MLS coach calls equal pay in international soccer "ridiculous".

[BobPSU92]

And a man in his position can't afford to be made to look ridiculous.

See the link below. From the article:

"(CNN) -- Football coach and former player Frank de Boer has been criticized for calling equal pay at international level a "ridiculous" idea.

De Boer, who played over 100 times for the Netherlands in the 1990s and early 2000s, took charge of Atlanta United last year after the side had won its first MLS Cup under Tata Martino.

"It's the same like tennis," De Boer said in an interview with The Guardian. "If there are watching, for the World Cup final, 500 million people or something like that, and 100 million for a women's final, that's a difference. So it's not the same.

"And of course they have to be paid what they deserve ... and not less, just what they really deserve. If it's just as popular as the men, they will get it, because the income and the advertising will go into that."

https://www.cnn.com/2019/08/14/football/frank-de-boer-equal-pay-football-spt-intl/index.html

So he's in line with many views expressed here.

 

[sluggo72]

And a man in his position can't afford to be made to look ridiculous.

See the link below. From the article:

"(CNN) -- Football coach and former player Frank de Boer has been criticized for calling equal pay at international level a "ridiculous" idea.

De Boer, who played over 100 times for the Netherlands in the 1990s and early 2000s, took charge of Atlanta United last year after the side had won its first MLS Cup under Tata Martino.

"It's the same like tennis," De Boer said in an interview with The Guardian. "If there are watching, for the World Cup final, 500 million people or something like that, and 100 million for a women's final, that's a difference. So it's not the same.

"And of course they have to be paid what they deserve ... and not less, just what they really deserve. If it's just as popular as the men, they will get it, because the income and the advertising will go into that."

https://www.cnn.com/2019/08/14/football/frank-de-boer-equal-pay-football-spt-intl/index.html

So he's in line with many views expressed here.

 

[BobPSU92]

View embedded media

GOOMBAH.

 

[Lion8286]

And a man in his position can't afford to be made to look ridiculous.

See the link below. From the article:

"(CNN) -- Football coach and former player Frank de Boer has been criticized for calling equal pay at international level a "ridiculous" idea.

De Boer, who played over 100 times for the Netherlands in the 1990s and early 2000s, took charge of Atlanta United last year after the side had won its first MLS Cup under Tata Martino.

"It's the same like tennis," De Boer said in an interview with The Guardian. "If there are watching, for the World Cup final, 500 million people or something like that, and 100 million for a women's final, that's a difference. So it's not the same.

"And of course they have to be paid what they deserve ... and not less, just what they really deserve. If it's just as popular as the men, they will get it, because the income and the advertising will go into that."

https://www.cnn.com/2019/08/14/football/frank-de-boer-equal-pay-football-spt-intl/index.html

So he's in line with many views expressed here.

Bob,

You do realize that you are not required to post every, single sports headline, right??

Concerned Citizen

 

[Cletus11]

Well in the socialist world that we are migrating to that is not true, everybody is equal. So let's just look at the big socialist/communist countries and see how great the citizens have it. Venezuela, China, Russia, ....look how great they have it in those countries.

 

[KnightSlayer]

Well in the socialist world that we are migrating to that is not true, everybody is equal. So let's just look at the big socialist/communist countries and see how great the citizens have it. Venezuela, China, Russia, ....look how great they have it in those countries.

Or rather the world where slack jawed yokels just make up things to suit their agenda.

 

[ivan brunetti]

Well in the socialist world that we are migrating to that is not true, everybody is equal. So let's just look at the big socialist/communist countries and see how great the citizens have it. Venezuela, China, Russia, ....look how great they have it in those countries.

Also look at the socialist democratic countries. Finland, Norway, Denmark, Iceland, Switzerland, Netherlands, etc. Atop the 2018 happiest countries list.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Happiness_Report#2019_World_Happiness_Report

 

[bcspsu]

Well in the socialist world that we are migrating to that is not true, everybody is equal. So let's just look at the big socialist/communist countries and see how great the citizens have it. Venezuela, China, Russia, ....look how great they have it in those countries.

Remember in socialist countries, everyone is equal; it's just some are more equal than others.

 

[Art]

And a man in his position can't afford to be made to look ridiculous.

See the link below. From the article:

"(CNN) -- Football coach and former player Frank de Boer has been criticized for calling equal pay at international level a "ridiculous" idea.

De Boer, who played over 100 times for the Netherlands in the 1990s and early 2000s, took charge of Atlanta United last year after the side had won its first MLS Cup under Tata Martino.

"It's the same like tennis," De Boer said in an interview with The Guardian. "If there are watching, for the World Cup final, 500 million people or something like that, and 100 million for a women's final, that's a difference. So it's not the same.

