Ziegler Slaten today 4:30 PM ET

[SteveMasters]

Steve,

I know the timelines, but apparently some here don't or are confused to how a criminal investigation works. The victims were talking to the police well ahead of ANY PSU involvement at all which means no money was on the table. The police were going after a pedophile at that point in time, nobody else. The schools lack of leadership is the real reason you should be pissed. They allowed it to be about PSU when it wasn't. You can stop the round and round BS game of proving a damn thing. You can't prove they all lied. Hell you can't even prove one lied.

I get you blue hairs are upset Joe's name got crapped on. It sucks and it bothers me too, but it doesn't make Jerry Sandusky innocent because in some little fantasy world there is a about a 1% chance everyone lied. Every victim. Every detective. Every prosecuting attorney. Forget PSU and the BoT, but look at Jerry's case by itself. Did higher ups in the BoT, TSM, and at PSU CYA, sure they did. You know why they did, because they know that sick SOB was guilty as hell. I really hope one day before he dies Jerry fesses up, but it's rare for criminals to do so since it will kill any hope of any appeal ever. Maybe he gets some terminal disease and finally sets the blue hairs here in denial straight. Short of that you'll continue to believe in Santa.

In March 2011, 2.5 years after AF's initial complaint, the OAG passed an illegal grand jury leak to Sara Ganim in order to help an investigation that was languishing due to a lack of victims. In conjunction, Sara Ganim also spoke with v6's mother, relaying the OAG message to find more victims or the case might be retired. I believe that v6's mother realized the opportunity and she was able to pass word of that opportunity to other interested parties

You haven't said which victim that you find believable. I don't find any of them believable. I don't believe you can prove any specific victim is telling the truth.

I am not sure if this meets your standards, but I believe there is very strong circumstantial evidence that demonstrates that AM and Matt Sandusky were more truthful in their statements of support for JS after he was arrested than in their statements after Joe Paterno was fired and they hired attorney Andrew Shubin to extract a settlement from Penn State.

Why would AM have JS stand with him on senior day at last HS football game, invite him to his wedding, travel 12 hours to attend JS's mother's funeral, write LTE's in support, and make a statement to investigator saying nothing happened if he had been abused?

Why would MS freely elect at age 18 to be adopted by JS, deny being abused to the GJ, go to court against ex-wife to permit JS access to own children if he knew JS to be a pedophile?

The victim that I think has the most credibility is AF; but that is not saying much as I don't believe he is very credible. The more I learn about him, the more his credibility is reduced. It was over four months from the initial complaint when he first make sexual accusations and then only after receiving refreshed memory therapy and in the presence of his psychologist. Given his claims of over 100 sexual acts, I do not find it credible that he is not able to identify one specific date and that there is no other evidence (physical or eyewitness) to corroborate these claims. His behavior as evidenced by his social media comments and his behavior as described by the people who know him the best do not correspond with the behavior of a CSA survivor.

Jerry Sandusky did not receive a fair trial. Judge Cleland should order hearings into whether Sandusky's Petition for Post Conviction Relief has merit. Jerry Sandusky should be given a fair opportunity to rebut the accusations of AF.

 

[LaJolla Lion]

In March 2011, 2.5 years after AF's initial complaint, the OAG passed an illegal grand jury leak to Sara Ganim in order to help an investigation that was languishing due to a lack of victims. In conjunction, Sara Ganim also spoke with v6's mother, relaying the OAG message to find more victims or the case might be retired. I believe that v6's mother realized the opportunity and she was able to pass word of that opportunity to other interested parties

You haven't said which victim that you find believable. I don't find any of them believable. I don't believe you can prove any specific victim is telling the truth.

I am not sure if this meets your standards, but I believe there is very strong circumstantial evidence that demonstrates that AM and Matt Sandusky were more truthful in their statements of support for JS after he was arrested than in their statements after Joe Paterno was fired and they hired attorney Andrew Shubin to extract a settlement from Penn State.

Why would AM have JS stand with him on senior day at last HS football game, invite him to wedding, travel 12 hours to attend JS's mother's funeral, write LTE's in support, and make a statement to investigator saying nothing happened if he had been abused?

Why would MS freely elect at age 18 to be adopted by JS, deny being abused to the GJ, go to court against ex-wife to permit JS access to own children if he knew JS to be a pedophile?

