This sums up CJF

[Ward Hog]

The second pick was doing what we've all been asking for since Trace. Take some shots down the field in big games. Perhaps he shouldn't have thrown it when he saw the coverage. Perhaps it was a bad call due to our inability to ground down Oregon at will. Perhaps he should have thrown it only 20 yards to Warren who was open on the shorter crossing route. I wouldn't have called that play but I'm not going to complain about them doing what we've all asked for.

We will beat Oregon if we get the second chance. It is much easier to scheme away short passing than it is to suddenly learn how to control the line of scrimmage.

 

[NittanyChris]

So you hate basic math. Got it.

You refuse to expound or use logic. Got it.

 

[mhlarch]

It makes sense to go for two, but I generally think about the psychological aspect if you miss. It deflates a team right after they score a TD and should be riding high. And I think that is tough to quantify.

Totally agree....but on the flip side, if you make it, it lifts the team.

 

[bdroc]

We will beat Oregon if we get the second chance. It is much easier to scheme away short passing than it is to suddenly learn how to control the line of scrimmage.

PSU had plenty of time to scheme away Oregon's short passing game. That's what Oregon does so we should have expected it.

Unfortunately PSU stuck with what they do which is try to create explosive plays on defense with maximum pressure that includes moving LBs & DBs around on blitzes. Oregon beat the pressure with screens and quick release slants.

 

[SR108]

I’ve been a Franklin defender for a long time now. He really has many outstanding attributes; an extraordinarily hard worker, a man of great integrity and class, a fantastic teacher of and role model for young men, a sensational recruiter, an excellent eye for talent, a strong advocate for the football program and a terrific representative of my Alma Mater.

Sadly, what I’ve also learned watching him all these years is he is indisputably bad at in-game coaching decisions including when to go for it on fourth down, when to go for a 2 point conversion, time management and when to challenge a call, for example.

As a fan, it’s extremely frustrating because of all that he does so well, yet ultimately falls short in big games because of poor in-game decisions. Should he be fired? No, that’s not fair. Will he learn from his mistakes and make better in-game decisions? He hasn’t shown that ability as of yet.

My biggest frustration at least this year are all the unsportsmanlike penalties.

 

[doctornick]

Totally agree....but on the flip side, if you make it, it lifts the team.

Sure, but I think having scored the touchdown (and getting an XP) lifts the team. I don't think going for two and making it helps that much more psychologically especially compared to missing it and the negative impact psychologically.

From an analytics standpoint, I agree with going for 2.

 

[PurposePitch]

And you refuse to expound or use logic. Got it.

What do I have to expound on? The math says you go for 2 there, because it increases your chance to win. They failed to convert. Poop happens. It was still the correct decision.

You’re freaking out about it because you’ve been conditioned over many years and many stupid decisions, to accept the suboptimal decision of attempting the extra point.

That’s not math or logic’s problem … or Franklin’s for that matter … that’s your problem.

Now, if you want to complain about the play call itself … I would not have chosen the Philly special. But that’s the bad you have to accept with AK, who brings a lot of good, too.

 

[AWS1022]

PSU had plenty of time to scheme away Oregon's short passing game. That's what Oregon does so we should have expected it.

Unfortunately PSU stuck with what they do which is try to create explosive plays on defense with maximum pressure that includes moving LBs & DBs around on blitzes. Oregon beat the pressure with screens and quick release slants.

I think Oregon’s speed surprised PSU….if they play again, PSU won’t be surprised.

 

[AWS1022]

Sure, but I think having scored the touchdown (and getting an XP) lifts the team. I don't think going for two and making it helps that much more psychologically especially compared to missing it and the negative impact psychologically.

From an analytics standpoint, I agree with going for 2.

Is this the only board that beats to death a topic that had no impact on the outcome of the game?

 

[PurposePitch]

It makes sense to go for two, but I generally think about the psychological aspect if you miss. It deflates a team right after they score a TD and should be riding high. And I think that is tough to quantify.

If they go from "inflated" because of a TD to pull them to within one score of the opponent, to deflated because they failed to convert, but they're still within one score of the opponent ... they need psychological counseling.

 

[NittanyChris]

What do I have to expound on? The math says you go for 2 there, because it increases your chance to win. They failed to convert. Poop happens. It was still the correct decision.

