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Sandusky prison interview article

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That they made a mistake is opinion.

Did Freeh say that?

How so? Was Joe involved after he reported it? Why would Curley mention him then

They did go to jail did they not? Didn't the prosecution say he felt that Curley said one thing behind closed doors and then another to "save face in front of his supporters"? Didn't the judge say that he didn't believe Curley was telling the truth when he sentenced him?

My calculation was 4%

Fair enough.
Your handle was created in 2012 (your profile is locked) and you only have 5 total posts and they all seem to be in this thread.....that's....interesting...Nice shill account you have there! Who gave you the bat signal to dust off this old ass shill account and get into this thread? Do you get paid per post or how does that work with your employer?
 
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Can you say JockStrapJohninPhila.
It wouldn't surprise me. His account reeks of being a shill/disinfo agent. The shills LOVE to point to that dumbass interview Joe did with Sassano 10 freaking years after the event and new info etc. could have clouded his judgement. He was also dealing with cancer at the time of that interview.
 
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I found the transcript and here is what Joe told Sassano:

INTERVIEW: JOSEPH V. PATERNO

The date is 10/24/11; time 12:17 p.m., interview of coach Joseph Vincent Paterno, 830 North McKee Street, State College, PA. Scott Paterno is here representing his father. Randy Feathers is also present.

SASSANO: Coach are you aware that this statement is being taped and do you give me permission to tape this statement?

J. PATERNO: Yes.

SASSANO: Did Mike McQueary, some years ago, come to you, report to you an incident that he observed in the shower between Jerry Sandusky and another individual most likely a young boy.

J. PATERNO: Yes he did.

SASSANO: Okay, and can you tell me what Mike McQueary told you please.

J. PATERNO: Mike McQueary came and said he was in the shower and that Jerry Sandusky was in the shower with another person, a younger, how young I don’t know and Mike never mentioned it, that there was some inappropriate sexual activity going on. We didn’t get in to what the inappropriate action was, but it was inappropriate. And that’s how I knew about it.


He told Joe and Curley and Schultz

Was it illegal then?

Schultz or Curley. Did he tell him a name?

MM and Joe said he did see something and probably thought Joe would handle it.

Wasn't PSU given a report in 1998 that said Sandusky was a likely pedophile? Chambers was the psychologist.
FWIW the police report doesn’t say that. It’s interesting the way it played out…it’s pretty clear the prosecution took advantage of joes old age imho …
 
"Jurors in CSS trials thought otherwise."

again, untrue. Curly and Schultz were never tried. They pled guilty to low misdemeanors after the prosecution persecuted them for over five years. Both had health issues and were getting old. They wanted to get past this so took the fine.
Here is what I found:
"Curley and Schultz, in lengthy colloquies with current case prosecutors Laura Ditka and Patrick Schulte, acknowledged receiving McQueary's report and interfering with or preventing its transmission to police and child welfare officials. They conceded a legal duty to do that and as a result of that inaction, the men admitted, prosecutors could show Sandusky continued to have access to boys and, in fact, abused another boy in Penn State's football facilities before his eventual arrest in 2011."
Curly actually didn't testify to what the prosecutors bribed him to do, with the lower plea, and were very upset that he testified truthfully in the Spanier trial. I think they went for jail time but can't recall if he actually served time in jail.
Both Curley and Schultz served time in jail. I think Curley got three months. I've seen their mug shots.
Spanier was tried for several felonies and misdemeanors. The jury found him guilty of a low end child endangerment charge.
True but Spanier served about two months right?
The jury foreperson said this happened because one juror held out for a conviction of some type and it was Friday afternoon.
Do you have a cite where the juror said that?
They wanted to go home. So to placate that jurist they settled on a single misdemeanor.
Did the juror say that? Cite?
 
It wouldn't surprise me. His account reeks of being a shill/disinfo agent. The shills LOVE to point to that dumbass interview Joe did with Sassano 10 freaking years after the event and new info etc. could have clouded his judgement. He was also dealing with cancer at the time of that interview.
Did Joe know he had cancer in November 2011?
 