The victim that I think has the most credibility is AF; but that is not saying much as I don't believe he is very credible. The more I learn about him, the more his credibility is reduced. It was over four months from the initial complaint when he first make sexual accusations and then only after receiving refreshed memory therapy and in the presence of his psychologist. Given his claims of over 100 sexual acts, I do not find it credible that he is not able to identify one specific date and that there is no other evidence (physical or eyewitness) to corroborate these claims. His behavior as evidenced by his social media comments and his behavior as described by the people who know him the best do not correspond with the behavior of a CSA survivor.

Jerry Sandusky did not receive a fair trial. Judge Cleland should order hearings into whether Sandusky's Petition for Post Conviction Relief has merit. Jerry Sandusky should be given a fair opportunity to rebut the accusations of AF.

Again you're worried about Paterno, not Jerry. That is the sad thing in all of this. I knew what he stood for and know he got screwed at the end. I just don't have the delusion of Jerry being innocent like you do. He's guilty and that isn't walking back. Joe's kids seem to feel the same way too. There is a reason people are call fans...some here prove it.

You folks are either in complete denial and are crazy or are geniuses seeing things the normal people on this planet can. I think most here defending Jerry are older and are more upset Joe took a hit on this. He was your hero and it bothers you...I get that. You just don't know how bad it looks when you have zero proof of anything. You can only attack the victims actions and ignore Jerry's.

 

[LundyPSU]

I recognize and understand the arguments about a fair trial, inconsistencies, etc. However, has JS ever explained why the showers, touching, and raspberries? He has not denied any of those things, but never an explanation. Creepy, at best, and contributes to the pattern of behavior and accusations

 

[ralpieE]

I would say that too I guess if I could refute a thing in the post. You can't answer any questions I ask in terms of the behavior. You can't prove anyone lied. You are basically saying every victim, cop, and prosecutor made this whole thing up to get kids paid. People they didn't know. It was all just made up in order to get a man who was so well thought of at the time. He was almost considered a saint. Hell even the Vatican can acknowledge their sinners.

Prove he opposite. You keep dodging it.

 

[sluggo72]

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/201...tifies-jerry-sandusky-forcibly-raped-him?lite

 

[Misder2]

Steve, you need to realize something

In March 2011, 2.5 years after AF's initial complaint, the OAG passed an illegal grand jury leak to Sara Ganim in order to help an investigation that was languishing due to a lack of victims. In conjunction, Sara Ganim also spoke with v6's mother, relaying the OAG message to find more victims or the case might be retired. I believe that v6's mother realized the opportunity and she was able to pass word of that opportunity to other interested parties

You haven't said which victim that you find believable. I don't find any of them believable. I don't believe you can prove any specific victim is telling the truth.

I am not sure if this meets your standards, but I believe there is very strong circumstantial evidence that demonstrates that AM and Matt Sandusky were more truthful in their statements of support for JS after he was arrested than in their statements after Joe Paterno was fired and they hired attorney Andrew Shubin to extract a settlement from Penn State.

Why would AM have JS stand with him on senior day at last HS football game, invite him to his wedding, travel 12 hours to attend JS's mother's funeral, write LTE's in support, and make a statement to investigator saying nothing happened if he had been abused?

Why would MS freely elect at age 18 to be adopted by JS, deny being abused to the GJ, go to court against ex-wife to permit JS access to own children if he knew JS to be a pedophile?

The victim that I think has the most credibility is AF; but that is not saying much as I don't believe he is very credible. The more I learn about him, the more his credibility is reduced. It was over four months from the initial complaint when he first make sexual accusations and then only after receiving refreshed memory therapy and in the presence of his psychologist. Given his claims of over 100 sexual acts, I do not find it credible that he is not able to identify one specific date and that there is no other evidence (physical or eyewitness) to corroborate these claims. His behavior as evidenced by his social media comments and his behavior as described by the people who know him the best do not correspond with the behavior of a CSA survivor.

Jerry Sandusky did not receive a fair trial. Judge Cleland should order hearings into whether Sandusky's Petition for Post Conviction Relief has merit. Jerry Sandusky should be given a fair opportunity to rebut the accusations of AF.

"In March 2011, 2.5 years after AF's initial complaint, the OAG passed an illegal grand jury leak to Sara Ganim in order to help an investigation that was languishing due to a lack of victims."

