But I'm an elite fan and I want multiple Natties.......
Sorry, but CJF is a perennial 9-3/10-2 coach!
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I get what you are saying...but a rare undefeated start for a UK or even Wake this year doesn't mean the same thing as recalibrating expectations for a bigger, national program like PSU. I would be confident in saying if UK went 9-3 this year, they would be thrilled as football will ALWAYS be an afterthought. If PSU finishes 9-3 this year (pretending we had a healthy Clifford), I would be in the minority as disappointed. But, I get your point. I'm not saying move on from JF....just more about this idea that b/c we don't outrecruit one specific program in the conference means we should never make the playoffs...that's ridiculous because it happens across the country.
If only the players and coaches were dedicated to winning.....like those who lurk here. Perhaps if we all hold are breath until PSU makes the playoffs?
Listen it's the dumbest argument around and it's one that people here LOVE to make and across all message boards of so many teams. They argue for the field meaning look at everyone else, when in fact right now....if you're PSU...it's look at Dabo, Saban, Day, and Kirby (yet to win the MNC) as they are about the only programs consistently ahead of PSU on the field and in recruiting.
Any time PSU loses the same people march out the same arguments because they cannot thump their chest. Yet anytime there is a major opening his name is mentioned because of how "sh!tty" he has done at PSU? Really. It took Dabo 9 years to climb that hill too and I think he had a losing season in year 5 or so....the torches here would have run him out of town. There are about 10-15 or so schools similar to PSU with winning traditions all trying to crack into that group. UT, FSU, UF, UM, UT, UT.....etc. and all of them are pretty much on a treadmill chasing the other guys while firing coaches every 3-4 years.
Who says JF has done a crappy job? But, u mention in your opinion just the four coaches/programs consistently ahead of PSU...ok, so why can't we finish 5th then? I mean it sounds like (and I don't want to put words in your mouth), if JF consistenly goes 10-2 or 9-3 on a down yr, that's cool? If so, that's fine...you aren't right or wrong, it's what you believe. However, as you state, and I agree, only OSU is ahead of everyone in talent in the B1G...so in that regard, some people are tired of the annual JF 4th quarter stumble vs a program with lesser talent...i.e., MSU, Minnesota, Iowa, etc. I know upsets happen, for sure....but they have happened to all four teams you mentioned, and yet they also make playoffs.
Who's to say he won't make the playoffs? Again you're taking the field and it's a cheap argument to make. I didn't see you babbling about this prior to Saturday. Why, because you're upset this year may not be the year. We all are, but this staff has the potential to get there....I don't care to hear people whine when there isn't much to whine about.
Taking the field...lol ok...that's not what I'm doing but whatever. He certainly could make the playoffs -- and if Cliff is back for OSU and beyond, there is a slight chance for sure. Sorry u don't care to hear people whine, lol. Then don't be on a board that isn't all 'wine' and roses. If JF is a lifer at PSU which I doubt b/c most coaches in today's era aren't, perhaps by year 14 still searching for a playoff spot will finally cause you to be impatient, or not.
Or if he makes it you can throw out the I'm glad I was wrong BS that people make when they make these silly arguments. Reality is he is a good coach, he is recruiting well, and has the team right in the middle of the conversation currently. Had he won this weekend, you wouldn't be saying JACK SH!t, but you pop your head out any time there is a bump in the road. He isn't perfect....there isn't a perfect coach.
Lol, u are such a shill against anyone who is critical. I've been critical for years about the collapses and wasted talent like in 2017 when we were better in talent than that OSU team at RB, QB, TE, etc. -- of course, PSU blew that lead. Seriously man, get over yourself. It's a message board. Yes, he is a good coach and a very good recruiter that preaches being 'elite' and 'detail oriented.' So far, neither have been attained to this point. It doesn't mean that it wont, but it hasn't so far.
Would rather be in this purgatory than Florida State or Nebraska. Last I checked out of 130 D-1 programs a whopping total of 10 teams have made the playoffs. We are in a division with a football machine that outside of Alabama is a close to pro caliber as you can get. We're the only team in the conference that is consistently nipping at their heals. Why? Franklin recruits very well. Agree that it is frustrating to not get over the hump but we are a lot closer than most. Have some perspective. Great coaches are not easy to find. And once you start the revolving door it gets harder to stop it. Texas has all the money in the world as well as fertile recruiting ground and where are they? Tennessee was once a power as well. Revolving door = sustained irrelevance. I bet Nebraska fans would love those 9 wins Bo Pellini brought every year right about now. I'm just happy we are in the conversation. At some point we'll breakthrough and that will kick it to a new level. Have some faith
No, you waffle back and forth and have no other legit options. You just moan after the fact.
Yep, sure thing -- I have no other legit options. Maybe u don't either as a fanboy who can't stand criticism of this program. It works both ways. At the end of the day, this program is close to a breakthrough -- maybe this year if we get Cliff back, maybe in 2 yrs when Allar is playing, but we are close, no doubt about it. I and others just remain frustrated when details and specifics continue to lag from our coach who mentions those things weekly in every press conference. If it doesn't bother you, that's cool, no problem. But, that's the crux I think of why the criticism comes.