Here is what I found:
"Curley and Schultz, in lengthy colloquies with current case prosecutors Laura Ditka and Patrick Schulte, acknowledged receiving McQueary's report and interfering with or preventing its transmission to police and child welfare officials. They conceded a legal duty to do that and as a result of that inaction, the men admitted, prosecutors could show Sandusky continued to have access to boys and, in fact, abused another boy in Penn State's football facilities before his eventual arrest in 2011."

Both Curley and Schultz served time in jail. I think Curley got three months. I've seen their mug shots.

True but Spanier served about two months right?

Do you have a cite where the juror said that?

Did the juror say that? Cite?
The people at TSM (who laughed Tim out of their office) were child welfare officials since the state contracted foster care, etc. services out to TSM. The PSU admins weren't even considered mandatory reporters but the people running TSM where. Again why were TSM losers like Raykovitz treated with kid gloves while school admins had the book thrown at them?
 
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Did Joe know he had cancer in November 2011?
That's irrelevant. It would impact his cognitive ability whether he knew he had cancer at the time or not. Just go away you loser shill. Way to ignore my post with all the testimony/judicial fuuckery and also ignore the fact that I called you out for being an obvious SHILL. Or did you just randomly create an account 10+ years ago, not post a single time, then stumble across this thread today?
 
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It's human nature to respond that way when an entire community is labeled as pedo enablers. The thing you can't get past is the response by alums that you keep harping on NEVER WOULD HAVE HAPPENED had the BOT initially taken a neutral approach, no comment until facts come out, etc. instead of immediately assuming the guilt of all their employees and throwing them and PSU's culture/fb program under the bus. That's why I keep pointing to cause and effect. The horse is already out of the barn but it's never too late to denounce the freeh report as garbage and apologize to the Paterno family. It would heal the PSU community, I don't give af about broader PR at this point. The masses would eventually wonder why PSU is apologizing and wonder if new facts have come to light, etc. which is true. We know way more about the scandal now then 10+ years ago. The state dropped all the conspiracy and felony charges against the admins, etc.
We agree the BOT handled it poorly--the "never would have happened" part doesn't matter because it did and that's what the public remembers. And that's all they care about and all they will ever care about.
What does apologizing to the Paterno family do? Why do you care about that? What are you trying to heal from?
If you don't care about the PR stance then why are you arguing with me about it because that is the entire discussion we're having.
The masses are going to say an apology is just Penn State admitting Joe is bigger than the kids that were abused. You get that right? The public doesn't care about Joe. They care that Penn State fans, in their minds, care more about Paterno than the "victims".
The issue with the public is "the defense of Joe" not what the University said.
Regardless of the BOT's approach, those that defended Joe would have still done so to the point of driving public perception against him.
I don't believe for a second there's a single person that doesn't comprehend "the defense of Joe" is why the public feels the way they do.
 
That's irrelevant. It would impact his cognitive ability whether he knew he had cancer at the time or not. Just go away you loser shill. Way to ignore my post with all the testimony/judicial fuuckery and also ignore the fact that I called you out for being an obvious SHILL. Or did you just randomly create an account 10+ years ago, not post a single time, then stumble across this thread today?
Did you just basically say he can't use Joe's words to say what Joe knew?
Come on--Joe was made aware of an incident and followed the proper chain of command.
This is the issue people have. If you just say, "McQueary told Joe and then Joe followed proper procedures" all is good because that's true. He doesn't need excuses made for him. STOP.
This, right here, is the exact reason non-Penn State fans won't move past it and primary remember Joe for this--because of how defensive you and others are. You're doing damage to his legacy.
 
Did you just basically say he can't use Joe's words to say what Joe knew?
Come on--Joe was made aware of an incident and followed the proper chain of command.
This is the issue people have. If you just say, "McQueary told Joe and then Joe followed proper procedures" all is good because that's true. He doesn't need excuses made for him. STOP.
This, right here, is the exact reason non-Penn State fans won't move past it and primary remember Joe for this--because of how defensive you and others are. You're doing damage to his legacy.
I never said Joe wasn't made aware of 2001. The details in the Sassano interview are inherently unreliable though.

Its not an excuse to point out an interview asking a guy (whose body was riddled with cancer) to recall details from a conversation from 10 years in the past is practically worthless. If you want accuracy look at contemporaneous emails, notes, actions, etc. which all clearly show MM didn’t report clear abuse to anyone. He heard some sounds and saw some positioning that weirded him out. Thats it. Everything outside of that is supposition/assumptions on Mikes part. The admins reported it to mandatory reporters at TSM who laughed them out of their office.
 