That is simply not true, you're making no sense whatsoever. Just exactly what was the illegal leak in March 2011 ?

"Why would MS freely elect at age 18 to be adopted by JS"

75% tuition break and a security blanket.

 

[ralpieE]

Yeah, Jerry grabbed me too, in 1974.

BS.

 

[SteveMasters]

Steve, you need to realize something

"In March 2011, 2.5 years after AF's initial complaint, the OAG passed an illegal grand jury leak to Sara Ganim in order to help an investigation that was languishing due to a lack of victims."

That is simply not true, you're making no sense whatsoever. Just exactly what was the illegal leak in March 2011 ?

"Why would MS freely elect at age 18 to be adopted by JS"

75% tuition break and a security blanket.

Please read the Petition for Post Conviction Relief paragraphs 219-294 on pages 49-66 for E. The Investigating Grand Jury Process as Used in this Case Unconstitutionally Deprived Sandusky of his Right to Due Process.

In particular, paragraph 228 l on page 52 "The Moulton Report credits the Ganim story with opening the floodgates of the investigation stating 'The publication of Ganim's story had two almost immediate consequences. First, it raised within the investigation the alarming prospect of a leak of grand jury information. Second, it generated two significant leads on additional criminal conduct by Sandusky.' Id. at Appendix, P. 74"

Also read paragraphs 229/230 on page 53. "The indisputable chain of facts show that the Commonwealth's case, which had remained essentially stalled since in opened in May 2009, rapidly advanced in the summer of 2011 after the fact of the investigation was leaked to Ganim. Moreover, there is evidence that Sara Ganim directly contacted <v6's mother> and told her she should reach out to investigators."

Matt Sandusky is not credible. Who is there right mind would fight to allow a person they know to be a pedophile to have access to the own children? His story has constantly changed. The interview of the woman who he tried to commit suicide with is very revealing. I believe Dottie Sandusky and the other Sandusky children have a lot more credibility than Matt and it isn't even close.

 

[ralpieE]

As long as it slanders and libels the Paternos, trolls and morons are fine with it.

 

[L.T. Young]

As long as it slanders and libels the Paternos, trolls and morons are fine with it.

The Paterno's have nothing to do with Sandusky's guilt or your denial.

Tell us again how it's legal for a pedophile to shower alone with a naked child.

If you really cared about what the Paterno's wanted you wouldn't be calling every victim a liar and refusing to accept the fact Sandusky is a sexual predator. Just keep pretending JS has a Christ like innocence that makes him incapable of doing any wrong.

 

[ralpieE]

The Paterno's have nothing to do with Sandusky's guilt or your denial.

Tell us again how it's legal for a pedophile to shower alone with a naked child.

If you really cared about what the Paterno's wanted you wouldn't be calling every victim a liar and refusing to accept the fact Sandusky is a sexual predator. Just keep pretending JS has a Christ like innocence that makes him incapable of doing any wrong.

Get lost, troll.

 

[LaJolla Lion]

The Paterno's have nothing to do with Sandusky's guilt or your denial.

Tell us again how it's legal for a pedophile to shower alone with a naked child.

If you really cared about what the Paterno's wanted you wouldn't be calling every victim a liar and refusing to accept the fact Sandusky is a sexual predator. Just keep pretending JS has a Christ like innocence that makes him incapable of doing any wrong.

This is the delusion a few here have. They didn't see Jerry on trial, they saw Joe. Joe's image took a hit and he was fired because of Jerry and these people think if they can prove Jerry was innocent, the world was wrong. It's not going to happen and I have a feeling the majority here screaming Jerry is innocent have blue hair. Screw the testimony, screw the police, screw the DA's office, it was all just a ploy to take down Joe. It really is borderline delusion and thankfully only this site allows and promotes the few saying Jerry is the victim. It's such an odd sense of false hope they have.

 

[CDW3333]

I think that is a distinct possibility. The accuser that I believe has the most credibility is AF and I believe his story is suspicious. I question whether his accusations can stand on their own. IMO if his story falls apart, the entire case against JS falls apart.

Hey Steve, you do know there was another PSU janitor, named Brian Huffman who "witnessed an incident between Sandusky and an unknown kid in the early 2000s." The OAG decided not to prosecute although they did consider it (it's in Appendix N of the Moulton Report).

So, what about Brian Huffman?

