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5W20 vs 5W30

91Joe95

Well-Known Member
Aug 15, 2003
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I have a 2003 Accord with the 2.4L engine. 5W20 is recommended in the owner manual, but I have read of the benefits of switching to 5W30 or even 0W20 as cars get older. This one has 185K miles. Everything I've read says 5W20 was mostly picked for its very minor fuel mileage increase, but 5W30 can actually provide better lubrication. Anybody ever do this or have thoughts on it?
 
I've never really trusted the new thinner oils- I agree that protection is better with a heavier viscosity- especially in hot weather. But if you're using a full synthetic, there probably isn't a lot to worry about either way. If it were me, I'd go up a weight anyway.
 
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0W20 vs. 5W20 just means the oil is thinner for cold starts during the winter. If you keep your car in the garage it won't make any difference. Even outside it won't matter unless it's really cold (in the teens or colder).

The theory with switching to heavier weight oils for older cars is that the engine is worn and therefore larger gaps between moving parts. 30 is heavier than 20 (obviously), so I wouldn't recommend switching unless you know for sure that your engine has worn enough that 20 isn't providing the necessary lubrication.
 
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I have a 2003 Accord with the 2.4L engine. 5W20 is recommended in the owner manual, but I have read of the benefits of switching to 5W30 or even 0W20 as cars get older. This one has 185K miles. Everything I've read says 5W20 was mostly picked for its very minor fuel mileage increase, but 5W30 can actually provide better lubrication. Anybody ever do this or have thoughts on it?

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The 1999 Toyota Corolla.

Let’s talk about features.
Bluetooth: nope
Sunroof: nope
Fancy wheels: nope
Rear view camera: nope . . . but it’s got a transparent rear window and you have a effing neck that can turn.

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Things this car is old enough to do:
Vote: yes
Consent to sex: yes
Rent a car: it IS a car

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Interesting facts:
This car’s exterior color is gray, but its interior color is grey.
In the owner’s manual, oil is listed as “optional.”
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You wanna know more? Great, I had my car fill out a Facebook survey.
Favorite food: spaghetti
Favorite TV show: Alf
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This car is as practical as a Roth IRA. It’s as middle-of-the-road as your grandpa during his last Silver Alert. It’s as utilitarian as a member of a church whose scripture is based entirely on water bills.
When I ran the CarFax for this car, I got back a single piece of paper that said, “It’s a Corolla. It’s fine.”

Let’s face the facts, this car isn’t going to win any beauty contests, but neither are you. Stop lying to yourself and stop lying to your wife. This isn’t the car you want, it’s the car you deserve: The effing 1999 Toyota Corolla.
 
I have a 2003 Accord with the 2.4L engine. 5W20 is recommended in the owner manual, but I have read of the benefits of switching to 5W30 or even 0W20 as cars get older. This one has 185K miles. Everything I've read says 5W20 was mostly picked for its very minor fuel mileage increase, but 5W30 can actually provide better lubrication. Anybody ever do this or have thoughts on it?


Why the eff would one step down to a thinner oil (0w20) on an older engine? You’d be doing nothing but sending oil past worn rings and out the exhaust pipe...

The ONLY difference between 5w30 vs 10w30 is COLD weather performance

Just stick with a brand name 5w30 synthetic and a good filter (ie: anything without the word “Fram” on it) and you're fine
 
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I have a 2003 Accord with the 2.4L engine. 5W20 is recommended in the owner manual, but I have read of the benefits of switching to 5W30 or even 0W20 as cars get older. This one has 185K miles. Everything I've read says 5W20 was mostly picked for its very minor fuel mileage increase, but 5W30 can actually provide better lubrication. Anybody ever do this or have thoughts on it?

If you're looking for higher viscosity, use the 5w30. 0w20 and 5w20 are supposed to provide the same lubrication properties, albeit at different weights.

And, yes, the lighter oils are specified by the vehicle manufacturers to improve their CAFE (Corporate Average Fuel Economy) rating with the NHTSA.
 
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Why the eff would one step down to a thinner oil (0w20) on an older engine? You’d be doing nothing but sending oil past worn rings and out the exhaust pipe...

The ONLY difference between 5w30 vs 10w30 is COLD weather performance

Just stick with a brand name 5w30 synthetic and a good filter (ie: anything without the word “Fram” on it) and you're fine

Or the word "Honda" on it, unless the part number ends in A01. The "new" A02s are made by Fram and have the telltale cardboard end caps.
 
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The reason manufactures recommend 5W20 so often in newer model cars is the bearing clearances are less than older cars. Thus, the thinner oil gets better lubrication between the bearings and crankshaft.
 
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The reason manufactures recommend 5W20 so often in newer model cars is the bearing clearances are less than older cars. Thus, the thinner oil gets better lubrication between the bearings and crankshaft.

