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Suriano Rumor?

Callthestall

Callthestall

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Mar 14, 2016
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I spoke to a real knowledgeable New Jersey wrestling fan. He claims that the Big Ten decision to allow Suriano to wrestle this year was because the Suriano's threatened legal action.
The supposed reasoned Suriano requested to leave, was Penn State mismanaged his ankle injury and other doctors opinion would confirm it.
Suriano's then said they would challenge the Big Ten transfer rule in a court. Deeming it not to be fair when it pertains to one's health and safety environment.
The Big Ten was put in a spot that it would have to support the Penn State side of the medical treatment.
The Big Ten decided it was better to allow transfer without 1 year penalty than possibly having the transfer rule deemed illegal.
 
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I can see the Suriano's threatening legal action, no idea why the B1G caved since by agreeing to the waiver, it makes it easier for other athletes to have a waiver approved too. In the end, I think the B1G wins and the Suriano's are out a bunch of money.

Regarding the medical treatment, very easy to doctor shop to find a favorable opinion to suit your needs. The fact that Suriano is now wrestling 100% demonstrates that the PSU medical treatment was not harmful which is the priority of most doctors. We will never know what would have happened had Suriano been allowed to wrestle, maybe he wins a national championship, maybe he severely injures the ankle and still can't wrestle. I do know that expecting to be able to compete athletically 3.5 weeks after breaking your ankle is an incredible stretch.

Bottom line, he made a poor choice deciding to attend PSU, he was not a good fit with the philosophy of the program and central PA is not his people. Now it is all about making excuses and trying to rationalize his incorrect original decision, PSU has to be the boogeyman. At Rutgers he may find individual success, not much team success, but he is okay with that since he is team Suriano. Good luck to the young man.
 
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I find this rumor somewhat credible because it squares a lot of the missing pieces. Except one, namely Nick's insinuation that he was somehow robbed of the opportunity to compete, b/c if the excuse is that PSU mismanaged his injury, he'd likely need to argue to the B1G that PSU pushed him to wrestle or train when he should have been resting.

I guess you could imagine scenarios where the basis for a legal threat didn't directly contradict the pretext (perhaps if, say, Nick was injured before the OSU dual and shouldn't have been wrestling that day), but that adds speculation to speculation. I don't doubt the threat of a lawsuit would cause the B1G to cave though, because there's not much of an economic basis for it to pick this particular battle, just time and money spent defending an amorphous principle that it's never satisfactorily defined to the public.
 
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tikk10 said:
I find this rumor somewhat credible because it squares a lot of the missing pieces. Except one, namely Nick's insinuation that he was somehow robbed of the opportunity to compete, b/c if the excuse is that PSU mismanaged his injury, he'd likely need to argue to the B1G that PSU pushed him to wrestle or train when he should have been resting.
.
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Spyker did see him beating Nico in the room during that time, and Guns said he was wrestling full speed. So, how can their be any doubt?:eek:
 
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tikk10 said:
I find this rumor somewhat credible because it squares a lot of the missing pieces. Except one, namely Nick's insinuation that he was somehow robbed of the opportunity to compete, b/c if the excuse is that PSU mismanaged his injury, he'd likely need to argue to the B1G that PSU pushed him to wrestle or train when he should have been resting.

I guess you could imagine scenarios where the basis for a legal threat didn't directly contradict the pretext (perhaps if, say, Nick was injured before the OSU dual and shouldn't have been wrestling that day), but that adds speculation to speculation. I don't doubt the threat of a lawsuit would cause the B1G to cave though, because there's not much of an economic basis for it to pick this particular battle, just time and money spent defending an amorphous principle that it's never satisfactorily defined to the public.
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Mismanaging the injury could mean not letting him compete at Nationals when he thinks he was able to.
 
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ClarkstonMark said:
Mismanaging the injury could mean not letting him compete at Nationals when he thinks he was able to.
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I suppose so, but I tend to think the B1G would be less likely to cave against a claim by the student that the coaching staff was being overprotective of that student's health. But you're right, it's well within the universe of possible scenarios.
 
As if this were in doubt, B10 leadership caught on camera:

Moon+Jellyfish3.jpg


As for that other guy, down the memory hole a couple weeks ago. 35+ guys who want to be at PSU, who deserve attention far more.
 