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I agree with you.

To the GJ, Joe said, "I don't know what you'd call it", and I'm not sure what it was." It's pure evil to try and twist Joe's words.
But wasn't that about what sex acts were told to him? Did he ever back off that the incident was sexual, with a child? He was pretty clear on that when he spoke to Sassano it seems.
Again, once MM reported what he saw to Tim and Gary, Joe was officially out.

Yes, Tim circled back with Joe and then said in his email to S/S:

I had scheduled a meeting with you this afternoon about the subject we discussed on Sunday. After giving it more thought and talking it over with Joe yesterday – I am uncomfortable with what we agreed were the next steps. I am having trouble with going to everyone, but the person involved. I think I would be more comfortable meeting with the person and tell him about the information we received. I would plan to tell him we are aware of the first situation. I would indicate that we feel there is a problem and we want to assist the individual to get professional help. Also, we feel a responsibility at some point soon to inform his organization and maybe the other one about the situation. If he is cooperative, we would work with him to handle informing the organization. If not, we do not have a choice and will inform the two groups. Additionally, I will let him know that his guests are not permitted to use our facilities. I need some help on this one. What do you think about this approach?

So what? After meeting with MM, Tim was having second thoughts. He then revisited the matter with Joe, who had received the initial report. But to S/S, Tim said: I am uncomfortable... I am having trouble... I think... I would plan to tell him... I would indicate.... I will let him know.... I need some help on this one.
Didn't you say that Joe was not involved once he reported? Here is what Freeh said "As detailed in my report, the e-mails and contemporary documents from 2001 show that, despite Mr. Paterno's knowledge and McQueary's observations, four of the most powerful officials at Penn State agreed not to report Sandusky's activity to public officials. As made clear in the attachments to our report, on February 25, 2001, Messrs. Spanier, Curley and Schulz agreed to report Sandusky's abuse to the Pennsylvania Department of Public Welfare. On February 27, 2001, these men agreed that reporting to DPW was not required, reasoning in the words of Graham Spanier that "[t]he only downside for us is if the message isn't 'heard' and acted upon, and we then become vulnerable for not having reported it." The only known, intervening factor between the decision made on February 25, 2001 and the agreement not to report on February 27, 2001, was Mr. Paterno's February 26th conversation with Mr. Curley regarding what to do about Sandusky. Again, this conversation was memorialized in the contemporary email, where Mr. Curley said "[a]fter giving it more thought and talking it over with Joe yesterday -- I am uncomfortable with what we agreed were the next steps."
At no point did he say, Joe is uncomfortable, or we are uncomfortable.
Why do you think he even mentioned Joe? Was it name dropping to get the other two to go along with his plan?
In Spanier's response to Tim, he said, "This approach is acceptable to me." Here you have the university president exercising his authority and accepting what was his ultimate responsibility. The buck stopped there.

This approach is acceptable to me. It requires you to go a step further and means your conversation will be all the more difficult, but I admire your willingness to do that and I am supportive. The only downside for us is if our message is not “heard” and acted upon, and we then become vulnerable for not having reported it. But that can be assessed down the road. The approach you outline is humane and a reasonable way to proceed.

Yet people were relentless in going after Joe! Why?
Because of his power within the institution and his image of being a great man as well as a coach?
To be clear, it is my belief that, rather than covering up a reported case of CSA, C/S/S/P were focused on preventing a repeat of the '98 shower incident. Even though nothing came of that, and as in the MM incident, Jerry remained close with that boy well into his adulthood, that Mom could have sued in civil court and would have likely walked away with a nice settlement. That's why they took Jerry's guest privileges away. They wanted to avoid a subsequent incident, in which an accusation and a he said/he said scenario would have left them "vulnerable".
What about the report in 1998 that said Sandusky was a likely pedophile?
What's apparent from both the emails and Schultz's notes is that they never acted as though the boy MM saw with Jerry was a victim. He was never even part of the discussion. Surely if they believed CSA had been witnessed by MM, they would have expressed concern for his well being and/or whether or not he might tell someone what had happened. But there was no mention of him at all.
Freeh said they showed a stunning lack of remorse for the victims.
Instead, their only concern was that Jerry might not get the message and continue to shower alone with other TSM kids, one of whose moms might be more opportunistic.

