Is my enemys enemy my friend?

[purescurve]

Thanks PC. I was thinking of Jimmy too in that. Not like his name is being dragged through the mud here...it isn't. I think their are legit reasons why fans might want to see another route taken at 141. However, it may be construed by those close to him as disloyalty by the fandom when it's not. Except for Lemonpie...he is one disloyal pain in the arse Anyways, this is what fans do...kick the tires.

As a former (p$%^ poor) wrestler I have nothing but respect for these wrestlers. I try to never put them down but I kind of like to debate with other posters. Jimmy needs our support..I bet this off season he will add the needed muscle I deemed lacking when I first saw him this fall. Good kid, wish he had bigger hands.. makes a difference imo.

 

[Azchief32]

I probably just missed it but do we know for sure that Brands turned down wrestling PSU this year?

No. Because our board would have been a dumpster fire.

 

[nitlion6]

I probably just missed it but do we know for sure that Brands turned down wrestling PSU this year?

What we know is the two sides could not agree on where to wrestle and the last time the match had to be scheduled as a non B1G match, and it was Penn State who traveled.

Brands probably was all in favor of wrestling Penn State, but not willing to recipicate the travel gesture PSU made last time. So yeah, the lack of the match sits with Brands.

 

[WildTurk]

What we know is the two sides could not agree on where to wrestle and the last time the match had to be scheduled as a non B1G match, and it was Penn State who traveled.

Brands probably was all in favor of wrestling Penn State, but not willing to recipicate the travel gesture PSU made last time. So yeah, the lack of the match sits with Brands.

If you say so. You Fabricated that story in your head so it must be true right?

 

[Tom McAndrew]

Dresser presented his version of what took place on today's FloRadioLive, episode 98, which can be accessed at THIS LINK.

 

[Allensville Amos]

Dresser presented his version of what took place on today's FloRadioLive, episode 98, which can be accessed at THIS LINK.

At 9:03 Dresser says, Tom Ryan told me, "I know for a fact Iowa doesn't want to wrestle you guys". I guess the only question remaining is, why not?

 

[Neo_Hawk]

What we know is the two sides could not agree on where to wrestle and the last time the match had to be scheduled as a non B1G match, and it was Penn State who traveled.

Brands probably was all in favor of wrestling Penn State, but not willing to recipicate the travel gesture PSU made last time. So yeah, the lack of the match sits with Brands.

You actually just made this up. Not sure anyone on BWI or HR knows for sure if there was any conversation and if so, what was discussed, but I would like to point out where the last few meets have taken place.
2010-11 at PSU
2011-12 at PSU
2012-13 at Iowa
2013-14 at Iowa - non big10
2014-15 at PSU
So I guess you can say whatever you want to make it look like this event should have taken place in PA or IA, and that it's Iowa's fault or Penn States fault, but in reality you don't know and continuing to pretend like you do is silly. It's my assumption (and hope) that both teams probably tried to work something out and couldn't for whatever reason, and that's too bad for wrestling fans.

 

[RoarLions1]

Good post, Neo_hawk. Closest I've seen to my understanding of what actually happened.

By the B1G scheduling matrix, we should wrestle both Iowa and Minnesota the next 2 years. Both should be away in 2016-17, and both home in 2017-18...again, assuming the model is unchanged.

 

[CentexLion]

You actually just made this up. Not sure anyone on BWI or HR knows for sure if there was any conversation and if so, what was discussed, but I would like to point out where the last few meets have taken place.
2010-11 at PSU
2011-12 at PSU
2012-13 at Iowa
2013-14 at Iowa - non big10
2014-15 at PSU
So I guess you can say whatever you want to make it look like this event should have taken place in PA or IA, and that it's Iowa's fault or Penn States fault, but in reality you don't know and continuing to pretend like you do is silly. It's my assumption (and hope) that both teams probably tried to work something out and couldn't for whatever reason, and that's too bad for wrestling fans.

Here is the entire history, from the PSU Wrestling Club Site below

17 at PSU; 17 at Iowa; 3 at Neutral

I believe 2011 ended the original home/home alternating schedule and 2012 started the new schedule in which it is in 2 year allocations with the addition of Nebraska, and the subsequent additions of Rutgers/MD.

Either way, PSU and Iowa should be wrestling every year, or set it up that we follow the B1G football model with two divisions and you rotate 2 and have a BIG championship versus what we have now.

