The Elephant in the Room is the 4th Quarter Collapse, the Hallmark of the Franklin Era

[BrucePa]

Penn State's last 4 losses, from Southern Cal in the Rose Bowl through Ohio State and Michigan State last year, to Saturday's one point loss to Ohio State, all had one thing in common.

Penn State was in control in all 4 of those games, and held a 4th quarter lead in all 4 games. Closing strong is not something the Franklin era is known for....instead, coughing up 4th quarter leads and letting QBs have their career-best quarters have become the hallmark of the Franklin era.

 

[LionDeNittany]

So you're ignoring the games when PSU closed strong? Those games when all seemed lost, and in the second half the Lions roared back and won?

Just curious.

http://www.espn.com/college-football/game?gameId=400926946

Edit: As a matter of fact... if ANYTHING, Penn State under Franklin IS a Second Half team. That was the hallmark of the championship season and other games.

LdN

 

[MJG-90]

The other elephant is the second half comeback. Also a hallmark of the Franklin era. This conversation is just silly.

 

[Lionguy32]

You'd think that we never beat Ohio State, won a Big Ten Championship game or the Fiesta Bowl.

I guess I am forgetting that big 4th quarter lead we coughed up on national TV to Michigan last year. Oh wait....that never happened.

 

[smealpsu2005]

Yeah, that one big ten championship game doesn't count...I guess neither does that mistake at Kinnick.

 

[MJG-90]

Yeah, that one big ten championship game doesn't count...I guess neither does that mistake at Kinnick.

Don't forget that time we outscored OSU 17-0 in the 4th quarter. That was barely two years ago. How soon we all forget.

 

[psuro]

I almost wish we played Pitt this weekend, just so the BWI posters would have their other love to focus on.

 

[LafayetteBear]

Perhaps it would be more accurate to say that, at least during the last few years, PSU's run defense has been better than its pass defense? (You see more passing in the fourth quarter.) I hope CJF continues to emphasize speed in recruiting defenders, particularly CB's and safeties.

 

[LaJolla Lion]

Funny how the POS posters only come out after a loss. Then they make inaccurate statements and tend to double down on them. The mark of the Franklin Era is he has this dopes expectations so high that in a rebuilding year he is crying like a little girl over a 1 point loss to tOSU. It just tells you how well Franklin is doing overall.

 

[LurkerLazarus]

This stuff is embarrassing. There's more idiots here than I ever knew.

 

[PineIslandLion]

Penn State's last 4 losses, from Southern Cal in the Rose Bowl through Ohio State and Michigan State last year, to Saturday's one point loss to Ohio State, all had one thing in common.

Penn State was in control in all 4 of those games, and held a 4th quarter lead in all 4 games. Closing strong is not something the Franklin era is known for....instead, coughing up 4th quarter leads and letting QBs have their career-best quarters have become the hallmark of the Franklin era.

The real elephant in the room is the emotionally charged and delusional fan who posts something ridiculous after a tough loss. I guess PSU's 2nd half comebacks vs Minnesota, Wisconsin, OSU (in 2016), Iowa, BC & others in Franklin era don't count.

 

[ImaWright]

I think the elephant in the room is non-PSU fans posting after a 1 point loss in hopes they have found a chink in the armor. Perhaps it is the ridiculous amount of positive recruiting feedback that is driving the insecure to create a distraction to Penn State's ascension to elite?

Look, playing Ohio St even the last few years with significantly less talent should scare some people. Seeing the amount of recruiting talent in our pipeline I think has pushed some over the edge.

 

[BobPSU92]

Franklin let us down. He owed us a win. He owed us. Sadly, he doesn't even care. You can see that he is just mailing it in for the payday.

 

[Chickenman Testa]

I miss solid, fundamental 6-4 losses to Iowa

 

[AWS1022]

Penn State's last 4 losses, from Southern Cal in the Rose Bowl through Ohio State and Michigan State last year, to Saturday's one point loss to Ohio State, all had one thing in common.

Penn State was in control in all 4 of those games, and held a 4th quarter lead in all 4 games. Closing strong is not something the Franklin era is known for....instead, coughing up 4th quarter leads and letting QBs have their career-best quarters have become the hallmark of the Franklin era.

The hallmark is more like not losing to teams we should never lose to, scoring a bunch of points, recruiting at a high level, and bringing us out of the sanctions much faster than anyone thought possible.

 

[psuro]

Franklin let us down. He owed us a win. He owed us. Sadly, he doesn't even care. You can see that he is just mailing it in for the payday.

Hot seat?

 

[Pizzaboy1]

In Psu last 5 loses how many times were they favored to win by Vegas?The experts said they were underdogs in 4 of 5 of these loses.Psu was only UPSET by MSU in 2017 the other 4 they were supposed to lose.

 

[bkmtnittany1]

Penn State's last 4 losses, from Southern Cal in the Rose Bowl through Ohio State and Michigan State last year, to Saturday's one point loss to Ohio State, all had one thing in common.

