More Ziegler

[JeannieNeedsAShooter]

Facebook chat after Glenn Beck appearance. So 99.9% of the population think JS is guilty yet there is no one that dare sit down and debate this guy? I don't mean some media member who has no clue and doesn't really care anyway (Pierce Morgan), I mean someone who is very well versed in the case and not just working off emotion. Someone capable of critical thinking and not afraid to admit they are/were wrong. Someone who is truly interested in the actual truth and not what is politically correct. In other words, is there a "Ziegler" for the JS is guilty side? If so, they need to debate in an open forum.

 

[OldTiredLion]

Debate? Okay, why did ol' Jerry continue his late night secluded showering with young boys after the '98 incident?

Truthfully, I believe a better debate would be why would Joe Paterno report what McQueary told him (whatever the hell it was...version #1?) if he wanted to cover-up this whole incident, of which is he's been accused?

 

[wensilver]

In other words, is there a "Ziegler" for the JS is guilty side? If so, they need to debate in an open forum.

Actually - what I'd like to see is Second Mile CEO Dr. Jack Raykovitz, his charity counterpart Katherine Genovese and board members Bruce Heim & Bob Poole sit with John Ziegler before a national audience and discuss the ironclad oversight of their Second Mile clients, the exact protocol, the paperwork on file, the careful programming, the methods they had in place at Second Mile - that would make it VIRTUALLY IMPOSSIBLE for ANY of those adult men to have EVER been victimized when they were minors by Sandusky.

I want this leadership to tell ME why Second Mile was NOT a grooming charity and how they could have ASSURED that. Because it sure as hell appears Second Mile was a PERFECT grooming charity :



To date - none of the above leadership has ever explained how this abuse COULD NOT POSSIBLY have gone on during their watch. Nor have they ever explained how Jerry is TOTALLY INNOCENT of all these accusations. We all thought Lynne Abraham was going to get to the bottom of what went down at Second Mile. Were we ever duped.

Bonus Points if you get Judge Grine to sit in on this forum.

So why hasn't that happened and why won't John entertain that?

 

[JeannieNeedsAShooter]

Wendy, you would be a perfect candidate for John's podcast. You are informed and actually care about the truth of this matter. You and John would have a very illuminating conversation for all to hear without pointless name calling.

Actually - what I'd like to see is Second Mile CEO Dr. Jack Raykovitz, his charity counterpart Katherine Genovese and board members Bruce Heim & Bob Poole sit with John Ziegler before a national audience and discuss the ironclad oversight of their Second Mile clients, the exact protocol, the paperwork on file, the careful programming, the methods they had in place at Second Mile - that would make it VIRTUALLY IMPOSSIBLE for ANY of those adult men to have EVER been victimized when they were minors by Sandusky.

I want this leadership to tell ME why Second Mile was NOT a grooming charity and how they could have ASSURED that. Because it sure as hell appears Second Mile was a PERFECT grooming charity :

View embedded media

To date - none of the above leadership has ever explained how this abuse COULD NOT POSSIBLY have gone on during their watch. Nor have they ever explained how Jerry is TOTALLY INNOCENT of all these accusations. We all thought Lynne Abraham was going to get to the bottom of what went down at Second Mile. Were we ever duped.

Bonus Points if you get Judge Grine to sit in on this forum.

So why hasn't that happened and why won't John entertain that?

 

[wensilver]

Wendy, you would be a perfect candidate for John's podcast. You are informed and actually care about the truth of this matter. You and John would have a very illuminating conversation for all to hear without pointless name calling.

Sorry - no can do. Last I spoke with John about getting his "fake victim" info in front of someone at our incoming Attorney General's executive team he called me a F*CKING C*NT WHO CAN ROT IN HELL FOR ALL ETERNITY.

Apparently I am THE WORST ONE OUT THERE.

Then he went on to rant about F*CK PENN STATE - YOU ALL F*CKING DESERVE WHAT YOU F*CKING GOT. I AM SO F*CKING DONE WITH ALL OF YOU. I DON'T GIVE A F*CKING SHIT ABOUT ANY OF YOU - YOU ALL CAN JUST F*CKING DIE.

So no. I won't "debate".

I want Second Mile Leadership to explain to the F*CKING PENN STATE COMMUNITY how there is ZERO chance their charity founder is guilty of abusing charity clients.

