plan who won-out over MacArthur's??


Couple of points. After the naval battles of Guadalcanal,carrier strength was just about even. Secondly, although General Pompous MacArthur has been given credit for the strategy of "island hopping", it was the brainchild of the Naval Chief of Staff Earnest King.
 
  • Like
Reactions: TheGLOV
ADVERTISEMENT
ADVERTISEMENT