Pa Supreme Court unseals documents AG Kathleen Kane sought to make public

[Marshall30]

I'm referring to something that was walked back by Kane's office after they first announced having the emails.

It wasn't specifically attached to a person and was just for shock value.

I obviously don't condone what's in those emails. I'm not going to lie, I'm not above looking at adult entertainment. What's in those emails isn't what I consider entertaining. The nature of it should have resulted in termination as soon as it was found.

At the same time, in my experience, it's not entirely surprising. That in no way excuses it, you just deal with it properly. In this case it's Seth Williams giving Fina two options, resign Friday morning or be fired Friday afternoon.

Stop disgracing yourself already!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[demlion]

"My point about technology was to illustrate this is nothing new. You can try and make this out to be something of great significance but it isn't. It's all too common."

So you deny that you claim that "everyone does it". As support for this claim you say its nothing new, and its all too common. See the problem? That is minimizing it because it in not at all common among high-level sex-crime prosecutors.

This is a prosecutor, not an insurance clerk at a hospital or a fertilizer taster at an agri-business company. He is in a position of trust, a place where victims of sexual and racial and gender violence, including children, go for protection and justice . That he embodies the same attitudes as the criminals he prosecutes is not very reassuring for those victims. THAT makes it a matter of great significance.

Meanwhile, he also has prosecuted government employees for wasting public resources, like ,say, using government computers for personal or campaign purposes instead of the work the public hired them to do.

So he is a top level prosecutor and LE official in a state with a massively incompetent set of social agencies designed for the protection of children which also happens to be loaded with political corruption. I do not think it is "nothing new" that he received and sent these offensive emails on government time mocking the very people he is supposed to protect. And I do not think this sort of stuff is common among people in his position. As a lawyer myself for 29 years I KNOW it isn't.

Lots of people smoke crack, lots of people assault their wives and girlfriends, lots of people steal and rape and even murder. But the only reason to repeatedly say that in THIS argument is to try and make me forget that Frank Fina is not "lots of people." He is a former top lawyer at the PA OAG, and now, a top hand at Seth Williams' DA office in the largest city in the state. Hell no, I ain't forgetting.

 

[marshall23]

"My point about technology was to illustrate this is nothing new. You can try and make this out to be something of great significance but it isn't. It's all too common."

So you deny that you claim that "everyone does it". As support for this claim you say its nothing new, and its all too common. See the problem? That is minimizing it because it in not at all common among high-level sex-crime prosecutors.

This is a prosecutor, not an insurance clerk at a hospital or a fertilizer taster at an agri-business company. He is in a position of trust, a place where victims of sexual and racial and gender violence, including children, go for protection and justice . That he embodies the same attitudes as the criminals he prosecutes is not very reassuring for those victims. THAT makes it a matter of great significance.

Meanwhile, he also has prosecuted government employees for wasting public resources, like ,say, using government computers for personal or campaign purposes instead of the work the public hired them to do.

So he is a top level prosecutor and LE official in a state with a massively incompetent set of social agencies designed for the protection of children which also happens to be loaded with political corruption. I do not think it is "nothing knew" that he received and sent these offensive emails on government time mocking the very people he is supposed to protect. And I do not think this sort of stuff is common among people in his position.

Lots of people smoke crack, lots of people assault their wives and girlfriends, lots of people steal and rape and even murder. but the only reason to repeatedly say that in THIS argument is to try and make me forget that Frank Fina is not "lots of people." He is a former top lawyer at the PA OAG, and not a top hand at Seth Williams' DA office in the largest city in the state. Hell no, I ain't forgetting.

Some of us have been troubled by what appeared to be issues with the investigation and prosecution of JS. We have debated for years the ease with which locations, dates, witnesses. etc seemed to be manipulated. We have speculated the motivations for such reckless behavior by the OAG. The emails confirm the character of the people who we have questioned. I find it beyond stunning that FF and dozens of OAG employees would feel comfortable sharing this sort of material on GOVERNMENT computers. It is obvious they felt entitled and above scrutiny. They carried the same attitude into their
investigations and prosecutions.

 

[demlion]

Some of us have been troubled by what appeared to be issues with the investigation and prosecution of JS. We have debated for years the ease with which locations, dates, witnesses. etc seemed to be manipulated. We have speculated the motivations for such reckless behavior by the OAG. The emails confirm the character of the people who we have questioned. I find it beyond stunning that FF and dozens of OAG employees would feel comfortable sharing this sort of material on GOVERNMENT computers. It is obvious they felt entitled and above scrutiny. They carried the same attitude into their
investigations and prosecutions.

As you probably know, I do not share those concerns about the trial of Jerry Sandusky, but this is enough to give anyone pause regarding the nature of the people bringing these allegations and prosecuting them. If you are right about the JS trial being some sort of put up job, then obviously that is horrendous. But even being able to raise the question, even if you are wrong, is a disservice to Jerry's victims, not on your part, but Fina's.

How can a prosecutor who sends porn emails prosecute sex crimes? At the moment it seems reasonable to conclude at least that Fina was a bigger fan of child porn than Jerry Sandusky.

 

[marshall23]

I

As you probably know, I do not share those concerns about the trial of Jerry Sandusky, but this is enough to give anyone pause regarding the nature of the people bringing these allegations and prosecuting them. If you are right about the JS trial being some sort of put up job, then obviously that is horrendous. But even being able to raise the question, even if you are wrong, is a disservice to Jerry's victims, not on your part, but Fina's.

How can a prosecutor who sends porn emails prosecute sex crimes? At the moment it seems reasonable to conclude at least that Fina was a bigger fan of child porn than Jerry Sandusky.