I want them to explain why it is that they never tried to stop the media shitstorm.

I want them to explain why they let the Penn State community be smeared as football crazed child rape enablers.

I want them to explain why then, this is a witch hunt.

 

[mn78psu83]

Sorry - no can do. Last I spoke with John about getting his "fake victim" info in front of someone at our incoming Attorney General's executive team he called me a F*CKING C*NT WHO CAN ROT IN HELL FOR ALL ETERNITY.

Apparently I am THE WORST ONE OUT THERE.

Then he went on to rant about F*CK PENN STATE - YOU ALL F*CKING DESERVE WHAT YOU F*CKING GOT. I AM SO F*CKING DONE WITH ALL OF YOU. I DON'T GIVE A F*CKING SHIT ABOUT ANY OF YOU - YOU ALL CAN JUST F*CKING DIE.

So no. I won't "debate".

I want Second Mile Leadership to explain to the F*CKING PENN STATE COMMUNITY how there is ZERO chance their charity founder is guilty of abusing charity clients and explain why it is that they never tried to stop this shitstorm and witch hunt.

JeannieNeedsAShooter said: ↑
Wendy, you would be a perfect candidate for John's podcast. You are informed and actually care about the truth of this matter. You and John would have a very illuminating conversation for all to hear without pointless name calling.

Without pointless name calling, rather with pointed.

 

[Connorpozlee]

The debate should begin and end with: "So this guy who was previously accused of molesting a kid in a shower, then agreed to never be in that position again, was found three years later to be in that same exact position knowing full well that his nationally recognized children's charity would be in jeopardy if he was caught. How can you reasonably explain that?"
No good, reasonable answer for that.

 

[coveydidnt]

I would happily debate Zig if there were rules set out & a mutually agreeable moderator and forum.

But, then again, doesn't he owe a bunch of people $10K since Tim & Gary pled?

He makes these sort of offers but never sets out any rules. So he never has to back up his claims.

BTW: He pled out a case against himself in PA recently. I guess he's a coward.

 

[PearlSUJam]

The debate should begin and end with: "So this guy who was previously accused of molesting a kid in a shower, then agreed to never be in that position again, was found three years later to be in that same exact position knowing full well that his nationally recognized children's charity would be in jeopardy if he was caught. How can you reasonably explain that?"
No good, reasonable answer for that.

I'm a 42 year old male, confident of my sexuality, and I've always found it extremely uncomfortable to shower with other guys after a game or working out. There's an old fat guy that "works out" at the gym I go to that walks around the locker room naked and I want to punch him in the face.

I work at a job that is very physical and it's common to sweat my ass off all day-dripping freakin' sweat. I drive home and take a shower. Why, in any environment, even with others adults around would it be acceptable to shower with young boys? Can someone explain this to me?

 

[WeR0206]

Sorry - no can do. Last I spoke with John about getting his "fake victim" info in front of someone at our incoming Attorney General's executive team he called me a F*CKING C*NT WHO CAN ROT IN HELL FOR ALL ETERNITY.

Apparently I am THE WORST ONE OUT THERE.

Then he went on to rant about F*CK PENN STATE - YOU ALL F*CKING DESERVE WHAT YOU F*CKING GOT. I AM SO F*CKING DONE WITH ALL OF YOU. I DON'T GIVE A F*CKING SHIT ABOUT ANY OF YOU - YOU ALL CAN JUST F*CKING DIE.

So no. I won't "debate".

I want Second Mile Leadership to explain to the F*CKING PENN STATE COMMUNITY how there is ZERO chance their charity founder is guilty of abusing charity clients.

I want them to explain why it is that they never tried to stop the media shitstorm.

I want them to explain why they let the Penn State community be smeared as football crazed child rape enablers.

I want them to explain why then, this is a witch hunt.

Yikes!

 

[Corabi94]

Facebook chat after Glenn Beck appearance. So 99.9% of the population think JS is guilty yet there is no one that dare sit down and debate this guy? I don't mean some media member who has no clue and doesn't really care anyway (Pierce Morgan), I mean someone who is very well versed in the case and not just working off emotion. Someone capable of critical thinking and not afraid to admit they are/were wrong. Someone who is truly interested in the actual truth and not what is politically correct. In other words, is there a "Ziegler" for the JS is guilty side? If so, they need to debate in an open forum.