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Callthestall said:
I spoke to a real knowledgeable New Jersey wrestling fan. He claims that the Big Ten decision to allow Suriano to wrestle this year was because the Suriano's threatened legal action.
The supposed reasoned Suriano requested to leave, was Penn State mismanaged his ankle injury and other doctors opinion would confirm it.
Suriano's then said they would challenge the Big Ten transfer rule in a court. Deeming it not to be fair when it pertains to one's health and safety environment.
The Big Ten was put in a spot that it would have to support the Penn State side of the medical treatment.
The Big Ten decided it was better to allow transfer without 1 year penalty than possibly having the transfer rule deemed illegal.
Click to expand...

Spoiled, enttitled child with overbearing parents. PSU should never waiver in not allowing an athlete to compete if they think they could be further injured because then the lawsuit would be that they lacked care for the athlete's safety. To think that this kid feels "robbed" of a championship that he was not guaranteed to win in the first place says it all in my opinion. He doesn't sound like a kid that belongs on a team--he should be wrestling solo. Good luck to RU, I see three years of a pain in the ass coming.

And to add, anyone here that feels "bad" that this kid is gone is crazy. Too much drama where there shouldn't be any. I know I sound insensitive but this is a classic case of kid/family used to getting their way.
 
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lyndj said:
Spoiled, enttitled child with overbearing parents. PSU should never waiver in not allowing an athlete to compete if they think they could be further injured because then the lawsuit would be that they lacked care for the athlete's safety. To think that this kid feels "robbed" of a championship that he was not guaranteed to win in the first place says it all in my opinion. He doesn't sound like a kid that belongs on a team--he should be wrestling solo. Good luck to RU, I see three years of a pain in the ass coming.

And to add, anyone here that feels "bad" that this kid is gone is crazy. Too much drama where there shouldn't be any. I know I sound insensitive but this is a classic case of kid/family used to getting their way.
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Big fish in little pond syndrome. As others have said, I will spend my energy on the 30+ guys in the room who aren't creating drama.
 
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El-Jefe said:
As if this were in doubt, B10 leadership caught on camera:

Moon+Jellyfish3.jpg


As for that other guy, down the memory hole a couple weeks ago. 35+ guys who want to be at PSU, who deserve attention far more.
Click to expand...

El Jefe, I'd give your comment 10 likes if I could.
 
CSauertiegPSU said:
Lawsuit like that would likely get thrown out pretty quickly as damages would be nearly impossible to prove
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Loss of a season of eligibility constitutes damages and the parties wouldn't be in dispute over that much, unless you think a student would have no legal recourse if the NCAA or B1G arbitrarily rescinded an athlete's eligibility.
 
tikk10 said:
Loss of a season of eligibility constitutes damages and the parties wouldn't be in dispute over that much, unless you think a student would have no legal recourse if the NCAA or B1G arbitrarily rescinded an athlete's eligibility.
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You wouldn't be arguing that in court though in the case presented, you would be arguing that Penn State's handling of the injuries caused damages. Considering he's back on the mat at full speed and has been for months, that'd be pretty tough. Only argument would be that they mishandled it causing him to miss out on a potential individual championship which will be almost impossible to prove
 
CSauertiegPSU said:
You wouldn't be arguing that in court though in the case presented, you would be arguing that Penn State's handling of the injuries caused damages. Considering he's back on the mat at full speed and has been for months, that'd be pretty tough. Only argument would be that they mishandled it causing him to miss out on a potential individual championship which will be almost impossible to prove
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No, you'd be arguing that Penn State's handling of the injury constituted a sufficient basis for the B1G to waive its rule and that question would be answered by competing fact witnesses (Nick, PSU staff, PSU doctors, Nick's doctors, if any) and experts (medical specialists), and whether the B1G's denial was (perhaps) arbitrary and capricious (or whatever other standard might apply). Nick wouldn't have to have suffered lasting injury to be 'damaged', for the purposes of making a prima facie claim against the B1G, he'd only need to have been disallowed to compete for the year. You're conflating physical damage with the concept of legal damages.
 
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Anyone that thinks Suriano would have been a National Champion or AA on that ankle has never tried to wrestle on even a severe sprain. Everybody at the National tournament knew he was injured and would have been wrenching on that baby constantly until Suriano cried uncle. If feel bad that the kid lost out on a year but that's just the breaks. To blame PSU is, in my opinion, pathetic.
 