"And of course they have to be paid what they deserve ... and not less, just what they really deserve. If it's just as popular as the men, they will get it, because the income and the advertising will go into that."

https://www.cnn.com/2019/08/14/football/frank-de-boer-equal-pay-football-spt-intl/index.html

So he's in line with many views expressed here.

From the man who Jose Mourinho dubbed "the worst manager in the history of the Premier League."

 

[Woodpecker]

Well in the socialist world that we are migrating to that is not true, everybody is equal. So let's just look at the big socialist/communist countries and see how great the citizens have it. Venezuela, China, Russia, ....look how great they have it in those countries.

 

[Pardlion]

Also look at the socialist democratic countries. Finland, Norway, Denmark, Iceland, Switzerland, Netherlands, etc. Atop the 2018 happiest countries list.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Happiness_Report#2019_World_Happiness_Report

They get to bang long-legged blondes all day. Of course they're happy.

 

[BobPSU92]

They get to bang long-legged blondes all day. Of course they're happy.

I could do that, but I choose not to.

 

[Woodpecker]

They get to bang long-legged blondes all day. Of course they're happy.

You get tired of that.

 

[bcspsu]

Also look at the socialist democratic countries. Finland, Norway, Denmark, Iceland, Switzerland, Netherlands, etc. Atop the 2018 happiest countries list.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Happiness_Report#2019_World_Happiness_Report

From the man who Jose Mourinho dubbed "the worst manager in the history of the Premier League."

That doesn't make what he said incorrect. And I say that as a fan of Inter Milan, for which he had a disastrous stint as manager several years ago.

I almost hope that this equal pay thing happens because that will expedite the death of pro women's soccer/football. I say this not because I want women's pro soccer to fail, which I don't, but because I want to see unrealistic people proven wrong. I would imagine that the MLS has enough trouble getting corporate support, let alone the women's league.

 

[LoyalandTrueLion]

Or rather the world where slack jawed yokels just make up things to suit their agenda.

Don't talk about women like that

 

[Art]

That doesn't make what he said incorrect. And I say that as a fan of Inter Milan, for which he had a disastrous stint as manager several years ago.

I almost hope that this equal pay thing happens because that will expedite the death of pro women's soccer/football. I say this not because I want women's pro soccer to fail, which I don't, but because I want to see unrealistic people proven wrong. I would imagine that the MLS has enough trouble getting corporate support, let alone the women's league.

On a universal basis I agree. But believe I read somewhere that the US National Women's Team brings in more revenue than the Men's Team. If that's the case, then the women should be paid more by the US federation.

 

[bcspsu]

On a universal basis I agree. But believe I read somewhere that the US National Women's Team brings in more revenue than the Men's Team. If that's the case, then the women should be paid more by the US federation.

If that's true, then I agree.

 

[ivan brunetti]

On a universal basis I agree. But believe I read somewhere that the US National Women's Team brings in more revenue than the Men's Team. If that's the case, then the women should be paid more by the US federation.

The US women have an argument to be paid MORE than the US men. They simply attract more viewers.

But in general, the men in most countries would be worth more.

 

[Pardlion]

On a universal basis I agree. But believe I read somewhere that the US National Women's Team brings in more revenue than the Men's Team. If that's the case, then the women should be paid more by the US federation.

That would never happen.

https://www.latimes.com/sports/soccer/story/2019-07-30/us-soccer-women-paid-more-than-men

 

[heckmans]

On a universal basis I agree. But believe I read somewhere that the US National Women's Team brings in more revenue than the Men's Team. If that's the case, then the women should be paid more by the US federation.

You've read this in the women's lawsuit that cherry picks a very specific data set that includes a world cup that the US Men didn't participate in, and that ignores the fact that the women collectively bargained a very different pay structure that favors stability over pay for performance.

I'll have to look it up, but in a thread a few weeks ago, I posted the stats on TV viewership of men vs women. It's not close.

EDIT: Here is what I posted a few weeks ago...

"The women just had something like 13M viewers for the World Cup final.
The men were not in the last WC, but in the one prior, for a group match, the US men drew something like 26.5M viewers. That 172% more then the women in a FINAL. to claim things are equal or the women outdraw is an outright falsehood."

I'll also add...
In the most recent Men's WC, the final involved teams that were not the US (The US did not even participate in the WC) and US viewership was approximately equal to the women's final which included the US.