The C/S/S response was never about damage control and always about prevention. Thus, there was never a reason for PSU to fall on the sword. And yet it did. Why?
Wouldn't the best course then would have been to call the police and have it properly investigated? Wouldn't that be better prevention?
Destroying Joe's reputation was utterly unnecessary with respect to Sandsuky. But it was totally necessary relative to the narrative, which to this day remains carved in stone.
Who created this narrative and what is their motive? Just to ruin PSU?
 
I never said Joe wasn't made aware of 2001. The details in the Sassano interview are inherently unreliable though.

Its not an excuse to point out an interview asking a guy (whose body was riddled with cancer) to recall details from a conversation from 10 years in the past is practically worthless. If you want accuracy look at contemporaneous emails, notes, actions, etc. which all clearly show MM didn’t report clear abuse to anyone. He heard some sounds and saw some positioning that weirded him out. Thats it. Everything outside of that is supposition/assumptions on Mikes part. The admins reported it to mandatory reporters at TSM who laughed them out of their office.
It is you making an excuse. Paterno wasn't prepped for the interview? Are you being serious?
Again, my complaint was you're trying to tell someone they can't use Paterno's words. That's the worst argument you can ever make in this situation. And it isn't even needed because he didn't do anything wrong using the words said there.
You're so mad at the admins and the BOT you can't have a rational conversation. You have to let it go.
 
But wasn't that about what sex acts were told to him? Did he ever back off that the incident was sexual, with a child? He was pretty clear on that when he spoke to Sassano it seems.

Didn't you say that Joe was not involved once he reported? Here is what Freeh said "As detailed in my report, the e-mails and contemporary documents from 2001 show that, despite Mr. Paterno's knowledge and McQueary's observations, four of the most powerful officials at Penn State agreed not to report Sandusky's activity to public officials. As made clear in the attachments to our report, on February 25, 2001, Messrs. Spanier, Curley and Schulz agreed to report Sandusky's abuse to the Pennsylvania Department of Public Welfare. On February 27, 2001, these men agreed that reporting to DPW was not required, reasoning in the words of Graham Spanier that "[t]he only downside for us is if the message isn't 'heard' and acted upon, and we then become vulnerable for not having reported it." The only known, intervening factor between the decision made on February 25, 2001 and the agreement not to report on February 27, 2001, was Mr. Paterno's February 26th conversation with Mr. Curley regarding what to do about Sandusky. Again, this conversation was memorialized in the contemporary email, where Mr. Curley said "[a]fter giving it more thought and talking it over with Joe yesterday -- I am uncomfortable with what we agreed were the next steps."

Why do you think he even mentioned Joe? Was it name dropping to get the other two to go along with his plan?

Because of his power within the institution and his image of being a great man as well as a coach?

What about the report in 1998 that said Sandusky was a likely pedophile?

Freeh said they showed a stunning lack of remorse for the victims.

Wouldn't the best course then would have been to call the police and have it properly investigated? Wouldn't that be better prevention?


Who created this narrative and what is their motive? Just to ruin PSU?
Freeh said?? Bhahahaaa!! No one gives AF what corrupt asshole freeh had to say about anything.

I find it fascinating that I called you out numerous times for using an obvious shill account and you didn't even have the gall to claim otherwise. Your silence on this speaks volumes.

How much do you get paid to post here? Since you've been outed you should just dust off another shill account and try again.

giphy.gif


It is you making an excuse. Paterno wasn't prepped for the interview? Are you being serious?
Again, my complaint was you're trying to tell someone they can't use Paterno's words. That's the worst argument you can ever make in this situation. And it isn't even needed because he didn't do anything wrong using the words said there.
You're so mad at the admins and the BOT you can't have a rational conversation. You have to let it go.
WTF are you talking about? All I said was relying on someone's ten year old recollection about an inappropriate shower is inherently unreliable, to me it's completely worthless. People that cling onto that Sassano interview as if its some huge indictment against Joe/admins are morons who aren't being intellectually honest.

Why do you think crimes have statutes of limitation? You can't expect people to provide accurate testimony about events that happened decades in the past especially when their brain is riddled with cancer. Stop playing dumb. Someone clearly coached Joe on his interview with Sassano and it was terrible coaching/advice. Any investigator worth their salt woudn't put much weight on that type of testimony. People's memories are inherently bad even 1 year after something happened let alone 10+ years.

