Scott says Superior court denied PSU & Pepper Hamiltons appeal
- Thread starter jerseylion109
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I wonder which street that is? Allen Street? Beaver Avenue? The soon to be named "Paterno Way"?
It seems to me that once the Alumni Trustees read all of the Freeh report supporting documentation and if they find that have a case where the old guard violated their fiduciary or possibly broke the law, the Alumni Trustees have a fiduciary obligation to charge the old guard with that violation first in executive committee to have them removed and then possibly in court if the action was serious enough (ie. millions of dollars spent on protecting their butts instead of the university's interest) and bring the case to the proper authorities, which in this case is the feds because they misspent a non-profits money, at which time the release of many of the damaging documents can be attached in the law suit.
Anybody have an idea if this is true? Once the documents become public, the end will be very near.
Anybody have an idea if this is true? Once the documents become public, the end will be very near.
Per The Doors
"This is the end, beautiful friend
This is the end, my only friend, the end
Of our elaborate plans, the end
Of everything that stands, the end
No safety or surprise, the end
I'll never look into your eyes, again"
Twitter is full of the legal precedent on this. ACP cannot be used as both a sword and a shield.
"Twitter is full of the legal precedent on this."
This is how we know we are at the end of civilization--when we learn about law precedent from the most toxic media outlet on the planet.
This is how we know we are at the end of civilization--when we learn about law precedent from the most toxic media outlet on the planet.
"Twitter is full of the legal precedent on this."
This is how we know we are at the end of civilization--when we learn about law precedent from the most toxic media outlet on the planet.
I thought that was ESPN.
Im pretty sure you can't sue for defamation of character once someone is dead. In any event, the laws are very lenient when it comes to defamation and public figures. Although one has to think that accusing someone of being a pedophile enabler when they're not would rank up there.
Which is why the Paterno's are suing the NCAA for commercial disparagement. Their argument is when the NCAA issued the sanctions, and specifically named Joe, they damaged the ability for his estate to make as much money as it otherwise could have. Since the NCAA used the Freeh Report as the basis for the sanctions, getting access to the documents used to produce the report, in order to show that the report was incorrect in its findings, became important. Remember, the NCAA claimed the report was more thorough than any investigation they could have done. If the work documents show the reports conclusions were not founded, or worse were willfully manipulated to pursue a narrative not shown with exculpatory evidence ignored, AND given the level of communication between Freeh's group and the NCAA (the NCAA told them what kinds of things they needed in the report to justify action), then the NCAA knowingly used bad/incomplete/misleading information to disparage Joe which affected the earnings potential of the estate.
Here's the thing... even if the Paterno's lost the case in the end, getting access to all the documents and being able to release them via filings to shed light on what actually happened, they still win (assuming it does, in fact, exonerate Joe).
Could they go after Freeh separately? Probably, if the statute of limitations hasn't worn off. Spanier is already doing that, and since Freeh interviewed him at the last minute after the report was mostly complete, and allegedly ignored most of the interview in the report, he's in a better place to sue. He wouldn't even need access to all the work product, just his interview that shows Freeh ignored the information he provided. Of course, we don't know what info was provided to Freeh by Spanier, but I would have to think there has to be something of substance he ignored. Otherwise Spanier is tilting at (very expensive) windmills. Had the NCAA not named Joe specifically in the sanctions, Freeh would have been (most likely) the Paterno's target. But when the NCAA specifically named Joe, and specifically adjusted his win record, and specifically accused him of not protecting children and covering up information on Sandusky in writing in the Consent Decree--that made the NCAA a better target for their argument.
This is a bit of a misnomer. The "estate" can sue no matter how dead the person is. The estate has to show damages. The reason why dead people typically don't sue is because 99.99% of people don't have "estates" that are damaged by disparagement. Most times, nobody cares about dead people. And, to that end, the Paterno's only need to show that they lost $1. They have no need for the money. This isn't about the money. Its about getting to the truth and clearing Joe's legacy/name. That's why they won't settle....and that's why the NCAA is in trouble. They cannot conceive of someone doing the right thing and not being money motivated. If you know the NCAA, you know that they have simply paid people off in the past (until O'Bannon). This time, they can't pay people off.
