Sammy Sasso
- Thread starter BrucePa
- Start date
...jes some additional D11 standouts over the years that I also followed...
John Fritz - NCAA Champion
Matt Reiss - ditto
Scott Turner - ditto
Don Rohn - ditto
Darian Cruz - ditto
Tom Sculley - ditto
Rob Rohn - ditto
Pat Santoro - 2X champ
Geoff Baum - 2X champ
...all great kids...
John Fritz - NCAA Champion
Matt Reiss - ditto
Scott Turner - ditto
Don Rohn - ditto
Darian Cruz - ditto
Tom Sculley - ditto
Rob Rohn - ditto
Pat Santoro - 2X champ
Geoff Baum - 2X champ
...all great kids...
With Lugo not being a pinner, I hope we see Gardner get a shot against him. Love Verk’s courage, but I want to see what Gardner has got. Right now, he may not be as good as Verk, but I think he has more upside. I’d like to find out if that is true in duals before March and not in the room where guys see each other every day.
One of the reasons Cael has been successful is that he knows the type and character of the wrestlers he recruits. There will sometimes be wrestlers who don't fit this model that go on to great success elsewhere but that doesn't mean he was the right fit for PSU and what Cael is building. I wish Sasso the best.
Cowbell may have other reasons, but from my perspective there are too many negatives when focusing on the season's goal.
II's a huge tourney (31 teams, 11 of the top 20) in the first weekend of December. Can't do it and Midlands/Scuffle 3 weeks later -- too much, too close together.
The holiday tourneys better simulate the run-up to nationals -- have some duals, then a week off before a huge tourney. CKLV does not afford that, unless the team has an extended break around Thanksgiving. But that means squeezing in non-conference duals at some other point in the year.
Many of the teams are already on PSU's schedule -- not as bad as Midlands, but worse than the Scuffle. Cael believes seeing different teams prepares his guys to see different styles at nationals.
Also, the CKLV teams often peak too early, suffer injuries, etc. Probably because they're in such a brutal tourney so early in the season.
Your thoughts and reasoning might very well be true. However what will you think IF over the next few years PSU comes up one deep scoring wrestler short of a Team title. Sasso ends up being 4x AA and graduates with honors. I would think, not just the fans but behind close staff doors they would have second thoughts on not recruiting him.
It would be far easier to accept the fact he chose not to go to Penn State than he was not recruited by PSU.
I watched Sasso tonight wrestle the 4th ranked freshman from Minnesota. Very tough match. Sasso scored counter takedown with about 20 seconds left to win.
Both kids are gonna be tough at BIGs.
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Hmmm. Callthestall, you may have an exceptional fascination for the emotion called regret. (Not that there’s anything wrong with that.) I can’t remember, were you also the guy who would not stop regretting that Cael did not bring an extra back up 184 pounder to ASU?
If you ever forget your BWI password, your next username can be Feeltheregret!
#allingoodfun
He has regerts.Hmmm. Callthestall, you may have an exceptional fascination for the emotion called regret. (Not that there’s anything wrong with that.) I can’t remember, were you also the guy who would not stop regretting that Cael did not bring an extra back up 184 pounder to ASU?
If you ever forget your BWI password, your next username can be Feeltheregret!
#allingoodfun
The list of NCAA champs and finalists PSU did not recruit is very long.
We recruited only 3 finalists in 2015 -- the year we didn't win: Brown, Snyder, and Gwiz. The other finalists included some all-timers: Cox, Stieber, Martinez, Dieringer, Dean. Plus some other guys who really would've helped like Coon, Brewer, ...
Is it hard to accept passing on them? It potentially cost us a national title.
Is it hard to accept passing on Mitchell Port? He was a finalist that year and is from Centre County ...
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You would certainly know better than me but was Port not recruited because of perceived ability or a character issue ?
The issue about the Sasso non-recruitment is a little personal to my own history. I was 18 and had a very bad moment in judgement. It involved drinking legally in NJ and driving(not legal). No one got hurt but let's just say I had to make a phone call. That one night I REGRET to this day. I've made a point not to have it happen again. It was a lessoned learned.
Did that isolated event make me a bad person or did it make me a better person by learning from it.
If Cael and Co. chose not to make play for Sasso because of one incident then that's my disappointment.
I hope this shares some thoughts of why I have been critical on this issue.
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Kid avenged his losses to Brayton Lee in in a very FUN match last night. I'll pick one of these two to win 49 this year.
I think you are missing my point. The reason we have won 8 of 9 is how Cael recruits. If he had broken his model consistently in the past, how many less championships might we have? How many less great wrestlers (and persons) might have passed on PSU if they didn't bond with those already on the team? You can't have it both ways. You can't celebrate tons of victories that are the result of a philosophy and then cry when once in a while you lose a championship because you stuck to what you know works right. I'll take whatever Cael is dishing out 8 of 9 years any time and live with the rest of the consequences. Flip flopping your approach to recruiting and culture doesn't work ...