The allocation has been as even as it could have been over the history, and that is great. Now, if we can wrestle every year, it looks like we even up the record at 27-27-2 in 2031

http://pennstatewrestlingclub.org/history/index.php?view=opphistory&opponent=Iowa

Dual Meet Results vs. Iowa
Dual Meet Record: 8-27-2
Season Date Location Result
2015 2/8/2015 Home L 18-12
2014 12/21/2013 Away W 24-12 (non conference)
2013 2/1/2013 Away L 22-16
2012 1/22/2012 Home W 22-12
2011 1/30/2011 Home L 22-13
2010 1/29/2010 Away L 29-6
2009 2/8/2009 Home L 33-6
2008 1/20/2008 Away L 27-13
2007 2/7/2007 Home W 24-13
2006 2/3/2006 Away W 21-12
2005 2/4/2005 Home L 23-16
2004 1/30/2004 Away L 23-11
2003 2/9/2003 Home L 26-10
2002 2/10/2002 Away L 24-11
2001 2/2/2001 Home L 33-10
2000 1/28/2000 Away L 22-9
1999 1/24/1999 Home L 30-9
1998 1/17/1998 Away L 23-9
1998 1/3/1998 Away W 25-17
1997 12/6/1996 Home L 22-15
1996 2/3/1996 Away L 28-6
1995 12/2/1994 Home L 33-6
1994 1/22/1994 Neutral L 24-15
1994 1/7/1994 Away L 29-15
1993 12/4/1992 Home T 18-18
1992 2/1/1992 Away L 30-11
1991 1/12/1991 Neutral T 19-19
1991 11/30/1990 Home L 32-6
1990 1/13/1990 Neutral L 22-5
1990 2/3/1990 Away L 33-3
1989 12/2/1988 Home W 18-16
1988 2/6/1988 Away W 19-18
1987 12/3/1986 Home W 27-15
1986 1/5/1986 Away L 35-5
1985 12/7/1984 Home L 31-9
1984 1/7/1984 Away L 26-19
1983 12/6/1982 Home L 34-9

 

[dicemen99]

Good post, Neo_hawk. Closest I've seen to my understanding of what actually happened.

By the B1G scheduling matrix, we should wrestle both Iowa and Minnesota the next 2 years. Both should be away in 2016-17, and both home in 2017-18...again, assuming the model is unchanged.

I don't think 2017-18 is for certain at home. The B1G works in 2 meet pairings for home and away, so if this is the start of another 2 year pairing it is entirely possible that Iowa gets 2 home matches in a row (assuming 2016-17 is the back end of the 2014-15 pairing). That seems a little odd to me (as we've rotated off a 2 out of the last 3 years), so maybe 2016-17 is actually the start of another pairing, if so 2016-17 may actually be at home. At least this is how it use to work. I don't know, maybe that's for football only. At this point I'm thoroughly confused....

 

[Ankle Pick]

What I found even more intriguing was Willie saying at the end of the podcast that Cenzo was over by TEN pounds at the Scuffle... geeesh.. is that true?.. sorry.. probably already discussed, but certainly memorable enough to drop that nugget in there.

 

[GOLDBANGER]

Here is the entire history, from the PSU Wrestling Club Site below

17 at PSU; 17 at Iowa; 3 at Neutral

I believe 2011 ended the original home/home alternating schedule and 2012 started the new schedule in which it is in 2 year allocations with the addition of Nebraska, and the subsequent additions of Rutgers/MD.

Either way, PSU and Iowa should be wrestling every year, or set it up that we follow the B1G football model with two divisions and you rotate 2 and have a BIG championship versus what we have now.

The allocation has been as even as it could have been over the history, and that is great. Now, if we can wrestle ever year, it looks like we even up the record at 27-27-2 in 2031

http://pennstatewrestlingclub.org/history/index.php?view=opphistory&opponent=Iowa

Dual Meet Results vs. Iowa
Dual Meet Record: 8-27-2
Season Date Location Result
2015 2/8/2015 Home L 18-12
2014 12/21/2013 Away W 24-12 (non conference)
2013 2/1/2013 Away L 22-16
2012 1/22/2012 Home W 22-12
2011 1/30/2011 Home L 22-13
2010 1/29/2010 Away L 29-6
2009 2/8/2009 Home L 33-6
2008 1/20/2008 Away L 27-13
2007 2/7/2007 Home W 24-13
2006 2/3/2006 Away W 21-12
2005 2/4/2005 Home L 23-16
2004 1/30/2004 Away L 23-11
2003 2/9/2003 Home L 26-10
2002 2/10/2002 Away L 24-11
2001 2/2/2001 Home L 33-10
2000 1/28/2000 Away L 22-9
1999 1/24/1999 Home L 30-9
1998 1/17/1998 Away L 23-9
1998 1/3/1998 Away W 25-17
1997 12/6/1996 Home L 22-15
1996 2/3/1996 Away L 28-6
1995 12/2/1994 Home L 33-6
1994 1/22/1994 Neutral L 24-15
1994 1/7/1994 Away L 29-15
1993 12/4/1992 Home T 18-18
1992 2/1/1992 Away L 30-11
1991 1/12/1991 Neutral T 19-19
1991 11/30/1990 Home L 32-6
1990 1/13/1990 Neutral L 22-5
1990 2/3/1990 Away L 33-3
1989 12/2/1988 Home W 18-16
1988 2/6/1988 Away W 19-18
1987 12/3/1986 Home W 27-15
1986 1/5/1986 Away L 35-5
1985 12/7/1984 Home L 31-9
1984 1/7/1984 Away L 26-19
1983 12/6/1982 Home L 34-9

