Supposedly the online version will go out next Monday and the print edition the following Friday.
OT: FYI, JZ says Newsweek article is still a go. (edit: Story now spiked)
- Thread starter MtNittany
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Supposedly the online version will go out next Monday and the print edition the following Friday.
I think there is a chance that if Joe Paterno had been charged, he may have attempted to flip on Curley and Schultz. Remember he become convinced the "old main had screwed it up", though it was likely due to him having his memory "refreshed" by McQueary or even his son Scott rather than him actually remembering what went down in 2001.
I have to believe MM to believe the "Old Main screwed it up" quote, don't I?
True, can't trust anything MM says. Though its believable that Joe would have said something like that to MM in 2011. The AOG was telling Joe that Jerry was a pedophile. MM was telling Joe that Jerry was a pedophile. Scott Paterno was telling Joe that Jerry was a pedophile. Joe had no reason to question it and had to been absolutely devastated by the news. Like all of us Penn Staters, looked for scapegoats.
I always thought it was a desperate attempt of MM's to try to get heat off JVP out of a sense of guilt.
Is that the right quote? Didn't he also tell Mike that he couldn't trust Old Main?
I agree with all of this--but it became a witch hunt pretty quickly on. That's why I figure they would have tried to charge him.... There were a number of folks demanding that, unfortunately.
BOB........
If you will recall, at the Linda Kelly press conference to announce Spanier's arrest, she was directly asked that question. Her response was not a firm "no" or "yes", but, rather, that Coach Paterno is deceased. So, she planted it in everyone's heads that if Joe was alive, he very well would have been arrested. At least, I think that was her intention.
Perhaps because they needed to lay the foundation for this PSU "conspiracy" and it would have been difficult to believe without JVP being involved. Frightening what the OAG can do to innocent people.
I would say that it is frightening to realize what Corbett and the OAG actually DID to innocent people. If it happened to them, it could happen to you.
If the worst about C/S/S was true, doesn't it make sense that they would have wanted to keep Joe in the dark?
Corbett would later say that firing Joe may have been a mistake. Cynically, I always took that to mean that the "plan" to get us to move on would have worked had Joe's name not been unfairly dragged through the mud. So my question is why was it necessary to involve Joe in the first place?
Why did Corbett send Noonan out there to assassinate Joe's character, when Joe had not been a target of the investigation and was clearly a witness for the prosecution? Was the pretext for canning Spanier, his refusal to fire Joe? Was involving Joe intended to turn the whole thing into a media circus? Was it all just a ruse to keep prying eyes away from TSM?
PSU could have and should have come to Joe's defense. If not initially, certainly after his death. The Freeh report could have easily left Joe out of it, and still hammered C/S/S. It wasn't like Joe was going to be able to speak on their behalf.
They could have, but they would have been incorrect.
Furthermore, Spanier was indicted in 2012. In 2013, Fina gave the interview in which he said there was no evidence that Paterno did anything wrong, which pokes a hole in your theory.
http://www.pennlive.com/midstate/index.ssf/2013/09/jerry_sandusky_prosecutor_no_e.html
While I think Fina is a piece of filth, he would have no reason to put that lie on national TV.
Spanier being charged was always part of the plan. In Erickson's notes after he became PSU President he states the Corbett strategy was to have Curley and Schultz flip on Spanier. The only problem was that Curley and Schultz didn't elect to flip.
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In hindsight, it ended up being the worst thing for Joe Paternos legacy that Mike McQueary and the OAG were actually praising him in 2011. If McQueary had even hinted that fear of Joe was a reason he didn’t pursue his Sandusky complaint further, or if the OAG had actually accused Joe of perjury or taking part in a cover up, maybe Scott Paterno and Wick Sollers would actually have put some effort into refuting the ever changing testimony of McQueary or exposing the unethical practices of the OAG. Instead we end up with the very PC “Paterno Report”, which did absolutely nothing to sway public opinion
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Those emails completely exonerate JVP. Tim wrote:
"...After giving it more thought and talking it over with Joe yesterday – I am uncomfortable with what we agreed were the next steps. I am having trouble with going to everyone, but the person involved. I think I would be more comfortable meeting with the person and tell him about the information we received...."
Forget that Tim said that he was giving it more thought before he spoke with Joe.
Forget that Tim repeatedly said "I". He never said "Joe is uncomfortable", or We are uncomfortable.
Forget that Tim referenced "we" in "what we agreed were the next steps". Who are "we"? C/S/S! Not Joe Paterno.