 

[toddbrewster]

Steve, I know the timelines,

Since you know the timelines, many "victims" initially said that there was nothing sexual and then after meeting with the lawyers there was sex. There is a chance to spin your way out of that, but then please explain how the timelines changed after meeting with lawyers.

 

[ralpieE]

And the clowns go on with their PL BS.

 

[sluggo72]

This is the delusion a few here have. They didn't see Jerry on trial, they saw Joe. Joe's image took a hit and he was fired because of Jerry and these people think if they can prove Jerry was innocent, the world was wrong. It's not going to happen and I have a feeling the majority here screaming Jerry is innocent have blue hair. Screw the testimony, screw the police, screw the DA's office, it was all just a ploy to take down Joe. It really is borderline delusion and thankfully only this site allows and promotes the few saying Jerry is the victim. It's such an odd sense of false hope they have.

I read this testimony and I have lots of questions (http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/201...tifies-jerry-sandusky-forcibly-raped-him?lite, see above as well) no doubt it's horrible and sicken. But when I re read it, I have questions, such as the kid says he stayed overnight at JS house 50-100 times, or once a week for 1 to 2 yrs straight, or maybe every other week for 4 yrs?? does that sound right?? He says JS forcibly raped him, and he cried out, but no one came. The reason no one came he believes is, the basement is sound proof. Well is it?? Did anyone verify it was sound proof?? and if it is, to what degree? and if it isn't, what does that mean, Dottie is in on it too?? Lastly he says he was raped when he was 13. When I was 13 I was in 8th grade (maybe 7th, but it doesn't matter) When I was in 8th grade, I didn't know a lot, but I knew enough about what was suppose to happen. He is right JS was bigger than him and I am sure JS could over power him, at least one time. My question is, why go back?? How could you be around him any more? Why take his tickets? (because my friend has my back?? please) , why spend the night at his house again?? Why not always have back up? The article goes on and talks about tangential things, and never addresses, what I feel are these real questions, they just heap more on JS.
I have an easier time believing what Vic 6 says (the first shower deal in 98), that he comes home upset, doesn't want to talk to his mom, hair wet yet wants to take another shower because he's creeped out. I believe him much more than I can believe the above. Still makes JS creepy, no doubt.

 

[toddbrewster]

I recognize and understand the arguments about a fair trial, inconsistencies, etc. However, has JS ever explained why the showers, touching, and raspberries? He has not denied any of those things, but never an explanation. Creepy, at best, and contributes to the pattern of behavior and accusations

I answered this earlier, but I respect your comment. I don't know the answer, but this is MHO. I think Jerry likes to help kids. I also think he saw his father help under privileged kids. Jerry wanted to be a father figure to some, because most people in jail had no father figure. He did things with these kids that he either observed his father do or things that he enjoyed doing with his father. I agree it is a bit creepy and probably when his father took showers with kids that was more accepted in the 50's. I loved touching and giving raspberries to my boys and I think Jerry was a kid himself and did not understand boundaries. I remember the kids in my tent at camp wanting to give me raspberries when I was 13 and I pushed them away and some got mad at me for responding like that.

IMO Jerry should not have to spend the rest of his life in jail for wanting to help under privileged kids in a creepy manner. His work helped thousands of kids and he deserves a second trial.

 

[LaJolla Lion]

todd you put your comments in the quote so I didn't see them. So during the investigation and before it was made public to anyone including PSU, the lawyers were in the room while they were questioning the victims. Money could be an incentive for anyone, but you have to believe 8 people that Jerry all had access to simply didn't care about him at all enough to talk about blowing him. They just felt the need to simply turn on him no matter what. All of them. Then you also had to get the cops and DA to buy off on this all because they had to get Jerry. You got so many dots, just working on connecting one or two before you keep going with the he's innocent line.

 

[PSU_Nut]

I am not sure if this meets your standards, but I believe there is very strong circumstantial evidence that demonstrates that AM and Matt Sandusky were more truthful in their statements of support for JS after he was arrested than in their statements after Joe Paterno was fired and they hired attorney Andrew Shubin to extract a settlement from Penn State.

Why would AM have JS stand with him on senior day at last HS football game, invite him to his wedding, travel 12 hours to attend JS's mother's funeral, write LTE's in support, and make a statement to investigator saying nothing happened if he had been abused?

