Bronny James had a heart attack at USC yesterday

[heckmans]

Rand Paul, a doctor, doesn't understand what another doctor is saying? Fascinating.

It's become obvious that it's best to just disengage from him on this topic. He's exhausting. I'm reminded of the famous Ronald Reagan quote, paraphrasing: The trouble with him is not that he's ignorant; it's just that he know so much that isn't so.
He yammers on about science and peer review as if science is infallible, peer review is iron clad, and the people involved in peer review don't sometimes have ulterior motives (hint: the peer review process is a nightmare. no peer reviewer wants to say NO because they don't want anybody preventing their own papers from getting published). It's like he's never heard of the 'Grievance Studies Affair' that fully exposed peer review to be broken at best, and politically corrupt at worst.
He refuses to consider that NIH scientists receiving(and not disclosing) royalty payments for experimental drugs they are giving to research subjects, could cause a COI and skew results, like say, the efficacy of a 'vaccine,' the definition of what vaccine means, or the downplaying of/refusal to investigate side effects.
It's as if, he refuses to consider that Fauci has an atrocious history of mismanagement and ethical questions. His handling of AZT (a chemotherapy drug) given to HIV patients is borderline monstrous. In 2021, his recommendation to give healthy people an experimental drug when they had a statistical zero risk, and it was known that it did not prevent infection or transmission, is unconscionable.
Time to end the back and forth. It will never go anywhere. How many days till football?

 

[Online Persona]

It's become obvious that it's best to just disengage from him on this topic. He's exhausting. I'm reminded of the famous Ronald Reagan quote, paraphrasing: The trouble with him is not that he's ignorant; it's just that he know so much that isn't so.
He yammers on about science and peer review as if science is infallible, peer review is iron clad, and the people involved in peer review don't sometimes have ulterior motives (hint: the peer review process is a nightmare. no peer reviewer wants to say NO because they don't want anybody preventing their own papers from getting published). It's like he's never heard of the 'Grievance Studies Affair' that fully exposed peer review to be broken at best, and politically corrupt at worst.
He refuses to consider that NIH scientists receiving(and not disclosing) royalty payments for experimental drugs they are giving to research subjects, could cause a COI and skew results, like say, the efficacy of a 'vaccine,' the definition of what vaccine means, or the downplaying of/refusal to investigate side effects.
It's as if, he refuses to consider that Fauci has an atrocious history of mismanagement and ethical questions. His handling of AZT (a chemotherapy drug) given to HIV patients is borderline monstrous. In 2021, his recommendation to give healthy people an experimental drug when they had a statistical zero risk, and it was known that it did not prevent infection or transmission, is unconscionable.
Time to end the back and forth. It will never go anywhere. How many days till football?

Valid points and it is clear that the guy is a political blowhard. He carries the water for his team on this board. The best way is to probably just ignore him.

 

[PSU2UNC]

He yammers on about science and peer review as if science is infallible,

Peer review is NOT infallible, but it IS self-correcting and is far more rigorous than posting a youtube video or substack article (which have zero oversight).

peer review is iron clad, and the people involved in peer review don't sometimes have ulterior motives (hint: the peer review process is a nightmare. no peer reviewer wants to say NO because they don't want anybody preventing their own papers from getting published).

Again, peer review is not perfect but I can tell you from being a reviewer that papers get rejected all the time.

It's like he's never heard of the 'Grievance Studies Affair' that fully exposed peer review to be broken at best, and politically corrupt at worst.

Please provide a citation of this as I have never heard of it. Happy to read it if you provide.

He refuses to consider that NIH scientists receiving(and not disclosing) royalty payments for experimental drugs they are giving to research subjects, could cause a COI and skew results, like say, the efficacy of a 'vaccine,' the definition of what vaccine means, or the downplaying of/refusal to investigate side effects.

Please provide evidence of this very serious charge you are making against hard working government scientists. Is it possible? Sure, but there are many checks and balances in place to prevent that from happening.

It's as if, he refuses to consider that Fauci has an atrocious history of mismanagement and ethical questions. His handling of AZT (a chemotherapy drug) given to HIV patients is borderline monstrous.

You are confusing policy decisions with science.

In 2021, his recommendation to give healthy people an experimental drug when they had a statistical zero risk, and it was known that it did not prevent infection or transmission, is unconscionable.

The vaccines are safe and effective and there are mountains of evidence to back that up. If you want to argue with the policy decision to make them available to people I guess you can, but saving lives with a safe vaccine seems like a no brainer.

Time to end the back and forth. It will never go anywhere. How many days till football?

