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I heard on KDKA that a PSU Frat was suspended but I didn't catch the name

Re: I am sure the many women who are given the date rape drug at frat houses


You sound like one of those whiners who was crying "victim blaming" when people dared to make sensible statements about the UVA Rape Hoax.

Here's my sensible statement: My daughter is going to know not to pass out at a frat house.

If you didn't tell your daughter that before she left for college, then you get an "F".
 
Re: The pictures were on Facebook. That much is going to be pretty


Obviously, if they were drugged, that's an entirely different story, But, no one has alleged that, so you're just making stuff up. I don't know what the rest of your nonsense is even about.

You don't even know what the described behavior is yet, so get off your high horse.
 
If your daughter is given the date rape drug, yes she will.

That isn't parenting, its science.
 
Re: The pictures were on Facebook. That much is going to be pretty


Originally posted by Aoshiro:
And what if they were roofied?
Stop being a jerk.

What if you got drunk and passed out and your buddy took your ATM card and emptied your bank account. Would you be cool with that?

The described behavior is amoral and illegal. Stop making excuses for it.
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Agreed. The spin some posters are making for this behavior is ridiculous.
 
Actually we do not know if they "passed out" at a frat, either.

So the entire premise you chose is in place for no reason other than to blame the victim.
 
Re: The pictures were on Facebook. That much is going to be pretty


Spin? Don't you people ever learn anything?

I mean, really, how many of these ridiculous frat-boy/jock gone-wild stories have come out in the last few years, and 75% of them end up being false, including one at this very University that everyone on here whined about for 3 years. Get a grip.

There are idiots on here talking about roofies and kiddie porn, and nobody even has the most basic facts yet.
 
Re: Actually we do not know if they "passed out" at a frat, either.


You mean except for the article stating that she passed out at a frat?

You're a racist.
 
You have no idea what your daughter is going to do

She could be in a long term relationship with a guy that she trusts and you trust who turns out to be a creep. She spends the night in his room and wake up to photos of her on Facebook. How would that make you feel?
 
Don't worry. The sons of wealthy white men usually get

due process.
 
Re: You have no idea what your daughter is going to do


Bad. But read the article. She found out about it, didn't call the cops, and instead had the frat take down the facebook page.
 
The same article you claim may not be true? Right. That one.

Somebody must be a brother at the frat in question.
 
Re: The same article you claim may not be true? Right. That one.


There you go making up strawmen again. Never said it wasn't true. I said the facts weren't all there.
 
Re: Don't worry. The sons of wealthy white men usually get


What kind of process do you think they should get, if not due process?
 
They should get due process. But I will decide on my own, using whatever


standards I choose, what to believe. I do not owe them due process.
 
Re: The article I read said this


Could be a problem. However, not necessarily what the actual search warrant says.
 
Inexcusable under any circumstances.

I understand boys will be boys, but by age 18 (actually, 16), you've got to know what a mess you will make of things if you dable in these practices. I feel bad for the frat kids that had nothing to do with it but will get dragged down into the mess of it all.

sex has become quite an interesting issue, hasn't it? We've got all kinds of titillating scenes on TV, billboards and ads. Then a kid acts out and we wonder why 18 year olds can't manage themselves properly. now, with video, there is no place to hide (nor should there be). Perhaps we should go the way of places like Singapore where prostitution is a valid career choice while something as light as a Playboy magazine is a federal offense.
 
Re: Pretty sure that publishing photos of naked women taken without their

I wouldn't like it if my daughter was passed out drunk on the floor of a frat. I would also tell her if you engage in that type of behavior nothing good is going to happen to you.
 
After reading the article, if what is being reported is true, they deserve to get in big trouble. One thing to take a picture of a girl passed out without her top and email to a few close friends. A whole other thing to create a secret, invitation only facebook page to post pictures of girls that you take with the sole purpose of putting them on a facebook page for invited guests to see. Obviously if you are doing that, you know that what you are doing is criminal and wrong and deserve to have the book thrown at you. Wonder what the invited guests will actually get in this whole criminal proceeding.
 
So I guess you have no problem with the people who call JoePa

a pedophile enabler?
 
