Three more transfers - McPhearson, Wade and Polk

[caseofthemondays]

A record 111 underclassmen have declared for the draft, up from the previous record last year. I wouldn't read too much into the guys looking to get drafted, more guys are deciding to go pro regardless of where they will be drafted.

I thought Polk and Johnson played more this year than they should have. It felt like the underclassman made more plays(considering opportunity) and were more reliable. I imagine they had a pretty good idea where they are in the program right now, regardless of any talk with the staff.

Wade and McPhersons would be nice for depth, but no more. Hardly a surprise they would look to find themselves higher on a depth chart somewhere.

Very little of this seems surprising.

You can talk of processing, but it goes both ways. I would have a problem with basically telling a kid get out, but no issue letting them know where they stand with regards to playing time. You are free to stay, continue to work, and get your degree; but playing time is earned.

Last year Tommy Stevens would have been in the transfer portal if it existed, as he looked around and ultimately decided to stay.

 

[spoog19050]

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Last week the naysayers were crying that PSU recruits too many WRs/DBs and this week they are crying about depth.

 

[mgkpsu]

I think we can reasonably infer that Franklin is being fairly blunt with some of these guys. But that may be the best approach, in the long run.

Kinda like when the kid in the stands was blunt with him after 4th and 5? I wonder if any of the players needed to be restrained?

 

[Judge Smails]

 

[spoog19050]

Kinda like when the kid in the stands was blunt with him after 4th and 5? I wonder if any of the players needed to be restrained?

Doubt it. The kid in the stands was a dbag. Do you think that kid would say that to a player or coach behind closed doors?

 

[Texas Lion]

I am going to say this is what happens:

If Nick Cross flips to Penn State, Wade will indeed follow through on his transfer.

If Nick Cross sticks with FSU, Wade will pull himself from the portal and stay and fight it out.

 

[mgkpsu]

Doubt it. The kid in the stands was a dbag. Do you think that kid would say that to a player or coach behind closed doors?

Why, is a 40 year old "professional" going to take a swing in that situation?

The kid was actually quite respectful:

 

[4rosco]

I am going to say this is what happens:

If Nick Cross flips to Penn State, Wade will indeed follow through on his transfer.

If Nick Cross sticks with FSU, Wade will pull himself from the portal and stay and fight it out.

Do you think Franklin and the coaching staff want him back at this point if he is afraid of competition? They could have already decided and are moving on with who they have and trying to make the team better.

 

[Texas Lion]

Total guesses but fun for conversation.

I think Wade went to his end of the season meeting where Franklin told him that Cross was a possibility. Wade, I think, can handle 2 deep but with Cross he was probably going to be 3rd string....might as well leave.

I understand Polk, I understand Zech.....I don't get a two deep guy wanting to go....unless of course they are now projected to be 3 deep.

 

[jferretti]

Aren't the players who see opportunity elsewhere the ones making the requests?

I am not critical of that at all. But perhaps we should be concerned about a program that does not present enough opportunites here. If the goal is to compete with the tOSU's of the world we had better figure a way.

 

[Woodpecker]

a thread of senior citizens crying about kids transferring

Or at least requesting more information about the process to get a better understanding. And discussing the ramifications on next year's roster. Wah!

 

[spoog19050]

Why, is a 40 year old "professional" going to take a swing in that situation?

The kid was actually quite respectful:

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KInd of like Rutgers coach Doug Graber being respectful with Paterno after the game?


There is a difference between a professional private conversation and calling someone out in public.

 

[Texas Lion]

LOL.

Wanna' bet?

Sure, unless of course you are an insider and already know for sure it won't happen!!

 

[KnightWhoSaysNit]

Do you think Franklin and the coaching staff want him back at this point if he is afraid of competition? They could have already decided and are moving on with who they have and trying to make the team better.

What makes you think you know the motivation for putting one's name in the database? Maybe Wade knows he's not as good as the starters, or maybe he thinks he's better but, in his view, the staff won't be fair.

Had Stevens transferred last year I doubt very much that his motive would have been a fear of competition. Choosing a school with holes at the position simply removes a potential obstacle that is beyond one's control -- the wants or bias of a coach.

 

[GregInPitt]

Do you think Franklin and the coaching staff want him back at this point if he is afraid of competition? They could have already decided and are moving on with who they have and trying to make the team better.