You can "let it go" all you want but I will continue to hammer away over here.
 
Here is what I found:
"Curley and Schultz, in lengthy colloquies with current case prosecutors Laura Ditka and Patrick Schulte, acknowledged receiving McQueary's report and interfering with or preventing its transmission to police and child welfare officials. They conceded a legal duty to do that and as a result of that inaction, the men admitted, prosecutors could show Sandusky continued to have access to boys and, in fact, abused another boy in Penn State's football facilities before his eventual arrest in 2011."

Both Curley and Schultz served time in jail. I think Curley got three months. I've seen their mug shots.

True but Spanier served about two months right?

Do you have a cite where the juror said that?

Did the juror say that? Cite?
Mug shots are taken at time of arrest, not incarceration. If you don’t know the fundamentals, there is no longer a need to discuss this with you.
 
WTF are you talking about? All I said was relying on someone's ten year old recollection about an inappropriate shower is inherently unreliable, to me it's completely worthless. People that cling onto that Sassano interview as if its some huge indictment against Joe/admins are morons who aren't being intellectually honest.

Why do you think crimes have statutes of limitation? You can't expect people to provide accurate testimony about events that happened decades in the past especially when their brain is riddled with cancer. Stop playing dumb. Someone clearly coached Joe on his interview with Sassano and it was terrible coaching/advice. Any investigator worth their salt woudn't put much weight on that type of testimony. People's memories are inherently bad even 1 year after something happened let alone 10+ years.

You can "let it go" all you want but I will continue to hammer away over here.
See you say it's worthless because you then said it's an indictment against Joe. It isn't and that's the argument you should be making not that what he's saying is inaccurate. We know he knew of an incident and he followed the correct procedure.

That's not why we have statutes of limitations. Take an intro to law course if you think that.

You seem to think I believe the interview is a negative for Joe. It isn't. At all. Why do you think it is? We know he knew of the incident. Think for a second. Everyone is coached prior to those interviews which is why you dismissing it makes less sense. Especially because it's not a problem.

I'm not mad about anything with Paterno. I'm annoyed that some can't accept they're inability to stop making excuses (which you're doing) for him is causing more harm than good.

Paterno did nothing wrong (read that multiple times) but the reason the story lives on is the people that won't let it die. Franco, Jay, you and everyone else destroyed this because of the PR nightmare that was created. See Michigan with Harbaugh--if you stop talking about it no one will talk about it.
 
If you aren't willing to go that far, I would postulate that there is absolutely evidence that creates reasonable doubt and therefore his guilty verdict was incorrect.

I don't disagree with these statements. TSM did not have good policies in place and Sandusky did not follow good protocols.

I disagree with this and think the evidence supports my assertion.

Agreed.

Completely agree and the facts back this up.

The jurors in Jer's trial later admitted they were frightened and didn't want to be painted as enablers.
 
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Disagree. MM was clearly panicked when contacted by police. He did not have any clue it was about Sandusky. He thought it was either about gambling or dpics. That's why initial meeting was on a park bench and not at his home or the police station.
It's possible that the police told him they would drop the other issues if he agreed to lower the boom on JS. It's also possible that they said they would drop the issue of MM failing to do more to stop what he saw. I haven't heard evidence of this but it's possible.
 
Whistleblower policies have evolved significantly since then.
Not all institutions had well defined procedures in place at the time (not saying the shouldn't have, just saying I do not think anyone circumvented the existing PSU policies; recall Paterno stated that he actually took the time to look up what he was supposed to do when McQueary made a report to him).
I worked for multiple companies much smaller than PSU that had clearly defined whistleblower policies back then.
 
It's possible that the police told him they would drop the other issues if he agreed to lower the boom on JS. It's also possible that they said they would drop the issue of MM failing to do more to stop what he saw. I haven't heard evidence of this but it's possible.
So is there any proof that the Police threatened MM in order to get testimony from him? Did they even suspect gambling? Was gambling ever proven except allegations from old roommates who were mad at him for the scandal? Are those type pictures illegal between consenting adults? Why would the police care about such?
 