Agreed. Bring on WVU!!

 

[Online Persona]

Study puts an end to the debate. 1 in 35 receiving Covid boosters get myocarditis. That risk is astronomical in terms of vaccine risks (the covid shots aren't really vaccines though, you will still get covid).



And according to the Cleveland Clinic, "The survival rate for myocarditis is 80% one year after having it and 50% five years later."

 

[PSU2UNC]

Study puts an end to the debate. 1 in 35 receiving Covid boosters get myocarditis. That risk is astronomical in terms of vaccine risks (the covid shots aren't really vaccines though, you will still get covid).

View embedded media

And according to the Cleveland Clinic, "The survival rate for myocarditis is 80% one year after having it and 50% five years later."

a) you linked to a tweet that is not available. So well done. You're doing terrific.

b) Please link to an actual peer reviewed study. Just saying the Cleveland Clinic said it provides no context.

c) The risk of myocarditis FROM covid is far worse than from the vaccine AND the (very rare) myocarditis originating from the vaccine is generally very mild and resolves itself.

https://www.ahajournals.org/doi/10.1161/CIRCULATIONAHA.122.059970

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lanchi/article/PIIS2352-4642(22)00272-3/fulltext

 

[Online Persona]

a) you linked to a tweet that is not available. So well done. You're doing terrific.

b) Please link to an actual peer reviewed study. Just saying the Cleveland Clinic said it provides no context.

c) The risk of myocarditis FROM covid is far worse than from the vaccine AND the (very rare) myocarditis originating from the vaccine is generally very mild and resolves itself.

https://www.ahajournals.org/doi/10.1161/CIRCULATIONAHA.122.059970

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lanchi/article/PIIS2352-4642(22)00272-3/fulltext

I'm not responding to you. You have shown yourself a political blowhard. This response is for others to see how dumb this poster is. He doesn't know that if the link comes up saying that the tweet is unavailable that all you need to do is click on it and it will take you to the tweet.

 

[PSU2UNC]

I'm not responding to you. You have shown yourself a political blowhard. This response is for others to see how dumb this poster is. He doesn't know that if the link comes up saying that the tweet is unavailable that all you need to do is click on it and it will take you to the tweet.

When I click on the link, it doesn't go anywhere, but keep providing dead links.

I'm probably the least political person you know. I really only care about the science.

 

[Online Persona]

When I click on the link, it doesn't go anywhere, but keep providing dead links.

I'm probably the least political person you know. I really only care about the science.

Yet you cannot figure out how to view a tweet with a valid link? You aren't a serious or honest poster.

 

[PSU2UNC]

Yet you cannot figure out how to view a tweet with a valid link? You aren't a serious or honest poster.

YOU posted the broken link. Your inability to post links properly is not my problem.

 

[Online Persona]

YOU posted the broken link. Your inability to post links properly is not my problem.

I see the link. Any time the same error message you stated shows on my screen for tweets that others post, all I had to do was click on the message and it takes me right to the actual tweet. If you cannot seem to figure out how to do this, it is your problem.

 

[PSU2UNC]

I see the link. Any time the same error message you stated shows on my screen for tweets that others post, all I had to do was click on the message and it takes me right to the actual tweet. If you cannot seem to figure out how to do this, it is your problem.

Why not just link directly to the peer reviewed study? Why post a tweet at all? A tweet is a terrible source of information.

 

[lazydave841]

YOU posted the broken link. Your inability to post links properly is not my problem.

Link was visible for me in the thread and when I clicked it. Do you have blocks on? Or no twitter perhaps?

 

[PSU2UNC]

Link was visible for me in the thread and when I clicked it. Do you have blocks on? Or no twitter perhaps?

I definitely have twitter. Maybe something weird with the way BWI in my browser interacts with twitter?

Regardless, using twitter as a scientific source is not good practice. I'd be happy to read the peer reviewed paper from the Cleveland Clinic if someone provides it.

 

[91Joe95]

What peer reviewed articles have been censored?

If yelling fire in a crowded theater (when there is no fire) results in injury or death, charges can be filed ( e.g. disorderly conduct, inciting a riot). So if the disinformation that some anti-vaxxers are spewing results in harm (i.e. someone dying because they didn't get vaccinated), then yes that should be censored (or at least punished if it results in harm).

So people who go around stating you can't yell fire in a crowded theater should be censored because that simple statement is factually incorrect and could lead to people dying because someone didn't understand when it is legal and encouraged? Should Fauci have been censored when he said masking didn't help? I'm not trying to pick on you, you're just making a lot of blanket statements that don't stand up to even a modicum of scrutiny.