View embedded media

F**k this piece of shit. He's f**king crazy. He should rot in hell with Jerry.

 

[ThePennsyOracle]

F**k this piece of shit. He's f**king crazy. He should rot in hell with Jerry.

Zieglar and any one of his merry band of idiots around here are total disgraces to Penn State University.

It's disgusting that this crap is allowed to be posted here.

 

[Doc-M]

It is hard to build a hut however it is easier to tear down a palace. All the critics need to add up all the contributions each one has made to this case. I bet John Z.'s contribution will add up to more than all these critics combined.

 

[Corabi94]

Zieglar and any one of his merry band of idiots around here are total disgraces to Penn State University.

It's disgusting that this crap is allowed to be posted here.

I'm actually starting to understand why people think we are all crazy. And Lubrano's comments are pathetic especially given his own credibility issues.

 

[Corabi94]

It is hard to build a hut however it is easier to tear down a palace. All the critics need to add all the contributions each one has made to case this. I bet John Z.'s contribution will add up to more all these critics combined.

Perhaps Sandusky actually raped kids and there aren't any conspiracies.

 

[ThePennsyOracle]

It is hard to build a hut however it is easier to tear down a palace. All the critics need to add up all the contributions each one has made to this case. I bet John Z.'s contribution will add up to more than all these critics combined.

....and all of you need to take off the tinfoil hat. The only thing John Z.'s contribution adds up to is more tinfoil sales.

 

[LaJolla Lion]

....and all of you need to take off the tinfoil hat. The only thing John Z.'s contribution adds up to is more tinfoil sales.

What has he really ever proven? The victims took money and a few weren't exactly model citizens. That isn't proof Jerry is innocent. Who in their right mind wants to debate with someone who basically is just looking for a fight/cause to get himself on the air. Charlie Sheen and Jesse the Body think that 911 was an inside job by the government....yeah...I'm not going out of my way to debate them either. The Paterno's distanced themselves from him as soon as he started on the Jerry is innocent card, but what would they know. If anyone on the planet wanted that to be more true, you would be hard pressed to find them.....yet they want no part of JZ. How about the OP in this thread lines up a debate with JZ and SuePa or Jay or Scott since she desperately wants anyone to debate JZ.

The trials coming up mean this will be on the news cycle. That means he can get his voice on a mic or face on the air which is his end game. A few months after this is all settled....this drum will slowly go to any other news story that gets him air time. If GS takes a plea it will be another huge injustice ahead of the plea being made public just like he already turned on TC and Schultz saying he wishes they get jail time for taking the plea. We'll see what they actually plead to in time when it becomes public and we'll see what happens with GS's trial if he doesn't take a plea. If he does we'll just have to see what that plea entailed as well. The whole things sucks for everyone involved but this guy saying Jerry is innocent isn't some great thing for PSU. It's pretty much the exact opposite of that.

 

[LaJolla Lion]

Sorry - no can do. Last I spoke with John about getting his "fake victim" info in front of someone at our incoming Attorney General's executive team he called me a F*CKING C*NT WHO CAN ROT IN HELL FOR ALL ETERNITY.

Apparently I am THE WORST ONE OUT THERE.

Then he went on to rant about F*CK PENN STATE - YOU ALL F*CKING DESERVE WHAT YOU F*CKING GOT. I AM SO F*CKING DONE WITH ALL OF YOU. I DON'T GIVE A F*CKING SHIT ABOUT ANY OF YOU - YOU ALL CAN JUST F*CKING DIE.

So no. I won't "debate".

I want Second Mile Leadership to explain to the F*CKING PENN STATE COMMUNITY how there is ZERO chance their charity founder is guilty of abusing charity clients.

I want them to explain why it is that they never tried to stop the media shitstorm.

I want them to explain why they let the Penn State community be smeared as football crazed child rape enablers.

I want them to explain why then, this is a witch hunt.

Yikes...sorry to hear that. Not really surprised and the second this slips away from the news cycle...he'll be done with PSU. This is about getting on the air any way possible at this point in time. He'll move on to the next great conspiracy theory after this if he can get some followers.

