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So there is clearly something going on inside with the coaching staff

Coaching changes in Frankllns third year as much at it has been is not good. Most programs with new head coaches are making significant improvements. Can't see PSU as doing that this coming year. Better perhaps, who knows. Franklin sounds like he was at a significant disadvantage this year. Really? 5 star QB, 4 star RB, 4 star WR's. DL with three NFL picks. Line backers with 4 stars, secondary with 4 star talent. WTF is he talking about.
 
Joe took less money so his assistants could make more. PSU assistants were paid a lot and thus, unless they were offered a better job (i.e. linebacker coach to d coordinator) there was no reason to leave.
?????

Truthiness check time?
 
My own kid was one of them.
That's funny. Because I have a daughter at PSU University Park right now (in the Environmental Resource Management program) because she couldn't get into Pitt Main Campus. She had 1280 SAT and graduated 17th in her high school class of 350. Couldn't get into Pitt, got into PSU. Is there right now and doing well.
 
That's because Pitt puts a premium on admission statistics, and PSU does not. I know people who got denied acceptance to PSU main campus, who were offered a full ride to Pitt, because of amazing test scores. It's a pointless waste of money for Pitt, because PSU is still almost universally considered a better school. Not only are my PSU degrees more valuable than a Pitt degree, having the largest alumni association opens many doors for graduates. It's kinda sad to brag about admission statistics, when they aren't printed on your degree. All that really matters is how the world views your degree.
lol... Two schools are really fine universities, Pitt over the last few years is a bit more selective. the world university rankings rank pitt much higher than PSU.. so I guess I dont know what world you are referring to.. Either way calm down psu is a fine school and the stats he mentioned are accurate. It doesnt make you degree less of an accomplishment.. Lets face it you can get a great education at pretty much any university, its what the individual makes of it that matters the most.
 
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That's because Pitt puts a premium on admission statistics, and PSU does not. I know people who got denied acceptance to PSU main campus, who were offered a full ride to Pitt, because of amazing test scores. It's a pointless waste of money for Pitt, because PSU is still almost universally considered a better school. Not only are my PSU degrees more valuable than a Pitt degree, having the largest alumni association opens many doors for graduates. It's kinda sad to brag about admission statistics, when they aren't printed on your degree. All that really matters is how the world views your degree.
I am a bit confused. PSU is denying admission to students who score over 1300 and are in the top 10% of their classes so that they can make room for the B students that scored 1000? That makes no sense. I think the world views both degrees as valuable. As far as rankings, all depends on the criteria used. US News has Pitt at #62 in the US, but in the world rankings they are #39 from the same magazine. Odd how that works. As far as kids being accepted, I think that is changing also. My kids graduated from Mercyhurst Prep in Erie in 2010 and 2014 and it is amazing how many kids were denied admission to Pitt and ended up at PSU Main. We can agree to disagree, but I know both schools are incredible academic institutions that we all can be proud of. As far as the alumni network, that is something that has really worked in PSU's favor. Even the kids that had a C average in high school and an 800 SAT can go to a branch campus for 2 years, then main for 2 years and get a job through through the vast alumni network whether they deserved it or not.
 
Coaching changes in Frankllns third year as much at it has been is not good. Most programs with new head coaches are making significant improvements. Can't see PSU as doing that this coming year. Better perhaps, who knows. Franklin sounds like he was at a significant disadvantage this year. Really? 5 star QB, 4 star RB, 4 star WR's. DL with three NFL picks. Line backers with 4 stars, secondary with 4 star talent. WTF is he talking about.
Good heavens. Does this really need to be explained again? In two words--depth, experience.
 
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lol... Two schools are really fine universities, Pitt over the last few years is a bit more selective. the world university rankings rank pitt much higher than PSU.. so I guess I dont know what world you are referring to.. Either way calm down psu is a fine school and the stats he mentioned are accurate. It doesnt make you degree less of an accomplishment.. Lets face it you can get a great education at pretty much any university, its what the individual makes of it that matters the most.

The world university rankings... did you just make that up? I'm referring to rankings that matter, such as US news and Princeton Review. Why does it even matter if tomorrow Pitt became universally known as the best school in the country? Because when I graduated with my degrees, and when EVERY PSU grad in the world graduated from PSU, it was considered a better school than Pitt... and that fact will NEVER change regardless of what happens in the future. Although we all know that PSU will always be considered the better school.