As I stated previously, some people cannot appreciate why their lies, inconsistencies, whatever you want to call it - have destroyed their credibility.

 

[91Joe95]

Rand Paul was an opthalmologist and hasn't practiced in 13 years. So it's not out of the realm of possibility that he doesn't understand everything about virology and gain of function research.

So you're trying to say ophthalmologists cannot understand gain of function? Maybe retired doctors cannot understand gain of function? Or literally every member of congress can't understand it and should just blindly fund it? Or that they banned it, and Fauci still found a way to fund it? Can they at least understand what is or is not gain of function and question Fauci on that part? I'm just trying to understand what part of Rand Paul's understanding you are actually questioning. Maybe opthalmologists never study how to stop the transmission of viruses?

 

[91Joe95]

discussing this on this thread reminds me of this Police Squad scene

View embedded media

Some people have told so many different stories they just can't keep them straight, and cannot fathom why their credibility has been destroyed.

 

[91Joe95]

It's become obvious that it's best to just disengage from him on this topic. He's exhausting. I'm reminded of the famous Ronald Reagan quote, paraphrasing: The trouble with him is not that he's ignorant; it's just that he know so much that isn't so.
He yammers on about science and peer review as if science is infallible, peer review is iron clad, and the people involved in peer review don't sometimes have ulterior motives (hint: the peer review process is a nightmare. no peer reviewer wants to say NO because they don't want anybody preventing their own papers from getting published). It's like he's never heard of the 'Grievance Studies Affair' that fully exposed peer review to be broken at best, and politically corrupt at worst.
He refuses to consider that NIH scientists receiving(and not disclosing) royalty payments for experimental drugs they are giving to research subjects, could cause a COI and skew results, like say, the efficacy of a 'vaccine,' the definition of what vaccine means, or the downplaying of/refusal to investigate side effects.
It's as if, he refuses to consider that Fauci has an atrocious history of mismanagement and ethical questions. His handling of AZT (a chemotherapy drug) given to HIV patients is borderline monstrous. In 2021, his recommendation to give healthy people an experimental drug when they had a statistical zero risk, and it was known that it did not prevent infection or transmission, is unconscionable.
Time to end the back and forth. It will never go anywhere. How many days till football?

Actually I'm kind of interested in who knows more about gain of function research, him or Rand Paul, because he's making some pretty interesting claims that by his standards he probably isn't qualified to opine on.

 

[MacNit07]

Rand Paul was an opthalmologist and hasn't practiced in 13 years. So it's not out of the realm of possibility that he doesn't understand everything about virology and gain of function research.

But he is more than capable of critical, science-based lines of questions.

 

[MacNit07]

How am I not serious?

There are lots of papers published about the physics of water. I don't understand your point.

Now you are just being obtuse. You know perfectly well that high ranking political medical officials lied and Social Media censured. Heck they even admitted it (even if you will not). Should we assume you are part of this problem?

COVID 19 was a colossal failure from the medical arena and an affront against American principals of free speech,

All neatly documented and part of the public record.

 

[aalion]

 

[indynittany]

Rand Paul was an opthalmologist and hasn't practiced in 13 years. So it's not out of the realm of possibility that he doesn't understand everything about virology and gain of function research.

How long has it been since Anthony Fauci practiced medicine? How many COVID patients did he treat?

 

[aalion]

How long has it been since Anthony Fauci practiced medicine? How many COVID patients did he treat?

Fauci was a career politician. Full stop, Hasn’t treated anyone i decades. Proud to say he served “7 presidential administrations”… which makes him a career politician.

And it showed as he changed his tune with whatever way the “science” was blowing that day, contradicting himself over almost literally every issue COVId related…. Masks, outdoor spread/risk, risk profiles, protests being ok, seasonality, lockdown effectiveness, vax stopping spread, COVId origins…

He said whatever he could get away with, without challenge, while children lost education and lifetime experiences, businesses were bankrupted, education was torpedoed, seniors died alone, people got fat (increasing COVId risk substantially and non-COVId risk materially), etc etc etc.

He is an absolutely despicable human being who cares about nothing other than Anthony Fauci.

 

[PSU Lion 2000]

Drexel basketball player died yesterday. No reason given yet.

 

[Erial_Lion]

Drexel basketball player died yesterday. No reason given yet.

Suicide

 

[Online Persona]

Suicide

Link? When I google "Drexel basketball player suicide" there are at least 3 dozen articles that all say cause of death was not identified. Not one says suicide.