This is a great post Centex, THANKS!!

 

[Franklin_Restores_TheTradition]

Here is the entire history, from the PSU Wrestling Club Site below

17 at PSU; 17 at Iowa; 3 at Neutral

I believe 2011 ended the original home/home alternating schedule and 2012 started the new schedule in which it is in 2 year allocations with the addition of Nebraska, and the subsequent additions of Rutgers/MD.

Either way, PSU and Iowa should be wrestling every year, or set it up that we follow the B1G football model with two divisions and you rotate 2 and have a BIG championship versus what we have now.

The allocation has been as even as it could have been over the history, and that is great. Now, if we can wrestle ever year, it looks like we even up the record at 27-27-2 in 2031

http://pennstatewrestlingclub.org/history/index.php?view=opphistory&opponent=Iowa

Dual Meet Results vs. Iowa
Dual Meet Record: 8-27-2
Season Date Location Result
2015 2/8/2015 Home L 18-12
2014 12/21/2013 Away W 24-12 (non conference)
2013 2/1/2013 Away L 22-16
2012 1/22/2012 Home W 22-12
2011 1/30/2011 Home L 22-13
2010 1/29/2010 Away L 29-6
2009 2/8/2009 Home L 33-6
2008 1/20/2008 Away L 27-13
2007 2/7/2007 Home W 24-13
2006 2/3/2006 Away W 21-12
2005 2/4/2005 Home L 23-16
2004 1/30/2004 Away L 23-11
2003 2/9/2003 Home L 26-10
2002 2/10/2002 Away L 24-11
2001 2/2/2001 Home L 33-10
2000 1/28/2000 Away L 22-9
1999 1/24/1999 Home L 30-9
1998 1/17/1998 Away L 23-9
1998 1/3/1998 Away W 25-17
1997 12/6/1996 Home L 22-15
1996 2/3/1996 Away L 28-6
1995 12/2/1994 Home L 33-6
1994 1/22/1994 Neutral L 24-15
1994 1/7/1994 Away L 29-15
1993 12/4/1992 Home T 18-18
1992 2/1/1992 Away L 30-11
1991 1/12/1991 Neutral T 19-19
1991 11/30/1990 Home L 32-6
1990 1/13/1990 Neutral L 22-5
1990 2/3/1990 Away L 33-3
1989 12/2/1988 Home W 18-16
1988 2/6/1988 Away W 19-18
1987 12/3/1986 Home W 27-15
1986 1/5/1986 Away L 35-5
1985 12/7/1984 Home L 31-9
1984 1/7/1984 Away L 26-19
1983 12/6/1982 Home L 34-9

Additionally, I believe the next time PSU and Iowa wrestle on the b1g schedule, could be next year - it's up to the conference front-office because they choose not to make PSU-Iowa as "designated rivals" (how, God only knows), it will be scheduled @KHA.

 

[Franklin_Restores_TheTradition]

I don't think 2017-18 is for certain at home. The B1G works in 2 meet pairings for home and away, so if this is the start of another 2 year pairing it is entirely possible that Iowa gets 2 home matches in a row (assuming 2016-17 is the back end of the 2014-15 pairing). That seems a little odd to me (as we've rotated off a 2 out of the last 3 years), so maybe 2016-17 is actually the start of another pairing, if so 2016-17 may actually be at home. At least this is how it use to work. I don't know, maybe that's for football only. At this point I'm thoroughly confused....

Didn't have to be this way if the morons at the b1g front-office had designated Iowa and PSU as "rivals" - had the b1g front-office done this, which was a no-brainer, PSU-Iowa would be an annual dual EVERY YEAR.