Just to be clear.....I am not part of the JS is innocent project. However, I have along with others, been concerned about the quality of justice he enjoyed in his trial. Everyone in Pa. should be paying attention here. As a reminder, FF and his cadre didn't just convict JS. They fire bombed PSU and In my opinion did a disservice to TC, GS2,JVP and MM.

 

[demlion]

I

Just to be clear.....I am not part of the JS is innocent project. However, I have along with others, been concerned about the quality of justice he enjoyed in his trial. Everyone in Pa. should be paying attention here. As a reminder, FF and his cadre didn't just convict JS. They fire bombed PSU and In my opinion did a disservice to TC, GS2,JVP and MM.

I am certainly more concerned about it than I was before.

 

[Misder2]

As you probably know, I do not share those concerns about the trial of Jerry Sandusky, but this is enough to give anyone pause regarding the nature of the people bringing these allegations and prosecuting them. If you are right about the JS trial being some sort of put up job, then obviously that is horrendous. But even being able to raise the question, even if you are wrong, is a disservice to Jerry's victims, not on your part, but Fina's.

How can a prosecutor who sends porn emails prosecute sex crimes? At the moment it seems reasonable to conclude at least that Fina was a bigger fan of child porn than Jerry Sandusky.

I agree with you, the proven lack of character of Frank Fina at best taints the conviction of JS. Frank Fina needs to fired immediately.

 

[demlion]

I agree with you, the proven lack of character of Frank Fina at best taints the conviction of JS. Frank Fina needs to fired immediately.

Wow, Seth. What you waitin' for? You know it is not like he did not know this was out there, or he has not had time to consider it. This has been talked about for years already. If message board peeps have known about it for this long, how long has Seth known?

Once Seth knew, why not act? Is it true in the end that the only thing that makes this bad is that he got caught, Seth? And it became public? You mean it was not wrong the first time you heard about it, but now that it is public is is wrong? Wow.

 

[marshall23]

Wow, Seth. What you waitin' for? You know it is not like he did not know this was out there, or he has not had time to consider it. This has been talked about for years already. If message board peeps have known about it for this long, how long has Seth known?

Once Seth knew, why not act? Is it true in the end that the only thing that makes this bad is that he got caught, Seth? And it became public? You mean it was not wrong the first time you heard about it, but now that it is public is is wrong? Wow.

Perhaps there is a reason SW cannot simply cast FF aside.

 

[lionlurker]

Agree with above. Fina probably has Seth's balls in a vise, for some reason, and Seth can't get himself free all that easily.

Damn, too bad newspapers aren't what they used to be. This would be such fun to watch unfold.

 

[Ceasar]

Agree with above. Fina probably has Seth's balls in a vise, for some reason, and Seth can't get himself free all that easily.

Damn, too bad newspapers aren't what they used to be. This would be such fun to watch unfold.

IMO it is as simple as Williams and Fina are close personal friends. And further, for all we know Williams really has no problem with the content of the emails and to him this is simply a PR issue. Won't surprise me at all if Williams tries to put this on the backburner by saying "we are investigating...", hope a few months go by without any real pressure from the media and then Fina stays on the job after it blows over. That is probably his hope.

 

[mn78psu83]

IMO it is as simple as Williams and Fina are close personal friends. And further, for all we know Williams really has no problem with the content of the emails and to him this is simply a PR issue. Won't surprise me at all if Williams tries to put this on the backburner by saying "we are investigating...", hope a few months go by without any real pressure from the media and then Fina stays on the job after it blows over. That is probably his hope.

Makes the most sense.

 

[PSU_Chicago]

You can act like this proof of some greater problem if you want. The real problem lies with this feud between Kane and Fina. They've wasted resources on a petty vendetta instead of doing their jobs.

That MontCo judge really needs to have his actions looked at by some authority. Or (from what I have seen on the net) Fina and Costanza flat out lied to him. If they did, what does he do about it?

 

[lionlurker]

It can't go away, so long as Kane is getting prosecuted. That alone will keep Fina in the headlines. Kane and her people will make sure of that.

 

[mn78psu83]

It can't go away, so long as Kane is getting prosecuted. That alone will keep Fina in the headlines. Kane and her people will make sure of that.

No doubt. All of these people in the fight are attorneys though. They will hang on like grim death for as long as they can. LOL.

 

[Ceasar]

That MontCo judge really needs to have his actions looked at by some authority. Or (from what I have seen on the net) Fina and Costanza flat out lied to him. If they did, what does he do about it?

Interestingly enough there is a decent article on Pennlive this morning in which a few law professors analyze the case against Kane and her defense. One of the things they suggest is the only way these e-mails are going to serve as a defense is if she in essence the entire Grand Jury was established to quiet her and that the Judge was a participant in that. So I would guess she will be going after Judge Carpenter at some point.

 

[mn78psu83]

Interestingly enough there is a decent article on Pennlive this morning in which a few law professors analyze the case against Kane and her defense. One of the things they suggest is the only way these e-mails are going to serve as a defense is if she in essence the entire Grand Jury was established to quiet her and that the Judge was a participant in that. So I would guess she will be going after Judge Carpenter at some point.

Disclaimer: the following link to an article, cited by Caesar, is a Pennlive article and some will not want to give that news outlet a click.
LINK: Porn emails raise troubling questions, but may not help AG Kane

 

[Aoshiro]

Disclaimer: the following link to an article, cited by Caesar, is a Pennlive article and some will not want to give that news outlet a click.
LINK: Porn emails raise troubling questions, but may not help AG Kane

If all the people who testified against Kane were sharing those emails would it affect the assessment of their credibility?

 

[mn78psu83]

If all the people who testified against Kane were sharing those emails would it affect the assessment of their credibility?

Yes. I hope this one goes to trial. Let's see it all on display. On the surface, to me, both sides are dirty. A purging seems in order.