Of course I’m in the insurance industry, so I see it first hand. Many of the people you drive by daily have no insurance....you’ll find out when they hit you. And I saw zero businesses do that.
No football this fall makes more and more sense.
- Thread starter Harrisburg Dave
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They need to shut down grocery stores and hospitals too...talk about Petri dishes.
Absolutely it should be and if someone is caught without it they should lose their license and their car.
Wear a mask when you see them and social distance.. ask the parents and grandparents if they think their kids should give up sports and school so that they're more "protected". What do you think the answer is?
And why shouldn’t we trust people to individually choose to not have insurance based on their personal risk tolerance?
It’s not about their risk tolerance, it’s about the person they hit. The people who could afford to self-insure, don’t....they buy insurance.
Precisely, and I agree with your logic, which is why I used car insurance as a good example in response to the following argument made by PSUFBfan:
“Why don't we simply let people take individual responsibility and make their own decisions for how they want to handle this aspect of life? If you are elderly, have underlying health issues, or simply fearful of catching the virus, take whatever precautions you deem are necessary.“
In other words, it’s not about their risk tolerance it’s about the person they pass the COVID infection too.
Of course people can self-insure if they have the financial ability to do it....they just have to take the proper legal steps. So it’s not a precise comparison.
Guess I can say the same for the people that lost their jobs. Just find another career. Easy peasy.
Oh and your above comparisons. Yikes.
Totally different. Self-insuring is still taking a proactive step so that when something bad happens to another because of your behavior that you are responsible to them. People that are ignoring public health recommendations or requirements aren’t doing anything proactively to safeguard others from the risks they take not to cover their potential medical costs or lost wages. They aren’t self isolating themselves afterwards and they aren’t getting tested in lieu of wearing a mask or following being in a crowded place with people. They aren’t doing anything comparable to self insurance.
That means you could go see a Jets game...the article specifically says PRO sports teams!
But if they don’t have the virus then they’re no risk to others and most people don’t have it. It would be like buying insurance on a vehicle that has no wheels and doesn’t leave the driveway. But I get your point.
I suppose it varies. I have a neighbor who decided to send his daughter to Drexel instead of PSU so she could live at home and not be exposed to living in a PSU dorm. Her mother is a physician. She is not a Div 1 athlete however, but a very strong student.
People don’t when they contract it so they aren’t sure whether the tires are on or not. Generally, it is spread by people that are unaware they have it not by people that know they have it.
If there is no one else at the intersection, then there is no risk if I run the red light either but we don’t accept that logic because we understand that we might miss seeing a vehicle. Taking risks by being in close contact to others or not wearing a mask increases the chance you will get it and unknowingly pass it to someone just light ignoring red light or stop sign will increase the risk that you be in an accident.
The point is the chances of wrecking your car is far far greater than catching this virus. Everyone on the road is a potential accident....not true for the virus.
There should not be college or high school football this fall.
However, the NCAA is too weak to stop college ball. The individual states will control high school ball.
Most of us have had to give up something for a period of time and we survived.
However, the NCAA is too weak to stop college ball. The individual states will control high school ball.
Most of us have had to give up something for a period of time and we survived.
You’re likely to eat your words on that one. Annually, there are 6 million accidents with about 40,000 fatalities. So around 500,000 accidents per month (17,000 per day). In the 5 months since the first US case there were 2,338,000 diagnosed cases or about 466,000 per month. The current daily average is about 50,000 cases and climbing, so you are more likely to come down with COVID-19 tomorrow that to crash your car tomorrow. And we’ve already seen enough COVID-19 deaths in 5 months as typically seen in three years of auto accidents. The odds certainly are not far far greater that you’ll be in an accident. Even at this point and COVID-19 is looking to surpass car accidents.
Everyone has the potential to catch Covid whereas a much smaller percentage of people drive. So 17,000 accidents per day out of how many drivers? If we’re looking at odds, we have to look at the pool of candidates.
And you’re also missing the point....if you don’t have Covid you are no risk to give it to someone else....and what percentage of people have it? A small percentage. Whereas everyone who is on the road is a risk of causing an accident. It’s apples and oranges.