You’re freaking out about it because you’ve been conditioned over many years and many stupid decisions, to accept the suboptimal decision of attempting the extra point.

That’s not math or logic’s problem … or Franklin’s for that matter … that’s your problem.

Now, if you want to complain about the play call itself … I would not have chosen the Philly special. But that’s the bad you have to accept with AK, who brings a lot of good, too.

“The math”, says no such thing. Your whole premise is ludicrous.

I posted the below elsewhere and it remains accurate.

So you run a low probability play, the 2 pt attempt, hoping it slightly increases the odds of winning the game, if successful.

When, in reality, the far more likely outcome, that the two point attempt fails, greatly decreases your odds of winning.

Makes absolutely no statistical sense at all.

 

[KnightWhoSaysNit]

LOL.. You are the only person in the universe who thinks that was on Dinkins. It's hilarious.

Actually, I would have given it high odds that Dinkins was in error. He was not expecting the ball for some reason, or was not on the same page with Allar as to the pattern.

When the QB and receiver are not on the same page it can make the QB look awful. That's what happened on that play. It's likely that the QB would have known the play better than Dinkins.

 

[94LionsFan]

“The math”, says no such thing. Your whole premise is ludicrous.

I posted the below elsewhere and it remains accurate.

So you run a low probability play, the 2 pt attempt, hoping it slightly increases the odds of winning the game, if successful.

When, in reality, the far more likely outcome, that the two point attempt fails, greatly decreases your odds of winning.

Makes absolutely no statistical sense at all.

You seem very sure about this, so what is the success rate on 2-pt conversions? Either for PSU or CFB as a whole?

 

[doctornick]

Is this the only board that beats to death a topic that had no impact on the outcome of the game?

I didn't bring it up and honestly I'm not really all that invested in either choice in that situation. But I do think there is a psychological aspect to consider that the analytics can't directly address.

 

[m.knox]

Actually, I would have given it high odds that Dinkins was in error. He was not expecting the ball for some reason, or was not on the same page with Allar as to the pattern.

When the QB and receiver are not on the same page it can make the QB look awful. That's what happened on that play. It's likely that the QB would have known the play better than Dinkins.

Well, many disagree, including HVI.

It was then Drew Allar's turn to fight through adversity. Allar threw a pass behind Khalil Dinkins, getting picked off by Dontae Manning and returned to the one-yard line. It was Allar's first interception since November 2nd against Ohio State and handed Oregon another touchdown.

 

[psrurock]

Look at what happened before the pass, Dinkins was pushed in the back. That made the pass look worse than it was

 

[m.knox]

Look at what happened before the pass, Dinkins was pushed in the back. That made the pass look worse than it was

It was essentially a pick six. And on Allar.

 

[roswelllion]

I’ve been a Franklin defender for a long time now. He really has many outstanding attributes; an extraordinarily hard worker, a man of great integrity and class, a fantastic teacher of and role model for young men, a sensational recruiter, an excellent eye for talent, a strong advocate for the football program and a terrific representative of my Alma Mater.

Sadly, what I’ve also learned watching him all these years is he is indisputably bad at in-game coaching decisions including when to go for it on fourth down, when to go for a 2 point conversion, time management and when to challenge a call, for example.

As a fan, it’s extremely frustrating because of all that he does so well, yet ultimately falls short in big games because of poor in-game decisions. Should he be fired? No, that’s not fair. Will he learn from his mistakes and make better in-game decisions? He hasn’t shown that ability as of yet.

You make it sound like your proclamation is something we have been waiting for. I say BS.
Here is another version.
Trailing 28-24 in the 3rd quarter and 4th and 5 the analytics say kick the FG.
Going for 2 is a coin toss.
In either case neither really mattered.

Here is why we lost. Oregon was a better team. With their 14 transfers and completely new DL, WR and Secondary they had too many horses.
Ohio State beat us with a $20 million dollar payroll and they too were the better team.

The fact that we were within one score is too the credit of CJF and his staff for building a group of talented and hard working kids that continue to punch above their weight. NIL will bring us to a crossroads. We will move forward and be competitive or slip backwards and be a perennial top 20 team but not top 10-12.

funny, two weeks ago against Minny he was big Balls James. Now he is a terrible game manager.

