and Michigan. Let's be honest about it. They recruit way better than we do. Sure we got hurt by the Big, But even before that we couldn't compete with Ohio State and Michigan. Go back 50years and compare the records and National Championships, and where were they , Ohio State and Alabama really do stand out. I love my Lions, have had season tickets since 1991, but please quit crying and now that we have our scholarships, let's see what we do.
To all the People who complain on this board about Ohio State
- Thread starter walleye38
- Start date
At times we were better than they were, no reason to think that those days are permanently in the past.
Must not be that much better than PSU because if you go back 40 years OSU and Michigan combined have a total of 2.5 National Titles and PSU has 2. If it were not for two badly missed calls by BigTen Refs in 2014 PSU-OSU game it would be 1.5 to 2.
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We operate under different models. We have the Grand Experiment, Success With Honor, scholar athlete model. They have a win at all costs, football factory, semi pro, tatgate model. We'll never be able to defeat that kind of approach and that's why we call it out. It wasn't fair that Joe had to compete against it and it's still not fair for CJF. As a result "success" for CJF will be winning 1 out of every 5 games against the ahia state's of the college football world
I get your point and agree to a certain extent, but I believe the potential to recruit on an even par and to have success on the field certainly exists. To some extent, Franklin has illustrated that PSU has a lot to sell recruits. On the other hand, this season has also illustrated that in order to secure and keep all those recruits, you need to win. Like it or not, fair or not given the sanctions, Franklin needs to start winning and start beating the big boys in the conference.
Not sure that I agree completely. I believe we can maintain our Graduation rates and win. We certainly do it in other sports and there are other schools such as Stanford and ND that do a pretty good job of it. It's not impossible.
Actually, our bowl record (28-15-2) is substantially better than either of theirs (tOSU 22-24, Michigan 21-23).
And you can certainly make the case that from the late 1960s through the mid to late 1990s we had a better overall program than either of them.
And you can certainly make the case that from the late 1960s through the mid to late 1990s we had a better overall program than either of them.
Total BS. Do a little research and compare the bowl records and the won lost records against the top team since the 60s. Pre B10 PSU had a winning record against OSU.
So Michigan hires a coach and suddenly they're way ahead of us for the past 50 years? Really? Let's look since 2005: UM is 83-56 (59%) and PSU 96-44 (69%). UM had three losing seasons in that time and PSU had 0. Even in the sanctions years PSU's record was 29-21 and UM's was 30-21. So please do not put Michigan ahead of Penn State and hold them up as a program Penn State hasn't ever been able to compete with.
And PSU has way more undefeated, untied seasons including a Major Bowl victory going back 50 years, PSU has 5 seasons where they went undefeated, untied and won the Orange, Fiesta or Rose Bowls! BTW, the reason the OP choose the odd number of last 40 years (back to 1976) rather than the much more logical number of last 50 years (back to 1966) is quite clear - over the past 50 years (even with the worst 5 year period in PSU history from 2000-2004 and the illegitimate sanctions in 2011) PSU is the 4th winningest program in the nation by wins (439) behind UNL (476), OU (455) and tO$U (450).....Alabama and scUM are tied at 5th behind PSU with 434 wins each. When you go to 40 years, PSU drops to 7th in the nation (345 wins) behind scUM who is 6th at 350. The b1g shiz-hole fans are really pathetic to denegrate PSU's tradition over the past 50 years considering that they were #1 in the nation in bowl winning % over this span and #1 in undefeated, untied seasons with a Major Bowl win over the span as well - really pathetic! But don't forget, these @sshole's who need to "cheat" to beat PSU and screw them out of additional undefeated, untied seasons aren't "biased" in the least.....pathetic little douchebag trolls and why we stay in this pathetic bushleague conference is well beyond me.
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For 20-30 years, up until the time that JoePa (and, to a fairly large extent, the overall staff) REALLY fell off in the recruiting effort.....PSU competed with anyone on the recruiting front - and most certainly with OSU and UM.
For a time, PSU more-or-less "kicked ass" - even in Ohio.....grabbing a TON of outstanding prospects out of the Buckeye state (Just OTTOMY - Shaffer, Blackledge, Carter, Ennis, McDuffie, Hartings, Joe J, Kim Herring, Sam Ruhe, John Gerak, Rich Buzin, and....of course.....Joe Hines!)
Michigan - for a long time - was a much more "national" recruiting team (that doesn't mean "better"....just that they recruited from a much broader base - which they kind of had to do, since Michigan is a not a real football rich state, and - aside from going into Ohio and competing with OSU/PSU/ND...they had to go out and get those California/Texas/etc kids - using their significant "Brand" awareness to do so)
Obviously, the recruiting "game" has changed a lot in the last 20-30 years (IMO, not for the better....but it is what it is)....those changes, which JoePa was probably not comfortable with - for justifiable reasons - along with a lazy, lethargic approach from a significant portion of the staff - really changed PSU's profile in the "recruiting wars".
For better or worse, that is changing....and changing fairly dramatically and rapidly.
There was a point in time and it was a question during a televised football game that from 1966 to whatever year that was, Joe Paterno's won-loss record was exactly the same as Ohio State's.
In the not so distant past, Joe Paterno had more bowl victories than Ohio State and Michigan COMBINED.
In the not so distant past, Joe Paterno had more bowl victories than Ohio State and Michigan COMBINED.
The only things those teams were better than us at during most of my youth (70s and 80s) was losing Rose Bowls.
Talk about boring football
Talk about boring football
Yeah, tOSU is riding high, and Michigan is trending up, but each program is only a pregnant cheerleader or a nervous breakdown away from losing their glamour coach.
And the competition in the meantime is a good thing IMO for the PSU program.
And the competition in the meantime is a good thing IMO for the PSU program.