Come on be smarter than that ... 1) you don’t need to be a driver to be in an accident, passengers can still be injured and killed, 2) people are staying home and taking extraordinary precautions yet are still getting COVID-19 at this rate (in fact insurance companies are seeing fewer accident claims due to this), and 3) when you pass as many or more cars on the road that people that you contact. If you want to adjust the numbers for driving then adjust the numbers to include probable COVID cases (estimates are than there may be 10 - 20 times as many cases as detected.
But to humor you, even if half of the US are drivers then the rate would be 6 million accidents/165 million, which be 3.6%. So let’s assume 3.6% of the entire 330 million US population gets COVID. That equals around 12 million rounded up or 1 million per month. What does 1 million per month come to per day...33,333. So more people will be diagnosed tomorrow with COVID than the per day rate of accidents in the US if spread out over just half of the population.
Epidemiologists estimate around 70% of US would need to be infected for herd immunity. God forbid that happens because that is around 231 million. That’s 38 years worth of 6 million accidents per year. The attitude that COVID is no worse than the flu or will be less prevalent than car accidents or claim fewer lives than drownings is the shortsighted and selfish attitude that will make people feel comfortable to let there guard down and make the situation dramatically worse that any of those risks.
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What you cannot comprehend is that 1 accident doesn’t lead to multiple accidents but 1 infection can lead to many. One out of 3711 passengers on the Diamond Princess had COVID-19. That single infection lead to 711 others getting COVID on that ship. Some of those people never even physically encountered the original infected passenger. So only 0.03% of the passenger initially had it yet 712, or 19%, of the passengers eventually got it.
In another example, 1 person in a choir practice infected 53 others out of 61. So 1.6% of group lead to 87% getting infected.
Very small percentages of infection can compound to much larger percentages. You don’t have to believe me, just know that never before has every state shut schools down and 46 of 50 states had some form of business closure or stay at home order before in order to curb the risk due to car accidents. It is uniformly understood that COVID poses a higher risk that a car accident simply by the unprecedented changes to our daily live that were imposed.
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How many times am I going to read on this board people comparing state college to "Florida?" I'm amazed at how many don't understand state college is a town, and Florida is a whole state.
I’m not going to keep this going, but your number regarding drivers is looking at total drivers...not every driver is on the road at the same time. There are far fewer people on the road at any given time than total drivers and there’s no way to know how many that is, so it can’t be compared.
All good points. Apparently the changes to our daily lives isn’t working all that well. Is it worth it is the question.
Point? We also haven't closed highways.
I don't think anybody denies the risk of covid. It's more of a discussion about how we live with it.
The point is that if we underestimate the risk then that impacts what we do to live with it. Plenty underestimate the risk either because they believe they won’t get it or that it will be mild for them.
Doesn’t seem to matter what we do...36 out of 50 states are on the rise and not all of those states are open for business.
Do you have a citation for this assertion? Or, if it's just your own belief, upon what data/info is it based?
The states that aren’t increasing are either in the Northeast, where it is being taken more seriously since they experienced it firsthand, or a couple states in the Midwest that have fewer large cities.
The worst areas are in places where people poo-pooed it in favor to get the economy running again. They ignore common sense while reopening and squander all the advantages they had.
That's probably true. Plenty also underestimate the risks of keeping the economy closed. Disrupting education, business closures, loss of insurance, stress, etc. I personally think that the riots were due in part to built up frustration and unemployment caused by the shutdown.
I'm not trying to convince anybody that they should think like me. I'm just encouraging people to take a balanced approach.
Both. The average age for infected people is declining, yet the total number of cases is increasing. As an example, Florida the average age has dropped to 35 from above 65 earlier in March/April but they are experiencing peak cases.
And despite stores still advertising that face masks are required, I see only about 50 - 70% enter stores with them. That they aren’t willing to continue something easy that they did just a few weeks prior tells me their concern is pretty low.
I can agree with that...a shutdown has to be the last thing we reach for, which means we should be eager to wear masks and to stay distanced so that we can stay open. What is good for preventing the spread while we are open is good for the economy.
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anon_xdc8rmuek44eq
Guest
Yep, the civil liberties argument to not wear in a store or public is a red herring.
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