Penn State was in control in all 4 of those games, and held a 4th quarter lead in all 4 games. Closing strong is not something the Franklin era is known for....instead, coughing up 4th quarter leads and letting QBs have their career-best quarters have become the hallmark of the Franklin era.

You really should not be allowed around a computer when you are doing bath salts and vodka!

 

[Crusher1950]

Get over it, we lost

 

[paws1957]

Franklin let us down. He owed us a win. He owed us. Sadly, he doesn't even care. You can see that he is just mailing it in for the payday.

Bob, you never cease to amaze me with your comments! Lmao

 

[paws1957]

Hot seat?

That photo has a hot seat...just saying....

 

[bkmtnittany1]

Hot seat?

Make sure this one makes your cabinet as well!

 

[Rip_E_2_Joe_PA]

Does anyone else see an elephant in the room? Not me!

 

[ThePennsyOracle]

Keep drinking the Kool Aid. But his coaching decisions have cost us the past two games against PSU. He’s a good coach—but he’s not “elite.”

 

[manatree]

Does anyone else see an elephant in the room? Not me!

Well duh, she packed her trunk and said goodbye to this circus.

 

[manatree]

Keep drinking the Kool Aid. But his coaching decisions have cost us the past two games against PSU. He’s a good coach—but he’s not “elite.”

Actually, it's much worse than that. His coaching decisions have cost us every bleeding Blue-White game since he's arrived.

 

[ThePennsyOracle]

Actually, it's much worse than that. His coaching decisions have cost us every bleeding Blue-White game since he's arrived.

Sorry to bring reality into the discussion.

 

[FightOnState]

Sorry to bring reality into the discussion.

Actually, he is bringing proof reading to the discussion.

 

[MJG-90]

Keep drinking the Kool Aid. But his coaching decisions have cost us the past two games against PSU. He’s a good coach—but he’s not “elite.”

Or we came close because of his ability to coach up less talented kids. This is a stupid argument. His decisions are the reason we were winning the game in the first place.

 

[ThePennsyOracle]

Or we came close because of his ability to coach up less talented kids. This is a stupid argument. His decisions are the reason we were winning the game in the first place.

Last time I checked....it doesn't matter what the score is at the end of Q3 or the start of Q4.

I figured everyone would "love" what I brought to the discussion.

 

[FightOnState]

I miss solid, fundamental 6-4 losses to Iowa

Or for that matter, getting upset at home in November to an unranked, 4 loss team with a NC on the line.

 

[Keyser Soze 16801]

Who would the haters rather have? OK Nick Saban is a better coach and Urban Meyer too (ignoring his moral failings). Dabo? He beats up on a weak conference. In my mind there are only 2 coaches in CFB that are demonstrably better right now than CJF.

 

[IANit]

The real elephant in the room is the emotionally charged and delusional fan who posts something ridiculous after a tough loss. I guess PSU's 2nd half comebacks vs Minnesota, Wisconsin, OSU (in 2016), Iowa, BC & others in Franklin era don't count.

You don't agree with his perception so you attack him, and you call him wrong, but he's not really wrong. I don't really care about games before 2016, because James was handcuffed and not really running his offense. If you want to give him credit for the BC game, fine. But in my view the Franklin era really started in 2016. The Minnesota game in 2016 was a comeback from a 13-3 deficit that turned into a 20-13 PSU lead after 3 quarters that ended up with a 4th quarter collapse (down 23-20) before we managed to send it to OT. The Iowa game in 2017 we were leading 15-7 after 3, then gave up 2 long 4th quarter TDs and had to pull it out. We don't win that game without a Superman performance by Barkley. The tOSU win in 2016 was a great comeback, and the Wisconsin game was an epic comeback. The USC game in 2017 we were down 13 twice, then went up 18 and couldn't close. App State this year, we're up 24-10 after 3, they score, we score, it's 31-17, then we give up 3 TDs before coming from behind, to win in OT. By the way, the QB who we made look all-world was 8-18 with 2 interceptions against South Alabama this past weekend. He was responsible for a lot of the scoring in their win, but his numbers sure look pedestrian.

I see two games that were actual comebacks where we were being beaten then went ahead and never looked back. There were 4 collapses - USC, 2xOhio State and MSU. There were 4 near collapses - Minnesota 2016, Iowa 2017, App State 2018 and Washington 2017 (up 28-7 in 2nd quarter, comes down to last play at 35-28). We get credit for winning the ones where we came from behind, but it all seems to point to us having trouble holding a lead late.

Other than the Wisconsin and Ohio State comebacks from 14 or more points, we haven't had much to point to as solid comebacks where we didn't blow it first. I guess you could count Indiana 2016 as a comeback - we were down 24-21 after 3. Against 3-9 Michigan State in 2016 we have a comeback you could maybe feel good about, down 12-10 at the half we won 45-12. There's the comeback against Rutgers in 2017, down 6-0 with 11:16 left in second. We trailed Nebraska 10-7 until 2:40 left in the first last year, another good comeback. You could even count Illinois 2018, down 24-21 in the 3rd.