Just some perspective:
For all of those complaining that Franklin hasn't yet made the playoff, the premise of their position inherently AGREES that OSU should have been in the playoffs over PSU the year that PSU won the Big 10...just some perspective fwiw 🤷♂️
For all of those complaining that Franklin hasn't yet made the playoff, the premise of their position inherently AGREES that OSU should have been in the playoffs over PSU the year that PSU won the Big 10...just some perspective fwiw 🤷♂️
Agreed...we were a two loss football team that gave up around 90 points combined in those losses. I had more an issue with Washington getting in than OSU.
LOL, fanboy BS. There are LEGIT criticisms or there are people like you that only crawl out and get loud following a loss. So give me your 5 LEGIT options of who you want coaching PSU right now. Your idea of being critical is saying he hasn't won the MNC or been in the playoffs....well awesome Captain Obvious. Be critical when it's due, not when it's convenient. Their gameplan this weekend was SPOT ON to attack Iowa, or do you disagree with that? So your next valid criticism is we didn't have a backup QB with our 3rd new OC in 3 years and trying to get that OC and the actual starter on the same page. If you think there is some perfect coach out there, you're wrong. I know Franklin has screwed up, but you look at the overall picture and say....there is a reason why he is mentioned for every GD job out there. It isn't because he sucks.
Now you're talking about how close they are, but then mention details....none of which you list. Just say I hate the fact they lost because you could see they were ready to win that game.
Again since u don't listen, I never said I want a new coach or we should get rid of JF, u always throw that in. And this argument about multiple OC's is fine -- Clifford seems to have handled it well. Here is a detail if you ask for it....if Cliff went down in the 3rd quarter and TR was forced in and gave us that performance, fine. That is hard to handle for sure. But, we had halftime...we had 30 minutes to get the kid somewhat organized...whether that is ripping out all but page 1 or 2 of the playbook or establishing a system to snap the ball whether it be the tap (which came late), or anything. And before you say 'well TR isn't some 5 star stud like Caleb WIlliams', who by the way is a FR and led OU to victory over Texas, we did not need TR to be the next Trace or Caleb....we needed him to look like a 3rd year guy in the program who could handle the rudimentary skills of snapping and passing properly, neither of which he could handle. That to me (and I'm sure you will emphatically tell me in all CAPS that I'm wrong), falls on JF to make sure in a moment's notice, TR can handle the basics and handle them very well. He should not have been passing deep and running the same offense, there needed to be a Plan B. This team's success was going to ride or crash on the health of CLiff (which has always been an issue). That's a pretty risky and dumb season plan if he goes down if you don't have someone ready to handle that. If TR could have been marginal, just functional, we win going away. The only way we lose that is if it was a total and systemic implosion and that is exactly what happened.
I listen, you're just a fool. PSU recruited Caleb Williams pretty damn hard, but it didn't happen. They also put out feelers in the portal....it didn't happen....SPILLED MILK. Had the starting TE caught 2 easy first downs which would have move the sticks....maybe the kid gets some confidence and things turn out differently. If the OL had a f--king clue how to manage the game better and stop putting the backup QB against the wall with false starts....it may have helped too. He was inside the 10 for 3 of his drives and some started well outside of the 10. There is so much more going on than you tend to notice....but you got him. Just get tissues, dry your eyes and get over it. You have yet to really make a valid point other than Roberson didn't play well in Iowa. Neither have PLENTY of our starters in the past.
Yep, name calling is what people like u do who can't see the forest for the trees. Part of why the OL imploded (beyond them being annually underwhelming) is the snap adjustment came too late, again on the coaches. Who do u blame for the OL not having a clue as you say? Is it...just football...or actually on the coaches? Here is a thought...how about putting him under center a couple of times to help out the OL? To win it has to be a two way street, if the players are blowing chunks, then the coaches have to quickly adjust on a moments notice -- something JF has mentioned every yr about.
So he's a good coach that is just about there, but you know so much more. Do you honestly believe the BS you type or do you know your FOS and just keep going because that hole just needs to get dug. I get it, we need to land a top 5 QB every year....why didn't anyone think of that in Unicorn Land prior to you. It's just that easy, you know they keyboard warriors are insanely good at it.
How about this....tell me how many snaps the backups get elsewhere in your head as compared to PSU when prepping for a top 5 team? What I imagine is it pretty much the same everywhere, but you clearly no better. Surely you have the answer there because you wouldn't go on like this if it wasn't so abnormal.