CJF has room for Cross no matter what Wade does. The previous losses to the NFL and transfers opened up enough room to take 7 additional 2019 players. I believe CJF is going after Cross regardless of Wade's decision. Sure Rudolph and Cross if he comes just add to the competition of Brisker, Sutherland, Monroe and Petrishen, but more realistically if Wade could not beat out those true freshmen he sure isn't going to beat out all of Sutherland, Brisker and Monroe, and Cross and Rudolph are more likely to be potential starters possibly in 2020, but more likely in 2021 and beyond....

 

[4rosco]

What makes you think you know the motivation for putting one's name in the database? Maybe Wade knows he's not as good as the starters, or maybe he thinks he's better but, in his view, the staff won't be fair.

Had Stevens transferred last year I doubt very much that his motive would have been a fear of competition. Choosing a school with holes at the position simply removes a potential obstacle that is beyond one's control -- the wants or bias of a coach.

The post I responded to said that he was predicting if Cross flips from FSU to PSU that Wade will leave and if he doesn't than Wade would return.

 

[4rosco]

CJF has room for Cross no matter what Wade does. The previous losses to the NFL and transfers opened up enough room to take 7 additional 2019 players. I believe CJF is going after Cross regardless of Wade's decision. Sure Rudolph and Cross if he comes just add to the competition of Brisker, Sutherland, Monroe and Petrishen, but more realistically if Wade could not beat out those true freshmen he sure isn't going to beat out all of Sutherland, Brisker and Monroe, and Cross and Rudolph are more likely to be potential starters in 2021 and beyond....

I understand that. The post I responded to predicted that if Cross flips than Wade is gone but if doesn't than Wade would return.

 

[anon_xdc8rmuek44eq]

Total guesses but fun for conversation.

I think Wade went to his end of the season meeting where Franklin told him that Cross was a possibility. Wade, I think, can handle 2 deep but with Cross he was probably going to be 3rd string....might as well leave.

I understand Polk, I understand Zech.....I don't get a two deep guy wanting to go....unless of course they are now projected to be 3 deep.

This likely never, ever, happened. Franklin says to a two year contributor who will see significant playing time (whether as a starter or not) 'Hey, Lamont - looks like that JC transfer we signed will probably play before you (and yeah, I know he hasn't played against the same competition as you or anything and he's not even on campus), and this one prospect, who is still in HS and who is still committed to another school, yeah, he too will likely play before you because, you know, he's taller and penciling in true freshmen on the 2 deep is all the rage these days and it's been super successful for us in the past. Thanks - you should probably enter the portal.'

My guess? Wade wants to play more and has an opportunity to start at several schools (maybe closer to home). When playing time starts to become the be all end all for players, and it's getting there, having an elite 22 is going to be everything.

 

[GregInPitt]

Honesty yes, blunt meaning encouraging them to leave? I doubt it considering the need for depth and practice competition.

Johnson
Polk
Wade
McPhersons
Sanders
Bates
McGovern
Givens

All gone without being replaced at this point with 19 freshmen coming in. All could have helped as either potential starters, in the three deep rotation, or on special teams, not to mention the competition they provide in practice. My guess is the staff is scrambling.

Yep, those 8, and the 2 LB's that are transferring (Darien and the Carolina kid) will be losses from practice. But with the 11 early enrollee's the Spring practice roster will be pretty much normal from a numbers stand point. There may be positions a little short on numbers, but there are walkon's as well, and at a number of these positions it's the young returning players (OL, DT, ...) that need the practice reps anyway......

 

[GregInPitt]

I understand that. The post I responded to predicted that if Cross flips than Wade is gone but if doesn't than Wade would return.

Yep, I was just trying to make a case that Wade has little to do with what CJF does regarding Cross, as there was room for him and the need for additional talent anyways. And that Wade, as far as competition goes, would be more concerned about Sutherland, Brisker and Monroe, than he would about any true freshmen.

 

[anon_xdc8rmuek44eq]

Yep, those 8, and the 2 LB's that are transferring (Darien and the Carolina kid) will be losses from practice. But with the 11 early enrollee's the Spring practice roster will be pretty much normal from a numbers stand point. There may be positions a little short on numbers, but there are walkon's as well, and at a number of these positions it's the young returning players (OL, DT, ...) that need the practice reps anyway......