 

[Erial_Lion]

Link? When I google "Drexel basketball player suicide" there are at least 3 dozen articles that all say cause of death was not identified. Not one says suicide.

Terrence Butler, a forward on the Drexel men's basketball team, was found dead inside his on-campus apartment on Wednesday morning, the university announced.

The Philadelphia medical examiner said Thursday that Butler died by suicide.

Drexel University men's basketball player Terrence Butler found dead inside on-campus apartment

Butler, a 6-foot-7 forward from Upper Marlboro, Maryland, would've been entering his junior year with the Dragons.

www.cbsnews.com

I read elsewhere that it was a self-inflicted gunshot unfortunately.

 

[Online Persona]

Terrence Butler, a forward on the Drexel men's basketball team, was found dead inside his on-campus apartment on Wednesday morning, the university announced.

The Philadelphia medical examiner said Thursday that Butler died by suicide.

Drexel University men's basketball player Terrence Butler found dead inside on-campus apartment

Butler, a 6-foot-7 forward from Upper Marlboro, Maryland, would've been entering his junior year with the Dragons.

www.cbsnews.com

I read elsewhere that it was a self-inflicted gunshot unfortunately.

Thanks

 

[91Joe95]

Terrence Butler, a forward on the Drexel men's basketball team, was found dead inside his on-campus apartment on Wednesday morning, the university announced.

The Philadelphia medical examiner said Thursday that Butler died by suicide.

Drexel University men's basketball player Terrence Butler found dead inside on-campus apartment

Butler, a 6-foot-7 forward from Upper Marlboro, Maryland, would've been entering his junior year with the Dragons.

www.cbsnews.com

I read elsewhere that it was a self-inflicted gunshot unfortunately.

But did he have covid at the time? I don't really care how people think about that because it's not flippant - that's how absurd the government tracked covid deaths. Even more under reported is how keeping kids out of school significantly increased depression and suicides. Too many people have a flippant attitude about that.

 

[Erial_Lion]

But did he have covid at the time? I don't really care how people think about that because it's not flippant - that's how absurd the government tracked covid deaths. Even more under reported is how keeping kids out of school significantly increased depression and suicides. Too many people have a flippant attitude about that.

Unfortunately, mental health issues and suicides with college kids were an issue long before COVID.

As far as the "absurd government tracking"...my understanding is that tracking was somewhat like the "wild west" in the early stages as there weren't true standards. But, as we got deeper into 2020, standards were put in place (much the same way that you'd track deaths from AIDS, or any other disease).

 

[aalion]

Unfortunately, mental health issues and suicides with college kids were an issue long before COVID.

As far as the "absurd government tracking"...my understanding is that tracking was somewhat like the "wild west" in the early stages as there weren't true standards. But, as we got deeper into 2020, standards were put in place (much the same way that you'd track deaths from AIDS, or any other disease).

Standard were put in place …. But they were “if they had tested positive within 30 days, it’s a COVId death”.

This we reinforced in a massive way by financial relief offered to hospitals for treating COVId patients, and for families for funeral expenses for COVId death.

It paid to code COVId deaths. So people did,

 

[Erial_Lion]

Standard were put in place …. But they were “if they had tested positive within 30 days, it’s a COVId death”.

This we reinforced in a massive way by financial relief offered to hospitals for treating COVId patients, and for families for funeral expenses for COVId death.

It paid to code COVId deaths. So people did,

That's not actually true...the standard was that if COVID contributed to the death, it was labeled a COVID death. It's tough to nail down exactly with something like COVID where the disease itself isn't necessarily what is killing you.

Was there some level of fraud potentially? As with everything, sure, there was probably some. Though I highly doubt there were that many people committing fraud and/or intentionally submitting incorrect information. And on the flip side, I'm sure we dealt with many that died from a COVID-related illness that was never caught.

AHA continues to debunk false claims about COVID-19 deaths and payments | AHA News

For the last several months, disturbing and unproven theories have gained attention about the death count for COVID-19. We find these erroneous and egregious charges leveled against doctors – which have been repeated during the past few weeks – dismaying, disconcerting and disturbing.

www.aha.org

Fact check: How are COVID-19 deaths counted, do hospitals get money for COVID-19 deaths?

(WLUK) -- Since the pandemic started, FOX 11 has received questions from viewers asking if hospitals are being paid for every COVID-19 death, and questions about how COVID deaths are counted. How COVID-19 deaths are counted. Determining the cause of death is up to a coroner, medical examiner or...

fox11online.com

 

[knickslions]

Drexel basketball player died yesterday. No reason given yet.

