I remember a while ago, my childhood team, the Dallas Cowboys won 5 Super Bowls. I'll slink my way out the back door now.
Iowa vs Minnesota
- Thread starter royboy
- Start date
Can/will T&T succeed in utilizing those tools to achieve that change? Would Real Woods be the best recent example of success in that department, and if so, can that be replicated?
Can’t be “Carl is just a recruiter not a developer” - said at least a thousand times on GIA and its predecessor.
Time will tell but I’m not confident they will. We have some very good transfers in Desanto, Eierman, and Woods. Franek and Caliendo were also good additions. Iowa is falling further behind in recruiting IMO. We have Deluca coming in and maybe Angelo Ferrari but not sure he will ever make it to campus. We aren’t getting enough difference makers out of high school.
And everyone who said that is flat out wrong. He obviously prepares his guys better than anyone else for March. You just have to look at the results.
The way I see it is pretty simple. The leadership (i.e. head coach) sets the level of the bar. I don't think anyone on this board would argue that Dan Gable was one of the greatest college coaches of all time regardless of what sport you're talking about. Iowa has every right to be proud of his accomplishments even 20 years later. It was also clear that when Gable finally stepped aside, he was leaving a very big pair of shoes to fill, and so far, nobody has been able to fill them at Iowa.
During that same period of time after Gable stepped down, the Penn State alumni, fan base, administration, etc. was getting pretty frustrated with seeing a program deliver less than spectacular results even though their potential recruitment base was probably the richest in the country. This frustration cumulated with Sunderland having his contract terminated at the end of the 2009 season. It's interesting what happened next. It seems that Penn State did not have Cael in mind when they started looking for a new head coach, but at some point in the process, he became aware they were looking for someone and he threw his hat into the ring. We all know now how that turned out. Now the bar is at least as high as when Gable was at Iowa and possibly higher. There's no way that Iowa can catch up until they find the equivalent of a Gable or Sanderson. The Brands are just not at that level.
No matter how you want to rank OkSt, Iowa and Penn St, the PSU wrestling program is the only one of the three to never face NCAA sanctions.
naa, just grew up and got over the childlike attraction of the star on the helmet (I did).
Somebody pin this.
Turk isn't here for legitimate discussion, so don't pretend he is.
Yeah pin it! Only legitimate wrestling discussions exist here right? How many times has Spencer Lee's moms glasses been talked about here? Who is pretending what?
Good Lord, what a drama queen - you're over here to defend Lee's Mother's honor. [insert eyeroll].
Nothing to see here.
2 pages of wrestling talk followed by 5 pages of the same old bickering between Iowa and PSU fans.
There is now, and there is used to be.
I choose now.
2 pages of wrestling talk followed by 5 pages of the same old bickering between Iowa and PSU fans.
There is now, and there is used to be.
I choose now.
This article is unintentionally funny. The Iowa “greats” listed here were meat and potato wrestlers who gutted out decisions. No match for what Cael was building toward.
What happened with Spencer's mom's glasses?
Angel has them now and STILL can't officiate.
My mind just imagined the brothers one standing on the other's shoulders and cael still looking down on them.
These comments got me thinking about what constitutes a "great head coach" in this modern era of college wrestling and, in the context of Iowa, who they could theoretically bring in that could help them consistently win national titles.
John Smith/Okie State presents an interesting case study. Smith is indisputably one of the greatest U.S. wrestlers of all time and most would consider him a great coach. Yet, in his 33-year tenure as head coach he has won "only" 5 NCAA team titles, with the last one coming 18 years ago. He rattled off 4 in a row from 2003 to 2006, but Okie State's star has progressively dimmed since then.
I don't know all the factors that account for Okie State's decline, but hiring an all-time great wrestler and "great coach" clearly is no guarantee of sustained success at the highest level.
I mean, as wrestlers:
Cael > Gable > Smith > Brands
And as coaches:
Cael > Gable > Smith > Brands
The last Gabe to assess a PSU wrestler’s rating early in his career was Gabe Dean vs Ed Ruth in Binghamton. It wasn’t pretty in that first meeting. And it turned out reasonably well for him.
If Gabe wrestles v Carter, it will be similar. And it will probably turn out well for him. Just not this year.
Unless Carter goes for another and then MM moves up.
Iowa will need to remove Rob Koll from coaching. He has more National Champions than Iowa since Cael took offer. Then, ….maybe….
We can rule out the "throw money at 'em" approach.
Slumlord Bob tried that with Nagao, Truax, Mesenbrink, and Griffith. It worked on Ferrari.
Did they go after Mesenbrink like that? The Nagao and Truax portal deals were big news with all kinds of speculation about Slumlord Millionaire's bag, and they were pretty much written in ink in Iowa's lineup on GIA (or HR if it was still HR). Mesenbrink was way under the radar compared to that circus while all that was going on, like "oh yeah, and this guy portaled in to Penn State, too". Our reaction here was wow, good wrestler but he doesn't even have a spot.
That wasn't my reaction! I thought he would come in and stomp anyone at 165 or 157 (yes I said it shoot me) and take what he wanted. I also was lucky enough to watch him in a practice room up close and personal wrestling a guy who is world level good. I also knew Nate Carr was deeply concerned about him, which is enough to make anybody else in his way concerned. I don't know if he can win it this year but he is going to win the next three without much of a challenge if he is healthy. KOT is going up to 174 next year and the psycho will bleed everyone else out with his 30-40 shots per match. Ben holds back in his praise on FRL but he is actually in awe on MM and his attitude and talent. I do think Amine presents a tough challenge as he will attempt to keep the match from becoming a wrestling skills competition, but this is the type of guy Mitch needs to figure out how to overcome. He came to the right place to master wrestling and win senior world gold medals.
Thank you for admitting he is great! Cyclone are sure tough guys. He would stand alone by a huge margin if he were a Hawkeye, but alas a greater one than him arrived in Ames and claimed that spot.
Edited out the booster’s slang name but wanted to respond by noting all of this happened after all were assured recruiting / portal recruiting was equal for the first time ever.
Keuter is in no way, shape, or form ready for Kerk.
I think he has his tank issues fixed by then but he's way too small for Kirk.
220lbs is not going to get it done.
I think Gabe and Star would be closer than many think. Star is very methodical in matches like this and Gabe is tough to take down. I'm guessing a 5-2 type match that isn't as close as the score.
Franek and Haines is a tossup imo. Franek appears too wrestle to the level of his competition.
Edit to clarify: Haines will obviously be favored but it wouldn't shock me if Franek beat him.
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@James P. Whitters III has been on the Mesenbrink train forever. Called him the best available in the portal by far last March. Said there wasn't a clear need/fit at PSU but he is a kid you put on the full court press for and figure it out later.
Yeah, it didn’t take long for me to be convinced about him.
Regardless, there was very little buzz about him in general compared to Nagao and Truax at the time.
Depends on how Arnold does underneath Carter.... C-Star has been a different wrestler on top this year. If Arnold isn't able to get off bottom, Carter would work him.
He is the greatest college wrestling coach there has ever been. No doubt about it. One of the best college coaches all time in any sport
That is an absolute fact! Coach Gable was an incredible coach and is still an amazing person. Cael is creeping up imo and may pass him, but that does nothing to lower my feelings about coach Gable.