 

[LaJolla Lion]

I'm not sure how you take the money that the men bring in and hand it over to the women. There is a HUGE gap in viewers between the mens and womens WC's where the money comes from. The men had 3.5 billion world wide viewers and I don't think the women had over 100 million. The prize money for each tournament reflects that as viewers = $$$'s. I think the mens WC has about 400 million to pay out to the teams in the WC and the womens had 30 million. The revenue difference is 4 billion to 75 million or so in favor of the men. I mean we all would love to see the women get paid more, but the mens side simply dwarfs the womens internationally in terms of revenue.

Are you going to tell other nations who are stronger mens side they need to give back money to the women to make it fair for the US women. Bottom line is get more eyes on the TV and the money will go up. I support the womens team and watch when I can which is more than most people in this country. The mens WC is the biggest sporting event on the planet and it's not even close. It makes the Superbowl look like a Pitt home game.

 

[Obliviax]

Pay is derived from value. Value is derived from income. that, then, drives negotiating leverage. the women's game simply does not drive the revenue.

 

[Cletus11]

Also look at the socialist democratic countries. Finland, Norway, Denmark, Iceland, Switzerland, Netherlands, etc. Atop the 2018 happiest countries list.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Happiness_Report#2019_World_Happiness_Report

the sparce population of those countries along allows some level of socialism to survive. Like saying Montana can function the same as other states. Also look at historical European money those countries have and exploitation of resources (Norway is Oil and Gas, Finland is forests) that is also not allowed per the green new deal.

 

[anon_xdc8rmuek44eq]

The US women have an argument to be paid MORE than the US men. They simply attract more viewers.

But in general, the men in most countries would be worth more.

They win a sh*t ton more too. That said, agree with the coach - won’t work internationally.

 

[Art]

You've read this in the women's lawsuit that cherry picks a very specific data set that includes a world cup that the US Men didn't participate in, and that ignores the fact that the women collectively bargained a very different pay structure that favors stability over pay for performance.

I'll have to look it up, but in a thread a few weeks ago, I posted the stats on TV viewership of men vs women. It's not close.

If the women bargained a different contract basis that should be followed. On the other hand, if the women brought more revenue to the federation because they made the WC and the men didn't that should be accounted for.

 

[heckmans]

If the women bargained a different contract basis that should be followed. On the other hand, if the women brought more revenue to the federation because they made the WC and the men didn't that should be accounted for.

Not looking for an argument Art, but you are not understanding how compensation from US Soccer for each team works. This is actually most of the problem, because most of those screaming about equality have no idea how things work.

Here are the highlights.

The women CBA includes a base salary and healthcare benefits.
The men get paid a "bonus" for being on the squad and winning games. Risk reward. End of story.

For the World Cup specifically, players get a share of revenues.
-Men's WC Revenues: $6B % to players: 7
-Women's WC Revenues: $131M % to players: 9 (I think, but it's def higher)

Then there is US Soccer broadcast rights revenue. They say they don't break out the bidding by team, but that's nonsense. One only needs to look at ratings to understand what each team is worth. For that order of magnitude, I'd refer you to WC viewership numbers above.
Ultimately the women are going to get screwed if they aren't careful. US Soccer will never unjustly hurt the men's team, which is the cash cow. If this nonsense continues, US Soccer will need to divest the Women's team to a separate organization and let them stand on their own big girl finances. It won't be pretty for them.

 

[Nitwit97]

On a universal basis I agree. But believe I read somewhere that the US National Women's Team brings in more revenue than the Men's Team. If that's the case, then the women should be paid more by the US federation.

They don’t. The men’s tournament is worth a lot more than the women’s. They had higher ratings this year than the men’s tournament , but that is in the US. The US women’s team was in the final, the men’s team did not qualify, so you can understand the disparity

I personally think all national teams should not be paid. They should be playing for the prestige of the tournament, etc

 

[heckmans]

Pay is derived from value. Value is derived from income. that, then, drives negotiating leverage. the women's game simply does not drive the revenue.

OMG, you are just part of the patriarchy

 

[heckmans]

They don’t. The men’s tournament is worth a lot more than the women’s. They had higher ratings this year than the men’s tournament , but that is in the US. The US women’s team was in the final, the men’s team did not qualify, so you can understand the disparity

I personally think all national teams should not be paid. They should be playing for the prestige of the tournament, etc

You mean like the NCAA?

 

[Obliviax]

Not looking for an argument Art, but you are not understanding how compensation from US Soccer for each team works. This is actually most of the problem, because most of those screaming about equality have no idea how things work.

Here are the highlights.

The women CBA includes a base salary and healthcare benefits.
The men get paid a "bonus" for being on the squad and winning games. Risk reward. End of story.