It doesnt make you degree less of an accomplishment..

You "aren't" doing Pitt any favors with "you" poor grammar, misuse of puncatiation, and apparent inability to use an apostrophe.
 
I am a bit confused. PSU is denying admission to students who score over 1300 and are in the top 10% of their classes so that they can make room for the B students that scored 1000? That makes no sense. I think the world views both degrees as valuable. As far as rankings, all depends on the criteria used. US News has Pitt at #62 in the US, but in the world rankings they are #39 from the same magazine. Odd how that works. As far as kids being accepted, I think that is changing also. My kids graduated from Mercyhurst Prep in Erie in 2010 and 2014 and it is amazing how many kids were denied admission to Pitt and ended up at PSU Main. We can agree to disagree, but I know both schools are incredible academic institutions that we all can be proud of. As far as the alumni network, that is something that has really worked in PSU's favor. Even the kids that had a C average in high school and an 800 SAT can go to a branch campus for 2 years, then main for 2 years and get a job through through the vast alumni network whether they deserved it or not.

This is not that difficult to understand. Great students can be denied entrance to a competitive majors at main campus, but still accepted at a branch campus or Pitt. Many times these students don't end up going to PSU, because they wanted to go to Main campus.

You also have to consider the size of the school. The larger the school the more people you need to accept to fill out a class. Case in Point, in 2013 Pitt admitted 15,047 students. PSU main campus alone accepted 23,603. Having to accept more people lowers your admission statistics But since PSU is still considered a better school than Pitt, it's proof that admission statistics are worthless.
 
This is not that difficult to understand. Great students can be denied entrance to a competitive majors at main campus, but still accepted at a branch campus or Pitt. Many times these students don't end up going to PSU, because they wanted to go to Main campus.

You also have to consider the size of the school. The larger the school the more people you need to accept to fill out a class. Case in Point, in 2013 Pitt admitted 15,047 students. PSU main campus alone accepted 23,603. Having to accept more people lowers your admission statistics But since PSU is still considered a better school than Pitt, it's proof that admission statistics are worthless.
I totally get it now. The 50% of students admitted to PSU are B students and those that weren't admitted were C students who went to the branch campuses. Pitt accepted 53% of A students and the B students who weren't admitted went to PSU-Main. Your argument is that all of the
This is not that difficult to understand. Great students can be denied entrance to a competitive majors at main campus, but still accepted at a branch campus or Pitt. Many times these students don't end up going to PSU, because they wanted to go to Main campus.

You also have to consider the size of the school. The larger the school the more people you need to accept to fill out a class. Case in Point, in 2013 Pitt admitted 15,047 students. PSU main campus alone accepted 23,603. Having to accept more people lowers your admission statistics But since PSU is still considered a better school than Pitt, it's proof that admission statistics are worthless.
The world university rankings... did you just make that up? I'm referring to rankings that matter, such as US news and Princeton Review. Why does it even matter if tomorrow Pitt became universally known as the best school in the country? Because when I graduated with my degrees, and when EVERY PSU grad in the world graduated from PSU, it was considered a better school than Pitt... and that fact will NEVER change regardless of what happens in the future. Although we all know that PSU will always be considered the better school.



You "aren't" doing Pitt any favors with "you" poor grammar, misuse of puncatiation, and apparent inability to use an apostrophe.
I must admit, your blue and white glasses are very thick.
 
I still accept the premise that our O-line troubles were a direct result of sanctions and that Hand is a decent coach. Clearly he is a very good recruiter.

I think what we are seeing is proof that the Grand Experiment ended in 2009. Paterno's staff was known for its loyalty to Joe so turnover was always minimal. The school benefited from that loyalty by being able to operate on the conservative side with payroll. We are living in a different time now, and I think that we are still coming to grips with our future, as cast by those wonderful people who brought you Judge Freeh. I suspect fewer than 10% of the D1 coaches today have the longevity of Paterno's guys.

Why 2009 and not 2011? But I think it's only the minimal turnover of coaches (and to some extent players) that has changed for sure. I still have hopes that we will be a place that graduates just like we always did and has a solid academic standing (and wins). I'd be loath to give up on that just yet. And I don;t think Franklin is.
 
I totally get it now. The 50% of students admitted to PSU are B students and those that weren't admitted were C students who went to the branch campuses. Pitt accepted 53% of A students and the B students who weren't admitted went to PSU-Main. Your argument is that all of the


I must admit, your blue and white glasses are very thick.