Why would MS freely elect at age 18 to be adopted by JS, deny being abused to the GJ, go to court against ex-wife to permit JS access to own children if he knew JS to be a pedophile?

That kind of behavior is common in sexual abuse victims. When a person is abused sexually they often stop maturing mentally. So you have realize that even though they may be adults they often behave like children. As a coping mechanism sexual abuse victims will often try to gain the attention of the abuser. It is easier for them to deal with the abuse if they think the abuser loved them. It is easier for them to say Jerry touched me because he loved me rather then he did it to get his rocks off. So they will keep relationship and do things as you describe to cope with it. That is also why those who are abused with out counseling will often go on to abuse others. It hard for victims to break out of that mindset.

 

[PSU_Nut]

I answered this earlier, but I respect your comment. I don't know the answer, but this is MHO. I think Jerry likes to help kids. I also think he saw his father help under privileged kids. Jerry wanted to be a father figure to some, because most people in jail had no father figure. He did things with these kids that he either observed his father do or things that he enjoyed doing with his father. I agree it is a bit creepy and probably when his father took showers with kids that was more accepted in the 50's. I loved touching and giving raspberries to my boys and I think Jerry was a kid himself and did not understand boundaries. I remember the kids in my tent at camp wanting to give me raspberries when I was 13 and I pushed them away and some got mad at me for responding like that.

IMO Jerry should not have to spend the rest of his life in jail for wanting to help under privileged kids in a creepy manner. His work helped thousands of kids and he deserves a second trial.

Let me ask you this. If the police came to your house and questioned you about giving raspberries in a tent with a thirteen year old would that be enough to stop you from doing it ever again? If it was harmless fun wouldn't police showing up at your house be enough for you to say "I better not do this again!"? I have to believe that their are deeper desires then just having fun to continue to do it even after police have been called.

 

[SteveMasters]

I answered this earlier, but I respect your comment. I don't know the answer, but this is MHO. I think Jerry likes to help kids. I also think he saw his father help under privileged kids. Jerry wanted to be a father figure to some, because most people in jail had no father figure. He did things with these kids that he either observed his father do or things that he enjoyed doing with his father. I agree it is a bit creepy and probably when his father took showers with kids that was more accepted in the 50's. I loved touching and giving raspberries to my boys and I think Jerry was a kid himself and did not understand boundaries. I remember the kids in my tent at camp wanting to give me raspberries when I was 13 and I pushed them away and some got mad at me for responding like that.

IMO Jerry should not have to spend the rest of his life in jail for wanting to help under privileged kids in a creepy manner. His work helped thousands of kids and he deserves a second trial.

When I visited Sandusky in prison, I asked him if he thought his behavior could be perceived as testing boundaries and what he was trying to accomplish.

He said that he never really thought of what he did as testing boundaries. He said that he wanted to be a positive influence in the lives of the TSM kids and did not want to be a figurehead. He said that he had probably thrown a 1,000 TSM kids into the pool and the kids by in large enjoyed it. He said that when he put his right hand on the left knee of the person sitting on the passenger front seat, there were often 2 other kids in the back seats. He said that he grew up living in a YMCA type building in Washington PA that had a communal shower. He said that he was taught to always to take a shower after a workout. He said that the kids often asked to take a shower in the locker room and it was a big deal to them. He also said that the kids usually reached out to him to get together or go to a game, and not visa verse.

I can understand why people believe that Sandusky's behavior may have been inappropriate and view it as creepy. That being said, I do not believe he did anything criminal. I do not believe he sexually molested any young men nor do I believe he was sexually aroused by young men. His case deserves a second look as he didn't get anything close to a fair trial in the first round.

 

[SteveMasters]

That kind of behavior is common in sexual abuse victims. When a person is abused sexually they often stop maturing mentally. So you have realize that even though they may be adults they often behave like children. As a coping mechanism sexual abuse victims will often try to gain the attention of the abuser. It is easier for them to deal with the abuse if they think the abuser loved them. It is easier for them to say Jerry touched me because he loved me rather then he did it to get his rocks off. So they will keep relationship and do things as you describe to cope with it. That is also why those who are abused with out counseling will often go on to abuse others. It hard for victims to break out of that mindset.

