If Joe had retired before the JS scandal, does the football program get blamed?

[royboy]

While I disagree with Crusin in his premise of Joe's responsibilities in that situation, his point is illuminating. There are a pretty large number of folks out there who think the same way--and it's an emotional feeling, I think, due to kids getting hurt.These are folks in many cases who are very reasonable individuals and are not in bed with the BOT. They want someone to blame. That would not have changed had Joe retired early and is unlikely to change even if Joe is exonerated by the lawsuits.

You make a good point; sexual abuse of children is one of the few true taboos left in our society, and people do react strongly. However, over a period of time, with a fuller understanding of events, and rational thinking, the position of initial blame should be questioned.

CR66 has been close to the case for years, and proclaims himself as one of high intelligence. Yet, he remains intransigent in blaming Joe and absolving the BOT. We have to conclude he either has an agenda or is a total blockhead.

 

[Duff]

I have had this very discussion on if Joe retired after that Orange Bowl in 2005. The magnitude of how the media reacts has a significant, if not dramatic fall off. With a new coaching staff there is a decent chance McCreery isn't even on the staff.
IMO, in the end, without a JVP available to metaphorically, BURN AT THE STAKE, there would obviously be no firing, and without the public fervor the headline seaking Emmert would not "chase the headline," and while there would be embarrassment and internal strife and investigations, there would be NO NCAA SANCTIONS. The NCAA would rule, and take the correct and logical approach that there were no NCAA violations, and that it was not an NCAA matter.
Joe stayed too long, it was bound to end badly, and the end unfortunately surpassed that expectation.

 

[NittanyOpp]

Would not have even been a big deal if the PSU BOT just stood up and said we will wait for all of the facts to come out and not rush to judgement. Its that simple and could have avoided all of this.

 

[91Joe95]

You make a good point; sexual abuse of children is one of the few true taboos left in our society, and people do react strongly. However, over a period of time, with a fuller understanding of events, and rational thinking, the position of initial blame should be questioned.

CR66 has been close to the case for years, and proclaims himself as one of high intelligence. Yet, he remains intransigent in blaming Joe and absolving the BOT. We have to conclude he either has an agenda or is a total blockhead.

Maybe he's in on it like Heim.

 

[aferrelli]

Would not have even been a big deal if the PSU BOT just stood up and said we will wait for all of the facts to come out and not rush to judgement. Its that simple and could have avoided all of this.

You are of course correct; but it's obvious that the BOT had an agenda. And that agenda was to throw JP under the bus.

 

[Franklin_Restores_TheTradition]

I have had this very discussion on if Joe retired after that Orange Bowl in 2005. The magnitude of how the media reacts has a significant, if not dramatic fall off. With a new coaching staff there is a decent chance McCreery isn't even on the staff.
IMO, in the end, without a JVP available to metaphorically, BURN AT THE STAKE, there would obviously be no firing, and without the public fervor the headline seaking Emmert would not "chase the headline," and while there would be embarrassment and internal strife and investigations, there would be NO NCAA SANCTIONS. The NCAA would rule, and take the correct and logical approach that there were no NCAA violations, and that it was not an NCAA matter.
Joe stayed too long, it was bound to end badly, and the end unfortunately surpassed that expectation.

Too funny, what a laughable rationalization for the immoral, corrupt, lying of the Pennsylvania OAG and Governor, the Executive Committee of the BOT (same immoral, lying corrupt AG turned Governor a member of BOT and was first Governor to take a personal active role in PSU BOT since forever!) and their co-conspirators the NCAA and Freeh?!?! Why am I not surprised a tool and shill of these corrupt, immoral scumbags is on here trying to "spin" their behavior as the "ends justifies the means"??? Ummm, attempting to claim that Paterno gave them no choice but to act like immoral, lying, self-interested, corrupt, tyrannizing scumbags is LAME AND COWARDLY - beyond lame and cowardly honestly. Truly pathetic.... So let me get this straight, had the OAG turned Governor prosecuted the case he was handed in by the Centre County DA, Michael Madeira (a guy who was a Deputy AG for Corbutt before being elected CC DA - Corbutt even endorsed him and campaigned for him!) in March 2009, he would not have called into question the timing of Paterno being pushed out by the BOT in March 2009? And used it as a hammer to cudgel that "Paterno knew" and his quasi-firing by the BOT in 2002 was proof of his guilt in regards to do nothing about Sandusky???

I don't think so jackoff - you and your masters are disgraceful little vermin deserving of nothing but a good kick in the @ss.