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In Suriano's interview he stated that his ankle was stronger than ever....and did NOT need surgery. Based on that it seems the most likely scenario is that the Penn State Doctor(s) said that surgery was required and the Suriano's have Doctors that say otherwise. Perhaps the PSU medical staff would not clear him to wrestle at Nationals because he "needed surgery" and the Surianos strongly felt otherwise. That would explain the "robbed of a chance" comments as well. In any event....stay healthy....good luck........oh.........and goodbye.
 
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Sportfan2017 said:
In Suriano's interview he stated that his ankle was stronger than ever....and did NOT need surgery. Based on that it seems the most likely scenario is that the Penn State Doctor(s) said that surgery was required and the Suriano's have Doctors that say otherwise. Perhaps the PSU medical staff would not clear him to wrestle at Nationals because he "needed surgery" and the Surianos strongly felt otherwise. That would explain the "robbed of a chance" comments as well. In any event....stay healthy....good luck........oh.........and goodbye.
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THIS!

Exactly what I was going to say.
 
Sportfan2017 said:
In Suriano's interview he stated that his ankle was stronger than ever....and did NOT need surgery. Based on that it seems the most likely scenario is that the Penn State Doctor(s) said that surgery was required and the Suriano's have Doctors that say otherwise. Perhaps the PSU medical staff would not clear him to wrestle at Nationals because he "needed surgery" and the Surianos strongly felt otherwise. That would explain the "robbed of a chance" comments as well. In any event....stay healthy....good luck........oh.........and goodbye.
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That could totally be the case, but it doesn't negate the fact that he had a bum ankle. It is highly doubtful that Cael would hold back one of his top wrestlers from the championships if they felt his ankle was a go. The student, the parent, did not trust the coaches or medical staff to make the correct call. That's a recipe for disaster. An outside doctor should not even be given an opportunity to question the PSU medical staff/trainer's decision on allowing a kid to compete unless they specifically sought out that opinion. And if the RU staff allows that to happen, then their just incompetent.
 
Yep makes sense. A coach didn't want a team to get too many points so he held back one of his studs. This one is a new one.
 
Again no dog in this.
If really Suriano wanted to wrestle and his parents did also that they felt it would be ok I can not see a reason why they did not let him.
Surely there must be some form or some way to protect the school from being liable in this situation . If he felt his injury was ok to go then he should have been able..No one really knows do we how bad it was but the ones involved.
Remember M* AA on one leg,St John going on one leg, and look at Clark last year. Surely Iowa was not going to be liable I would think the school would say no go...Know I could be wrong and you guys think I'm crazy but I just still can see reason he wanted go if he felt he was ready.
 
minnhawkeye said:
Again no dog in this.
If really Suriano wanted to wrestle and his parents did also that they felt it would be ok I can not see a reason why they did not let him.
Surely there must be some form or some way to protect the school from being liable in this situation . If he felt his injury was ok to go then he should have been able..No one really knows do we how bad it was but the ones involved.
Remember M* AA on one leg,St John going on one leg, and look at Clark last year. Surely Iowa was not going to be liable I would think the school would say no go...Know I could be wrong and you guys think I'm crazy but I just still can see reason he wanted go if he felt he was ready.
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this has to be some kind of joke?
 
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316_Lyons said:
Based on this Podcast with Suriano's high school coach, there sure doesn't sound like there's any hard feelings toward Penn State. Bell comes off almost apologetic toward Cael for what went down with Nick.

https://www.mattalkonline.com/podca...l-and-his-take-on-the-nick-suriano-situation/
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This is really worth listening to, thanks for posting. Bell is close with the Surianos and I trust his take. He suggests that the dispute, as presented to the B1G committee, was over how Nick's injury (which Bell says was a break) was treated between the time it happened and the NCAAs; the Surianos felt that different treatment would've enabled him to wrestle.

Assessing whether the Surianos were right or not relies on knowing information that we'll likely never see or hear. But you can kind of see why the B1G blinked at the threat of a lawsuit--discovery would be time consuming, possibly ugly, definitely public (which is in no one's interest); instead, much easier to just give Nick what he wanted.
 