Matt Sandusky was 32 and AM was 24 when Jerry Sandusky was first arrested. They both very publicly supported Jerry Sandusky after his arrest. They both seemed well adjusted and there was nothing to suggest that their mental development had been impaired. Then Joe Paterno and Graham Spanier were fired and Penn State made it known that they were open to settlements with possible victims. MS and AM then decide to seek the services of Andrew Shubin. Then MS gets repressed memory therapy and AM lies low and they both collect multi million dollar settlements. In summary MS and AM both did not make contemporaneous reports, both changed their stories over time to adapt to circumstances, and both hired lawyers before reporting molestation to authorities. I don't find either one credible.

 

[L.T. Young]

This is the delusion a few here have. They didn't see Jerry on trial, they saw Joe. Joe's image took a hit and he was fired because of Jerry and these people think if they can prove Jerry was innocent, the world was wrong. It's not going to happen and I have a feeling the majority here screaming Jerry is innocent have blue hair. Screw the testimony, screw the police, screw the DA's office, it was all just a ploy to take down Joe. It really is borderline delusion and thankfully only this site allows and promotes the few saying Jerry is the victim. It's such an odd sense of false hope they have.

At first I thought it was a few trolls trying to bait some poor soul into agreeing with them. That's certainly not the case.

What's scary is they don't have a problem with Sandusky's seemingly uncontrollable need to get children naked.

 

[pandaczar12]

The reason no one came he believes is, the basement is sound proof. Well is it?? Did anyone verify it was sound proof?? and if it is, to what degree?

This was debunked when Matt Lauer interviewed JZ and Dottie in the basement.

 

[L.T. Young]

Get lost, troll.

You post things like "prove oral" and I'm the troll? Wow.

BTW, nice rebuttal to a fact you can't argue.

 

[L.T. Young]

Matt Sandusky was 32 and AM was 24 when Jerry Sandusky was first arrested. They both very publicly supported Jerry Sandusky after his arrest. They both seemed well adjusted and there was nothing to suggest that their mental development had been impaired. Then Joe Paterno and Graham Spanier were fired and Penn State made it known that they were open to settlements with possible victims. MS and AM then decide to seek the services of Andrew Shubin. Then MS gets repressed memory therapy and AM lies low and they both collect multi million dollar settlements. In summary MS and AM both did not make contemporaneous reports, both changed their stories over time to adapt to circumstances, and both hired lawyers before reporting molestation to authorities. I don't find either one credible.

Okay, what about the 8 victims?

 

[Misder2]

Matt Sandusky was 32 and AM was 24 when Jerry Sandusky was first arrested. They both very publicly supported Jerry Sandusky after his arrest. They both seemed well adjusted and there was nothing to suggest that their mental development had been impaired. Then Joe Paterno and Graham Spanier were fired and Penn State made it known that they were open to settlements with possible victims. MS and AM then decide to seek the services of Andrew Shubin. Then MS gets repressed memory therapy and AM lies low and they both collect multi million dollar settlements. In summary MS and AM both did not make contemporaneous reports, both changed their stories over time to adapt to circumstances, and both hired lawyers before reporting molestation to authorities. I don't find either one credible.

Please read the Petition for Post Conviction Relief paragraphs 219-294 on pages 49-66 for E. The Investigating Grand Jury Process as Used in this Case Unconstitutionally Deprived Sandusky of his Right to Due Process.

In particular, paragraph 228 l on page 52 "The Moulton Report credits the Ganim story with opening the floodgates of the investigation stating 'The publication of Ganim's story had two almost immediate consequences. First, it raised within the investigation the alarming prospect of a leak of grand jury information. Second, it generated two significant leads on additional criminal conduct by Sandusky.' Id. at Appendix, P. 74"

Also read paragraphs 229/230 on page 53. "The indisputable chain of facts show that the Commonwealth's case, which had remained essentially stalled since in opened in May 2009, rapidly advanced in the summer of 2011 after the fact of the investigation was leaked to Ganim. Moreover, there is evidence that Sara Ganim directly contacted <v6's mother> and told her she should reach out to investigators."

Matt Sandusky is not credible. Who is there right mind would fight to allow a person they know to be a pedophile to have access to the own children? His story has constantly changed. The interview of the woman who he tried to commit suicide with is very revealing. I believe Dottie Sandusky and the other Sandusky children have a lot more credibility than Matt and it isn't even close.