Two things I know for sure in college football - you're not going to win without quality depth, and relying on freshmen to make a significant impact is a losing strategy. We're only a few years removed from having our LB corps wiped out against Michigan. Losing quality depth should be a concern for any team.

 

[GregInPitt]

Two things I know for sure in college football - you're not going to win without quality depth, and relying on freshmen to make a significant impact is a losing strategy. We're only a few years removed from having our LB corps wiped out against Michigan. Losing quality depth should be a concern for any team.

Agree on depth, and mostly on freshmen. But programs like Bama, Clemson, and oh-high-ya have been winning big while relying on high talent freshmen for years, and Clemson's strategy to start a true freshman QB looks pretty good right now. With CJF getting high 4 and 5 star players in numbers the last 2 cycles that will also begin to be more common at PSU as well...

Lots of work for CJF this Spring, with the additional starting spots from the NFL defections to work to find the best players, and building the depth it takes to win. I'm hoping players like Monroe and Petrishen stay just for the impact they can have on special teams. That's where losing a good athlete like Darien hurts. He wasn't going to play much in 2019 but he's a mature, solid athlete that could have been a special teams captain.

But there will likely be players in 2019 like the example Luketa set in 2018. A talented true freshmen that competed for playing time but won't make the 2 deep, but will still play in every game and not redshirt by just contributing on special teams. I look for Dixon to be such a player in 2019.

 

[anon_xdc8rmuek44eq]

Agree on depth, and mostly on freshmen. But programs like Bama, Clemson, and oh-high-ya have been winning big while relying on high talent freshmen for years, and Clemson's strategy to start a true freshman QB looks pretty good right now. With CJF getting high 4 and 5 star players in numbers the last 2 cycles that will also begin to be more common at PSU as well...

Lots of work for CJF this Spring, with the additional starting spots from the NFL defections to work to find the best players, and building the depth it takes to win. I'm hoping players like Monroe and Petrishen stay just for the impact they can have on special teams. That's where losing a good athlete like Darien hurts. He wasn't going to play much in 2019 but he's a mature, solid athlete that could have been a special teams captain.

Clemson can afford to start a freshman because all the other pieces are in place. And he's sort of that rare talent who can come in right away and play - name another school who has done that regularly with success.

And I think it's funny that Wade, a 5 star prospect looking to transfer, is suddenly worse than these other, unproven 'high 4 and 5 star players' who have come in the last two recruiting cycles. You guys are very much in the 'two in the bush' camp. And giving up on a guy like Darien or even Wade is interesting since we've had several examples of players suddenly blooming late in their careers (Haynes, Nassib, B. Johnson, Hull).

 

[Thomas1945]

Clemson can afford to start a freshman because all the other pieces are in place. And he's sort of that rare talent who can come in right away and play - name another school who has done that regularly with success.

And I think it's funny that Wade, a 5 star prospect looking to transfer, is suddenly worse than these other, unproven 'high 4 and 5 star players' who have come in the last two recruiting cycles. You guys are very much in the 'two in the bush' camp. And giving up on a guy like Darien or even Wade is interesting since we've had several examples of players suddenly blooming late in their careers (Haynes, Nassib, B. Johnson, Hull).

I totally agree with your last paragraph. The only qualifier is that the names you quoted apparently wanted to be here despite the early adversity that they faced. Wade for reasons we are just speculating on appears not so inclined. Perhaps one day the real story will unfold as to his reasons.

 

[djr4rebs]

relying on freshmen to make a significant impact is a losing strategy.

I don't desire for any of our current players to leave before graduation. Yet, I can't lose sleep over a guy whose contributions on the field significantly declined from his freshman to sophomore years AFTER we graduated 4 DBs. Those who keep bringing up special teams play are grasping at straws. Yeah, he made some tackles, but it wasn't like he was the first man down every kickoff and every punt.

As for relying on freshmen, you didn't say "except for Clemson and Alabama." You simply said: "relying on them is a losing strategy." It's not true. Kelly Bryant doesn't have the arm to beat Alabama. Dabo relied on a freshman early enough to get him the experience to have the opportunity to win that game.

 

[PearlSUJam]

I totally agree with your last paragraph. The only qualifier is that the names you quoted apparently wanted to be here despite the early adversity that they faced. Wade for reasons we are just speculating on appears not so inclined. Perhaps one day the real story will unfold as to his reasons.