For the World Cup specifically, players get a share of revenues.
-Men's WC Revenues: $6B % to players: 7
-Women's WC Revenues: $131M % to players: 9 (I think, but it's def higher)

Then there is US Soccer broadcast rights revenue. They say they don't break out the bidding by team, but that's nonsense. One only needs to look at ratings to understand what each team is worth. For that order of magnitude, I'd refer you to WC viewership numbers above.
Ultimately the women are going to get screwed if they aren't careful. US Soccer will never unjustly hurt the men's team, which is the cash cow. If this nonsense continues, US Soccer will need to divest the Women's team to a separate organization and let them stand on their own big girl finances. It won't be pretty for them.

Great data....thanks...there is an easy solution. Dissolve the men's league and make it an "open league" where only the best play. Those players, the best in the world, will be compensated fairly.

Then, you can also create a "women's league", for those that do not qualify for the open league.

 

[heckmans]

Great data....thanks...there is an easy solution. Dissolve the men's league and make it an "open league" where only the best play. Those players, the best in the world, will be compensated fairly.

Then, you can also create a "women's league", for those that do not qualify for the open league.

I think technically, that's what we already have across all pro sports.
Obviously an MLB, NFL, NHL, NBA team would put a woman on the roster if they were better than one of the men already there...of course, in the case of women's soccer, the US National team couldn't compete with the men's U20 team.

 

[Obliviax]

I think technically, that's what we already have across all pro sports.
Obviously an MLB, NFL, NHL, NBA team would put a woman on the roster if they were better than one of the men already there...of course, in the case of women's soccer, the US National team couldn't compete with the men's U20 team.

IIRC, the US Woman's Team got beat by a U-15 team in 2017. I feel like they are different games and find the woman's game to be just a bit less entertaining than the men's game. Again, bottom line is revenue.

 

[bison13]

Here is the HS version of this. Working as athletic admin, our basketball teams (boys and girls varsity, who are both very good) routinely play DH's at 5 and 7 pm with 1 ticket getting both games. We have 16 conference games that we try to split so that each team plays the late game of the DH 8 times to allow parents and such the opportunity to see the whole game if working later. We generally gave our girls the later times for the midweek game while giving the boys the Friday ones unless the competition level lead us to have the better game last. Though some years its a 9/7 or 7/9 split.

Well one year the girls team had parents complaining that they didnt get enough late games specifically on Fridays. The next year of that cycle we made an effort to give them more of what they wanted. The problem was that all of the crowd would leave after the boys game ended. It was giving the kids 2-3 hours more to party. They generally left after boys all games but it wasnt as big of a difference on a Tuesday compared to Friday. Our crowds on good Friday games would have 800-1200 for the boys game and under 100 for the girls by halftime of their game. The girls hated it, they begged to play early so that at least the 4th quarters of their games would be loud and they would have the crowd to help them.

Not that HS athletics should chance things based on $ but those friday nights with girls going last cost our booster club over $2500 each time. $7500 can buy kids a lot of T-shirts, practice jerseys etc. The following year the girls players asked that they always play late on weeknights.

 

[Pardlion]

The following year the girls players asked that they always play late on Friday.

Huh?

 

[Woodpecker]

Here is the HS version of this. Working as athletic admin, our basketball teams (boys and girls varsity, who are both very good) routinely play DH's at 5 and 7 pm with 1 ticket getting both games. We have 16 conference games that we try to split so that each team plays the late game of the DH 8 times to allow parents and such the opportunity to see the whole game if working later. We generally gave our girls the later times for the midweek game while giving the boys the Friday ones unless the competition level lead us to have the better game last. Though some years its a 9/7 or 7/9 split.

Well one year the girls team had parents complaining that they didnt get enough late games specifically on Fridays. The next year of that cycle we made an effort to give them more of what they wanted. The problem was that all of the crowd would leave after the boys game ended. It was giving the kids 2-3 hours more to party. They generally left after boys all games but it wasnt as big of a difference on a Tuesday compared to Friday. Our crowds on good Friday games would have 800-1200 for the boys game and under 100 for the girls by halftime of their game. The girls hated it, they begged to play early so that at least the 4th quarters of their games would be loud and they would have the crowd to help them.

Not that HS athletics should chance things based on $ but those friday nights with girls going last cost our booster club over $2500 each time. $7500 can buy kids a lot of T-shirts, practice jerseys etc. The following year the girls players asked that they always play late on Friday.

Did the girls speak to their parents?

 

[bison13]

Huh?

Sorry. My mistake. Thanks

 

[Nitwit97]

The women should be brave and refuse to play for the national team. You know how eager they are to use their platform for social issues. Time to put their (little bit) of money where their mouths are. Otherwise, they are cherry picking cowards who really only seem to be trying to get some extra money.

This is about equality, not about squeezing every buck they can get out of their 15 minutes.