Originally posted by Cletus11:
After reading the article, if what is being reported is true, they deserve to get in big trouble. One thing to take a picture of a girl passed out without her top and email to a few close friends. A whole other thing to create a secret, invitation only facebook page to post pictures of girls that you take with the sole purpose of putting them on a facebook page for invited guests to see. Obviously if you are doing that, you know that what you are doing is criminal and wrong and deserve to have the book thrown at you. Wonder what the invited guests will actually get in this whole criminal proceeding.
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Maybe. But, I don't think that invitation-based facebook groups are as unusual as you think. Also, if you read the search warrant, it is not at all clear that there are many pictures of nude, passed out women as some here want to believe. Use common sense: how likely is it that this would happen frequently?

That said, if it turns out that there are several nude pictures of unconsenting females, then there is going to be a problem here.
 
Let's test this "blame the victim" excuse

I'm just curious. How far are you guys willing to take this "It's OK to commit a crime against someone who is asleep or passed out" argument?

Say you have a friend visiting from out of town staying at your house. Is it OK to take his wallet while he's asleep? I mean, you're a person of low moral character and your friend should have known that, right?

Or say you're in State College on during Arts Festival and you walk by someone who is crashed on the HUB lawn. Is it OK to kick the crap out of them? I mean, really, they should have known better than to fall asleep on the lawn.

Or is it only OK to commit a crime against a woman who is asleep or passed out?
 
they are going to have to show that the 'invitation only' FB page

had something more than drunk, naked ladies posted without their consent. If that's all there is, everyone who looked at them is in trouble. I guess they can argue that they looked and immediately clicked off, but I am pretty sure that is tracked and people would know how long they were on the site. But if the only thing on those pages were those gals and they looked for more than 20 seconds, they will get in trouble too.
 
Re: Let's test this "blame the victim" excuse

Originally posted by Aoshiro:
I'm just curious. How far are you guys willing to take this "It's OK to commit a crime against someone who is asleep or passed out" argument?

Say you have a friend visiting from out of town staying at your house. Is it OK to take his wallet while he's asleep? I mean, you're a person of low moral character and your friend should have known that, right?

Or say you're in State College on during Arts Festival and you walk by someone who is crashed on the HUB lawn. Is it OK to kick the crap out of them? I mean, really, they should have known better than to fall asleep on the lawn.

Or is it only OK to commit a crime against a woman who is asleep or passed out?
Click to expand...
You should improve your reading comprehension, since no one on here ever said that it was "It's OK to commit a crime against someone who is asleep or passed out". But, I jest, because obviously you can read, and I realize that you're just posing a big, bogus strawman.

I did make the statement that my daughter will be taught never to pass out at a frat house. And, she'll still be taught that, notwithstanding your apparent disapproval. I'll also advise her to teach same to all of her friends whose parents sent them to college clueless and vulnerable, I guess like your daughter.
 
Re: They should get due process. But I will decide on my own, using whatever

Originally posted by demlion:


standards I choose, what to believe. I do not owe them due process.
Click to expand...
I can hear idiots at the lair saying the same thing about PSU with regards to Sandusky.
 
Re: They should get due process. But I will decide on my own, using whatever


Originally posted by pandaczar12:
Originally posted by demlion:


standards I choose, what to believe. I do not owe them due process.
Click to expand...
I can hear idiots at the lair saying the same thing about PSU with regards to Sandusky.
Click to expand...
Well I'm going to depart from demlion here. I'm going to refrain from passing judgement on any individuals until they've had their day in court.

What pisses me off is people who are trying to excuse the described criminal activity as "knucklehead behavior." Taking a picture of someone nude without their knowledge or consent and posting it on the internet is illegal. There's no excuse for it.
 
Yes I do. They are wrong. But they never owed Joe Paterno due process.

There is a general duty to be correct, but individuals do not owe other due process. That term has to do with how the government treats you.
 
Re: Yes I do. They are wrong. But they never owed Joe Paterno due process.