DB

 

[aalion]

That's not actually true...the standard was that if COVID contributed to the death, it was labeled a COVID death. It's tough to nail down exactly with something like COVID where the disease itself isn't necessarily what is killing you.

Was there some level of fraud potentially? As with everything, sure, there was probably some. Though I highly doubt there were that many people committing fraud and/or intentionally submitting incorrect information. And on the flip side, I'm sure we dealt with many that died from a COVID-related illness that was never caught.

AHA continues to debunk false claims about COVID-19 deaths and payments | AHA News

For the last several months, disturbing and unproven theories have gained attention about the death count for COVID-19. We find these erroneous and egregious charges leveled against doctors – which have been repeated during the past few weeks – dismaying, disconcerting and disturbing.

www.aha.org

Fact check: How are COVID-19 deaths counted, do hospitals get money for COVID-19 deaths?

(WLUK) -- Since the pandemic started, FOX 11 has received questions from viewers asking if hospitals are being paid for every COVID-19 death, and questions about how COVID deaths are counted. How COVID-19 deaths are counted. Determining the cause of death is up to a coroner, medical examiner or...

fox11online.com

Complete nonsense. You actually linked an article where the second sentence was “one of the only coroners willing to speak …l” . Yep, nothing suspicious there…

At one point the media asked DeSantis about 2 young adults who died from COVId in contrast to his claims (facts) that COVId wasn’t dangerous for young people.

His response “one of them died in a car accident”.

 

[indynittany]

Standard were put in place …. But they were “if they had tested positive within 30 days, it’s a COVId death”.

This we reinforced in a massive way by financial relief offered to hospitals for treating COVId patients, and for families for funeral expenses for COVId death.

It paid to code COVId deaths. So people did,

And let's not forget that you weren't counted among the vaccinated until two weeks after getting the jab!

 

[Online Persona]

Complete nonsense. You actually linked an article where the second sentence was “one of the only coroners willing to speak …l” . Yep, nothing suspicious there…

At one point the media asked DeSantis about 2 young adults who died from COVId in contrast to his claims (facts) that COVId wasn’t dangerous for young people.

His response “one of them died in a car accident”.

It is true that thousands of covid deaths coded covid deaths were accidents and other completely unrelated causes. Anyone who looks at the results by category in the CDC's own covid death database can confirm this.

Another point of contention from above (not your post) is that suicide and mental diseases have always been prevalent in college and school aged kids. That's true, however, the US Surgeon General and the CDC only proclaimed it a crisis after many months of covid shutdowns. They did so because of a massive spike in suicides and mental disease after many months of the covid shutdowns. There is a very clear inflection point in the data.

 

[91Joe95]

Unfortunately, mental health issues and suicides with college kids were an issue long before COVID.

As far as the "absurd government tracking"...my understanding is that tracking was somewhat like the "wild west" in the early stages as there weren't true standards. But, as we got deeper into 2020, standards were put in place (much the same way that you'd track deaths from AIDS, or any other disease).

Other people have spoken to the counting of covid deaths, and even how your own links undermine your description and/or understanding of it.

What you glossed over, just like a lot of people, and how I pointed out, is the large increase in depression and suicides in young people caused by them being locked out of school.

 

[aalion]

Which is a huge part of why Sweden’s excess deaths (total deaths vs expectation based on decades of data) is the lowest in Europe. They prioritized life versus avoiding death.

 

[Erial_Lion]

Other people have spoken to the counting of covid deaths, and even how your own links undermine your description and/or understanding of it.

What you glossed over, just like a lot of people, and how I pointed out, is the large increase in depression and suicides in young people caused by them being locked out of school.

Wasn’t there a pretty big upward trend in suicide rates well before Covid? Can “being locked out of school” really be treated as the definitive cause in post-2019 suicide rates when there was such an increase in them pre-2020?

 

[Online Persona]

Wasn’t there a pretty big upward trend in suicide rates well before Covid? Can “being locked out of school” really be treated as the definitive cause in post-2019 suicide rates when there was such an increase in them pre-2020?

There was a long term slight upward trend but it had a massive uptick after months of the lockdowns. So much so that many articles were written about it at the time (I recall something like a 30% increase at the time in several articles) and then the Surgeon General officially declared it a mental health crisis.

 

[91Joe95]

There was a long term slight upward trend but it had a massive uptick after months of the lockdowns. So much so that many articles were written about it at the time (I recall something like a 30% increase at the time in several articles) and then the Surgeon General officially declared it a mental health crisis.

Details.