 

[nitlion6]

Apparently hurt some hawk feelings, sorry.
Neo, in your post you listed the last 5 Iowa psu meets. 4 of them were B1G scheduled matches. Those 4 were split 2 home 2 away. The fifth was the non B1G match. Since Penn State joined the Big 10 Penn State and Iowa have wrestled exactly one non B1G scheduled match, and Iowa hosted it. Non of that is subjective.

Whether or not the Penn State staff and the Iowa staff tried to work something out is not subjective, they did.

And yes, I do know if Penn State had been willing to travel to Iowa the match would have taken place. I also know if Iowa had been willing to travel to State College the match would have happened.

The rest is my little commentary.
There was an opportunity for Penn State and Iowa to just make the match tradition despite inept B1G leadership. Tom was the one who owed a recipical, not Cael.

Yes, the wrestling community missed out. Penn State and Iowa, especially now, should wrestle every freaking year.

 

[Franklin_Restores_TheTradition]

Apparently hurt some hawk feelings, sorry.
Neo, in your post you listed the last 5 Iowa psu meets. 4 of them were B1G scheduled matches. Those 4 were split 2 home 2 away. The fifth was the non B1G match. Since Penn State joined the Big 10 Penn State and Iowa have wrestled exactly one non B1G scheduled match, and Iowa hosted it. Non of that is subjective.

Whether or not the Penn State staff and the Iowa staff tried to work something out is not subjective, they did.

And yes, I do know if Penn State had been willing to travel to Iowa the match would have taken place. I also know if Iowa had been willing to travel to State College the match would have happened.

The rest is my little commentary.
There was an opportunity for Penn State and Iowa to just make the match tradition despite inept B1G leadership. Tom was the one who owed a recipical, not Cael.

Yes, the wrestling community missed out. Penn State and Iowa, especially now, should wrestle every freaking year.

Additionally, it makes Brands' lamentations, complaints and references about Iowa not having an opportunity to face PSU this year in his latest "Press Release Statement" in his little public squabble with Dresser particularly lame.

 

[RoarLions1]

I don't think 2017-18 is for certain at home. The B1G works in 2 meet pairings for home and away, so if this is the start of another 2 year pairing it is entirely possible that Iowa gets 2 home matches in a row (assuming 2016-17 is the back end of the 2014-15 pairing). That seems a little odd to me (as we've rotated off a 2 out of the last 3 years), so maybe 2016-17 is actually the start of another pairing, if so 2016-17 may actually be at home. At least this is how it use to work. I don't know, maybe that's for football only. At this point I'm thoroughly confused....

No longer. It's now 3 year cycles.
Will explain more later.

 

[jtothemfp]

I really enjoyed Kevin Dresser this week. Here's my recap & takery of the interview and some Iowa-VaTech history: http://www.blackshoediaries.com/2016/2/18/11044828/phat-mat-stats-is-examining-fired-shots

 

[Azchief32]

Apparently hurt some hawk feelings, sorry.
Neo, in your post you listed the last 5 Iowa psu meets. 4 of them were B1G scheduled matches. Those 4 were split 2 home 2 away. The fifth was the non B1G match. Since Penn State joined the Big 10 Penn State and Iowa have wrestled exactly one non B1G scheduled match, and Iowa hosted it. Non of that is subjective.

Whether or not the Penn State staff and the Iowa staff tried to work something out is not subjective, they did.

And yes, I do know if Penn State had been willing to travel to Iowa the match would have taken place. I also know if Iowa had been willing to travel to State College the match would have happened.

The rest is my little commentary.
There was an opportunity for Penn State and Iowa to just make the match tradition despite inept B1G leadership. Tom was the one who owed a recipical, not Cael.

Yes, the wrestling community missed out. Penn State and Iowa, especially now, should wrestle every freaking year.

IAW Centex's post (Yeoman's work bud), we are exactly even...meaning had Cael not traveled to Iowa in Dec 2013, you would owe us one. Since Cael has been at PSU, we are now even. Why do you think Cael, defending national champion, chose to travel to Iowa?

 

[WildTurk]

Apparently hurt some hawk feelings, sorry.
Neo, in your post you listed the last 5 Iowa psu meets. 4 of them were B1G scheduled matches. Those 4 were split 2 home 2 away. The fifth was the non B1G match. Since Penn State joined the Big 10 Penn State and Iowa have wrestled exactly one non B1G scheduled match, and Iowa hosted it. Non of that is subjective.

Whether or not the Penn State staff and the Iowa staff tried to work something out is not subjective, they did.

And yes, I do know if Penn State had been willing to travel to Iowa the match would have taken place. I also know if Iowa had been willing to travel to State College the match would have happened.

The rest is my little commentary.
There was an opportunity for Penn State and Iowa to just make the match tradition despite inept B1G leadership. Tom was the one who owed a recipical, not Cael.