I never said that. What I said was that the govt dropped all the major charges to get them to plead to a minor misdemeanor. I recall Curley didn’t testify the way they wanted so went for a bigger sentence (in other worlds that is called blackmail)
You do accept that's a standard tactic used to get a conviction and save money, right? It doesn't mean other crimes didn't occur
This is like saying someone is guilty when they settle a civil suit. It's illogical.
 
You do accept that's a standard tactic used to get a conviction and save money, right? It doesn't mean other crimes didn't occur
This is like saying someone is guilty when they settle a civil suit. It's illogical.
The standard tactic is to overcharge (can't prove the charges with evidence but they use it to leverage out a lesser conviction/plea).

The state never had a hint of evidence there was a conspiracy, etc. (there's no conspiracy if you report the incident OUTSIDE of your org to people you have no control over) but they held those charges over the admins heads for YEARS while they dragged their feet hoping to bankrupt them and force them to plead out. At the end of the day they got the admins on a single misdemeanor (based on a tortured interpretation of mandatory reporting laws at the time) after charging them with multiple felonies each. All the while they didn't charge a single person at TSM and even used Raykovitz as a prosecution witness against Spanier. Amazingly during Spanier's trial Raykovitz admitted that informing TSM about 2001 satisfied any obligations the PSU admins had.
 
The standard tactic is to overcharge (can't prove the charges with evidence but they use it to leverage out a lesser conviction/plea).

The state never had a hint of evidence there was a conspiracy, etc. (there's no conspiracy if you report the incident OUTSIDE of your org to people you have no control over) but they held those charges over the admins heads for YEARS while they dragged their feet hoping to bankrupt them and force them to plead out. At the end of the day they got the admins on a single misdemeanor (based on a tortured interpretation of mandatory reporting laws at the time) after charging them with multiple felonies each. All the while they didn't charge a single person at TSM and even used Raykovitz as a prosecution witness against Spanier. Amazingly during Spanier's trial Raykovitz admitted that informing TSM about 2001 satisfied any obligations the PSU admins had.
Talk about not understanding the legal system...sigh. The scariest part is you don't even comprehend how delisional you are about this.
 
Two things can be true: A) the trial was flawed; and B) Sandusky was guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.

I don't know enough about the trial to have a strong opinion on (A) but based on all the facts and evidence, I'm comfortable with (B)...and if I'd been on the jury, I'd have been voting to convict his ass.

Obli, I totally get your point, but I also stand by mine. Appealing to the example of...uh, you know who...only strengthens my argument.

Plus, I don't care what the "rules" say. If you're truly innocent of heinous charges, you look the jury in the eye and say so. Screw the lawyers.

I mean, their advice didn't help him a whole lot in the end. As I recall, more than one juror said his unwillingness to testify influenced their thinking in favor of guilty. No surprise. As a juror, I'd have felt the same way in the same circumstances.

LdN, I totally think Sandusky should have a fair trial. But beyond that, I totally think guilty people should be convicted. And I totally think Sandusky is guilty.
You’d feel differently if you were the accused.
 
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I never said that. What I said was that the govt dropped all the major charges to get them to plead to a minor misdemeanor. I recall Curley didn’t testify the way they wanted so went for a bigger sentence (in other worlds that is called blackmail)
Ok good.

The Judge said this when he sentenced Curley : "I was unimpressed by your testimony,’ Boccabella told Curley, who received the harshest sentence of the three. He added that the athletic department, where the incident occurred, was Curley’s area of oversight and that he found it difficult to believe Curley couldn’t remember the details of the situation."

The prosecution said this:
"While Curley deserves credit for taking responsibility for his actions in the form of admitting his guilt, his repeated claims of memory lapses around critical events surrounding the crime was nothing short of bizarre, Ditka wrote. His memory was ‘markedly more clear’ when he gave a statement to investigators a week before the trial, Ditka wrote. The Commonwealth’s position is that Curley’s testimony in the Spanier trial was designed to protect those who deserved to share blame with Curley for the decisions that led to the colossal failure to protect children from Sandusky, the memorandum said. ‘His ‘forgetfulness’ also allowed him to save face in a room full of supporters."

Looks like Curley told the prosecutors one thing out of court to get his deal and then told another story in court in front of his supporters? So it might have backfired on him and he got the most time.
 
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