NATO
- Thread starter pish69
- Start date
You do realize that nato has two big ten titles over Iowa wrestlers in the finals? Granted he has lost two national semi finals to Iowa guys also. I wouldn't say he has no success I would say it's more like a 50/50 chance against Lee using his past results against Iowa kids. Using this baseline he beats Lee at b10s loses to him in the national semi's and finishes 3rd again.
No one here is privy to what's discussed behind closed doors re. seeding. The loss at the All-Star Classic does not count officially, but it happened, and we're dealing with human beings here, so it's going to be part of their thought process, whether consciously so, or subconsciously so.
All Mark can do is continue to wrestle well, win against the guys that will be in front of him, and let the chips fall where they may. Seeding is important, but our clues are minimal if both guys are undefeated...but here's two...
-- How well Mark wrestles against Bo, likely facing him twice. I don't think the transitive property is valid, but it might be used here. My thinking here is that the committee will use
-- The Coaches Ranking. The Wrestling Committee can use all the tools at it's disposal when seeding, and one is how the Coaches Rank the wrestlers. I will look it up tomorrow, and tell you which coaches have a say in the 174 rankings...only 8 coaches rank each weight class.
EDIT: 174 Rankings provided by; Navy, PSU, Northern Illinois, North Carolina, Appalachian St, South Dakota St, Arizona St, Edinboro
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I already argued too much about this on TheMat but I take zero issue to it given Nato's rust, weight and injury. He probably just isn't ready for this match and it makes sense to pick the weaker guy his first match back and not make weight twice. I know Ryan's history but it just makes sense for him not to wrestle Suriano given the layoff.
Besides, I think he has way more to gain with seeding by winning this match than by losing it.
Besides, I think he has way more to gain with seeding by winning this match than by losing it.
Roar, do you know when and how coaches assigned the weights they'll vote on? Is it completely arbitrary?
Come on minnhawkeye your better than this. Clark avenged his loss to nato in the semi's, then took out a former Hawkeye teammate in gross in the finals. After that he planted terry brands on the mat, by terry request, as an exclamation point. I feel like you know this and are just needeling me because I am a nato fan.
It's not a popular opinion here, but I give Ryan some leeway with THIS specific move. I don't really know the nature or severity of Tomasello's prior injury, nor do I know how hard the pull presently is to 125, but I can fully understand them trying to protect him from wrestling a bull in his first weekend on the mat. Aside from that, Ryan's antics are cowardly and stupid and, as Cael would say, "are ruining the sport".
I am also in agreement with you, and to answer NittanyChris, my opinion wouldn't change of this weekend (still his first match), but if he (Ryan) has Nato duck a similarly recovering Spencer, then the intentions would be obvious.
I have a hard time believing he would do that though (we'll see if I am naive). Not a good way to prepare for Nationals.
As SHP said, the conferences decide, and each may have their own way of selecting which coach ranks which weight class. I may have last year's roster somewhere, and try to make sense of the process.
As further explanation, each conference ranks every weight class. That's EIWA, B1G, MAC, ACC, SoCon, Big 12, Pac-12, and EWL, so each weight has 8 Coaches Rankings that is reconciled into one ranking.
For conferences with fewer than 10 members (all but the B1G and Big 12), they will double up and certain teams will get 2 weight classes. For example, in the ACC, Duke has 141 and 149, and Virginia Tech has 133 and 197. In the B1G, 4 teams get no votes for rankings.
As far as when, the first of four Coaches Ranking will be released on or about January 19, so the rankings have to be submitted earlier that week at the latest. The next one will be on or about February 9, followed by one on or about late Feb/early March. A final one is submitted after the Conference Championships, but before NCAA's to determine Bronze standard wrestlers (and no, this is not a tanning bed reference).
We shall see. I'm of the opinion that the odds we get to see NATO vs Spencer in the tOSU-Iowa dual are about 2 to 1 against.
I agree and at that point, I'll become critical of Ryan's propensity to have his kids dodge good wrestlers to protect their seeds, their psyche or whatever.
Here's another question...so we're led to believe that NATO is ready for his first match but two matches in three days is too much right now, because of the cut or otherwise.
Then if Maryland were to FF 125 and NATO does not wrestle, he'd get his one match in vs Rutgers, correct?
Then if Maryland were to FF 125 and NATO does not wrestle, he'd get his one match in vs Rutgers, correct?
Thanks...likable kid.
Just an fyi...Ohio State has 9 duals left, and a wrestler needs at least 8 D1 matches to reach Silver Standard and earn the Big Ten an allocation for his weight class (17 matches to reach Gold Standard). Assuming Nathan does not wrestle any tournaments (to get more matches), he'll have to wrestle every dual to get to 8, given that he's missing Rutgers.
Doesn't affect him so much, as he'll surely earn his way, but it may affect another wrestler that misses by one placement.
what? Duals matter for everyone? Same thing at hwt, again.
If the rumors of the grad student in the directory by the name of Kuhns are true, not having that spot could be an issue for us. again if the rumors are true....
So if he doesn't get enough matches our conference loses a spot? Wouldn't they purposely not get enough to help worsen PSU chances of qualifying a guy?
Assuming you're serious...the Aruba comment threw me...here's some Bronze Standard info...
More criteria (beyond RPI, Coaches Ranking, and Win %) are added to the mix to determine Bronze Standard. Wrestlers that don't earn a trip to Nationals at their conference tourney must meet at least 2 of the following criteria;
.700 overall win %
Top-33 RPI (recalculated AFTER conference tourneys)
Top-33 coaches ranking
One win against an Automatic Qualifier (win must be prior to conference tourneys)
Qualifying event placement one below auto-qualifying
Again, meeting 2 of those 5 earns Bronze Standard, then all eligible wrestlers are compared, and the selection committee fills the at-large slots with the wrestlers having the highest criteria scores.
I doubt that it's a sinister attempt to hurt PSU or other Big Ten schools, but I'd still argue that it's a selfish position to take for Ryan if he doesn't recognize that holding NATO (or Snyder) out may end up costing the conference a qualifier. It's another reason why I can't stand the fact that he does this stuff (and for what it's worth, I've defended the plan to hold him out against Suriano this weekend, so I'm not just a bash Ryan kind of guy).
Rarely, if ever, keeps deserving wrestlers from going, simply because the at-large bids are available. Because of this, the Big Ten, as a conference, doesn't really lose an NCAA qualifier.
Thank you, Captain Obvious.
I'll assume you meant to say he has more to gain by winning than he has to lose by losing the match. Even that proposition is ridiculous, however. NaTo is ranked #1 by the national ranking services (Flo, Intermat, Wrestlestat), so he's likely #1 -- or at worst #2 -- for seeding purposes. In other words, he has virtually (perhaps literally) nothing to gain by winning, and faces a significant drop in seeding by losing.
I listened to the interview quickly, but I thought I heard NATO say he has a wedding to go to... a commitment made awhile ago...
I heard that the sock drawer needed rearranging on the dual-meet date. #SockDrawersDontOrganizeThemselves
Correct.................... His best friend he made a promise tooooooooo. Check the flights out of Columbus for a NATO.
That's not something you can just let slide. Skip one sock drawer organizing day, and next thing you know it's been weeks since you separated your argyles from your stripes. Yikes!
Real bad. Hayes looked good for TOSU. Hope not but he may challenge Sorenson for runnerup
Match ended 7-0. I thought he had an hours worth of riding time as well.
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