 

[PurposePitch]

“The math”, says no such thing. Your whole premise is ludicrous.

I posted the below elsewhere and it remains accurate.

So you run a low probability play, the 2 pt attempt, hoping it slightly increases the odds of winning the game, if successful.

When, in reality, the far more likely outcome, that the two point attempt fails, greatly decreases your odds of winning.

Makes absolutely no statistical sense at all.

The math absolutely does say such a thing. It's very straightforward stats and percentages. Basic math. Figure it out. Think about this ... you finally "snapped" and became anti-Franklin because you're being illogical and math illiterate. So maybe you should come to your senses and support Franklin again. Or chose to be be stubborn, ignorant and just flat out embarrassingly wrong.

https://footballscoop.com/news/coaches-always-go-two-14-late

 

[NittanyChris]

You make it sound like your proclamation is something we have been waiting for. I say BS.
Here is another version.
Trailing 28-24 in the 3rd quarter and 4th and 5 the analytics say kick the FG.
Going for 2 is a coin toss.
In either case neither really mattered.

Here is why we lost. Oregon was a better team. With their 14 transfers and completely new DL, WR and Secondary they had too many horses.
Ohio State beat us with a $20 million dollar payroll and they too were the better team.

The fact that we were within one score is too the credit of CJF and his staff for building a group of talented and hard working kids that continue to punch above their weight. NIL will bring us to a crossroads. We will move forward and be competitive or slip backwards and be a perennial top 20 team but not top 10-12.

funny, two weeks ago against Minny he was big Balls James. Now he is a terrible game manager.

Oregon is the better team, to be sure. That said, the game was winnable and the better team doesn’t win 100% of the team.

As I said in my post, I like CJF for a lot of reasons, but he didn’t become a bad game manager this week, he’s been that way for years.

 

[PurposePitch]

Oregon is the better team, to be sure. That said, the game was winnable and the better team doesn’t win 100% of the team.

As I said in my post, I like CJF for a lot of reasons, but he didn’t become a bad game manager this week, he’s been that way for years.

Here, you make that assessment only because you can't handle basic math and you're demonstrably and unequivocally wrong. You wanted him to make the clearly illogical decision to support your ignorance. But now that you're hopefully more educated on the matter, you'll apologize for doubting Big Game James and pledge your undying fealty ... or at least stop being a weenie.

 

[diontechristmas]

PSU outgained and outplayed the #1 team in the country for large stretches in the game. It was a few costly turnovers and the inability of the defense to get a key stop or two when needed that did us in.

But, everything is still in front on this team. Franklin needs to beat SMU and Boise, period. It won’t be often that PSU gets such a gift of a bracket in the playoffs and he needs to make it count.

 

[Kasparaitis]

Allar was the least of our problems. We put up 37 (should be 38) and he accounted for 4 scores.
People have to learn the game beyond "let's blame the QB"
It's also funny because the national narrative today is "Allar has the more upside than Sanders or Ward", "Allar reminds me of Josh Allen", "Allar gives Penn State a chance to contend for a title" yet our fan base, maybe because they haven't seen a good QB in 30 years believes Allar is either the problem or part of it. Only here.

You’re funny.

 

[Kasparaitis]

Sure, but I think having scored the touchdown (and getting an XP) lifts the team. I don't think going for two and making it helps that much more psychologically especially compared to missing it and the negative impact psychologically.

From an analytics standpoint, I agree with going for 2.

Analytics is for losers. You don’t go for 2 there no matter what some pinhead from Dartmouth says.

 

[ryoder1]

I actually feel James did well.

I didn’t see any of the OSU issues if clamming up.

The 2 of conversion. I get the hand wringing but it makes sense. The analytics (remember 20 yrs ago the As started analytics in baseball. Now it’s everywhere. Sometimes it works. Sometime it doesn’t. He also put ball in best player hand.

The bomb. It wasn’t a horrible call. I agree with dinking and dunking and killing clock but that wasn’t guaranteed. 2nd 1 calling bomb is not unheard of. It wasn’t not greatly executed.

We went blow for blow with best team in cfb. We had 2 turnovers . They had none. Sometimes games are like this.

