Since my wife is Or.., I mean Asian, you would think I would know that Oriental was now politically incorrect. I had no idea, but looked it up after I saw your post. Just proves your point since you would think I of all people would know that.
Senior WT Trials Thread
- Thread starter Tom McAndrew
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Since my wife is Or.., I mean Asian, you would think I would know that Oriental was now politically incorrect. I had no idea, but looked it up after I saw your post. Just proves your point since you would think I of all people would know that.
I once called an 8th grade teacher of mine a Polack, because I didn't know that that was offensive.
Of course, when he yelled and I shit my pants, he figured out that I was just an ignorant, arrogant SOB that needed the education he was giving.
How was I supposed to know Polack was a bad term? I heard it in a million jokes. What more does one need to know than that? Never made that mistake, again, I tell ya what.
Of course, when he yelled and I shit my pants, he figured out that I was just an ignorant, arrogant SOB that needed the education he was giving.
How was I supposed to know Polack was a bad term? I heard it in a million jokes. What more does one need to know than that? Never made that mistake, again, I tell ya what.
Crop, I'm a huge fan...from all the way back to your early days on the "G". That said, I'm hoping I am reading your first post, and those after it defending your position wrongly.
My thoughts are polar-opposite to yours (or maybe not, as I'm hoping). It's not emotion that has no place in sports. Pain, anger, disappointment, etc., are as natural as me breathing. How those emotions are channeled, is important however. When I read "If you're pissed off, you should act accordingly", or "I could care less if somebody wants to throw a chair", or even your unexplained reference to "guns, like in Russia".
Not sure where your "line" is, and I understand it may be at a different place than mine, my opinion is... unchecked bad sportsmanship doesn't end well, and quickly escalates into very bad behavior. And it has nothing to do with taking love and passion out of this sport.
Yes indeed. I held a global sales position for a dozen years with extensive travel to SE Asia, and didn't find out Oriental was taboo until I was educated at a dinner party in Easton, PA!! Stuff happens, which is why I caution against criticism on the first offense.
While there are comments here stating their positions on how Cael and Taylor reacted, I can't find anywhere in the thread that actually says what they did.
Can someone explain what happened after the match? Did they just complain or was it worse? Seems very out of character.
Can someone explain what happened after the match? Did they just complain or was it worse? Seems very out of character.
Heard the same jokes growing up...and I'm at least one generation, maybe two, older than you. After marrying a Pole, I can tell you, the joke's on us.
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From what I have pieced together, DT blast doubled the ref after the match from a dry area of mat to show him what the match could have looked like if it had been fair wrestling. The ref seemed not to take the lesson for what it was worth, and so Cael decided to explain matters further by slamming a folding chair into the ref's back to mimic the point that backs are just as important to scoring as blast doubles. The ref, being embarrassed that he didn't call the match correctly, took those lessons the wrong way and red carded the two. Simply looked like a misunderstanding to me.
I think that's what happened ...
DT pointed and jawed at the ref at the conclusion of the match. Ref approached his corner while holding up a card, Cael proceeded to toss the challenge brick and then a towel into the ref. As ref started to walk away, Cael put a folding chair up on the stage and flipped it mildly in the direction of the ref. DT kicked the challenge brick across the mat and then started pointing and jawing at someone off the stage (someone posted either here or on HR that they thought it was Bill Zadick).
I struggle w/ posting Twitter videos, but one is available on HR midway down this page:
https://iowa.forums.rivals.com/threads/throwing-a-chair-challenge-cube-and-red-carded.192838/
I think it is pretty clear that the young man has a problem. Here he is in December using the same slur in an interview (at 4:57 of the linked video):
Note that this interview took place very shortly after he had a heated match with American's Josh Terao. It would be a real shame if Thomas Gilman ended up being the U.S. representative at 57kg on the 2020 Olympic team, given that the Games take place in Tokyo. What an embarrassment it would be to send someone that has repeatedly and publicly used that particular slur to represent our country in Japan.
What's more is that Gilman claims to be a history buff (see here: http://www.hawkcentral.com/story/sp...tom-brands-terry-brands-ncaa-bigten/98343516/ ). In particular, this article notes the following:
"An avid reader and war history buff, he’s recently dove into Korean War topics through a box his late grandfather left him."