I suggest you read it more slowly and then post a complete thought. Or even better, stop trying to prove the sky is green and simply go away. Realize that every time you post rambling incoherent garbage like this. You only further prove how lousy your education was.
 
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I don't think there is any way that we were going to be able to keep both Shoop and Pry. If Shoop hadn't left, Pry would have, if not this year then next. Now he has a reason to stay. Shoop wasn't going to stay long in any event, and Pry has probably had as much or nearly as much to do with the defense anyway- I think this worked out as well as it could have. Call it a break even.

Donovan had to go, and it appears to me that Moorehead is a significant upgrade at OC. A clear win.

Hand probably got a lot more criticism than he deserved, but the environment for him had grown pretty toxic, deserved or not. Limegrover has a nice resume, and a clean slate. I'm calling this a win, too.
 
I don't think there is any way that we were going to be able to keep both Shoop and Pry. If Shoop hadn't left, Pry would have, if not this year then next. Now he has a reason to stay. Shoop wasn't going to stay long in any event, and Pry has probably had as much or nearly as much to do with the defense anyway- I think this worked out as well as it could have. Call it a break even.

Donovan had to go, and it appears to me that Moorehead is a significant upgrade at OC. A clear win.

Hand probably got a lot more criticism than he deserved, but the environment for him had grown pretty toxic, deserved or not. Limegrover has a nice resume, and a clean slate. I'm calling this a win, too.


Shoop flying the coup is a no brainer, its what he does. You are correct that Pry would have sought better opportunities if Shoop stayed and next year we might have lost both. Who knows maybe Shoop was pissed that Franklin didn't hire his brother as OC? As far as Hand goes....I believe his family never moved here? Not a sign of long term commitment to one or the other. Also, the change at OC had to hit home and he knew the signs, Donovan was the sacrificial lamb....but Hand clearly was next to the firing squad. For years people on this board have bitched and professed that JVP didn't have anyone on this staff who anyone else would want. Well, now you all should be very happy.
 
These last few years in the PSU football program have been very stressful -- sanctions, reduced roster, a continued false narrative of a cover-up of sex abuse, the passing of a legend, coaching changes, etc. For the players and coaches, they have been dog years -- each year seems like multiple years. It's not surprising that some want to escape when given the chance.

It'll be a while before some sense of normalcy returns. That said, I think CJF is the right guy for the job and is doing the single most important thing -- recruiting talented players who are a good fit for the program and the University.
The worst of the sanctions are behind us and we will have had 3 consecutive good recruiting classes. Why would coaches want to escape at this point? Just because we might have one more transitional year?
 
Is it a fact that Shoops family never came to State College with him? I thought his family stayed in Nashville...maybe thats why he took the UT job. Happy wife....happy life...

No, that is absolutely false. I know this for a fact. His wife is a fitness instructor at the Y. His oldest son is on the PSU team. His youngest is at State High. They stayed in Nashville until last May/June so his oldest son could finish HS there, but then they moved here.
 
The worst of the sanctions are behind us and we will have had 3 consecutive good recruiting classes. Why would coaches want to escape at this point? Just because we might have one more transitional year?

They are not "escaping". This is standard and usual movement in the coaching world of 2016. Look at how many tOSU coaches moved this off-season, for example. About the same as us. And they have nothing to "escape from". We just lived in a bubble for a long time.
 
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Shoop flying the coup is a no brainer, its what he does. You are correct that Pry would have sought better opportunities if Shoop stayed and next year we might have lost both. Who knows maybe Shoop was pissed that Franklin didn't hire his brother as OC? As far as Hand goes....I believe his family never moved here? Not a sign of long term commitment to one or the other. Also, the change at OC had to hit home and he knew the signs, Donovan was the sacrificial lamb....but Hand clearly was next to the firing squad. For years people on this board have bitched and professed that JVP didn't have anyone on this staff who anyone else would want. Well, now you all should be very happy.
I read somewhere, might have been an article in a posted thread, where a PSU Assistant was explaining 3 drop protection in a camp, and a HS coach commented how complicated the explanation was. Didn't mention a name but you could probably guess Hand or Donovan. I think moving to a simpler system on O will produce better results. Apparently, Moorhead is very difficult to scheme against, according to coaches who have played against him.
 
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