This to me was a team who felt they could win and very well could’ve. Oregon executed slightly better last night. Games like this happen. But for James - I felt it was his best performance.

Probably one of his best on the big game stage simply because our offense showed up and we didn't look scared and tight. We fought back and hung in there. On the 2 pointer I guess he was thinking an OT game favors them and if we can steal 2 points and get it on an odd number then we could win it at the end. If the 2 pointer had been good then we are driving at the end to win it.

I am now concerned about the defense. Franklin is to blame for our poor performance along with Allen. I get Oregon is a prolific offense but you can't give up 38 points. 37 points should have been enough. We should have been able to hold them to 31 at most. The fact that they ran over our defense on the first 3 drives like a mack truck was pathetic.

 

[ryoder1]

LOL... Loado thinking he's God again......

The first pick was on Allar. Second one he threw it to the inside where the defender was. Poor throw. Overall he played a very good game but made mistakes and was not perfect.

 

[bdroc]

You make it sound like your proclamation is something we have been waiting for. I say BS.
Here is another version.
Trailing 28-24 in the 3rd quarter and 4th and 5 the analytics say kick the FG.
Going for 2 is a coin toss.
In either case neither really mattered.

Here is why we lost. Oregon was a better team. With their 14 transfers and completely new DL, WR and Secondary they had too many horses.

PSU had 6 of the 10 highest rated players in that game.

 

[NittanyChris]

The math absolutely does say such a thing. It's very straightforward stats and percentages. Basic math. Figure it out. Think about this ... you finally "snapped" and became anti-Franklin because you're being illogical and math illiterate. So maybe you should come to your senses and support Franklin again. Or chose to be be stubborn, ignorant and just flat out embarrassingly wrong.

View embedded media

https://footballscoop.com/news/coaches-always-go-two-14-late

View embedded media

Your little video boy’s data is way off. Here’s the most recent data on 2 point conversions in college football:

“According to recent data, the success rate for a 2-point conversion in college football in 2024 is around 32.4%.”

That is well below a coin flip, making his calculations moot. So it’s he and you who are “math illiterate”.

Now, I’m out. Hopefully, your logic deficiency improves with age. Good day, sir.

 

[PurposePitch]

Analytics is for losers. You don’t go for 2 there no matter what some pinhead from Dartmouth says.

Yeah, let’s listen to Kasparaitis who says “winning is for losers!”

 

[PurposePitch]

Your little video boy’s data is way off. Here’s the most recent data on 2 point conversions in college football:

“According to recent data, the success rate for a 2-point conversion in college football in 2024 is around 32.4%.”

That is well below a coin flip, making his calculations moot. So it’s he and you who are “math illiterate”.

Now, I’m out. Hopefully, your logic deficiency improves with age. Good day, sir.

You poor thing. That’s a sample size blip. This isn’t a “video boy” … it’s a well known, well established fact.

 

[PSUWrestlingFanSince2011]

Refs ****ed us so bad I’m not putting this one on James.

 

[LandoComando]

The first pick was on Allar. Second one he threw it to the inside where the defender was. Poor throw. Overall he played a very good game but made mistakes and was not perfect.

No one is perfect--the had three very bad passes out of 4 in the 3rd including the play where Warren lined up as tackle and the throw was high
The picks weren't on him as much as people want them to be--hence the PFF grade

 

[PSU20]

I actually feel James did well.

I didn’t see any of the OSU issues if clamming up.

The 2 of conversion. I get the hand wringing but it makes sense. The analytics (remember 20 yrs ago the As started analytics in baseball. Now it’s everywhere. Sometimes it works. Sometime it doesn’t. He also put ball in best player hand.

The bomb. It wasn’t a horrible call. I agree with dinking and dunking and killing clock but that wasn’t guaranteed. 2nd 1 calling bomb is not unheard of. It wasn’t not greatly executed.

We went blow for blow with best team in cfb. We had 2 turnovers . They had none. Sometimes games are like this.

This to me was a team who felt they could win and very well could’ve. Oregon executed slightly better last night. Games like this happen. But for James - I felt it was his best performance.

The problem with the call was we were methodically moving the ball all game long. On 2nd and 1 with a little over 2 minutes left, get the easy 1st down and then try a deep throw if you feel good about the play. But, why give the ball to Gabriel who methodically moved the ball with ease all game. He would have marched With time left on the clock say minute - minute half, he would have marched his team right down the field for a winning FG.