Yes, the wrestling community missed out. Penn State and Iowa, especially now, should wrestle every freaking year.

Just curious. Where do you get your information from? A friend of a friend that met Cael once? Do you really think Cael would have agreed to come to Iowa if Tom Brands said he would never reciprocate the trip? Yikes people

 

[Franklin_Restores_TheTradition]

Just curious. Where do you get your information from? A friend of a friend that met Cael once? Do you really think Cael would have agreed to come to Iowa if Tom Brands said he would never reciprocate the trip? Yikes people

It's a fact that he refused to reciprocate the trip this year. Talk about not letting facts get in the way of a good story....

 

[Azchief32]

It's a fact that he refused to reciprocate the trip this year. Talk about not letting facts get in the way of a good story....

FRTT...Nah, you mind if I just go with FART? Adds a bit of personality. Anyways FART, where are these "facts" coming from? You have a source?

 

[nitlion6]

IAW Centex's post (Yeoman's work bud), we are exactly even...meaning had Cael not traveled to Iowa in Dec 2013, you would owe us one. Since Cael has been at PSU, we are now even. Why do you think Cael, defending national champion, chose to travel to Iowa?

I understand the need to include regularly scheduled B1G matches in your argument. I get that. It moves the target enough to validate a point we are not discussing.
This conversation is about how does Penn State and Iowa address the years that they will not meet in a B1G scheduled event. In the model currently being used the 2 will meet 2 times out of every 3 years. Next year PSU travels to Iowa.
The math is really simple, not complicated at all. Two years Penn State traveled to Iowa City to wrestle in a non conference match. There has been exactly one of those, not counting PSU's pre Big 10 days or neutral site duals. The regularly scheduled B1G are not applicable. So yes, if the Lions and Hawks are going to wrestle in those non scheduled years (every third year, unless something changes) it is going to be home and away. Not that difficult. Really.

Turk
Sometimes you are a funny guy. I need to explain myself to you to validate myself?
No I do not. I told you what I know. You choose to disbelieve me I do not care nor is it a big deal.

 

[PCLion]

So because he has a beef with the NWCA, his response is to call Brands a pu$$y? You'd think before making such a statement he must have knowledge of Brands directly lobbying against a VTech match?

If any of you happened to see Coach Brands in his little “hop, skip and jump” routine to the scorer’s table you might be able to justify Dressler calling him that … terrible descriptor.

 

[RoarLions1]

I don't think 2017-18 is for certain at home. The B1G works in 2 meet pairings for home and away, so if this is the start of another 2 year pairing it is entirely possible that Iowa gets 2 home matches in a row (assuming 2016-17 is the back end of the 2014-15 pairing). That seems a little odd to me (as we've rotated off a 2 out of the last 3 years), so maybe 2016-17 is actually the start of another pairing, if so 2016-17 may actually be at home. At least this is how it use to work. I don't know, maybe that's for football only. At this point I'm thoroughly confused....

No longer. It's now 3 year cycles.
Will explain more later.

Ok, imagine the 14 Big Ten Teams in pairs;
Penn State & Ohio State
Iowa & Minnesota
Michigan & Michigan State
Wisconsin & Nebraska
Purdue & Indiana
Northwestern & Illinois
Maryland & Rutgers

This is important because your "partner" is your "rivalry" team, so for us it's Ohio State, and we wrestle them every year. It's also important because teams come on the schedule and leave the schedule in pairs, as noted above (example: Maryland and Rutgers arrive and depart together).

So, aside from the "rivalry" match, the other 12 teams are all wrestled 2 years out of 3, in a 3-year cycle.

In 2014-15, we wrestled;
Ohio State (Away)
Iowa & Minnesota (both Home)
Michigan & Michigan State (both Away)
Maryland & Rutgers (both Away)
Purdue & Indiana (both Home)
& we did not wrestle;
Wisconsin & Nebraska
Northwestern & Illinois

In 2015-16, we wrestled;
Ohio State (Home)
Michigan & Michigan State (both Home)
Wisconsin & Nebraska (both Home)
Purdue & Indiana (both Away)
Northwestern & Illinois (both Away)
& we did not wrestle;
Maryland & Rutgers
Iowa & Minnesota

Soooo, in 2016-17 (year 3 of the cycle), we should wrestle;
Ohio State (Away)
Iowa & Minnesota (both Away)
Northwestern & Illinois (both Home)
Wisconsin & Nebraska (both Away)
Maryland & Rutgers (both Home)
& we should not wrestle;
Michigan & Michigan State
Purdue & Indiana

Then it starts all over again.