Feel like they already have had such a back and forth rivalry, and they’re only freshmen—going to be fun to watch them go at it for years to come.
Culture certainly is part of the concept and success of the program. So is the reputation of the coaching staff with Cael being reverned in the wrestling community. Also the facilities and the PSU environment would be a good recruiting tool.
As I noted before, the concerns about Sasso character maybe was warranted. However your argument painting the picture Cael would never recruit a kid with skeletons in the closet is wrong. Maybe he didn't know about them. I will not mention names but I know 2 kids he recruited that did have some issues.
The flip flop issue is not on me, I've been consistent about this issue since Sasso committed to Ohio State.
I think it's easy to hide behind the character issue but we have little knowledge about every kid he recruits. I think you would be very neive to think he hasn't recruited a kid that maybe made a bad decision while being a teenager.
we've won 8 of 9, so i'll go with what cael and the staff feel about individuals. looks like it works. do we miss some, absolutely. can't get them all. that's life. our approach to recruiting doesn't bother me one iota.
That's just blatantly false. Sasso took 3 shots. I rewatched it yesterday. Were they very effective? No, but he took 3 shots nonetheless...the same amount that Lugo took. The difference is Lugo was much closer to scoring in his attempts.
Watch it yourself again..
And.....if you were a devout Mormon hoping to set examples for your charges.....
I’ve never talked to him about this but knowing his expectations for personal development and hopes for spiritual growth, I’d guess any place named Sin City might be avoided.
Cael sets his standards however he chooses. He also seems gracious and genuine in forgiving and maybe feels his program can help some thru difficult situations.....we all have something in the closet, or most do. It doesn’t matter the sport, we all probably have someone we wish wore our teams colors. In the end, if Cael didn’t think it was a match, it’s hard to second guess this level of success in those decisions. And frankly, some that were on the edge of Cael’s spectrum, didn’t stay. So.....
I’ll also say this: Tan Tom is a high character guy and his wrestlers reflect this. Sasso is in a very good spot there, regardless.
"One incident" is a whitewash. It was the result of a recurring pattern of behavior.
He has since cleaned that up and good for him.
Meanwhile Cael has won 8 of 9 titles identifying talent his way. The reasons for past decisions are irrelevant -- he is winning big with a clean program.
If Sasso costs us one, and we drop to 8 of 10, I'm not second guessing Cael or downgrading him to a B-.
I personally know of one issue that was outside of a school perimeter. I was told he had had a few school issues that involved skipping classes and accusations of inappropriate behavior.
When I referenced "one issue" I was talking about the police situation which actually also involved another great District 11 wrestler.
Maybe you know of other issues that I don't and for that,I stand corrected.
I'm not saying Sasso was a Saint but Cael recruited another kid from the area with some school issues which I know for fact.
When I referenced "one issue" I was talking about the police situation which actually also involved another great District 11 wrestler.
Maybe you know of other issues that I don't and for that,I stand corrected.
I'm not saying Sasso was a Saint but Cael recruited another kid from the area with some school issues which I know for fact.
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What's not to like about this kid. The offense will come. He's only a freshman. His counters are top shelve. Once he puts the attack in his arsenal he 'll be really dangerous because he'll either win on the take down off of his offense, scramble off of his shot to a take down or scramble to a stale mate.
Not event one?
Let's keep the PD3 references to one thread, OK?
If you're referring to the Chlebove allegation -- I would hope everybody understands that Penn State Athletics cannot allow itself to be associated with that even 3rd or 4th hand. Even if not present that day. Even if everyone is later exonerated.
PSU does not get the benefit of the doubt now, and maybe not even after a certain state inmate dies.
If that makes Sasso collateral damage, that's unfortunate but that's life.
Penn State Wrestling fan's options regarding Sammy Sasso:
A.) Lament not getting him for 4 years (or more).
B.) Hope the kid flames out to "vindicate" Cael for not recruiting him.
C.) Enjoy his wrestling and root for him when not wrestling our guys. And understand the limitations of 9.9 scholarships.
I'll take C. Seems like the only reasonable option.
A.) Lament not getting him for 4 years (or more).
B.) Hope the kid flames out to "vindicate" Cael for not recruiting him.
C.) Enjoy his wrestling and root for him when not wrestling our guys. And understand the limitations of 9.9 scholarships.
I'll take C. Seems like the only reasonable option.