The commonwealth case rapidly advanced in the fall of 2010 not the spring of 2011. I don't know where you're getting your info but that's the timeline. It was then stalled again but had nothing to do with the Ganim article. You have it wrong, quit focusing on Ganim's article.
Personally I consider MS to be a lacking sack of crap. That said, he was abused.

 

[jerot]

Okay, I haven't said a word about anything other than Sandusky and Ziegler.

I doubt Sandusky gets a new trial. He was rightfully convicted on a lot of the charges.

Exactly.

 

[SteveMasters]

The commonwealth case rapidly advanced in the fall of 2010 not the spring of 2011. I don't know where you're getting your info but that's the timeline. It was then stalled again but had nothing to do with the Ganim article. You have it wrong, quit focusing on Ganim's article.
Personally I consider MS to be a lacking sack of crap. That said, he was abused.

My information comes from the Moulten Report and Sandusky's Petition for Post Conviction Relief. Where does your information come from?

Do you have any evidence that MS was abused by the Sanduskys? He may have been abused by his birth parents, but I am not aware of any evidence that he was abused by the Sanduskys other than Matt's word and I don't trust Matt. Do you know Matt personally?

 

[SteveMasters]

Okay, what about the 8 victims?

I am assuming that you are referring to the 8 "victims" who testified at trial. Which victim(s) do you find the most credible and believable?

 

[Misder2]

My information comes from the Moulten Report and Sandusky's Petition for Post Conviction Relief. Where does your information come from?

Do you have any evidence that MS was abused by the Sanduskys? He may have been abused by his birth parents, but I am not aware of any evidence that he was abused by the Sanduskys other than Matt's word and I don't trust Matt. Do you know Matt personally?

My information comes from me, I have never found a better source.

Yes, I know him

 

[LundyPSU]

I answered this earlier, but I respect your comment. I don't know the answer, but this is MHO. I think Jerry likes to help kids. I also think he saw his father help under privileged kids. Jerry wanted to be a father figure to some, because most people in jail had no father figure. He did things with these kids that he either observed his father do or things that he enjoyed doing with his father. I agree it is a bit creepy and probably when his father took showers with kids that was more accepted in the 50's. I loved touching and giving raspberries to my boys and I think Jerry was a kid himself and did not understand boundaries. I remember the kids in my tent at camp wanting to give me raspberries when I was 13 and I pushed them away and some got mad at me for responding like that.

IMO Jerry should not have to spend the rest of his life in jail for wanting to help under privileged kids in a creepy manner. His work helped thousands of kids and he deserves a second trial.

I think everyone can agree that JS is a reasonably intelligent person. What may have been common behavior many years ago is not now and hasn't been for some time. It is common sense not to do certain behavior, especially around at risk kids. The fact that he did it, continued to do it, and didn't stop despite directives from DPW and police is disturbing. I agree about many of the trial issues and am not completely opposed to a new trial. But that is far from claiming his innocence or trying to rationalize disturbing behavior. Only he and the victims know exactly what happened. But given the admitted creepy behavior, it is not a stretch to believe some of the accusations.

 

[jerot]

Where is the proof, that he showered with a boy after the MM inc

Your name calling and attempts to categorize others is disgusting. Why are you afraid to listen to others with a different opinion than yours. The Paterno's not backing JZ
only means that they are being cautious of ALL others. Do you remember how everyone twisted Joe's words to "Joe should have done more". ????

Wouldn't you be wary of others at this point if you were that family. The Paterno family was thrown under the bus by the BOT, the entire school, the media, etc. after 60+ years of good service. Nobody came to Joe's defense immediately after this happened. Unbelievable isn't it?

Now apply the same reasoning to someone else (JS); unbelievable isn't it? But the truth is sometimes stranger than fiction.

DUH, does this make any sense? The only people the Paterno's will trust right now is themselves. And understandably so.

So why would the Paterno's listen to JZ? Maybe because they have a ton of their own problems to deal with right now. But that doesn't make JZ less credible.

Ralphie, answer these simple questions. I don't have to prove oral, the victims testified to it. I didn't think you would try and defend the stupid comment about damage, nice change of direction there.

1. How many times did you shower with kids that were not your own?
2. How many times were you told to stop, but still did this anyway?
3. How often did you have children in your basement alone or even over to your house?
4. How many kids were you alone with? 1-2, 50?
5. How many grown men do you know that hang out with kids that are not their alone all of the time?
6. How many kids stated you molested them? 1, 10?