 

[elvis63]

You're exactly right lajolla.​

 

[elvis63]

This is all Ziegler is good for, if you had a functioning brain you wouldn't buy into his BS.

 

[NC2017]

There's an old fat guy that "works out" at the gym I go to that walks around the locker room naked and I want to punch him in the face.

I'm sorry I bothered you. I'll wear my Speedo from now on.

 

[BBrown]

Sorry - no can do. Last I spoke with John about getting his "fake victim" info in front of someone at our incoming Attorney General's executive team he called me a F*CKING C*NT WHO CAN ROT IN HELL FOR ALL ETERNITY.

Apparently I am THE WORST ONE OUT THERE.

Then he went on to rant about F*CK PENN STATE - YOU ALL F*CKING DESERVE WHAT YOU F*CKING GOT. I AM SO F*CKING DONE WITH ALL OF YOU. I DON'T GIVE A F*CKING SHIT ABOUT ANY OF YOU - YOU ALL CAN JUST F*CKING DIE.

So no. I won't "debate".

I want Second Mile Leadership to explain to the F*CKING PENN STATE COMMUNITY how there is ZERO chance their charity founder is guilty of abusing charity clients.

I want them to explain why it is that they never tried to stop the media shitstorm.

I want them to explain why they let the Penn State community be smeared as football crazed child rape enablers.

I want them to explain why then, this is a witch hunt.

Yikes.

 

[BBrown]

What has he really ever proven? The victims took money and a few weren't exactly model citizens. That isn't proof Jerry is innocent. Who in their right mind wants to debate with someone who basically is just looking for a fight/cause to get himself on the air. Charlie Sheen and Jesse the Body think that 911 was an inside job by the government....yeah...I'm not going out of my way to debate them either. The Paterno's distanced themselves from him as soon as he started on the Jerry is innocent card, but what would they know. If anyone on the planet wanted that to be more true, you would be hard pressed to find them.....yet they want no part of JZ. How about the OP in this thread lines up a debate with JZ and SuePa or Jay or Scott since she desperately wants anyone to debate JZ.

The trials coming up mean this will be on the news cycle. That means he can get his voice on a mic or face on the air which is his end game. A few months after this is all settled....this drum will slowly go to any other news story that gets him air time. If GS takes a plea it will be another huge injustice ahead of the plea being made public just like he already turned on TC and Schultz saying he wishes they get jail time for taking the plea. We'll see what they actually plead to in time when it becomes public and we'll see what happens with GS's trial if he doesn't take a plea. If he does we'll just have to see what that plea entailed as well. The whole things sucks for everyone involved but this guy saying Jerry is innocent isn't some great thing for PSU. It's pretty much the exact opposite of that.

The only thing I agree with JZ about is Scott P.

 

[step.eng69]

I'm sorry I bothered you. I'll wear my Speedo from now on.

Like the avatar NC, reminds me of "ME" in my youth.
I can no longer fit in that narrow rocker.

 

[canuckhal]

Yikes...sorry to hear that. Not really surprised and the second this slips away from the news cycle...he'll be done with PSU. This is about getting on the air any way possible at this point in time. He'll move on to the next great conspiracy theory after this if he can get some followers.

How many times has he said it is over and I'm done with Jerry and PSU b/c it has ruined career and no one cares. And then, there he is again talking about PSU and Jerry.

 

[Roxine]

Yikes...sorry to hear that. Not really surprised and the second this slips away from the news cycle...he'll be done with PSU. This is about getting on the air any way possible at this point in time. He'll move on to the next great conspiracy theory after this if he can get some followers.

If we look at the timeline, you know exactly who John Ziegler is. He's a ambulance chasing charlatan.

Story breaks - Ziegler appears on the scene. Starts "Framing Paterno.com" website.
Gets in touch with the Paterno family.
Says he's going to research and make a documentary.
Asks for money (Scott Paterno will confirm)
Gets rejected. Dead end...
What to do now...Claims Sandusky is innocent!
Gets air time - for his prison interview(s)
Piers Morgan/Matt Lauer
Attacks Paterno family when they distance themselves
Then...nothing.
Gets Dottie to agree to an interview with Matt Lauer
More air time!
Court Filing?
More air time!
Guilty verdict?
More air time!

The only thing John Ziegler wants is to be famous. To be on TV. To be somebody. Want proof?