LOL, slush, I love your takes. And your positing of them. I feel like we're so similar in lots of ways, so I particularly enjoy it when I disagree with you. Well, in this case, it's not disagreement, per se, just that I reacted/responded differently to this Sasso - Lugo bout. And I, like you, am particularly vulnerable to feeling "annoyed." But Sasso's counterwrestling & the excitement it produced, to me, was far more enjoyable (and thus anti-annoying) than a Beckman/Karam one-knee performance, or a Mike Evans/Sam Stoll Pushfest performance, or a Daton Fix Supreme Offensive Talent Who Frustratingly Keeps It Holstered performance. Sasso's scrambles, and energy & movement, especially against a center-mat bull like Lugo, had me on the edge of my seat, like what is this guy gonna do next? For those reasons, the relative lack of initiated offensive attacks by the winner did not annoy me.
However (b/c, again, we're pretty similar here), I *was kinda annoyed by Brands holding Warner out against Kollin Moore. Just as I was annoyed at Gable holding Wes Hand out against Kerry McCoy in '97, quipping (via phone call to Zalesky & Brands, since Gable himself was getting his hip repaired and didn't attend the BJC dual then)(from Zavorall's Season on the Mat, of course) "he hasn't earned the right to face somebody that good."
Two things were different about how Brands handled this (from how Gable directed him to handle Hand & McCoy): first, notably, Brands didn't forfeit. At least Moore got to compete, unlike McCoy, and to Cash Wilcke's credit, he held the bout to a Decision. Second, check out how Brands handled informing Warner and the reason he gave:
What the heck is that? Gable at least gave a decent quotable, even if it was b.s. and not transparent in the real reason: to stick a thumb in the eye of an opponent you're already dominating in the dual. Seems to me Brands & Gable both had the same real reason (thumb in the eye of an opponent you're already dominating in the dual), but that extra piece about Warner not even knowing he was being denied the chance to battle Moore, until Wilcke walked out? Definitely annoying to this fan.
You have quite more insight into these situations than I do and with that I understand your thoughts.
Just to be clear I know some these issues not by 3rd or 4th party rumors but because of friendships with police officers. I also have connections to maybe the ultimate insider in the wrestling community. If I'm ever told something that is supposed to be privey I do treat it that way.
You are obviously connected to the PSU inner workings. And for that your opinion has more merit than mine.
It's just my opinion.
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So difficult to comprehend the lack of notice unless Warner did something on the bench, or was back in the locker room. Or wasn't focused while warming up.
Especially with Brands, not exactly a shrinking violet.
IDK that my opinion has more merit. It's an opinion. I don't work in Lorenzo so my opinion doesn't mean all that much.
To be clear: by 3rd/4th hand, I didn't mean the source of our info -- I meant the relationship of any parties between Chlebove and PSU. 6 degrees of separation kind of thing.
So basically like PSU’s current 149 but with wins over 2 of the top guys at the weight?
I like B Lee better than Sasso anyway, I might be on an island with that opinion but.....
It looks like Cael passed on both Lee and David Carr who was also very high on my list. No idea if PSU was on either's radar but we can't get them all.
9.9 is a huge equalizer and the biggest factor in why I doubt we will see a modern team run off 6+ NCs in a row including Cael and the good guys.
That is until the impact of the transfer portal sorts out over the next few years.
I am a bit surprised that not even one top 10 kid out there @ 125 or 149 hasn't jumped at the chance to becone a lion and learn from Cael.
It looks like Cael passed on both Lee and David Carr who was also very high on my list. No idea if PSU was on either's radar but we can't get them all.
9.9 is a huge equalizer and the biggest factor in why I doubt we will see a modern team run off 6+ NCs in a row including Cael and the good guys.
That is until the impact of the transfer portal sorts out over the next few years.
I am a bit surprised that not even one top 10 kid out there @ 125 or 149 hasn't jumped at the chance to becone a lion and learn from Cael.
When Randy Newman got posted I thought it was a Smalls tribute.
" Short People"
" Short People"
I like BL a bit better too (Sorry CallTheStall). Both very talented. I do wonder what weight Sasso & Echemendia will wind up at next year.
Echemendia is not on Ohio State's roster (no idea why) but he's listed at 141 pm WrestleStat. That shocked me, thought for sure he'd be in the 149/157 range.
Likely logjam at 141-157 with those 2 + Kinner + D'Emilio + Mattox, plus Cleary has a year left. And none of them are going 165 with Kharchla 17-0 there.
This conversation just won’t end.
He went to Ohio State. Good for him and hopefully he excels. He’s in a good place. I knew him. So what.
and maybe...Cael just didn’t like him. Maybe it’s that simple Does this whole thing matter?
He went to Ohio State. Good for him and hopefully he excels. He’s in a good place. I knew him. So what.
and maybe...Cael just didn’t like him. Maybe it’s that simple Does this whole thing matter?
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