Question for our Buckeye friends. What are your thoughts on Joe Paterno?

[ChiTownLion]

Question for our Buckeye friends. What are your thoughts on Joe Paterno?

And, by extension, what are your thoughts on Greg Schiano, Larry Johnson and the man who employs them, Urban Meyer? Thanks. Looking forward to another great game on Saturday.

 

[tOSU_fan]

Question for our Buckeye friends. What are your thoughts on Joe Paterno?

And, by extension, what are your thoughts on Greg Schiano, Larry Johnson and the man who employs them, Urban Meyer? Thanks. Looking forward to another great game on Saturday.

I think Joe Paterno is a legend, and I cannot believe that he would have known anything of what happened at PSU that has now set you guys back. Frankly, I think it was unfair to punish the athletes due to the terrible crimes committed and I think the whole situation probably (sadly) hastened JoePa's death. That was a sad day.

I can only speak to the coaching of LJ and Schiano, but they've been kick-a$$ as far as I can tell. Of course, changing from zone to man coverage is a pretty easy call when you've got tons of athletic talent to deal with.

I think Meyer is also going to be a legend, as will Saban. They're both masterminds with recruiting both athletes and coaches, not to mention the culture they instill in their respective programs. I was surprised at the Franklin hire for PSU and part of me sort of hopes the season doesn't end well for you, but only because I don't think he's the right fit at PSU - he just isn't gritty enough for Linebacker U. Sorry for the novel. Here's to a good game on Saturday night.

 

[LafayetteBear]

That was a nice post from tOSU_fan, but I have a sinking feeling that this thread will not end well.

 

[tOSU_fan]

That was a nice post from tOSU_fan, but I have a sinking feeling that this thread will not end well.

Thanks. I generally don't like to troll other fanbases' forums, but I do enjoy reading the thoughts from the fans of the rest of the B1G teams. I really don't know how anyone could feel animosity toward JoePa: He was truly the last of a generation of legendary coaches that I'm not sure we will see again. Best of luck Saturday - here's to hoping the B1G refs get their shit together for Saturday. They were horrible for both tOSU and UW yesterday.

 

[Bob78]

I think Joe Paterno is a legend, and I cannot believe that he would have known anything of what happened at PSU that has now set you guys back. Frankly, I think it was unfair to punish the athletes due to the terrible crimes committed and I think the whole situation probably (sadly) hastened JoePa's death. That was a sad day.

I can only speak to the coaching of LJ and Schiano, but they've been kick-a$$ as far as I can tell. Of course, changing from zone to man coverage is a pretty easy call when you've got tons of athletic talent to deal with.

I think Meyer is also going to be a legend, as will Saban. They're both masterminds with recruiting both athletes and coaches, not to mention the culture they instill in their respective programs. I was surprised at the Franklin hire for PSU and part of me sort of hopes the season doesn't end well for you, but only because I don't think he's the right fit at PSU - he just isn't gritty enough for Linebacker U. Sorry for the novel. Here's to a good game on Saturday night.

Thanks for the response.

I think Meyer has proven himself to be one of the all-timers already. I'm one who hopes Franklin has great success and stays here long enough to become grittier! He'll have some staff turnover every year or two most likely, so the quality of his hires will help to determine his fate.

I apologize in advance for the temporary hijacking of the thread's original question, but with a reasonable poster from Ohio State, I want to take the chance and ask this question below.

Question regarding Meyer's style:
From what you've heard and observed, does Meyer tend to delegate to his assistants more, or is he rather deeply involved in each position / coaching area to a large extent?
I get the impression based on observing from afar that he tends to hire coaches who he feels can handle their area of responsibility well, and then lets them coach and play to their strengths. This leaves him much more time for overall strategy and game planning. Not saying he is hands-off, just seems to me that he trusts the coaches and gives them the chance to be their best. This is based on watching him on TV and on the sidelines when he has been to PSU, and listening to a handful of
press conferences and interviews.
By contrast, I've always had the impression that Saban is deeply involved with each individual coaching area. Same basis for that impression. Both could be way off base.
I believe JVP was deeply into each area early on, but gradually eased back as his assistants proved their success over the long term. His assistants were far more loyal and long-tenured than at most schools. They reached a comfort level that was at times great for the program's success, and then later was probably a factor in becoming relatively slow to adapt to changes and trends, especially on offense.