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Ok, I'm done arguing with you since u aren't even twisting my words, you are making up crap that I'm not saying. A few minutes ago, I never said I wanted JF gone, and now, where in my last message did I remotely say we need a top 5 qb...I was critical of the OL and the coaching, specifically in not adjusting quickly enough and also helping out TR. The over-arching point to all of this isn't TR, or the OL or even recruiting. The premise of my points is what JF has said and using that, I don't want to say against him, but as the basis. He wants to be 'elite' by comparing us to OSU as he did, and secondly, as the reporters on BWI make mention from JF's mouth...he is extremely detail oriented in everything he does. So, my perspectives are based on simply what JF preaches his goals to be. That's it.
42 wins in four years coming off sanctions is a pretty good history. I can’t think of too many “shocking” losses considering most of them were against teams even or better than us. It’s not like he’s losing to the Ball States of the world.
All the playoff teams I’ve seen have recruited some pretty darn good talent.
Oh no question...and the teams I was referring to that aren't the top dogs, so to speak, in their respective conferences in recruiting that have made a playoff are Mich St and Washington. Granted, they got smoked, but I'd take that over not getting there, lol. But, yes outside of those two, most recruit at a very high level. But, breaking through to the CFP is not unheard of and we have had more than enough to get there.
2014 7/6 no wins against a team with a pulse
2015 7/6 no wins against a team with a pulse. Loss to temple
2016 11/3 beat Ohio State and Wisky. Best year for Franklin to date.
2017 11/2 beat Mich and Wisky. Not great wins but decent.
I wasn’t a math major but my count is not 42. 2016/17 teams had some good talent no surprise to have 11 wins. This should be the minimum at PSU. As I said in my earlier post, most of the teams in the Big 10 and out of conference schedules make 11 the baseline expectation. Anything less is considered an underachieving season.
2015 7/6 no wins against a team with a pulse. Loss to temple
2016 11/3 beat Ohio State and Wisky. Best year for Franklin to date.
2017 11/2 beat Mich and Wisky. Not great wins but decent.
I wasn’t a math major but my count is not 42. 2016/17 teams had some good talent no surprise to have 11 wins. This should be the minimum at PSU. As I said in my earlier post, most of the teams in the Big 10 and out of conference schedules make 11 the baseline expectation. Anything less is considered an underachieving season.
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Is there a reason you picked those 4 years instead of the 4 that the wins occurred? Doesn't make sense.
Go back and count the number of 11 win seasons by Big 10 teams over the past 10 years. Then 20. 30 even. Going to be a lot of underachieving.
Apparently Paterno at 9-3 was a career underachiever
I picked them because the post I replied to said coming out of sanctions. Not trying to down play and of Franklin’s records. Words and numbers have meanings.
I'm pretty sure the post said ”42 wins over 4 years". And just because we were allowed a bowl in '14 that isn't exactly coming out of sanctions. I think '16 was the first year we had 85 scholarships, but I could be mistaken.
Regardless, you intentionally avoided the 4 years we won 42 games. And the message I quoted, you didn't quote anybody.
“42 wins in four years coming off sanctions is a pretty good history.” Direct quote. I could talk about those 42 wins also.
2016 11/3. Best year at PSU beat OSU and Wisky
2017 11/2. Best win #19 MSU. I know they beat #12 Wash But they wouldn’t have made that game in any other conference.
2018 9/4. Best win #19 Iowa nuff said
2019 11/2. Best win #17 Mich.
After 2016 not one top 15 win. 42 wins doesn’t truly tell the whole story.
11 wins is not a baseline expectation for anyone- with the possible exception of Alabama- that statement is pure idiocy
So when did the sanctions end? Apparently you think it was '14. Like to hear your side of it.
How else would one describe '16-'19? Is that time frame not coming off sanctions?
We play in the second toughest division of CFB over the past decade. Tell me about all the teams who won 42 games in 4 years. You already skipped over the last assignment because you know it will undermine your argument.
What is the narrative you are trying to get across? And what do you think is the solution?
16 to 19 was the 42 win period previously mentioned. Second toughest conference maybe but look at where those teams are ranked. Not a lot of ranked teams that were beat. That’s a fact. Please prove me wrong on that.
Most of my comments are replying to others. I said in the beginning Franklin is a great guy, a great motivator, brings in great student athletes and runs a great program. His results don’t show that he is a g coach. Good enough for 10 to 11 wins against competition that is not great.
As I said before this conference is not a powerhouse. It is full of mostly above average football teams with one great team. No reason PSU should lose on paper to any BIG 10 team except OSU.
Most of my comments are replying to others. I said in the beginning Franklin is a great guy, a great motivator, brings in great student athletes and runs a great program. His results don’t show that he is a g coach. Good enough for 10 to 11 wins against competition that is not great.
As I said before this conference is not a powerhouse. It is full of mostly above average football teams with one great team. No reason PSU should lose on paper to any BIG 10 team except OSU.
Meaning no other coach at any other school had to deal with sanctions….you’re really stretching to make a moronic point. When only a few other coaches had 42 wins in four years, yes it does tell the whole story. Every program plays bad teams….almost none of them had that kind of win total. And teams like Oklahoma and Clemson play bad teams all year long…are you going to say their coaches underachieve?
