PSU @ OSU - Feb 19
- Thread starter backdrft76
- Start date
I'm a little surprised since we are losing to Illinois
125- Suriano dec Piotrowski 3-0
133- Duncan tech Carpenter (RS pulled for upset of century) 3-5
141- Richards dec Gulibon 3-8
149- Zain tech Barone 8-8
157- Nolf tech Langenderfer 13-8
165- Martinez pin Joseph (Joseph goes for throw and gets pinned) 13-14
174- Brunson dec Hall (Brunson beat Meyer!) 13-17
184- Nickal dec Parker 16-17
197- Cutch dec Lee 19-17
Hwt- Black dec Nevills (See: 2016 result) 19-20
125- Suriano dec Piotrowski 3-0
133- Duncan tech Carpenter (RS pulled for upset of century) 3-5
141- Richards dec Gulibon 3-8
149- Zain tech Barone 8-8
157- Nolf tech Langenderfer 13-8
165- Martinez pin Joseph (Joseph goes for throw and gets pinned) 13-14
174- Brunson dec Hall (Brunson beat Meyer!) 13-17
184- Nickal dec Parker 16-17
197- Cutch dec Lee 19-17
Hwt- Black dec Nevills (See: 2016 result) 19-20
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hmm, I thought the NWCA tweet from Jan. 25th indicated that NBCSN would be broadcasting the Championship.
LOL, NWCA on Flo, a match made in heaven.
Pyles once memorably told me to educate myself when I was speculatively tweeting about broadcast rights & the broadcast business, but with so much of that education private info, I don't really know how to. Beyond asking. Dice hooked me up a good bit with background on Flo & Escape the Rock, and that was helpful, so I'll try something similar.
Observations, with open solicitation for fact-checking / corrections when I've got something jacked:
- Last year sometime, OkSt made some biz deal with Flo to be exclusive broadcaster of their home duals
- Last year, the NWCA BCS thingy proved pretty loose in how matchups & pretty much all arrangements were made. See: Dresser, Kevin and Brands, Oranges.
- I think I remember hearing Dresser on Short Time saying how the Hokie AD hooked him up with a charter flight to Ann Arbor, after it was sloppily determined that Tech was to face Michigan, and not Iowa. Seems to indicate to me that teams themselves were mostly responsible for travel (not uncommon), but no idea if or how much the NWCA kicked in, for anything.
- Flo has a pretty famous longstanding beef with the NWCA and Mike Moyer
- Flo's personalities notably went completely dark ahead of the NWCA Allstar Meet last Fall. No mentions on their site and no discussion on twitter, unless I missed it. I hope I did.
- Nowhere in Pyles' release is "NWCA" listed or named.
- Only on the Flo Pro Event Page is "NWCA Bowl Series" mentioned
Speculation:
- Cael/Donghia/PSU & John Smith/OkSt began making arrangements, even tho the Dual Season is not complete, so PSU could book their travel
- Smith/OkSt reminded that OkSt has home dual video broadcast deal with Flo; PSU didn't fight it
- PSU probably insisted that Byers can still do the audio & that PSU can still stream it for free; Flo probably didn't fight that
- NWCA probably has some naming rights/brand arrangement as to the name of the event; Flo probably didn't or can't fight that in its actual event site, but it clearly is not going to go out of its way to reference the naming #brand in all of its correspondence
End results:
- NWCA made some event, however loosely arranged with respect to rules/structure, gets have all the duals use that name/brand
- PSU & OkSt cut to the chase, to get a jump on travel
- Because of OkSt's prior agreement with Flo, PSU fans must pay Flo to watch the PSU-OkSt dual
What do you guys think? If any of that above is utter horseshit, pretend they're written as questions, and hook us up with answers pretty please? Or corrections, if it's more fun to call out an internet speculator.
Pyles once memorably told me to educate myself when I was speculatively tweeting about broadcast rights & the broadcast business, but with so much of that education private info, I don't really know how to. Beyond asking. Dice hooked me up a good bit with background on Flo & Escape the Rock, and that was helpful, so I'll try something similar.
Observations, with open solicitation for fact-checking / corrections when I've got something jacked:
- Last year sometime, OkSt made some biz deal with Flo to be exclusive broadcaster of their home duals
- Last year, the NWCA BCS thingy proved pretty loose in how matchups & pretty much all arrangements were made. See: Dresser, Kevin and Brands, Oranges.
- I think I remember hearing Dresser on Short Time saying how the Hokie AD hooked him up with a charter flight to Ann Arbor, after it was sloppily determined that Tech was to face Michigan, and not Iowa. Seems to indicate to me that teams themselves were mostly responsible for travel (not uncommon), but no idea if or how much the NWCA kicked in, for anything.
- Flo has a pretty famous longstanding beef with the NWCA and Mike Moyer
- Flo's personalities notably went completely dark ahead of the NWCA Allstar Meet last Fall. No mentions on their site and no discussion on twitter, unless I missed it. I hope I did.