 

[psu00]

That was a nice post from tOSU_fan, but I have a sinking feeling that this thread will not end well.

Yeah. What could possibly go wrong?

 

[tOSU_fan]

Thanks for the response. I think Meyer has proven himself to be one of the all-timers already. I'm one who hopes Franklin has great success and stays here long enough to become grittier! He'll have some staff turnover every year or two most likely, so the quality of his hires will help to determine his fate.

Question regarding Meyer's style:
From what you've heard and observed, does Meyer tend to delegate to his assistants more, or is he rather deeply involved in each position / coaching area to a large extent?
I get the impression based on observing from afar that he tends to hire coaches who he feels can handle their area of responsibility well, and then lets them coach and play to their strengths. This leaves him much more time for overall strategy and game planning. Not saying he is hands-off, just seems to me that he trusts the coaches and gives them the chance to be their best. This is based on watching him on TV and on the sidelines when he has been to PSU, and listening to a handful of
press conferences and interviews.
By contrast, I've always had the impression that Saban is deeply involved with each individual coaching area. Same basis for that impression. Both could be way off base.
I believe JVP was deeply into each area early on, but gradually eased back as his assistants proved their success over the long term. His assistants were far more loyal and long-tenured than at most schools. They reached a comfort level that was at times great for the program's success, and then later was probably a factor in becoming relatively slow to adapt to changes and trends, especially on offense.

I think you're spot on Bob78. I think Meyer keeps close to his QBs, but outside of that I think he has a good eye for finding talented coaches for each unit. He then allows them to thrive in that area, giving him time to create the culture he wants and pull it all together. That's likely why so many of his assistants go on to become head coaches: They're already talented but they learn the higher-level stuff from him.

On the other hand, Saban seems to hold the reigns a little tighter. It's likely just personality, but while they're successful, I'm not sure his assistants get the same level of mentoring that UM's assistants get. I'm trying not to be a homer; that's just my honest opinion from being a bit of an obsessed CFB fan.

 

[Agoodnap]

Yeah. What could possibly go wrong?

Oh good God! LMFAOROTF!

 

[Peetz Pool Boy]

I think you're spot on Bob78. I think Meyer keeps close to his QBs, but outside of that I think he has a good eye for finding talented coaches for each unit. He then allows them to thrive in that area, giving him time to create the culture he wants and pull it all together. That's likely why so many of his assistants go on to become head coaches: They're already talented but they learn the higher-level stuff from him.

On the other hand, Saban seems to hold the reigns a little tighter. It's likely just personality, but while they're successful, I'm not sure his assistants get the same level of mentoring that UM's assistants get. I'm trying not to be a homer; that's just my honest opinion from being a bit of an obsessed CFB fan.

I agree. Meyer is a great football CEO. Saban used to be just a "great coach", but he's now a great coach and CEO.

Franklin???

 

[tOSU_fan]

BTW, if you guys are ever interested in a good tOSU forum to lurk on, elevenwarriors.com is the least a-hole you'll find. Of course, we have our homers, but as an example, there's a whole thread where most of us elect Barkley as the best B1G running back. Of course, that seems obvious to me. If the kid had a stud O-line he'd be unstoppable. Once he turns downhill he's almost impossible to stop.

 

[tOSU_fan]

I agree. Meyer is a great football CEO. Saban used to be just a "great coach", but he's now a great coach and CEO.

Franklin???

Well, it's probably not a popular thing to say on this board, but I think Franklin has two things working against him at PSU.

(1) He doesn't "feel" B1G to me. The first thing he needs to do is secure the entire state of Pennsylvania, not to mention the wealth of talent in NY and NJ right around the corner. It can't be that hard to steal great talent from the dumpster fire that is Rutgers (I get the irony of my statement with Ash - a former Buckeye coach - being there, but it is his first year).