The most important word in the entire email is "everyone". "Everyone, but the person involved" means the exact opposite of 'anyone, but the person involved'. We are told to believe that Tim was saying he was uncomfortable telling anyone other than Jerry. Thus, he supposedly had proposed that no outside report should have been made. That's not what he said at all. In fact, he was saying that he was uncomfortable telling everyone except Sandusky. He was saying he didn't like going behind Jerry's back and wanted to bring him into the loop.
'Anyone' is exclusive, while 'everyone' is inclusive.
The entire narrative falls apart with that one word....everyone.
For $8 million, does anyone really think Louis Freeh didn't know this?
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I don't disagree with that. My point is that Spanier was largely charged based on those emails. Freeh assigned guilt to them all and especially JVP, saying that the plan changed after Tim met with JVP. OAG could have taken that same approach as Freeh. I am not saying it would have been correct.
For the same reason there won't be a "Klages" movie! Despite having a 1000000x more culpability.
HBO wouldn’t be the right vehicle for a klages movie. She needs to be on the big screen.
Exactly. This is pure fiction being passed off as "based on a true story" in an attempt for financial gain. Nobody gives a crap about Curley, Shultz, Spanier, Dranov, Raykovitz, etc. Even former governor Corbett. The way to make money is to disparage Paterno.
I would hope that the Paterno family sues for defamation. They'd have to drop the case because HBO will claim in fine print that the story is fiction but at least they would have to go on record.
Maybe it has something to do with treating defense arguments as though they’re fact? They’re legal arguments that fit certain criteria not holy scripture.
Part of Sandusky’s appeal for a new trial is presenting an argument that wasn’t used at trial. RMT is essentially a stock defense in this type of case with professional experts always willing to take the stand for any defendant.
Look at this excerpt from Ziegler’s interview with Sandusky in early March of 2013:
Jerry: You read some books and things you understand why.
John: Why do you think that is? What’s your explanation?
Jerry: You have to read the book, Victims of Memory, and then, I’ve written my version of what that book meant relative to what happened to me, what transpired, when one person started the whole thing, the young man from Lock Haven.
The RMT defense was crafted out necessity by Sandusky and his lawyers using a book.
As far as porn, if 90% are found with porn on their computer that leaves 10% that aren’t. Plus Sandusky had two years to get rid of whatever he may have had stashed.
Complaining about being referred to as the ‘free Jerry crowd’ is a perfect example of the aforementioned intellectual dishonesty. For five years it’s been a one sided fight by definition. One side is creating and arguing whatever they can out of desperation. The other has to sit there consistently pointing to things that are often ignored or dismissed without supporting logic.
None of this stopped the Judge in the Spanier trial from digging up the deceased guy and letting a bus run him over one more time.
Offering more evidence that this was an orchestrated hit job on Joe and CSS.
Who wrote Victims of Memory? Oh yeah....hmmm, a man who was accused (may be falsely, have no idea) of abuse by his daughters and he still has no relationship with them today I believe. Then he writes another book on Jerry's behalf as the objective bystander (wink, wink). So Jerry reads his book mentions it to JZ, and poof a new book is out there proclaiming Jerry is the real victim here. Correct me if I'm wrong @L.T. Young but didn't the prosecution poopoo the RMT defense during the trial, yet some here are still claiming it as the savior.
A trade-off with Surma perhaps...
Wow, you actually acknowledged the possibility of a false accusation. That’s some real growth right there.
He was never convicted nor charged...unlike JS. Funny thing how these people all hooked up....almost like someone was promoting a theory...nahhh. Birds of a feather....
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I tend to agree. Corbett to Surma: "I'll give you Paterno, if you give me Spanier."
Victim 7 admitted he previously though highly of Sandusky but needed therapy to remember his abuse. Matt Sandusky also at one point seemed to believe his memories of abuse were recovered by therapy (he previously said the testimony of victim 4 refreshed his memory), but later claim he just “stopped being a coward”. It’s very likely his interview with Pendergrast is what led him to once again change his story. Pendergrast and Ziegler disagree on the role of RMT in the saga. Mark believes at least some accusers have created false memories of abuse via therapy, while Ziegler believes the recovered memories are only an excuse the accusers used for why they changed their stories so significantly.
I think Corbett throwing Joe under the bus was the result of panicking in the face of an unexpected media firestorm. Corbett had to know going after Joe was the worst thing a PA Republican could do, he just was confident Joe would be unscathed by the whole scandal. After all, Sara Ganim and the OAG was calling Joe a hero right after the arrest. He obviously underestimated how much the national sports media hated PSU and Paterno.
Though many in the field believe repressed memory therapy to be garbage (and it may well be), I have to admit to viewing his book with a little more skepticism now knowing his past. One thing is reasonably certain, and that is his book will not change the narrative one bit, and in fact will, right or wrong, only serve to cement it.
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