It stands to reason that a history buff such as Mr. Gilman knows EXACTLY the weight that the word he chooses to use carries, yet he continues to use it, notably immediately after having a heated match with Josh Terao ( http://www.aueagles.com/sports/m-wrestl/2016-17/bios/terao_josh_v1ld?view=bio ).
Edit: To those that are using the defense that "maybe he didn't know it was offensive": a) It's 2017, he should have figured it out by now and b) he knows enough that in the above video he qualified his statement by saying that he "doesn't know if it's politically correct to say." So he absolutely knows that the word carries some weight.
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Definitely something that needs corrected. Although I'm still reluctant to label the kid a racist. He's a meathead. I think we knew that already. At this point, I think the education he's received is more in question than whether he's a racist.
This politically correct stuff perplexes me.
I was chastised recently for making some reference to my dog.
I was told dogs here are now Canine-Americans.
I was chastised recently for making some reference to my dog.
I was told dogs here are now Canine-Americans.
Hyphenating Americans is one thing you'll never see me do. You're either an American or your not. I find -American to be an unhealthy label, even if it's self-labeling. We'll never be one as long as we seek separation.
Okay, only a little off topic.
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There is a line. I obviously don't want guns on the mat. However, especially in a style like Free or Greco, I've had athletes on the lesser side of a call. While I think officials are some of the best people on earth... They NEVER win. Some also act like they're NEVER wrong. I've had it out with officials. And ya know what? I've had some tell me that they had made the wrong call and we chopped it up, later.
While I love Free & Greco more than Folk, the subjectivity gets aggravating. Even worse, when politics get involved. I had an athlete get hosed because the other kid's coach/dad was a ref. They reversed the score, and they brought my athlete back to raise his hand. Everyone was uppity about it. They did the right thing, and I tried to keep my composure.
But where the hell does "composure" end and emotion/passion begin? It's a gray area. If Cael felt compelled to toss a brick at the ref, by lord, I say it's the right move. When Brands was chirping at the table judge in "Terry" about them "wanting the wrong guy to win", ya know what? He was probably right, too. As coaches... Athletes... People give their damn lives to this sport. It doesn't make us above the sport, but I'm sick of being told to sit in my chair and pat everyone on the back when I don't think it's right.
If you don't think something is right, we have a right to say, "No, you're wrong." That's the beauty of this country. Now, HOW we say that, is where the gray area lies. Some throw a chair, others strip their clothes, and I'll tell some kid's dad they're an idiot. Doesn't make us terrible people... Just rather poor at expressing our passion.
/rant
Maybe someone should have interviewed Taylor when he was in the middle of his temper tantrum. Or maybe someone has a cell phone recording of Taylor screaming at Zadick.
Clearly this isn't as serious as calling the Minnesota colors Burgundy and Gold and saying a ref is incompetent
Looked like he tried to hit a splits, going out of bounds and landed wrong. I initially thought it was a hamstring, to be honest. Don't think it was intentional, regardless of if being a PSU guy involved.
I'm from you era, Roar, and remember all those polack jokes. Since, I've become a bit of student of history and have learned how undeserved all those jokes were. Throughout history the Poles have shown great courage, resisting the Ottoman European advance when most of the rest of Europe was willing to capitulate. And in WW 2 they showed tremendous fight with limited assets. The Polish people have a heroic past. I don't have Polish blood that I know of, so not defending "my people."
Just watched the DT and Cael video and to be honest with you I thought it would be worse. DT points his finger at the ref but is like 10 feet away from him and then proceeds to walk away. OK so he kicks the challenge block but the ref was talking to Cael already and its not like he punted it into the crowd. My level of outrage at DT is like a 2/10.
As for Cael, again its hard to see but its not like he is in the refs face, I believe he is actually below him due to the height of the mat. Probably the worst thing he did was throw the towel at the ref but come on it's a towel. Even so, I would expect a bit more restraint from a coach. There are better ways to voice your displeasure than acting out in any physical manner. But again, not near as bad as some are making it out to be IMO.
edit: OK I just watched it again and he did throw and hit the ref with the soft cushy challenge brick as well.
As for Cael, again its hard to see but its not like he is in the refs face, I believe he is actually below him due to the height of the mat. Probably the worst thing he did was throw the towel at the ref but come on it's a towel. Even so, I would expect a bit more restraint from a coach. There are better ways to voice your displeasure than acting out in any physical manner. But again, not near as bad as some are making it out to be IMO.
edit: OK I just watched it again and he did throw and hit the ref with the soft cushy challenge brick as well.