(2) If I remember correctly, he was a WR coach and more offensively focused. That also just doesn't feel right to me for some reason, unless he can get great assistants. I hope you don't take it as me trashing your coach, but the guy just doesn't have a very successful coaching record, and it blows my mind that PSU couldn't land someone of what I would consider higher caliber; even someone like a PJ Fleck. Although with Purdue's woes I wouldn't be surprised to see him end up there.

 

[Nashville Lion]

Well, it's probably not a popular thing to say on this board, but I think Franklin has two things working against him at PSU.

(1) He doesn't "feel" B1G to me. The first thing he needs to do is secure the entire state of Pennsylvania, not to mention the wealth of talent in NY and NJ right around the corner. It can't be that hard to steal great talent from the dumpster fire that is Rutgers (I get the irony of my statement with Ash - a former Buckeye coach - being there, but it is his first year).

(2) If I remember correctly, he was a WR coach and more offensively focused. That also just doesn't feel right to me for some reason, unless he can get great assistants. I hope you don't take it as me trashing your coach, but the guy just doesn't have a very successful coaching record, and it blows my mind that PSU couldn't land someone of what I would consider higher caliber; even someone like a PJ Fleck. Although with Purdue's woes I wouldn't be surprised to see him end up there.

With all due respect....his recruiting is not the issue. He inherited a dumpster fire at PSU....3 years ago he was mentioned for every coaching job in America...Southern Cal, Texas, etc. I was happy to see him come to PSU. our fanbase has to be patient with coach Franklin. Time will tell...but recruiting is not the job. Coaching during games is more of a question mark to me. I am impressed that he brought in two new coaches in Limegrover and Moorhead. Those were two good hires in my opinion.

 

[tOSU_fan]

With all due respect....his recruiting is not the issue. He inherited a dumpster fire at PSU....3 years ago he was mentioned for every coaching job in America...Southern Cal, Texas, etc. I was happy to see him come to PSU. our fanbase has to be patient with coach Franklin. Time will tell...but recruiting is not the job. Coaching during games is more of a question mark to me. I am impressed that he brought in two new coaches in Limegrover and Moorhead. Those were two good hires in my opinion.

You could totally be right: I only have an outsider's opinion on it. I like to see PSU be tough, and if Franklin is the guy then I hope it works out. I'm not the kind of tOSU fan that thinks losing to PSU, UW, MSU, or UM is a death sentence (although I admit dreading the latter). There isn't a good intellectual reason for my feeling on Franklin - it's just my gut.

 

[michnittlion]

BTW, if you guys are ever interested in a good tOSU forum to lurk on, elevenwarriors.com is the least a-hole you'll find. Of course, we have our homers, but as an example, there's a whole thread where most of us elect Barkley as the best B1G running back. Of course, that seems obvious to me. If the kid had a stud O-line he'd be unstoppable. Once he turns downhill he's almost impossible to stop.

11Warriors --- I think that's the best team-oriented college football blog out there. They run a good site.

 

[ChiTownLion]

Perhaps our fanbases can work together one day and put this POS back where he belongs -- in a dumpster. Maybe when College GameDay grows the balls to show up on campus with Mushmouth in tow.

 

[psute]

[QUOTE="tOSU_fan, post: 2372811, member: 77033"]I think you're spot on Bob78. I think Meyer keeps close to his QBs, but outside of that I think he has a good eye for finding talented coaches for each unit. He then allows them to thrive in that area, giving him time to create the culture he wants and pull it all together. That's likely why so many of his assistants go on to become head coaches: They're already talented but they learn the higher-level stuff from him.

On the other hand, Saban seems to hold the reigns a little tighter. It's likely just personality, but while they're successful, I'm not sure his assistants get the same level of mentoring that UM's assistants get. I'm trying not to be a homer; that's just my honest opinion from being a bit of an obsessed CFB fan.[/QUOTE]


I agree 100% with the bolded, he did one hell of a job for us at Utah, set us up for success as the original BCS buster and mentored the best coach in the PAC. Whittingham took that and ran with it winning the Sugar Bowl in '08 leading to the invite to the then PAC 10, he has turned down numerous job offers from blue bloods and pro teams (puts family first) to stay and took us from a G5 to a P5 contender in three years.