Sounds like you've been talking to a service rep at your dealer...and you buy what he says, hook, line, and $$$$inker.
 
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Why don't we just use a SAE 10 motor oil so we can get instant lubrication on engine start up?
The reason is simple: it would be a SAE 10 motor oil at 210° F! The lower the viscosity, the more wear will inevitably occur. This is why it is best to use the proper oil viscosity recommended by the auto manufacturer as it will protect hot and at cold start ups. Obviously a 10W-10 motor oil won't have the film strength to prevent engine wear at full operating temperature like a 5W-20, 10W-30 or 5W-30 motor oil for example.

The VI additives have the effect of keeping the oil from thinning excessively when heated. The actual mechanics of this system are a little more complex in that these additives are added to a thinner oil so that it will be fluid at a cold temperature. The VI additives then prevent thinning as the oil is heated so that it now can pass the SAE viscosity rating at 210. For example; if you have a SAE 10 motor oil it will flow like a 10W at the colder temperature. But at 210 degrees it will be a SAE 10 giving us a 10W-10 or SAE 10 viscosity rating. Obviously this is good at cold start up, but terrible at engine operating temperature especially in warmer climates. But by adding the VI additives we can prevent the oil from thinning as it is heated to achieve higher viscosity numbers at 210 degrees. This is how they make a petroleum based motor oil function for the 10W-30 rating. The farther the temperature range, like with a 10W-40, then more VI additives are used. With me so far? Good, now for the bad news.

Drawbacks of Viscosity Improving additives
Multi-grade motor oils perform a great service not being too thick at cold startup to prevent engine wear by providing more instantaneous oil flow to critical engine parts. However, there is a draw back. These additives shear back in high heat or during high shear force operation and break down causing some sludging. What's worse is once the additive begins to be depleted the motor oil no long resists thinning so now you have a thinner motor oil at 210 degrees. Your 10W-30 motor oil can easily become a 10W-20 or even a SAE 10 (10W-10) motor oil. I don't have to tell you why that is bad. The more VI additives the worse the problem which is why auto manufacturers decided to steer car owners away from motor oils loaded with VI additives like the 10W-40 and 20W-50 viscosities.

The less change a motor oil has from high to low temperatures gives it a high Viscosity Index. Synthetic motor oils that are made from Group IV (4) PAO base stocks have Viscosity Indexes of more than 150 because they are manufactured to be a lubricant and don't have the paraffin that causes the thickening as they cool. But petroleum based motor oils (Group I (1) & II (2)) usually have Viscosity Indexes of less than 140 because they tend to thicken more at the colder temperature due to the paraffin despite the addition of Viscosity Improving additives. The higher the Viscosity Index number the less thinning and thickening the motor oil has. In other words, high number good, low number bad. Low numbers thicken more as they cool and thin more hot. You see these Viscosity Index ratings posted on data sheets of motor oils provided by the manufacturer.

http://www.upmpg.com/tech_articles/motoroil_viscosity/
 
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Can you put synthetics in a car if you never used them before?
 
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I would never purchase an “OEM” replacement filter from a dealer unless they were spinning it on for me ;)

Of course not. But there are a couple of Honda dealers that sell OEM oil filters on line for about the price you'd pay for a Purolator in a box store. Key is to put together an order with enough stuff so that shipping isn't a killer.
 
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I have a 2003 Accord with the 2.4L engine. 5W20 is recommended in the owner manual, but I have read of the benefits of switching to 5W30 or even 0W20 as cars get older. This one has 185K miles. Everything I've read says 5W20 was mostly picked for its very minor fuel mileage increase, but 5W30 can actually provide better lubrication. Anybody ever do this or have thoughts on it?

I’d split it and go 5W25
 
Why don't we just use a SAE 10 motor oil so we can get instant lubrication on engine start up?
The reason is simple: it would be a SAE 10 motor oil at 210° F! The lower the viscosity, the more wear will inevitably occur. This is why it is best to use the proper oil viscosity recommended by the auto manufacturer as it will protect hot and at cold start ups. Obviously a 10W-10 motor oil won't have the film strength to prevent engine wear at full operating temperature like a 5W-20, 10W-30 or 5W-30 motor oil for example.

The VI additives have the effect of keeping the oil from thinning excessively when heated. The actual mechanics of this system are a little more complex in that these additives are added to a thinner oil so that it will be fluid at a cold temperature. The VI additives then prevent thinning as the oil is heated so that it now can pass the SAE viscosity rating at 210. For example; if you have a SAE 10 motor oil it will flow like a 10W at the colder temperature. But at 210 degrees it will be a SAE 10 giving us a 10W-10 or SAE 10 viscosity rating. Obviously this is good at cold start up, but terrible at engine operating temperature especially in warmer climates. But by adding the VI additives we can prevent the oil from thinning as it is heated to achieve higher viscosity numbers at 210 degrees. This is how they make a petroleum based motor oil function for the 10W-30 rating. The farther the temperature range, like with a 10W-40, then more VI additives are used. With me so far? Good, now for the bad news.