- Nowhere in Pyles' release is "NWCA" listed or named.
- Only on the Flo Pro Event Page is "NWCA Bowl Series" mentioned
Speculation:
- Cael/Donghia/PSU & John Smith/OkSt began making arrangements, even tho the Dual Season is not complete, so PSU could book their travel
- Smith/OkSt reminded that OkSt has home dual video broadcast deal with Flo; PSU didn't fight it
- PSU probably insisted that Byers can still do the audio & that PSU can still stream it for free; Flo probably didn't fight that
- NWCA probably has some naming rights/brand arrangement as to the name of the event; Flo probably didn't or can't fight that in its actual event site, but it clearly is not going to go out of its way to reference the naming #brand in all of its correspondence
End results:
- NWCA made some event, however loosely arranged with respect to rules/structure, gets have all the duals use that name/brand
- PSU & OkSt cut to the chase, to get a jump on travel
- Because of OkSt's prior agreement with Flo, PSU fans must pay Flo to watch the PSU-OkSt dual
What do you guys think? If any of that above is utter horseshit, pretend they're written as questions, and hook us up with answers pretty please? Or corrections, if it's more fun to call out an internet speculator.
LOL, all the above totally excludes the NWCA Track promise of streaming, that Tom just posted.
Revision: Flo still has the OkSt deal, so is just trying to use it to get more people to buy Flo Pro, even though people can totally watch it on Track/NBCSN. Makes this line in Pyles' release extra funny: "The only place to watch the dual live is on FloWrestling."
I had serious problems with this back in the day, but Flo has upgraded its customer service signficantly in the past few days. The last five or six times (before I bit the bullet and bought an annual subscription), I canceled and reupped without any problem.
Careful. My earlier post was just wondering if NBCSN wasn't covering the Championship dual.
From the article embedded in the Tweet that I posted, all of the National Duals will be covered by the TrackWrestling Dashboard, which is far different than TV or video streaming. As far as video streaming, the only National Duals that TrackWrestling will stream are those being held at:
- Mizzou
- Cornell
- Lehigh
- App State
The Flo article linked by the OP closes with:
"The only place to watch the dual live is on FloWrestling."
I'll take them at face value, as they don't have a track record of making inaccurate claims. Pure speculation, but it's possible that Flo will have the Dual Championship live, while NBCSN will have it on TV on delay. I checked the NBCSN TV schedule for 2/19, and they indicate they'll have College Wrestling on from 4 - 6 pm EST.
Confusing: after the 174 match, shouldn't the score be 13-17; after 184, it would be 16-17; after 197, 16-20; and after Hwt, 16-23.
I really did mess that one up along the way. And had Lee/Cutch reversed for whatever reason. Thanks. Edited. STILL A LOSS! Still figuring out how they lose to Maryland.
I realize there is some apples to oranges between last year and this year, in that the National Dual Meet Championship Series title event was held at PSU last year and will be held at Ok. St. this year, and that since that time Flo has signed contracts with Ok. St., and NWCA may have signed additional contracts related to the National Duals.
Ignoring all the apples to oranges for a minute, I just wanted to point out that last year's National Duals title event was broadcast live by BTN.
Ignoring all the apples to oranges for a minute, I just wanted to point out that last year's National Duals title event was broadcast live by BTN.
Really stinks this isn't on TV for free. That is all.
So what will be televised on NBCSN on the 19th at 3 pm CST then? Trying to make sense of this....
The fact this is not available for free is absurd if they want to try and get more exposure. Only hardcore fans know what Flo is and are willing to pay $20 for 1 dual.... and this is not a knock of Flo, I understand they gotta make money and have a contract. Just pointing out having a "championship" that people have to sign up and pay for goes against spreading the sport theme
Tom, any knowledge on tickets? Does PSU get an allotment or is this all controlled by OSU? Guessing it would be the same model as last year, but I don't know what that is.
I'm certainly looking at driving up to Stillwater to watch the dual, but would feel better with tickets in hand.
I'm certainly looking at driving up to Stillwater to watch the dual, but would feel better with tickets in hand.
They'll need to lose to Maryland too. Let's see your predictions for that one. Fyi, McCoy has exhausted his eligibility.
I'm pretty sure it's treated as home dual for Ok. St. I don't know their model for tickets. It appears that you can call their ticket office at (877) ALL-4-OSU, and their hours are 8 am - 5 pm, Mon. - Fri.
Not sure if you are referring to the fact that it would be worth $15 to watch or something else, but LemonPie is on point here. Track streaming events are now either $9.99 or $14.99 per event to watch - it is up to the event host (who shares in the revenues).
For those of you who may not have noticed, Track was purchased by SportsEngine - part of the NBCSports group - in July. They have added content to their site - so essentially Flo and Track are attempting to provide the same services through similar platforms now. Big change from just a year or two ago when the prevailing opinion (one I didn't share) on wrestling message boards was the battle brewing was between DarthFlo and big-hearted Track.