To get back to how this is PSU related, Franklin IMO, is the right fit for PSU. Pa. kid. Lucky to have not been the coach who replaced a legend. Understands, respects and carries on the tradition of success with honor, and team first. Came in under crippling sanctions and has not had a losing season. Great recruiter who will have his own team in 2 years. That is when he should be judged...

 

[psuro]

Looking forward to Franklin_Restores' posts on this thread.

Or, maybe not.

 

[dbsteel]

Well, it's probably not a popular thing to say on this board, but I think Franklin has two things working against him at PSU.

(1) He doesn't "feel" B1G to me. The first thing he needs to do is secure the entire state of Pennsylvania, not to mention the wealth of talent in NY and NJ right around the corner. It can't be that hard to steal great talent from the dumpster fire that is Rutgers (I get the irony of my statement with Ash - a former Buckeye coach - being there, but it is his first year).

(2) If I remember correctly, he was a WR coach and more offensively focused. That also just doesn't feel right to me for some reason, unless he can get great assistants. I hope you don't take it as me trashing your coach, but the guy just doesn't have a very successful coaching record, and it blows my mind that PSU couldn't land someone of what I would consider higher caliber; even someone like a PJ Fleck. Although with Purdue's woes I wouldn't be surprised to see him end up there.

Franklin recruits fine, and it should get better if they start winning more. He does pretty well in the states you mentioned. The guy was handed a mess and quite frankly, the three years he has been here should be the worst of the sanctioned years. I would expect the next two, they should start the upswing. So far he has been running the program the "right way" and I think kids like playing for him. He's still only 44. We didn't need any more Bill Obrien stepping stone guys.

They weren't going to get a coach any better. I'm personally of the belief that a lot of these "geniuses" are just great recruiters. Whoever gets the players wins. At some point he will be fine because he works hard at recruiting, but the fanbase can be way too impatient to really look at where the program was. We are lucky we didn't see any 2-10 seasons. A few 6-6 years with this mess, is pretty remarkable.

 

[Woodpecker]

It can't be that hard to steal great talent from the dumpster fire that is Rutgers

I think that the greater challenge for recruiting NJ talent is Booger.

 

[Zenophile]

I think that the greater challenge for recruiting NJ talent is Booger.

 

[bdgan]

Franklin recruits fine, and it should get better if they start winning more. He does pretty well in the states you mentioned. The guy was handed a mess and quite frankly, the three years he has been here should be the worst of the sanctioned years. I would expect the next two, they should start the upswing. So far he has been running the program the "right way" and I think kids like playing for him. He's still only 44. We didn't need any more Bill Obrien stepping stone guys.

They weren't going to get a coach any better. I'm personally of the belief that a lot of these "geniuses" are just great recruiters. Whoever gets the players wins. At some point he will be fine because he works hard at recruiting, but the fanbase can be way too impatient to really look at where the program was. We are lucky we didn't see any 2-10 seasons. A few 6-6 years with this mess, is pretty remarkable.

Sorry but I think you're looking at things through blue tinted glasses.

I certainly agree that Franklin came into a tough situation and that his recruiting started out great. I also like the fact that his players seem to like him and they appear to be doing well academically. I think he made a few bad calls that could have cost us some games the last two years but overall the results are close to what could be expected. For the most part I think we are in agreement to this point. PSU definitely needed somebody that viewed this job as more than a brief stepping stone.

That said...

1. I think it's an overstatement to say we're lucky that we haven't seen 2-10 seasons. Our sanction ridden recruiting classes still had more talent than the bottom half of our opponents.
   
2. PSU was (is) still an attractive job with top facilities, a top fan base, and top pay. The brand was damaged but it's foolish to think PSU couldn't attract top coaches (I'm not saying Franklin isn't one).
3. It's fair to question PSU's recruiting. After a good start Franklin had some big losses to close out 2016 and schools like Notre Dame and Michigan have been doing better than PSU in PA and NJ. Of course there's still time left and some top talent is still available (Wade, Proctor, Anthony).