My guess is that he wants to be closer to a reputable studio so that he can work on his rap music. I'm totally serious about that.

 

[anon_xdc8rmuek44eq]

I don't desire for any of our current players to leave before graduation. Yet, I can't lose sleep over a guy whose contributions on the field significantly declined from his freshman to sophomore years AFTER we graduated 4 DBs. Those who keep bringing up special teams play are grasping at straws. Yeah, he made some tackles, but it wasn't like he was the first man down every kickoff and every punt.

As for relying on freshmen, you didn't say "except for Clemson and Alabama." You simply said: "relying on them is a losing strategy." It's not true. Kelly Bryant doesn't have the arm to beat Alabama. Dabo relied on a freshman early enough to get him the experience to have the opportunity to win that game.

It is true with few exceptions. Talk about grasping at straws.

 

[GregInPitt]

Clemson can afford to start a freshman because all the other pieces are in place. And he's sort of that rare talent who can come in right away and play - name another school who has done that regularly with success.

And I think it's funny that Wade, a 5 star prospect looking to transfer, is suddenly worse than these other, unproven 'high 4 and 5 star players' who have come in the last two recruiting cycles. You guys are very much in the 'two in the bush' camp. And giving up on a guy like Darien or even Wade is interesting since we've had several examples of players suddenly blooming late in their careers (Haynes, Nassib, B. Johnson, Hull).

You must not believe that Clemson and Bama lose players each year to say that "all the other pieces are in place". Sure, PSU's roster is not up to what Clemson and Bama and oh-high-ya have. But the talent is building up on PSU's roster. And Clemson also started a true freshmen WR that performed extremely well, a second rare talent. If Shorter wasn't injured last year PSU may have had a true freshman leading WR as well. And Bama plays lots of young players on their great teams. As PSU's roster continues to stock talent PSU will be playing more young players with success as well.

No one here knows if Wade would have won the starting position in competition with Brisker, Sutherland, Monroe, and Petrishen, so all here are speculating. But there sure must be reasons that Wade is strongly considering leaving, although they could be personal for all anyone here knows. Wade is pretty outgoing so it seems to me that he will comment on the reasons by the time he either stays or finds a new home.

"You guys" ?? I saw enough from Darien in the B/W that I was hoping he would get a chance on the field for significant PT in 2018. But as a fan that does not see practice, that's not a very informed point of view. And I also still hope Wade decides to stay, so don't put me in whatever group you may be forming about giving up on talented recruits/players......

 

[anon_xdc8rmuek44eq]

You must not believe that Clemson and Bama lose players each year to say that "all the other pieces are in place". Sure, PSU's roster is not up to what Clemson and Bama and oh-high-ya have. But the talent is building up on PSU's roster. And Clemson also started a true freshmen WR that performed extremely well, a second rare talent. If Shorter wasn't injured last year PSU may have had a true freshman leading WR as well. And Bama plays lots of young players on their great teams. As PSU's roster continues to stock talent PSU will be playing more young players with success as well.

No one here knows if Wade would have won the starting position in competition with Brisker, Sutherland, Monroe, and Petrishen, so all here are speculating. But there sure must be reasons that Wade is strongly considering leaving, although they could be personal for all anyone here knows. Wade is pretty outgoing so it seems to me that he will comment on the reasons by the time he either stays or finds a new home.

"You guys" ?? I saw enough from Darien in the B/W that I was hoping he would get a chance on the field for significant PT in 2018. But as a fan that does not see practice, that's not a very informed point of view. And I also still hope Wade decides to stay, so don't put me in whatever group you may be forming about giving up on talented recruits/players......

We are not Bama and Clemson. Neither is anyone else.

 

[GregInPitt]

We are not Bama and Clemson. Neither is anyone else.

Thanks. We all know that. But PSU will still see top freshmen perform well, just like many teams that recruit top talent. Parsons was a pretty good example of a plug and play top talent taking over a position for PSU, especially given his having to learn a new position as well. Shorter would have been another if he would have been healthy. And there are some candidates going into 2019 as well, although I can't say I would predict any true freshmen to start early in the season if at all in 2019.

For me, this is what makes college football fun. The turnover every year and the speculation on who will play and the level of play that the team will get from the new players. Although whats going on now is pretty unprecedented.