Drawbacks of Viscosity Improving additives
Multi-grade motor oils perform a great service not being too thick at cold startup to prevent engine wear by providing more instantaneous oil flow to critical engine parts. However, there is a draw back. These additives shear back in high heat or during high shear force operation and break down causing some sludging. What's worse is once the additive begins to be depleted the motor oil no long resists thinning so now you have a thinner motor oil at 210 degrees. Your 10W-30 motor oil can easily become a 10W-20 or even a SAE 10 (10W-10) motor oil. I don't have to tell you why that is bad. The more VI additives the worse the problem which is why auto manufacturers decided to steer car owners away from motor oils loaded with VI additives like the 10W-40 and 20W-50 viscosities.

The less change a motor oil has from high to low temperatures gives it a high Viscosity Index. Synthetic motor oils that are made from Group IV (4) PAO base stocks have Viscosity Indexes of more than 150 because they are manufactured to be a lubricant and don't have the paraffin that causes the thickening as they cool. But petroleum based motor oils (Group I (1) & II (2)) usually have Viscosity Indexes of less than 140 because they tend to thicken more at the colder temperature due to the paraffin despite the addition of Viscosity Improving additives. The higher the Viscosity Index number the less thinning and thickening the motor oil has. In other words, high number good, low number bad. Low numbers thicken more as they cool and thin more hot. You see these Viscosity Index ratings posted on data sheets of motor oils provided by the manufacturer.

http://www.upmpg.com/tech_articles/motoroil_viscosity/
Sluggo very impressive. I am lost
 
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Sounds like you've been talking to a service rep at your dealer...and you buy what he says, hook, line, and $$$$inker.

The truth always gets the attention of those who like to bullshit and don't know WTF they are talking about!
 
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The truth always gets the attention of those who like to bullshit and don't know WTF they are talking about!

And a fool and his money are soon parted. You must be a real popular guy at your dealer's service department.
 
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tenor.gif
 
And a fool and his money are soon parted. You must be a real popular guy at your dealer's service department.

And, I know fools like you who sit around and bull shit their entire lives since they know a "little bit" about everything, but know nothing about one thing. We will anoint you as a "Webster" since you impart all your knowledge with one liners of complete and utter Bull Shit. That keyboard makes you feel important!
 
And, I know fools like you who sit around and bull shit their entire lives since they know a "little bit" about everything, but know nothing about one thing. We will anoint you as a "Webster" since you impart all your knowledge with one liners of complete and utter Bull Shit. That keyboard makes you feel important!

You do? Well lucky fvcking you. I'm sure your service rep appreciates your deep insights into human nature all the way to his commission check.
 
I have a 2003 Accord with the 2.4L engine. 5W20 is recommended in the owner manual, but I have read of the benefits of switching to 5W30 or even 0W20 as cars get older. This one has 185K miles. Everything I've read says 5W20 was mostly picked for its very minor fuel mileage increase, but 5W30 can actually provide better lubrication. Anybody ever do this or have thoughts on it?
I'm probably not the right person to ask. I have a 97 Maxima with 245,000 miles and a leaky rear bearing seal, so I use 15W50 in an attempt to make the leak as slow as possible. :eek:
 
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You do? Well lucky fvcking you. I'm sure your service rep appreciates your deep insights into human nature all the way to his commission check.
wow? service reps get commission checks? Next you'll tell me the wrenches work off flat rate.
 
Yeah, service reps are getting straight up rich off changing your oil every 6-9 months. That's about $.75 to $2.50 in commission for them depending upon the type of vehicle and oil, excluding high end luxury vehicles. The real question is, what do they do with all that cash?
 
Yeah, service reps are getting straight up rich off changing your oil every 6-9 months. That's about $.75 to $2.50 in commission for them depending upon the type of vehicle and oil, excluding high end luxury vehicles. The real question is, what do they do with all that cash?

That's true (in fact I doubt they get anything on a simple oil change) but they do better on a successful upsale when you bring that car in for an oil change.
 
That's true (in fact I doubt they get anything on a simple oil change) but they do better on a successful upsale when you bring that car in for an oil change.

I bet you are a big hit at the local coffee shop each morning imparting your worldly knowledge to those emotional imbeciles willing to listen.
 
I bet you are a big hit at the local coffee shop each morning imparting your worldly knowledge to those emotional imbeciles willing to listen.

You'd lose, but you're used to that.
 
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