We'll have to wait and see how things go. It's a victory if Franklin gets 8 wins this year. Not so much if he only gets to 6 or 7 wins. It's a victory if he finishes out the recruiting class strong. Not so much if we can't land a top 5 player from PA, NJ, or MD.

I certainly support Franklin but I don't think tOSU_fan's comments were unreasonable. I just think Franklin needs another year and a half before we can make a fair assessment.

 

[psualum10]

Sorry but I think you're looking at things through blue tinted glasses.

I certainly agree that Franklin came into a tough situation and that his recruiting started out great. I also like the fact that his players seem to like him and they appear to be doing well academically. I think he made a few bad calls that could have cost us some games the last two years but overall the results are close to what could be expected. For the most part I think we are in agreement to this point. PSU definitely needed somebody that viewed this job as more than a brief stepping stone.

That said...

1. I think it's an overstatement to say we're lucky that we haven't seen 2-10 seasons. Our sanction ridden recruiting classes still had more talent than the bottom half of our opponents.
   
2. PSU was (is) still an attractive job with top facilities, a top fan base, and top pay. The brand was damaged but it's foolish to think PSU couldn't attract top coaches (I'm not saying Franklin isn't one).
3. It's fair to question PSU's recruiting. After a good start Franklin had some big losses to close out 2016 and schools like Notre Dame and Michigan have been doing better than PSU in PA and NJ. Of course there's still time left and some top talent is still available (Wade, Proctor, Anthony).

We'll have to wait and see how things go. It's a victory if Franklin gets 8 wins this year. Not so much if he only gets to 6 or 7 wins. It's a victory if he finishes out the recruiting class strong. Not so much if we can't land a top 5 player from PA, NJ, or MD.

I certainly support Franklin but I don't think tOSU_fan's comments were unreasonable. I just think Franklin needs another year and a half before we can make a fair assessment.

1. While you're right about maybe we wouldn't have seen 2-10 seasons it was what the media was portraying. It's probably more accurate to say we're lucky we've never seen a losing season either under O'Brien or under Franklin

2. You're extremely naïve to think many of the top coaches wanted to come here. There are others that PSU put feelers out for that had no interest in coming here because of what happened (and one that had no interest in coming here because of how we treated Joe -- you could figure out that one for yourself though it shouldn't be hard)

3. Sorta. At the beginning, Franklin could speak towards the future and rebuilding the brand and get kids to see long term. But now after two 7-6 seasons most of the top rated kids want to go to top rated programs. It's a bit harder when you have HS juniors and seniors not only get persuaded by coaches going yea he's telling you how they're going to be good yet they keep going 7-6 ... and you have coaches going yea he's not only going to not be there in 4 years when you graduate he may not even be there at the end of THIS year. Have you seen their fan base? Heck they're calling for Les Miles to be coach.

The biggest thing we needed was the fan base to be patient to let his players get to be seniors before we started judging him on his ability. That starts next year (though the schedule is much tougher).

 

[bdgan]

1. While you're right about maybe we wouldn't have seen 2-10 seasons it was what the media was portraying. It's probably more accurate to say we're lucky we've never seen a losing season either under O'Brien or under Franklin Agree

2. You're extremely naïve to think many of the top coaches wanted to come here. There are others that PSU put feelers out for that had no interest in coming here because of what happened (and one that had no interest in coming here because of how we treated Joe -- you could figure out that one for yourself though it shouldn't be hard) No school is likely to get a coach that is already coaching another top 5-10 team because that would be a lateral move at best. But I think the PSU job was still incredibly attractive. A top 10 salary, great facilities, a top 5 fan base, and a low initial expectations. Of course PSU made it really difficult on themselves by pretty much refusing to consider candidates with ties to Paterno.

3. Sorta. At the beginning, Franklin could speak towards the future and rebuilding the brand and get kids to see long term. But now after two 7-6 seasons most of the top rated kids want to go to top rated programs. It's a bit harder when you have HS juniors and seniors not only get persuaded by coaches going yea he's telling you how they're going to be good yet they keep going 7-6 ... and you have coaches going yea he's not only going to not be there in 4 years when you graduate he may not even be there at the end of THIS year. Have you seen their fan base? Heck they're calling for Les Miles to be coach. Agree, but that's what we're paying Franklin a $4.8 million salary to deal with. That's why PSU paid so much money to keep Shoop for another year.