Here's his appearance on a dating show -

<iframe width="640" height="360" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/RQqLPJvk3gM?feature=player_embedded" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>



David Foster Wallace wrote an article for The Atlantic about Ziegler. You can read on the article here: https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2005/04/host/303812/

Excerpt: "The fact of the matter is that it is not John Ziegler's job to be responsible, or nuanced, or to think about whether his on-air comments are productive or dangerous, or cogent, or even defensible...

John Ziegler is not a journalist—he is an entertainer. Or maybe it's better to say that he is part of a peculiar, modern, and very popular type of news industry, one that manages to enjoy the authority and influence of journalism without the stodgy constraints of fairness, objectivity, and responsibility that make trying to tell the truth such a drag for everyone involved....

Which all sounds great, except of course "explaining" the news really means editorializing, infusing the actual events of the day with the host's own opinions. And here is where the real controversy starts, because these opinions are, as just one person's opinions, exempt from strict journalistic standards of truthfulness, probity, etc., and yet they are often delivered by the talk-radio host not as opinions but as revealed truths, truths intentionally ignored or suppressed by a "mainstream press" that's "biased" in favor of liberal interests."

There's also a good timeline of Mr. Ziegler's "career" - at least until 2005, the time of publication of this article. I'd say most of his life, his resume would read "unemployed."

Nothing more than a 2-bit ambulance chaser. Now he's on the "never-trump" bandwagon hoping to parlay that into some more air time - but occasionally dips his toe back into the Sandusky matter when given the chance.

He's proven NOTHING. He spouts his opinion like they are facts. Here are the facts:

Sandusky found GUILTY on 45 counts - sentence 30-60 years
Tim Curley plead GUILTY - sentence TBD
Gary Schultz plead GUILTY - sentence TBD
Dr. Spanier jury selection starts Monday - outcome TBD

 

[NC2017]

Like the avatar NC, reminds me of "ME" in my youth.
I can no longer fit in that narrow rocker.

LOL!

The older I get the harder it is to take life all that seriously

 

[marshall23]

If we look at the timeline, you know exactly who John Ziegler is. He's a ambulance chasing charlatan.

Story breaks - Ziegler appears on the scene. Starts "Framing Paterno.com" website.
Gets in touch with the Paterno family.
Says he's going to research and make a documentary.
Asks for money (Scott Paterno will confirm)
Gets rejected. Dead end...
What to do now...Claims Sandusky is innocent!
Gets air time - for his prison interview(s)
Piers Morgan/Matt Lauer
Attacks Paterno family when they distance themselves
Then...nothing.
Gets Dottie to agree to an interview with Matt Lauer
More air time!
Court Filing?
More air time!
Guilty verdict?
More air time!

The only thing John Ziegler wants is to be famous. To be on TV. To be somebody. Want proof?

Here's his appearance on a dating show -

<iframe width="640" height="360" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/RQqLPJvk3gM?feature=player_embedded" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>



David Foster Wallace wrote an article for The Atlantic about Ziegler. You can read on the article here: https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2005/04/host/303812/

Excerpt: "The fact of the matter is that it is not John Ziegler's job to be responsible, or nuanced, or to think about whether his on-air comments are productive or dangerous, or cogent, or even defensible...

John Ziegler is not a journalist—he is an entertainer. Or maybe it's better to say that he is part of a peculiar, modern, and very popular type of news industry, one that manages to enjoy the authority and influence of journalism without the stodgy constraints of fairness, objectivity, and responsibility that make trying to tell the truth such a drag for everyone involved....

Which all sounds great, except of course "explaining" the news really means editorializing, infusing the actual events of the day with the host's own opinions. And here is where the real controversy starts, because these opinions are, as just one person's opinions, exempt from strict journalistic standards of truthfulness, probity, etc., and yet they are often delivered by the talk-radio host not as opinions but as revealed truths, truths intentionally ignored or suppressed by a "mainstream press" that's "biased" in favor of liberal interests."

There's also a good timeline of Mr. Ziegler's "career" - at least until 2005, the time of publication of this article. I'd say most of his life, his resume would read "unemployed."

Nothing more than a 2-bit ambulance chaser. Now he's on the "never-trump" bandwagon hoping to parlay that into some more air time - but occasionally dips his toe back into the Sandusky matter when given the chance.