 

[kgilbert78]

People went after Paterno and decided that he was the guy to blame because the trustees pointed the press in the direction.
It was quite deliberate.

While I feel the same way about the BOT--the press would have gone after Joe anyway. He had a lot of enemies there as well, as has been documented. And remember, dog bites man is not a story but man bites dog is. When there's a scandal at any place that is held up as a paragon of virtue or any person held up as a good example, there will be press and public interest.

One of the reasons the Cosby story is a bigger deal that if it were, say, Charlie Sheen, is because every thought he was a good guy. Sheen? Not so much.

 

[sluggo72]

maybe he

Maybe he's in on it like Heim.

Maybe he is Heim.

 

[bvillebaron]

While I disagree with Crusin in his premise of Joe's responsibilities in that situation, his point is illuminating. There are a pretty large number of folks out there who think the same way--and it's an emotional feeling, I think, due to kids getting hurt.These are folks in many cases who are very reasonable individuals and are not in bed with the BOT. They want someone to blame. That would not have changed had Joe retired early and is unlikely to change even if Joe is exonerated by the lawsuits.

Somebody to blame? How about Sandusky? The manner in which this situation was mishandled by the BOT has resulted in many thinking Paterno was the one McQueary heard/saw in the shower for God's sake.

 

[wensilver]

To answer the OP, good question - depends on the winds in the sports media maybe.

I don't think so...? Or at least not at the disastrous level it became.

If Joe had retired - would the media have descended like locusts and been camped out on his doorstep?

Surma has no need to step over Garban's body and ax Joe. No need for that scrap of paper to be delivered with Surma's phone number. There is no 10 pm press conference which sparked the conflagration. Perhaps Ken Frazier actually tells the media to sit down & shut up and that the University will wait for due process for the 3 administrators - because it's the right thing to do.

The AG is very careful not to implicate Joe in Kelly's presser, because I think at this time they are skating a fine line and want to keep the fire on just Curley & Schultz to flip on Spanier. (I wonder if Noonan piping up with the "moral" thing was him not being in on the "script" and just trying to insert his own importance at the mic)

This was about having the opportunity to use a grand jury process to nail someone, anyone for election points - PSU was a "calculated risk" - Spanier comes along as an additional bonus as a trophy pelt for Corbett - and it's full steam ahead. No one would have cared about 2 faceless administrators at a university & the president - it's academia - no one would care.

No one cared about our own AG pillaging the Hershey Trust and the Koons pedophile scandal at the Hershey School - all done while under our AG's watch! Plenty of people out there still aren't educated on how Second Mile and CYS are interwoven in all this.

I am of the belief that the AG thought they could carry out their case against CSS, as they have in the past, using the Harrisburg beat writers. We know that game. We're seeing it play out with Kane. These guys made up their own rules.

However, the sports media is unpredictable - they could give a flip about access to Harrisburg. They aren't beholden to the AG's office.

It's a good question.

 

[bvillebaron]

People went after Paterno and decided that he was the guy to blame because the trustees pointed the press in the direction.
It was quite deliberate.

Oh yeah, they were and continue to be supreme opportunists and the blood thirsty media who love nothing more than to discredit a legend like Paterno handled them the opportunity to make him their scapegoat and the football program their sacrificial lamb on a sliver platter. Anyone like Cruisin who thinks Freeh conducted a through and "independent" investigation for PSU or in a number of his other investigations (including at least one where the trial judge refused to permit him to testify as an expert because of the woeful lack of factual basis to support his "opinions" which almost never happens) also believes that the Easter Bunny and Santa Claus are real. Frazier in particular knew exactly who Freeh is and remains--a hired gun (less delicately but accurately referred to in the legal profession as a professional whore) who delivers whatever opinions the person paying his fee wants and Frazier made sure Freeh "got it right" by virtue of his frequent contacts with Freeh of those who worked for him while he was conducting that :"fair and independent" investigation.

 

[kgilbert78]

Somebody to blame? How about Sandusky? The manner in which this situation was mishandled by the BOT has resulted in many thinking Paterno was the one McQueary heard/saw in the shower for God's sake.

That is who to blame for the crime. But that's not all of it--folks want someone to blame for not catching him sooner, as it is really too scary for many to think that predators exist in our midst and cannot be spotted. So if you can find someone to blame for that....

 

[BBG65]

Interesting question and I'm not sure of the answer. I'm not buying the conspiracy theories about Surma and the BOT. It was an emotional media firestorm and Joe was the lightening rod. Paterno was not only one of the most revered coaches, but one of the most hated. Some of the hate was jealousy and some was because of his arrogance. I don't know what difference it would have made if he was retired or not.