The biggest thing we needed was the fan base to be patient to let his players get to be seniors before we started judging him on his ability. That starts next year (though the schedule is much tougher). Agree, but it's fair to look for some progress this year (W/L record and recruiting). I think the fans have been pretty patient. Attendance is still 7th in the nation in spite of higher prices to see a less competitive product.

 

[psualum10]

2. You might think that as a PSU fan ... the vast majority of coaches said otherwise. I do think we can get back there but objectively speaking we're not looked at as some powerhouse right now .... and some don't even see us as being second tier right now. Btw our facilities actually rank behind a lot of other schools ... we're actually upgrading them now just to get to where others have been. You wrote low initial expectations ... but when JF is actually probably exceeding expectations you have a vocal segment of the fanbase calling for his head lol. Lastly in a way I'm glad we haven't really had a coach with ties to Paterno. Not that I think they couldn't be good but ... just was good to find someone who was from the outside who respected Paterno, understands what he was trying to do (in regards to the Grand Experiment) and continues to follow it with his own mark on the program. Sometimes hiring from within doesn't always work out well. If you want the perfect example for that ... see Oregon. Oregon never outside hires ... they've been going downhill the last few years and now they're 2-4 I believe.

3. Franklin's salary means nothing. And it's one of the most ridiculous arguments out there. A) we were going to have to overpay for a good coach to come here and we did B) his salary is going rate as more and more high paying jobs open up ... with USC, Oregon, Texas, LSU, possibly FSU (if Jimbo goes to LSU) all vacant see how much those coaches get paid. We paid Franklin 4.8 mil/year to basically keep us afloat through the toughest sanction years which were ALWAYS going to be years 3 and 4. But people became delusional once the sanctions ended and thought this group would automatically be 9-3 or 10-2 the second it was removed and now Franklin is a horrible coach because of it. He didn't just forget how to coach when he moved from the SEC to the Big Ten.

4. The W/L record might be better (though most were calling for 8-4 before the season and we still might get there with a shot to go 9-4 after the bowl game) and recruiting was probably going to take a dip this year either way since we had a smaller class. It's going to be a chicken/egg conundrum ... you need the recruits to win ... but you need to win to get the higher rated recruits here.

 

[bdgan]

2. You might think that as a PSU fan ... the vast majority of coaches said otherwise. I do think we can get back there but objectively speaking we're not looked at as some powerhouse right now .... and some don't even see us as being second tier right now. Btw our facilities actually rank behind a lot of other schools ... we're actually upgrading them now just to get to where others have been. You wrote low initial expectations ... but when JF is actually probably exceeding expectations you have a vocal segment of the fanbase calling for his head lol. Lastly in a way I'm glad we haven't really had a coach with ties to Paterno. Not that I think they couldn't be good but ... just was good to find someone who was from the outside who respected Paterno, understands what he was trying to do (in regards to the Grand Experiment) and continues to follow it with his own mark on the program. Sometimes hiring from within doesn't always work out well. If you want the perfect example for that ... see Oregon. Oregon never outside hires ... they've been going downhill the last few years and now they're 2-4 I believe.

3. Franklin's salary means nothing. And it's one of the most ridiculous arguments out there. A) we were going to have to overpay for a good coach to come here and we did B) his salary is going rate as more and more high paying jobs open up ... with USC, Oregon, Texas, LSU, possibly FSU (if Jimbo goes to LSU) all vacant see how much those coaches get paid. We paid Franklin 4.8 mil/year to basically keep us afloat through the toughest sanction years which were ALWAYS going to be years 3 and 4. But people became delusional once the sanctions ended and thought this group would automatically be 9-3 or 10-2 the second it was removed and now Franklin is a horrible coach because of it. He didn't just forget how to coach when he moved from the SEC to the Big Ten.