This is all good news for wrestling from my seat. People have to make money and the more people that can from providing wrestling content, the more content we continue to have access to.
So, meet begins at 2pm eastern? Then on NBCsports on delay at 4pm eastern? Trying to figure it out. There MIGHT be a couple sports bars here in SC who will televise live, from what I'm hearing.
Floor reserved tickets are $20, 200-300 level tickets are all general admission, $10. Season ticket holders did not get 1st choice to buy their seats-according to our ticket office, that was set by NWCA. Sucks, but that is apparently the way they do it. Dual will start at 2:00 Central.
So, the match apparently will be televised on a one hour delay. What's the deal? Flo can sue anyone who wants to televise it live?
Far from ideal, but I can make a 1 hour TV delay work. Rather do that than go through the hassle of subscribing to Flo to see one dual and then cancelling.
Gotta say, some of the things that Flo promotes as newsworthy seem somewhat tabloid-like.
I would like them better if the moved away from the occasional "National Inquirer" approach and make their stories embody more of the tradition of wrestling.
That, and let's stop calling JH & HS kids "All-Americans", especially when more than 1/2 of these "next big things" never AA in college. Not sure which tournament started this, but it was surely done for marketing purposes.
I feel better now...had to get that out!
I would like them better if the moved away from the occasional "National Inquirer" approach and make their stories embody more of the tradition of wrestling.
That, and let's stop calling JH & HS kids "All-Americans", especially when more than 1/2 of these "next big things" never AA in college. Not sure which tournament started this, but it was surely done for marketing purposes.
I feel better now...had to get that out!
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I suggest that Flo move the match to a hidden location somewhere on the Texarcana border...like a speakeasy. Nobody knows until the day of the meet...word of mouth only. Secret guest list at the door, not on the list? You don't get in.
Or subscribing to Flo to see the event, but waste your time and money staring at a black screen for the first three matches.
I remember that thread awhile back, Track charging $15 for that one event. From the press releases, the only things we have to go on so far, there's still a ton of questions:
- Does "exclusive coverage" cover more than one distribution channel (Web vs Cable), or can two different companies claim "exclusive" if one is broadcasting web video/audio and another is broadcasting on cable TV? The Iowa at OkSt Dual was streamed for $ on Flo, but broadcast on regional cable TV on Fox for free.
- What time will the PSU-OkSt Dual be held:
a. In the arena?
b. Broadcast on Flo Web $$?
c. Broadcast on NBCSN TV Free (* if that channel's on your cable package; I acknowledge that you already 'paid' for it)
- Will Track charge for its web streams of the other duals, at Lehigh, Mizzou, App St? Their press releases on their own site and on USA Wrestling (which vary slightly, notably about the 'title dual') seemed to indicate they would be free, but I'm not sure, which fed my reply to Pie.
- What the hell did BATS-TOI pay for to Track or NWCA as a sponsor of the Title Dual, if Track/NBCSN is NOT broadcasting it, on either web stream or cable tv channels?
While I'm with you on the general premise that More Content Providers might = Better for Wrestling, I'm not yet quite sure about it here. My interest in clarity are these:
1. Personal interest in learning about broadcast rights, which I'm largely ignorant about.
2. Interest on behalf of the Wrestling Community, as to what its true viewing options for this singular dual are.
3. Curious about Flo's marketing language, against the backdrop of those true viewing options.
For those of you who grew up in the 70s, you'll get this.
We need Spyker to go to Gallagher Iba with a camera under his coat, record the dual surreptitiously, then upload it quickly.
Like Rerun in What's Happening secretly recording the Doobie Brothers concert at their school.
Just don't get caught like Rerun - he ended up getting scolded by the band
We need Spyker to go to Gallagher Iba with a camera under his coat, record the dual surreptitiously, then upload it quickly.
Like Rerun in What's Happening secretly recording the Doobie Brothers concert at their school.
Just don't get caught like Rerun - he ended up getting scolded by the band
The answers to many of these questions would require looking at the contracts themselves and that's not going to happen here.
The term "exclusive rights," to borrow from the "bundle of sticks" analogy, might not necessarily mean all the sticks, it might merely mean the right to broadcast live. It can have legal import in the context of a contract, but we hear it more in a marketing context; when I hear the term I don't typically presume much by it. But I wouldn't imagine that Company A would be using the term if Company B has rights to simultaneously broadcast on a separate distribution channel.
I too am curious what BATS-TOI (thought they) paid for. Also curious why they thought it was a good idea to call their company/product BATS-TOI; reads like an acronym for baseball statistic I couldn't possibly care about.
Fair enough, thanks! Like you, I don't have any expectations of learning about the actual business contracts. But I think through the process of typing out all my questions, I got to the most important one:
What are the viewing options available to the Wrestling Community?
1. Time: Live vs Tape-Delay Broadcast vs On-demand later
2. Cost: Free or Fee
3. Channel: Web stream or TV
Flo is incentivized to provide the community only their option of viewing it. I hope we can learn what other options exist.