Charity is one thing and a ton of good people do that work. You don't have to do it alone when you have 5 kids in your house. Why would that person be alone with so many kids all of the time? You can sit there and deny it because 10 year old kids weren't smart enough to save his DNA, but that is on you. I hope every day of his life is completely miserable and I only wish that people have gotten to him in jail. He used a childrens charity for kids that were already dealt a tough hand to appease his own little fantasies. I'm sure your in denial which is fine, but he is NEVER EVER getting out of jail.

As blatant as it gets.

 

[LundyPSU]

The commonwealth case rapidly advanced in the fall of 2010 not the spring of 2011. I don't know where you're getting your info but that's the timeline. It was then stalled again but had nothing to do with the Ganim article. You have it wrong, quit focusing on Ganim's article.
Personally I consider MS to be a lacking sack of crap. That said, he was abused.

Took off when they finally spoke to MM. Question is why it took so long and what led to Mike's version of events.

 

[SteveMasters]

My information comes from me, I have never found a better source.

Yes, I know him

Did you know him before 2011? Do you find him trustworthy?

I hope you don't take this personally, but I trust the Moulten Report and Sandusky's Petition over you.

 

[Misder2]

Took off when they finally spoke to MM. Question is why it took so long and what led to Mike's version of events.

"Question is why it took so long "?
Are you asking why it took so long to talk to Mike?

 

[WeR0206]

Took off when they finally spoke to MM. Question is why it took so long and what led to Mike's version of events.

Yep...it took off right after that anonymous email tip to talk to MM magically found its way to CC DA/PA OAG the day after Corbett was elected Governor in November 2010. Then the OAG actually started using the tools of the GJ to the fullest. How convenient!

Before that magical anonymous email tip Corbett/OAG did pretty much none of the basic investigation steps for 1.5 YEARS after the OAG first took over the case in March 2009 including--never searched JS's house, never searched TSM (no warrant required), never touched base with Clinton County CYS and reviewed their indicated report, never asked UPPD if they had any previous reports re: JS (1998 file), and never subpoenaed CC CYS. Yeah, Corbett and Fina were realllly bustin their humps to try and get JS off the streets....smh

 

[Misder2]

Did you know him before 2011? Do you find him trustworthy?

I hope you don't take this personally, but I trust the Moulten Report and Sandusky's Petition over you.

Yes before, and not in the slightest.

I'm not going to comment on the Petition, it's from the defense and I haven't really looked at it that hard.

The Moulten Report. No comment further than "what a load of shit"

I don't take it personally, you are well aware that I have been trying to point you in the right direction for some time now. I don't know why, you just seemed reasonable so I made the attempt. It doesn't offend me if you don't believe anything I say.

 

[LaJolla Lion]

I think everyone can agree that JS is a reasonably intelligent person. What may have been common behavior many years ago is not now and hasn't been for some time. It is common sense not to do certain behavior, especially around at risk kids. The fact that he did it, continued to do it, and didn't stop despite directives from DPW and police is disturbing. I agree about many of the trial issues and am not completely opposed to a new trial. But that is far from claiming his innocence or trying to rationalize disturbing behavior. Only he and the victims know exactly what happened. But given the admitted creepy behavior, it is not a stretch to believe some of the accusations.

He couldn't stop and the victims were children. Their behavior wasn't out of line, his was. I asked a series of 6 questions above and nobody touched them that really believe Jerry is innocent. I know why they didn't touch them as no adult would continue to keep behaving this way over and over again. He couldn't stop and we now know why. You say only he and the victims know for sure which is true. I just happen to believe them over the tickle monster.

 

[Misder2]

Yep...it took off right after that anonymous email tip to talk to MM magically found its way to CC DA/PA OAG the day after Corbett was elected Governor in November 2010. Then the OAG actually started using the tools of the GJ to the fullest. How convenient!

Before that magical anonymous email tip Corbett/OAG did pretty much none of the basic investigation steps for 1.5 YEARS after the OAG first took over the case in March 2009 including--never searched JS's house, never searched TSM (no warrant required), never touched base with Clinton County CYS and reviewed their indicated report, never asked UPPD if they had any previous reports re: JS (1998 file), and never subpoenaed CC CYS. Yeah, Corbett and Fina were realllly bustin their humps to try and get JS off the streets....smh

It took off right around the time of his retirement.