 

[KnightSlayer]

Two things I know for sure in college football - you're not going to win without quality depth, and relying on freshmen to make a significant impact is a losing strategy. We're only a few years removed from having our LB corps wiped out against Michigan. Losing quality depth should be a concern for any team.

So what point exactly are you trying to make? Do you think Franklin has a strategy to get rid of quality depth and rely on freshmen?

 

[anon_xdc8rmuek44eq]

Thanks. We all know that. But PSU will still see top freshmen perform well, just like many teams that recruit top talent. Parsons was a pretty good example of a plug and play top talent taking over a position for PSU, especially given his having to learn a new position as well.

For me, this is what makes college football fun. The turnover every year and the speculation on who will play and the level of play that the team will get from the new players. Although whats going on now is pretty unprecedented.

For every one Parsons we get, Clemson and Bama get four or five. When we're at that level (and do it every year), I'll worry less about transfers.

I'm glad this is fun for you though - I hate it.

 

[anon_xdc8rmuek44eq]

So what point exactly are you trying to make? Do you think Franklin has a strategy to get rid of quality depth and rely on freshmen?

I do not. In fact, I would think if he could, Franklin would convince half of the guys leaving to stay. My point is if you're not worrying about mass transfers, you probably should be (unless you are Bama or Clemson or maybe OSU). That is all.

 

[djr4rebs]

It is true with few exceptions. Talk about grasping at straws.

Jalen Hurts was QB in a title game. Jacob Fromm led UGA to the title game a year later. Tua stepped in after halftime of the same title game and along with 4 WRs sparked a Bama victory. Trevor Lawrence was named starter by week 4, 5 for Clemson and the Ross kid became a huge threat in the playoffs.

All were freshmen.

All in just the last 3 seasons.

Hell, we just had Saquon. He was starting to show that he was the man by his second or third game. As a freshman. There aren't very many of these players every year, but the teams that get them benefit immensely.

 

[GregInPitt]

For every one Parsons we get, Clemson and Bama get four or five. When we're at that level (and do it every year), I'll worry less about transfers.

I'm glad this is fun for you though - I hate it.

The normal turnover is fun. But this is excessive and for sure could negatively impact the wins and losses in 2019, and that is not fun.

Our special teams coach, who didn't seem so special last year, will have his work cut out for him getting the talented but inexperienced true freshman coached up to be good special teams coverage players and blockers, as that's where most of the transfer losses will likely show up.....

 

[cjrugger]

Or at least requesting more information about the process to get a better understanding. And discussing the ramifications on next year's roster. Wah!

Yeah 380 posts 'requesting more information about the process.' Thats exactly whats going on here

 

[SR108]

This board is so precious

You all love to call these kids snowflakes and talk about how soft they are, yet here we are on page 9 of a thread of senior citizens crying about kids transferring

Not crying at all, if the coaches can do it the players should also be able to do it. Just pointing out the issues that they will have to deal with.

 

[anon_xdc8rmuek44eq]

Jalen Hurts was QB in a title game. Jacob Fromm led UGA to the title game a year later. Tua stepped in after halftime of the same title game and along with 4 WRs sparked a Bama victory. Trevor Lawrence was named starter by week 4, 5 for Clemson and the Ross kid became a huge threat in the playoffs.

All were freshmen.

All in just the last 3 seasons.

Hell, we just had Saquon. He was starting to show that he was the man by his second or third game. As a freshman. There aren't very many of these players every year, but the teams that get them benefit immensely.

Yes, that is true - there are always a handful of outstanding freshman performers in a given year. My point is if you're relying on that as a consistent winning strategy, you're not going to win consistently. And as good as Saquon was, and he is a generational back, he wasn't enough. Plug him in at Georgia, OSU or Bama? And he probably has 2,000 yards rushing (and is on a NC team).

 

[eidolon21]

Transfer Rules We don't need no stinkin' transfer rules. Seriously I expect the Fields precedent to open the flood gates.

 

[anon_xdc8rmuek44eq]

Transfer Rules We don't need no stinkin' transfer rules. Seriously I expect the Fields precedent to open the flood gates.

To counter, the P5 schools will no doubt try to figure out a way of their '4 year' guaranteed scholarship agreement. So, they want Player A from the portal but don't have room - buh buy Player B; you have no scholarship next year.