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This is uncalled for, unclear how you can spew hating Iowa fans? Words have meaning and these words are unnecessary, and you're a "wrestling" fan?
I'm the last guy that will be joining the PC Police so I will go along with some of the posters and believe Gilman is just ignorant of the term and doesn't know it is offensive. I grew up in a small town in PA that was pretty much all white. My younger brother had a friend that looked Asian and of course all of his friends nicknamed him "Jap" when he was younger. Heck, I even called him it. I'm six years older than my brother so I went away to college and did my thing and a few years later I was told that "Jap" was longer longer called "Jap". His new nickname was "Hap". Apparently my brother and his friends were told that using the term "Jap" was offensive so they made a small change to his nickname.
Just watched the Taylor Cox match. To be honest, I don't really see where Taylor has a gripe.
Could Cox have been hit for passivity. Yes. But it wasn't nearly as bad as some have made it out to be. I thought the push out point awarded to Cox at the 1.04 (left in the match) mark was ridiculous however. That's a real problem with that rule if it was applied correctly.
And the sweat was ridiculous. If Cox sweats that much He should be forced to wear sone type of Lycra shirt and be wiped down after each stoppage.
Could Cox have been hit for passivity. Yes. But it wasn't nearly as bad as some have made it out to be. I thought the push out point awarded to Cox at the 1.04 (left in the match) mark was ridiculous however. That's a real problem with that rule if it was applied correctly.
And the sweat was ridiculous. If Cox sweats that much He should be forced to wear sone type of Lycra shirt and be wiped down after each stoppage.
Gilman get it from this sport. It's always been culturally insensitive. "Greco Roman" "Sumo". You know thats gotta piss off the Sumoans
someone on the HR board beat you to this one... I think he said Easter Asian whizzer. Good for a chuckle
Just rolls off the tongue. Can see coaches yelling that across the mat during matches.
my wrap - hard watching via an iphone all weekend but:
- Hall - great job.. Don't know how he does it. Settles the #1 draft pick issue once again
- Nico - Wanted more but he didn't come close to getting through Gilman's hands. Different next time? let's hope
- Nolf - hard to be disappointed when you know its just a matter of time. I think he would have won at least one if he made it to Green. Steady improvement
- Train/hulk - what I wanted to see. No ill feelings with hulk but Zain is our guy now
- DT - Feel bad. Big hill to climb and he almost made it. Has never been closer. I don't see how he doesn't go on a 2-3 year run next year (that includes olympics).
- Dake - feel the same way as DT. Although more competition from others.
- Logan - doing what he is supposed to be doing.
- Snyder - when will there be another challenger?
- Gwiz - is this his for awhile?
Rule changes: I like controlling the center. 'Good form on a zero scoring throw' has to go! Consistency when backing up penalties are called (we've seen 2 awarded a few times for evading, running, stalling, etc....); limit the number of exposures per one move.... Those are the one's off the top.
- Hall - great job.. Don't know how he does it. Settles the #1 draft pick issue once again
- Nico - Wanted more but he didn't come close to getting through Gilman's hands. Different next time? let's hope
- Nolf - hard to be disappointed when you know its just a matter of time. I think he would have won at least one if he made it to Green. Steady improvement
- Train/hulk - what I wanted to see. No ill feelings with hulk but Zain is our guy now
- DT - Feel bad. Big hill to climb and he almost made it. Has never been closer. I don't see how he doesn't go on a 2-3 year run next year (that includes olympics).
- Dake - feel the same way as DT. Although more competition from others.
- Logan - doing what he is supposed to be doing.
- Snyder - when will there be another challenger?
- Gwiz - is this his for awhile?
Rule changes: I like controlling the center. 'Good form on a zero scoring throw' has to go! Consistency when backing up penalties are called (we've seen 2 awarded a few times for evading, running, stalling, etc....); limit the number of exposures per one move.... Those are the one's off the top.
Lol. You really do think I hate Iowa fans don't you? Lol.
You do understand it was a "tongue in cheek" comment thrown towards a couple of guys that have been known to throw a few friendly jabs my way over on HR ....you're aware of that right?
Btw...I said jabs, not japs....
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