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tikk10 said:
This is really worth listening to, thanks for posting. Bell is close with the Surianos and I trust his take. He suggests that the dispute, as presented to the B1G committee, was over how Nick's injury (which Bell says was a break) was treated between the time it happened and the NCAAs; the Surianos felt that different treatment would've enabled him to wrestle.

Assessing whether the Surianos were right or not relies on knowing information that we'll likely never see or hear. But you can kind of see why the B1G blinked at the threat of a lawsuit--discovery would be time consuming, possibly ugly, definitely public (which is in no one's interest); instead, much easier to just give Nick what he wanted.
Click to expand...

It's also important to note that the Big Ten likely doesn't want a ruling on whether their 1-year mandatory sit out is legal or not. A bit like Hooters doesn't want a ruling on whether being a woman is a BFOQ for being a server there.
 
greenmanRD said:
It's also important to note that the Big Ten likely doesn't want a ruling on whether their 1-year mandatory sit out is legal or not. A bit like Hooters doesn't want a ruling on whether being a woman is a BFOQ for being a server there.
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Heh, yeah, good example. I don't see any particular reason to presume the B1G rule wouldn't withstand a challenge to its validity but even so, it's not something I imagine they're eager to explore and defend in court, especially as they've been less than transparent over the years concerning the rule. Only risk to caving is signaling to others similarly situated that threatening a lawsuit will get you your waiver, rendering the rule toothless. Maybe they don't really care about the rule's deterrent effect, and view the rule as a speed bump--if you want to get past it, just put up a fight and you'll get past it.
 
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When I posted the initial comment it was meant to be insightful of how the Suriano- Big Ten ruling played out. It wasn't meant to rehash his decision to leave.
The worst thing about his transfer was the weight he was at . 125 and Hwt are the 2 toughest weights to have depth. We should remember what happened when Nevills got hurt ,Cael had to recruit a football player.
Sometimes you might get lucky and have a potential redshirt that you can slide in at 125. Next year would have worked out better for that option.
 
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Bob_Anderson said:
this has to be some kind of joke?
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Ok gif
Ok give up with you guys..Couple post above mine some one posted that he wanted to wrestle and no one made any comment on that..So tell me why this is so funny. Have no fear will be gone from your wonderful site there are lots of good people here but sadly like most boards always some bad stuff..
As for the drinking or sauce sorry have to tell ya I'm now 80 years young and have 40 years of being sober maybe some of you should take a look in the mirror just saying..........
 
colt21 said:
Can anyon give the cliff notes version as it won't play
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Bergen Catholic Coach Bell spoke very highly of Cael. Said Cael approached retaining Suriano as more than just a coach wanting to keep a starter, sincerely wanted to help Suriano achieve his goals. Was impressed by Cael during the recruitment process, and even more impressed by him during the past few months. Would have no problem sending other wrestlers to Penn State.
 
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Exhausted of the Suriano drama. He isn't winning a national title this year anyway because he won't beat Tomasello, who is a strong, sound and positional wrestler with much more experience and just as much grit. The schedule is out -- let's focus on the upcoming season not on a kid that didn't fit.
 
minnhawkeye said:
Ok gif
Ok give up with you guys..Couple post above mine some one posted that he wanted to wrestle and no one made any comment on that..So tell me why this is so funny. Have no fear will be gone from your wonderful site there are lots of good people here but sadly like most boards always some bad stuff..
As for the drinking or sauce sorry have to tell ya I'm now 80 years young and have 40 years of being sober maybe some of you should take a look in the mirror just saying..........
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Your post above seemed to indicate that an athlete should compete if he feels he can, no matter what the doctor says. Hope that's not what you meant, but that's how it came across.

PSU's philosophy is that the doctor and trainers can overrule the coaches. I'd be surprised if Iowa had a different philosophy. The athlete's health should be the primary concern.
 
El-Jefe said:
Your post above seemed to indicate that an athlete should compete if he feels he can, no matter what the doctor says. Hope that's not what you meant, but that's how it came across.

PSU's philosophy is that the doctor and trainers can overrule the coaches. I'd be surprised if Iowa had a different philosophy. The athlete's health should be the primary concern.
Click to expand...

You think a kid's father would go against the best interests of his son? Do you have children?
 
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