Originally posted by demlion:
There is a general duty to be correct, but individuals do not owe other due process. That term has to do with how the government treats you.
Click to expand...
Oh, so you mean lynchings and witchhunts are OK so long as the government isn't involved. OK, then.
 
The same people who say we do not know what happened say it is knucklehead

behavior. Due process is about what the government must prove before punishing you, about giving you your day in court. I am not subject to those rules because I am not the government.
 
Re: Yes I do. They are wrong. But they never owed Joe Paterno due process.

Originally posted by demlion:
There is a general duty to be correct, but individuals do not owe other due process. That term has to do with how the government treats you.
Click to expand...
Yes, well of course that's true.

But after all I've seen in the last few years I am a lot more cautious about condemning people based on news reports. I'm doing my best to avoid being part of any rush to judgement. It seems to me that's a lesson we all should have learned.
 
Re: The same people who say we do not know what happened say it is knucklehead

There are different kinds of due process. There is the "Due Process" that is described in the Constitution, and as to that, you're right.

But, there is also the "due process" that is the courtesy that ordinary intelligent people should afford to others who are accused of sensational crimes and wrongful acts, but haven't yet had the opportunity to defend themselves yet. When people go off half-cocked and rush to judgment, well, F them.
 
If what's being alleged here is true, I think this is certainly enough to revoke this fraternity's charter, and I would expect the national office of the fraternity to do just that. Further, I think if it's determined that photos of nude women were taken without their consent and posted on this Facebook page, the individuals who took and posted these photos should be disciplined severely by the university, up to and including expulsion. If the claims that were made in the police report are accurate, the individuals responsible must learn that there is not only no place for this type of behavior at this university, but that there is no place for this type of behavior in society at large.
 
I was in a large fraternity 85-88...this is tragic but does not surprise me

When I think back at my days I can think of a handful of guys that just had no filter when it came to treatment of women. If Facebook and iPhone cameras existed back then I can all by guarantee this would have happened at my house (or something similar). I haven't heard info about pictures but I hope at least these idiots had good sense not to include gals faces. We have laws (and University by-laws) covering this stuff and they should be allowed due process. I just feel bad for women and the other brothers at this house who had nothing to do with this.
 
Not okay, just no violations of due process. This is not up for debate.

It is inherent in the meaning of the term "due process."
 
That second kind you mentioned? You just made it up.

BTW, there has been no mention whatever of any names that I have seen. The frat has been suspended. And calling it knucklehead behavior and blaming the victim are also violations of that mythical second kind of due process you mentioned.
 
Re: That second kind you mentioned? You just made it up.

Originally posted by demlion:
BTW, there has been no mention whatever of any names that I have seen. The frat has been suspended. And calling it knucklehead behavior and blaming the victim are also violations of that mythical second kind of due process you mentioned.
Click to expand...
Talk about making things up, find the post where I used the term "Knucklehead". Also, find the post where I said that it's the victim's fault--in fact, I already told you that that's just a whiny fallback argument that you used when confronted with actual common sense. When that failed, you cried racism, remember?

And no, I didn't make up the fact that people of ordinary intelligence and courtesy don't rush to judgment on the basis of sketchy facts. Everyone here already learned that lesson, except you.
 
Agree...especially since these kids grew up knowing the consequences...

of this kind of behavior. Setting aside the obvious human decency issues, it's the one big no-no in the digital era: you don't take nude photos of yourself or others. And if you come across them, then you NEVER share them or post to social media.

There have been high school kids charged with sex crimes just for having received and shared nude photos of other high school kids who are underaged.
 
I know victim blaming when I see it. And you are actually doing something

worse than calling it knucklehead behavior, so there is no doubt you would agree with that too. Name the person I am judging. Lots of people here have said if this is true then it is really, really bad. that is all I am saying, except to call out the victim blamers like yourself.
 
Not for nuthin' but who takes pics of their drug deals? These guys are truly morons if even half of this stuff is true.

As someone mentioned, if any of these girls are minors, these guys are cooked. Furthermore, if the media can tie this into "Pedophilia Charges Against A PSU Frat" it will be a circus up there.

We'll have to wait and see what all comes out of the investigations but I'm at the point where I just expect the worse.
 
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