I thought it was a freaking horrible call which is why I'm not a coach. But, JF is now "1-14" against top five opponents, and the one we won was the lucky FG block vs OSU in 2016 at the Beav.

 

[m.knox]

The problem with the call was we were methodically moving the ball all game long. On 2nd and 1 with a little over 2 minutes left, get the easy 1st down and then try a deep throw if you feel good about the play. But, why give the ball to Gabriel who methodically moved the ball with ease all game. He would have marched With time left on the clock say minute - minute half, he would have marched his team right down the field for a winning FG.

I thought it was a freaking horrible call which is why I'm not a coach. But, JF is now "1-14" against top five opponents, and the one we won was the lucky FG block vs OSU in 2016 at the Beav.

Agreed. A lot of play callers will take a shot on second and short, but in that scenario, run the ball. They were having success with it all game. Get an easy first down and run your 2 minute drill. Over thought it yet again.

 

[91Joe95]

My biggest frustration at least this year are all the unsportsmanlike penalties.

Which is nothing new. Franklin's teams too often are undisciplined.

 

[BucksLion52]

Agreed. A lot of play callers will take a shot on second and short, but in that scenario, run the ball. They were having success with it all game. Get an easy first down and run your 2 minute drill. Over thought it yet again.

I don't agree with the play call at all. Like many of us I was absolutely shocked at that play call. Continue to run the ball, take time off the clock. Don't give Gabriel the ball back with more than 30 seconds left. Also, since when is Wallace a deep threat?? If you want to isolate a receiver on a DB for a go route throw it to Omari Evans, our fastest receiver.

 

[LandoComando]

I don't agree with the play call at all. Like many of us I was absolutely shocked at that play call. Continue to run the ball, take time off the clock. Don't give Gabriel the ball back with more than 30 seconds left. Also, since when is Wallace a deep threat?? If you want to isolate a receiver on a DB for a go route throw it to Omari Evans, our fastest receiver.

I still fully believe they took the shot because they felt like they needed time in case the 2 pt conversion failed again.

 

[PSUWrestlingFanSince2011]

I still fully believe they took the shot because they felt like they needed time in case the 2 pt conversion failed again.

Correct

 

[roswelllion]

Your little video boy’s data is way off. Here’s the most recent data on 2 point conversions in college football:

“According to recent data, the success rate for a 2-point conversion in college football in 2024 is around 32.4%.”

That is well below a coin flip, making his calculations moot. So it’s he and you who are “math illiterate”.

Now, I’m out. Hopefully, your logic deficiency improves with age. Good day, sir.

My coin toss comment was a philosophical coin toss not a statistical one. If you google 2 point conversion strategy it covers the analytics and then has an interesting discussion of this very case. I am not a statistics major but I am pretty sure if the chance of success is 33% the logic follows this line of reasoning.
. kick the pat twice - chance of success [around 95%] best outcome is a tie and overtime
. go for 2 make the first kick the 2nd 33% and 97% - YOU WIN
. go for 2 and make one of the 2. Much higher than 33% and very near the the 2 PATs

The article says what drives those decisions are 2 things. Is your team any good at 2 point conversions? Are you playing to win in regulation or tie and go to OT. There is nothing I read that says one or the other is clear cut, hence my "coin toss" comment.

A couple final thoughts
. the same folks who thought we should go on a 4th and 5 [with still no guarantee of a score] don't think we should go on [effectively] a 4th and 3 at the goal line.
. two weeks ago he was Big Balls James for going on 4th down and running a fake punt. this week he is a goat for going for 2.
Having said that IMO the thing that was baffling was his logic doesn't hold when looked at together. He goes for 2 to try and win on I'll call it 4th and 3 and kicks from 4th and 5 and doesn't go for the win.
His explanation was if it was 4th and 2 or 3 he would have gone for it. those extra 2 yards are offset by the less compact field your playing in. [the 20 instead of the 3]

 

[Lion84]

I think Oregon’s speed surprised PSU….if they play again, PSU won’t be surprised.

Yeah but PSU without a quality WR that can get separation will continue to hold us back - look what Tez did to us.