 

[Nittany_93]

There's really only 4 ways to categorize a loss this way: blowout loss or close loss. Loss while ahead or loss while behind. Out of the 4 permutations I'll take blowing a lead and losing a close game.

Would it feel better to be trailing and lose a close game? I don't think the narrative changes much in that scenario.

 

[wrm125]

Another (IMO) perfectly valid way to reframe the “4th quarter collapse is a hallmark of Franklin” point: Penn State has been winning in the 4th quarter in every single game since Michigan in early 2016.

Really, really wanted to beat OSU and think that we should have but I can’t understand how people wouldn’t still be happy with Franklin overall.

 

[IANit]

There's really only 4 ways to categorize a loss this way: blowout loss or close loss. Loss while ahead or loss while behind. Out of the 4 permutations I'll take blowing a lead and losing a close game.

Would it feel better to be trailing and lose a close game? I don't think the narrative changes much in that scenario.

I'd rather see us figure out how to hold a lead when we get ahead against top teams and not have to rely on heroic comebacks against 2nd and 3rd-tier programs when we give up a late lead that never should have been given up.

 

[BobPSU92]

Hot seat?

In a sense. I burned Franklin's office chair down to the ground. No more sitting down. He has too much work to do. He owes us.

 

[PSUcup1]

I miss solid, fundamental 6-4 losses to Iowa

I miss scoring less than 10 points a game in 7 of our first 11 b10 trips to Columbus and averaging 12ppg. Those were the days!!

 

[IANit]

Another (IMO) perfectly valid way to reframe the “4th quarter collapse is a hallmark of Franklin” point: Penn State has been winning in the 4th quarter in every single game since Michigan in early 2016.

Really, really wanted to beat OSU and think that we should have but I can’t understand how people wouldn’t still be happy with Franklin overall.

I'm happy with Franklin and the direction of the program. I just see an area of concern. Under Joe the concern was often whether we could muster enough offense to win a tight game. Now we've got plenty of offense, but the defense hasn't been as reliable. But sometimes the offense plays into that ability to close out games. And a lot of times that comes down to in-game coaching.

 

[nittany119]

You don't agree with his perception so you attack him, and you call him wrong, but he's not really wrong. I don't really care about games before 2016, because James was handcuffed and not really running his offense. If you want to give him credit for the BC game, fine. But in my view the Franklin era really started in 2016. The Minnesota game in 2016 was a comeback from a 13-3 deficit that turned into a 20-13 PSU lead after 3 quarters that ended up with a 4th quarter collapse (down 23-20) before we managed to send it to OT. The Iowa game in 2017 we were leading 15-7 after 3, then gave up 2 long 4th quarter TDs and had to pull it out. We don't win that game without a Superman performance by Barkley. The tOSU win in 2016 was a great comeback, and the Wisconsin game was an epic comeback. The USC game in 2017 we were down 13 twice, then went up 18 and couldn't close. App State this year, we're up 24-10 after 3, they score, we score, it's 31-17, then we give up 3 TDs before coming from behind, to win in OT. By the way, the QB who we made look all-world was 8-18 with 2 interceptions against South Alabama this past weekend. He was responsible for a lot of the scoring in their win, but his numbers sure look pedestrian.

I see two games that were actual comebacks where we were being beaten then went ahead and never looked back. There were 4 collapses - USC, 2xOhio State and MSU. There were 4 near collapses - Minnesota 2016, Iowa 2017, App State 2018 and Washington 2017 (up 28-7 in 2nd quarter, comes down to last play at 35-28). We get credit for winning the ones where we came from behind, but it all seems to point to us having trouble holding a lead late.

Other than the Wisconsin and Ohio State comebacks from 14 or more points, we haven't had much to point to as solid comebacks where we didn't blow it first. I guess you could count Indiana 2016 as a comeback - we were down 24-21 after 3. Against 3-9 Michigan State in 2016 we have a comeback you could maybe feel good about, down 12-10 at the half we won 45-12. There's the comeback against Rutgers in 2017, down 6-0 with 11:16 left in second. We trailed Nebraska 10-7 until 2:40 left in the first last year, another good comeback. You could even count Illinois 2018, down 24-21 in the 3rd.

So BOB goes 8-4 in 1012, losing to two inferior teams in Ohio and Virginia, and playing with Joe's players, who were pretty good. And he is coach of the year. Franklin gets the worst part of the sanctions and in his third yea,. Against ridiculious odds wins the conference championship and he is not a good coach? He or his staff coached up a 3 star qb, I mean safety, to win the conference in his first year starting. Other than the bad play call on 4th down Saturday, I don't understand S how any true PSU fan can not be happy with the job he has done