He's proven NOTHING. He spouts his opinion like they are facts. Here are the facts:

Sandusky found GUILTY on 45 counts - sentence 30-60 years
Tim Curley plead GUILTY - sentence TBD
Gary Schultz plead GUILTY - sentence TBD
Dr. Spanier jury selection starts Monday - outcome TBD

Interesting that YOU would use the term charlatan.

 

[demlion]

Sorry - no can do. Last I spoke with John about getting his "fake victim" info in front of someone at our incoming Attorney General's executive team he called me a F*CKING C*NT WHO CAN ROT IN HELL FOR ALL ETERNITY.

Apparently I am THE WORST ONE OUT THERE.

Then he went on to rant about F*CK PENN STATE - YOU ALL F*CKING DESERVE WHAT YOU F*CKING GOT. I AM SO F*CKING DONE WITH ALL OF YOU. I DON'T GIVE A F*CKING SHIT ABOUT ANY OF YOU - YOU ALL CAN JUST F*CKING DIE.

So no. I won't "debate".

I want Second Mile Leadership to explain to the F*CKING PENN STATE COMMUNITY how there is ZERO chance their charity founder is guilty of abusing charity clients.

I want them to explain why it is that they never tried to stop the media shitstorm.

I want them to explain why they let the Penn State community be smeared as football crazed child rape enablers.

I want them to explain why then, this is a witch hunt.

Lol! What an eloquent and cutting response.

Yeah, nobody will debate JZ because He.Is. An. Ass. It has nothing to do with the quality of his arguments. He is an abusive jackass. Surprised that so many people cannot see this. A debate? Lol.

 

[psulion2001]

Facebook chat after Glenn Beck appearance. So 99.9% of the population think JS is guilty yet there is no one that dare sit down and debate this guy? I don't mean some media member who has no clue and doesn't really care anyway (Pierce Morgan), I mean someone who is very well versed in the case and not just working off emotion. Someone capable of critical thinking and not afraid to admit they are/were wrong. Someone who is truly interested in the actual truth and not what is politically correct. In other words, is there a "Ziegler" for the JS is guilty side? If so, they need to debate in an open forum.

View embedded media

 

[Roxine]

Interesting that YOU would use the term charlatan.

I have done NOTHING untoward in all of this. Yes, I spoke out about my own personal abuse following this story breaking. Yes, I started a charity to advocate for other survivors. Yes, I attended the Jerry Sandusky trial in support of the victims. And Yes, I still work with some of the families and provide them support.

My charity, Tree Climbers, accepted donations from a very niche audience on Daily Kos prior to attending the trial. We used the funds raised to print a book "Bearing Witness" that was distributed to the young men who testified, and to fund our stay in Bellefonte to attend the trial. Following that - we no longer solicited for NOR RECEVIED ANY DONATIONS and have since done advocacy on behalf of the victims.

All records are public, filed with the IRS.

The reason I monitor John Ziegler is because he has, for the past 4 years, stalked and harassed the victims and their families. And because they have asked me to.

Your opinion matters not to me. Theirs does. And I will fight for them for as long as it takes. They were raped, as children - had their childhoods stolen from them. They deserve the right to their privacy - and I will fight for that right regardless what you think of me.

Thanks.
Roxine

 

[BBrown]

Lol! What an eloquent and cutting response.

Yeah, nobody will debate JZ because He.Is. An. Ass. It has nothing to do with the quality of his arguments. He is an abusive jackass. Surprised that so many people cannot see this. A debare? Lol.

At one time I thought JZ might actually be able to help, of course that was before I knew that he couldn't make a comment or reply to someone with out looking like a complete lunatic.
It is unfortunate as I do believe he has a wealth of knowledge about everything that went down and probably knows more about the case than 99.5% of the people do.

 

[kgilbert78]

I'm a 42 year old male, confident of my sexuality, and I've always found it extremely uncomfortable to shower with other guys after a game or working out. There's an old fat guy that "works out" at the gym I go to that walks around the locker room naked and I want to punch him in the face.

I work at a job that is very physical and it's common to sweat my ass off all day-dripping freakin' sweat. I drive home and take a shower. Why, in any environment, even with others adults around would it be acceptable to shower with young boys? Can someone explain this to me?