4. The W/L record might be better (though most were calling for 8-4 before the season and we still might get there with a shot to go 9-4 after the bowl game) and recruiting was probably going to take a dip this year either way since we had a smaller class. It's going to be a chicken/egg conundrum ... you need the recruits to win ... but you need to win to get the higher rated recruits here.

These articles list PSU as the 13th best facilities in the country (before upgrades) and the 14th best head coaching job in the country (with sanctions still hanging over us).

I specifically said that we wouldn't be able to get a coach from another top 10 school. That's a lateral move. But we should be able to attract a top coach.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...essive-facilities-in-college-football/page/14

http://www.outkickthecoverage.com/the-top-25-jobs-in-college-football-080314


PSU has offered some top local talent that chose schools like ND and UM instead. That has nothing to do with class size. But like I said, Franklin still has time to land some top talent with the spots he has remaining.

 

[phlop87]

Getting back to the original question ... What do we think about JoePa. Personally always had a lot of respect for him as a coach. Last of the breed of long-term coaches who were the face of their university (Hayes, Schembechler, Byant, Bowden ). I don't think Joepa was part of a coverup nor do I think he tried to force this to be swept away. I do however think he knew prior to McQuerry coming to him and had convinced himself it was not his responsibility.

 

[YorkCoLion]

I have a great deal of respect for Urban Meyer and for the tOSU program. Urban was one of the few coaches who has stood up for Joe, and he attended Joes memorial service. He didn't need to do either of those things.

Link

How tOSU runs their program can be argued for and against. I personally think they can cut corners at times, but they are playing by the rules, or lack there of, like the SEC teams do. Their internet fans, however, have spewed some of the worst and vile comments towards our team, and those fans can go hang for all I care.

 

[psuro]

I do however think he knew prior to McQuerry coming to him and had convinced himself it was not his responsibility.

Well, that certainly is an interesting statement. What, pray tell, makes you make that statement? How you "think" he knew?

 

[psuro]

By the way, this thread just appeared on my Yahoo! homepage.

 

[klemman]

From a football perspective I think that Paterno is on the Mt.Rushmore of college coaches, assuming that the Mt. Rushmore of college coaches has more than 4 heads on it. Not a dis on Paterno, but there have been more college coaches than Presidents.

To me he probably should have left the game a bit earlier. While he still had some good teams in his later years, I question as to how involved he was overall. At a certain point no matter how great you are, time works against you.

Regarding the Sandusky thing. I don't believe for a moment that Paterno was OK with child molestation or would put football over allowing such a crime. Paterno did make mistakes however that are much clearer in retrospect than when you are dealing with such issues in real time. We get fooled, we give too much credit to individuals who have been with us for a long time, and I find it possible that Paterno didn't realize the full extent of the situation, although he should have.

But when you are in charge of an organization, sometimes you need to be the one to take the fall. I do think it was justifiable to fire Paterno given all the controversies.

Larry Johnson, fantastic. Schiano- too early to tell but he seems to be fitting in what as an ex-head coach could be akward. He gets points for that and the defense looks really good. As far as Meyer, I think he made some mistakes in his career which he admits to making and has worked towards changing. From a X and O, recruiting, game planning, game coach, and as a person, I've been elated having Meyer as OSU's head coach.

 

[jim cummings]

Where the king ad buck?

 

[Doc-M]

This is not a good question to ask. Not all Ohio State fans are in the know about all the nuances of Jerry Sandusky case and JoePa's part, if any, in it.

 

[BobPSU92]

This is not a good question to ask. Not all Ohio State fans are in the know about all the nuances of Jerry Sandusky case and JoePa's part, if any, in it.

That won't stop some of them from holding a strong opinion in line with the false narrative.

 

[jdoncbus]

Question for our Buckeye friends. What are your thoughts on Joe Paterno?

And, by extension, what are your thoughts on Greg Schiano, Larry Johnson and the man who employs them, Urban Meyer? Thanks. Looking forward to another great game on Saturday.

Answer 1: Joe Paterno was a legendary coach. His legacy has been tarnished by the Sandusky scandal.

