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Gable Steveson saga

One of the issues here is that "professional wrestling" isn't really a sport. If someone goes into acting, should they be allowed back into NCAA sports?
very good! The worse thing about 'our' sport is that other thing they call wrestling... need to change the name - one or the other...
 
My thoughts are if you go professional you should be done with NCAA eligibility. This is a can of worms the NCAA should never allow to be opened. My example is, let's use any true Junior football player that gets drafted in the NFL and ends up being a bust and only plays for a year or two and is cut. Can he now test the NIL market for his services since he has a year of eligibility left?
If we are being honest, since NIL came into play, anyone receiving NIL money is a professional.
 
very good! The worse thing about 'our' sport is that other thing they call wrestling... need to change the name - one or the other...
I'm pretty sure that there was a court ruling some time ago that said that pro wrestling was entertainment and not an actual sports contest. Tikk10 - this is a good one for you to clarify here.
 
I'm pretty sure that there was a court ruling some time ago that said that pro wrestling was entertainment and not an actual sports contest. Tikk10 - this is a good one for you to clarify here.
So is the NFL, although that is a legitimate sport, too. There is some legal advantage for a professional league to be called "entertainment" instead of "sport", so that distinction on it's own doesn't have a lot of meaning. It's easy to see the difference between the NFL and WWE in terms of legitimate sport vs scripted outcomes (and as much as conspiracy theorists want to whine about the NFL being "fixed", at worst, the league has their thumb on the scale in the NFL as opposed to predetermining the entire outcome beforehand in the WWE).

No offense to any pro wrestling fans here, of course. If you like that, that's fine. It certainly can be entertaining. Just don't kid yourself into thinking the outcome isn't scripted from start to finish.
 
So is the NFL, although that is a legitimate sport, too. There is some legal advantage for a professional league to be called "entertainment" instead of "sport", so that distinction on it's own doesn't have a lot of meaning. It's easy to see the difference between the NFL and WWE in terms of legitimate sport vs scripted outcomes (and as much as conspiracy theorists want to whine about the NFL being "fixed", at worst, the league has their thumb on the scale in the NFL as opposed to predetermining the entire outcome beforehand in the WWE).

No offense to any pro wrestling fans here, of course. If you like that, that's fine. It certainly can be entertaining. Just don't kid yourself into thinking the outcome isn't scripted from start to finish.
And on the other hand, you still need to be pretty athletic to do some of the stunts those guys perform in their WWE matches! Just because they are acting doesn't mean they aren't real athletes.
 
My thoughts are if you go professional you should be done with NCAA eligibility. This is a can of worms the NCAA should never allow to be opened. My example is, let's use any true Junior football player that gets drafted in the NFL and ends up being a bust and only plays for a year or two and is cut. Can he now test the NIL market for his services since he has a year of eligibility left?
Kyke Snyder got $250k for winning 2016 Olympic Gold. He retained NCAA eligibility by deferring that payment a few years.

Was Snyder truly any less of a professional in 2017 and 2018 because he hadn't yet deposited the cash?
 
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I'm pretty sure that there was a court ruling some time ago that said that pro wrestling was entertainment and not an actual sports contest. Tikk10 - this is a good one for you to clarify here.
IIRC it wasn't a court ruling -- it was McMahon's lawyers making that point in court as part of their argument in some case.

Can't remember which case or what the bigger argument was. Maybe someone not on vacation can dredge that up.
 
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One of the issues here is that "professional wrestling" isn't really a sport. If someone goes into acting, should they be allowed back into NCAA sports?
Even if it were a sport, it's obviously unrelated to college wrestling.

This is how we got the ridiculous Jeremy Bloom case. Bloom lost mutiple years of college football eligibility because he accepted sponsorships to train for and compete in Olympic skiing.

OK, really he lost the eligibility because NCAA.

It probably cost him an NFL career too. He got drafted anyway, but clearly needed 2-3 years of development that the NCAA denied him.
 
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I think this was straight about the money. He has NOTHING left to prove in NCAA NOTHING. If not that then its the thing I loathe the most...trophy hunters.
 