There was a time in this country, probably fueled by classicism (the interest in emulating the virtues of the Greek and Roman cultures), where this was normal. It was also partly due to a desire for places like the Y to be "classless". Thus it was common at places like the Y for swimming to be in the nude (true up to the 1970s, when the Y became coed) (link). This was true at PSU and many other colleges too, as older alums have noted (and frankly I do not remember if my swim test at PSU--required then for graduation--was that way or not--blocked it out of my mind, I guess).

It's one reason why Sandusky's behavior did not raise as many red flags as it would today. The culture has changed.

Mind you, I personally get being uncomfortable in locker room situations.

 

[wensilver]

@JeannieNeedsAShooter

I wrote this back in October 2015. I still feel the same way. Zig can & should make this happen.

 

[bkmtnittany1]

Actually - what I'd like to see is Second Mile CEO Dr. Jack Raykovitz, his charity counterpart Katherine Genovese and board members Bruce Heim & Bob Poole sit with John Ziegler before a national audience and discuss the ironclad oversight of their Second Mile clients, the exact protocol, the paperwork on file, the careful programming, the methods they had in place at Second Mile - that would make it VIRTUALLY IMPOSSIBLE for ANY of those adult men to have EVER been victimized when they were minors by Sandusky.

I want this leadership to tell ME why Second Mile was NOT a grooming charity and how they could have ASSURED that. Because it sure as hell appears Second Mile was a PERFECT grooming charity :

View embedded media

To date - none of the above leadership has ever explained how this abuse COULD NOT POSSIBLY have gone on during their watch. Nor have they ever explained how Jerry is TOTALLY INNOCENT of all these accusations. We all thought Lynne Abraham was going to get to the bottom of what went down at Second Mile. Were we ever duped.

Bonus Points if you get Judge Grine to sit in on this forum.

So why hasn't that happened and why won't John entertain that?

They new it was going on...but to many prominent people were making some major coin...so it was let go....

 

[psulion2001]

Yeah...saying kids from broken homes who were molested may not turn out great...no kidding. He was on to something there...good thing he stalked a couple of them.

He literally WENT THROUGH THEIR GARBAGE! How do people applaud that crap?

 

[coveydidnt]

He literally WENT THROUGH THEIR GARBAGE! How do people applaud that crap?

He's never went through their garbage? Where did you ever get that idea?

 

[LaJolla Lion]

He literally WENT THROUGH THEIR GARBAGE! How do people applaud that crap?

Why do some people follow some world leaders blindly? They say what they want to hear or they put the fear of death in them. In this case he has a little audience that really wants to believe Jerry is innocent and that the world was wrong. It's bordering on delusional at this point and even after we read their plea deals and see what happens with GS....they will still believe it no matter what. I stopped listening to a word he said the second he started bragging about harassing the victims. Yet his minions cheered him on because they didn't want any of this to be true. If you deny something enough...you'll believe it. If you still believe him that Jerry is innocent...you're a nut.

 

[Roxine]

Why do some people follow some world leaders blindly? They say what they want to hear or they put the fear of death in them. In this case he has a little audience that really wants to believe Jerry is innocent and that the world was wrong. It's bordering on delusional at this point and even after we read their plea deals and see what happens with GS....they will still believe it no matter what. I stopped listening to a word he said the second he started bragging about harassing the victims. Yet his minions cheered him on because they didn't want any of this to be true. If you deny something enough...you'll believe it.

Next week is going to be painful - for many people. Unfortunately I cannot attend Spanier's trial due to work conflicts. But I advise everyone who wants the truth to follow it closely.

I know several people who will be there - and while there are no transmissions allowed from within the courtroom, once testimony begins, the truth will start to be revealed.

 

[dshumbero]

Next week is going to be painful - for many people. Unfortunately I cannot attend Spanier's trial due to work conflicts. But I advise everyone who wants the truth to follow it closely.

I know several people who will be there - and while there are no transmissions allowed from within the courtroom, once testimony begins, the truth will start to be revealed.

Will Andrea DiMorphio be there?

 

[BBrown]

He literally WENT THROUGH THEIR GARBAGE! How do people applaud that crap?

I don't know if he went through their garbage or not, although I wouldn't put it past him, but he did take pictures through their garage windows which would have pissed me off. He should have had a round of salt shot in his ass.