The Paterno Way traditionally meant Success With Honor. Soon, it will also be known as, "Don't screw with us."
It's a race to the bottom. Currently, it's a dead heat among espn, twitter, facebook, tmz, and several others.
The Paterno Way traditionally meant Success With Honor. Soon, it will also be known as, "Don't screw with us."
I said this on a separate thread yesterday:
Given what may potentially happen with the legal actions of the Paternos and the NCAA, I find it ironic that, of all the run ins that U of Miami, Oklahoma, the SEC, SMU, etc have had with the NCAA, it could very well be "conservative, boring Penn State" that finally kicks this cabal in the arse and exposes them for the frauds they are.
Well said. I certainly hope you are right, and I think you could well be.
Things like this would be very messy, but I have no legal expertise.
http://www.ncaa.com/news/basketball...ner-broadcasting-ncaa-reach-14-year-agreement
Agree, but suspect these broadcasters would only be too interested in dealing directly with the conferences and not the NCAA. So much has changed...I see that Comcast if offering a streaming service for basic programing plus HBO for $15/month now. Wow.
Plus, the big five would be happy to keep the revenue they create and cut out the other conferences like the MAC in this time of financial insecurity for colleges.
The public uses phrases like defamation, slander, libel, disparagement, etc. interchangeably. However, if you research it, you'll find that each has a separate LEGAL definition (for example, slander and libel are subsets of defamation, one written, one spoken). You can only sue for defamation if you're the one being defamed. There is a specific reason why the lawsuit is for commercial disparagement and not defamation.
Agree....but in the end, its simply "word salad." The tool for the Paternos, or anyone else, is there to be used regardless of the specific name. The Paterno's have some unique claims and needs as well.
I think it will be the combined quote.....Success with Honor & don't screw with us......We stand up for our Honor.The Paterno Way traditionally meant Success With Honor. Soon, it will also be known as, "Don't screw with us."
Well, it may be word salad, but in court, a lawsuit for defamation would have been thrown out.
Especially when "conversing" with outsiders who don't know the case, but do know about the law, if you start arguing the merits of the case and use the term defamation you're liable to get a smack back that undermines your credibility. A previous poster mentioned defamation... with all the misinformation out there, it's important to get details like that right as much as possible. Otherwise you get branded a cultist, etc. and dismissed by people who do know a little about the law. IMHO.
I like it. Just add "unlike Penn State" to the end of it.
Whatever happened to "Fight for her honor, fight!"?
Well, it may be word salad, but in court, a lawsuit for defamation would have been thrown out.
So they would toss the word salad?
whenever I hear the name 'Pepper Hamilton' this Pepper always comes to mind
Based on what you posted, couldn't the NCAA sue Freeh for false and misleading information that lead to their punishment of JoePa?
the NCAA allowed themselves to get backed into a corner by trusting the SITF. they WERE required by their own bylaws to conduct an independent investigation. they cannot sue Freeh since they willingly accepted the conclusions of HIS investigation because they were too lazy (or assured by Frazier, Erickson, and Peetz) that Freeh was reliable.
I don't know. It would be an interesting argument. The NCAA had the option to do their own investigation, which is their policy, and didn't. Now, assuming the NCAA was steering the direction of the investigation, as has been suggested by the emails previously released, then the NCAA was probably just as guilty for the information in the report as Freeh. So, I don't see how that would fly. If the NCAA could prove they weren't involved in steering the investigation and predetermine the narrative they wanted, then they might have a case. However, even if that were the case, given that the report was not commissioned by the NCAA, they just decided to co opt it for their purposes, I think they would have a hard time making the case. Again, if they weren't invoked in steering the investigation, I think they'd ironically have a better case of suing Penn State for providing them with the Freeh Report to use, when it was faulty. Especially if it is shown some BOT members were involved in setting the narrative. This is the danger of pursuing the truth--even if it clears a number of innocent people, there could be unintended consequences.