I think this was straight about the money. He has NOTHING left to prove in NCAA NOTHING. If not that then it’s the thing I loathe the most...trophy hunters.
I’d argue Carter Starocci has nothing to prove either. He’s pretty much dominated through the field 4 times. Sure, bumping up is a new obstacle, but he’s using an extra year of eligibility to get paid to wrestle and live a college lifestyle. I can’t blame anyone, Gable or Carter included, for taking an opportunity like that.
 
I want Kerk to win as much as anyone. But I also don’t want any rules that cause college wrestlers to wrestle fewer than 4 NCAA tournaments.
 
I’d argue Carter Starocci has nothing to prove either. He’s pretty much dominated through the field 4 times. Sure, bumping up is a new obstacle, but he’s using an extra year of eligibility to get paid to wrestle and live a college lifestyle. I can’t blame anyone, Gable or Carter included, for taking an opportunity like that.
I agree with what you're saying but are you sure there is nothing Carter can do? Like maybe a super unique accomplishment that would make him stand alone in history (regardless of how the opportunity came about?)
 
I agree with what you're saying but are you sure there is nothing Carter can do? Like maybe a super unique accomplishment that would make him stand alone in history (regardless of how the opportunity came about?)
5 titles would be an incredible, obviously unprecedented accomplishment. However, it kind of sucks to me because those 4 time title winners before him may be looked upon as lesser than him, even though the opportunity to win a fifth, or lack there of, was entirely out of their control.
 
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5 titles would be an incredible, obviously unprecedented accomplishment. However, it kind of sucks to me because those 4 time title winners before him may be looked upon as lesser than him, even though the opportunity to win a fifth, or lack there of, was entirely out of their control.
So, what do you think of the 3-time winners who came before freshmen were allowed to compete at the varsity level?
 
And on the other hand, you still need to be pretty athletic to do some of the stunts those guys perform in their WWE matches! Just because they are acting doesn't mean they aren't real athletes.
This is definitely true. I didn’t say they weren’t athletes, just that it isn’t a sport because it isn’t a contest, it’s scripted entertainment.
 
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5 titles would be an incredible, obviously unprecedented accomplishment. However, it kind of sucks to me because those 4 time title winners before him may be looked upon as lesser than him, even though the opportunity to win a fifth, or lack there of, was entirely out of their control.
So, what do you think of the 3-time winners who came before freshmen were allowed to compete at the varsity level?
I consider the accomplishments of the 3-3 guys when freshmen couldn’t compete, the 4-4 guys, and Starocci if he gets 5-5 on the same level. If you wrestle every year you’re allowed to and you win every year, what more can you do?

I get that C-Star wants to do something that’s not only never been done, but also never will be done again, either, unless the NCAA goes to 5 years of eligibility. Who wouldn’t want to do that if they had the chance? That wouldn’t put him ahead of Cael or Brooks in history, though, just because he has one more.
 
So, what do you think of the 3-time winners who came before freshmen were allowed to compete at the varsity level?
Slumlord Bob would be cutting them checks right now, except they're too young.
 
IIRC it wasn't a court ruling -- it was McMahon's lawyers making that point in court as part of their argument in some case.

Can't remember which case or what the bigger argument was. Maybe someone not on vacation can dredge that up.
As I recall......Vince couldn't get insurance to cover his business. He had to prove that his business was highly regulated entertainment....not a competition. They had to admit that everything was pre-planned and choreographed......as if you couldn't figure that out by watching :)
 
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5 titles would be an incredible, obviously unprecedented accomplishment. However, it kind of sucks to me because those 4 time title winners before him may be looked upon as lesser than him, even though the opportunity to win a fifth, or lack there of, was entirely out of their control.
I feel more for the group of wrestlers whose opportunity to compete in a 4th NCAA. taken away from them by some bureaucrat.
 
I'm pretty sure that there was a court ruling some time ago that said that pro wrestling was entertainment and not an actual sports contest. Tikk10 - this is a good one for you to clarify here.
It had to do with the use of PED’s. Meaning professional wrestling is free to use it as entertainment. I think one of the states was banning them from holding a sports event over the issue.
 
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