Answer 2: Besides chopping wood at Rutgers & hitting a student on a bike recently; I don't know too much about Schiano. It appears he is assisting Fickell with the defense, a unit which has played well this season. I think you know the answer to Larry Johnson, a respected and outstanding defensive line coach.

I assume you are attempting to debate someone if they claim Paterno knew and did nothing about Sandusky while Schiano and Johnson worked under or with Sandusky. Just a hunch & I haven't read the entire thread.

 

[Bob78]

I have a great deal of respect for Urban Meyer and for the tOSU program. Urban was one of the few coaches who has stood up for Joe, and he attended Joes memorial service. He didn't need to do either of those things.

Link

How tOSU runs their program can be argued for and against. I personally think they can cut corners at times, but they are playing by the rules, or lack there of, like the SEC teams do. Their internet fans, however, have spewed some of the worst and vile comments towards our team, and those fans can go hang for all I care.

You are right - Meyer was very fond of JVP and Sue. His, Fickel's, and Herbie's presence at JVP's funeral ceremony spoke volumes to me.

I saw author John Bacon give a talk on PSU's campus soon after his book came out. In a conversation with him afterward, I asked him if Meyer and Northwestern's Fitzgerald shared any thoughts about JVP with him. He said they did - both held and continued to hold JVP in high regard and were very saddened by what had happened to him. Neither felt JVP was at fault in the whole ordeal. He also mentioned that Meyer told him that he still used certain things on Defense that he had learned from JVP because they were still relevant to playing defense after all these years.

Hiring 2 ex-JVP Assts. seems to support that as well. But LJ Sr. was going to be a super-hot commodity if he ever left PSU, and Meyer was smart enough to reach out to him at the right time.... when LJ Sr. probably had just about had his fill with the nonsense at PSU in the aftermath. (Franklin wanted to retain him, but not as D Coord, which LJ wanted, if I recall).

 

[phlop87]

I put JoePa in the same bucket as the bishops and other priests who pushed aside or overlooked child abuse because they couldn't handle the truth ... They knew but wanted to take the easy way out to save the overall good of the Catholic Church .. My opinion is JoePa wanted to save the "good name and reputation" he had created over his career.

 

[psuro]

I put JoePa in the same bucket as the bishops and other priests who pushed aside or overlooked child abuse because they couldn't handle the truth ... They knew but wanted to take the easy way out to save the overall good of the Catholic Church .. My opinion is JoePa wanted to save the "good name and reputation" he had created over his career.

Really? Is that your opinion? How nice.

 

[bwifan]

I put JoePa in the same bucket as the bishops and other priests who pushed aside or overlooked child abuse because they couldn't handle the truth ... They knew but wanted to take the easy way out to save the overall good of the Catholic Church .. My opinion is JoePa wanted to save the "good name and reputation" he had created over his career.

Ok... I will take the bait of your trolling... By all means please back your statement with the facts. I would love to see links and facts that Joe knew and overlooked all this....

 

[psuro]

I honestly am surprised that Chi Town Lion posted this question/thread.

It's been only Monday, and it's only going to get worse during the coming days.

 

[Zenophile]

,

I put JoePa in the same bucket as the bishops and other priests who pushed aside or overlooked child abuse because they couldn't handle the truth ... They knew but wanted to take the easy way out to save the overall good of the Catholic Church .. My opinion is JoePa wanted to save the "good name and reputation" he had created over his career.

While the candor of your response is appreciated, I'm genuinely fascinated by the way in which you "fill in the blanks" with your own ideas of Joe. Coach Paterno had many character flaws (so many, in fact, that they were an almost daily topic of discussion here in the recent past), but honesty & integrity were simply not among them. And there is a library of documentation that speaks to this fact. Those of us who are familiar with the (well documented) life & ethos of Joe Paterno find responses like yours to be laughable. This is a man who, at one point in his life, got into a physical altercation in order to speak up for a minority who was the target of bullies, and at another point threw a fit that one of his children who had not ordered the all-you-can-eat buffet ate from the plate of another who had.

These are true stories (and there are many more like them) of the same man whom you seem to think was aware of the abuse of a child or children and somehow decided that this abuse was either ok or was simply none of his business. It's frankly an absurd notion.