Well I guess they could try but frankly if they would have read the report instead of just going by his (Freeh's) grandstanding PC they would have know there was no substance to it. So too bad for them.
Edit: it also didn't help that our idiot BOTS were too interested in evening up scores and vendettas and deflecting blame to not challenge the report.
Right. The mistaken presumption was that there was no way PSU's BoT would sell its own University down the river in the quite the manner we have seen here. Surely the SITF would not hire a shyster and a fraud to simply make up a narrative that was not true casting blame exclusively on the football program and a few isolated and quickly fired employees They are, after all, trustees--people with a fiduciary duty to the University.
A fiduciary duty is a legal duty to act solely in another party's interests.
"A trustee is held to something stricter than the morals of the market place. Not honesty alone, but the punctilio of an honor the most sensitive, is then the standard of behavior… the level of conduct for fiduciaries [has] been kept at a level higher than that trodden by the crowd." Meinhard v Salmon 249 NY 458 (1928). This is one of my favorite legal maxims, mostly because of the use of punctilio.
Kind of hard to hold your behavior to the punctilio of an honor the most sensitive when you are a self-serving, lying, blame casting son of a bitch like Kenny F, but the NCAA will end up claiming it could not have known this because it believed Kenny F was operating within his fiduciary duty. Instead, Kenny spent millions of his principal's dollars to hire Swervin' Louie Crashcup in the service of a falsehood that absolved...Kenny and his friends...and cost the University 9 figures.
Ultimately this claim by the NCAA will fail, since it is required to conduct its own investigations for the very reason that you cannot trust even University trustees not to throw other people under the bus to save themselves.
Exactly....and we know that at least one NCAA big wig (Ed Ray) didn't even bother himself enough to read the FR before voting on the CD. Talk about lack of institutional control and due diligence!
Also, we know from the Corman and Paterno lawsuits that the NCAA has been siding WITH PSU in court to prevent the release of emails and other discovery material re: Freeh's report and "investigation" so to me that says the NCAA is tied with the OG BOT at the hip and is fully aware of what really happened....otherwise they wouldn't be fighting the release of information, they'd be advocating for it if they felt the PSU BOT duped them somehow re: FR.
At some point the NCAA, OG BOT, and Freeh are all going to start pointing fingers at each other and it's going to get real interesting who's left holding the flaming bag of dog poop...my guess is the OG BOT since they are the ones who hired/indemnified freeh but the NCAA will still get theirs since they didn't even do any due diligence at all from their end.
Does anyone really think the NCAA is going to get away with saying "but but.. the PSU BOT told us the FR was legit so we didn't do any due diligence on our end"? I don't think so. The NCAA gets handed "internal" reports from schools all the time. The NCAA can't just take all these reports at face value as the schools may be lying about or try to obfuscate certain things. The NCAA needs to read the school's report then do their own damned due diligence to see if further investigation/inquiry is needed and they did none of those things re: PSU and the FR.
I think it is reasonable to conclude that the reason the NCAA waived its responsibility to do its own investigation, is because it directed the Freeh group on what they needed to hear in order to level bogus LOIC sanctions.
yeah, but TSM made much more use of paper records than Freeh did, I bet. Not so easy to shred hard drives and servers, especially those of the recipient.
I think PSU and the NCAA negotiated this at the time. PSU said to the NCAA 'if we hire Louie Freeh to do an investigation, will that satisfy you?' and the NCAA was in agreement.
If people don't think the Paterno team doesn't know what's in those documents, you're nuts. They also have people who were interviewed talking to them. They haven't made mistakes like Louis, the NCAA and the OGBOT.
Why else would the NCAA have not completed their own investigation? If the PSU self investigation report had come back that the FB program and University did nothing wrong, would the NCAA blindly accept that? Heck no. They wanted blood and got it and were willing to go along with the façade.
The public, media, and NCAA wanted blood. Public opinion already convicted everyone and PSU plead guilty from the beginning. PSU wanted this in the rear view mirror as quickly as possibly. The only way to do that was to give the public, media, and NCAA what they wanted.
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