UFO Evidence that demands a verdict ...

[KnightWhoSaysNit]

Maybe they are smart enough to find a short-cut.

Exactly. Deniers view the problem within a limited understanding of the universe. We understand time and 3 dimensional space, sometimes referred to as the 4 dimensional "space-time." But what if it is possible to bend space-time? Wormhole travel? It sounds far fetched but modern physics would have been a stretch for the greatest minds only a few centuries ago.

 

[Zenophile]

Legal update from December:

Scientific Coalition for UAP Studies Applauds new UAP Law in the 2022 National Defense Authorization Act as "Historic," Urges Government Collaboration with Civilian Experts​

 

[L.A.Lion]

This is an interesting take on the subject from Barry Goldwater, who during his 30 years in the Senate chaired both the Armed Services Committee and the Intelligence Committee:



I think Goldwater's avoidance of the words "Roswell" and "crash" was intentional.

That clip reminds me of a joke told by John McCain that has stuck with me for many years. For those of you who don't know this about him, he was smartass and renowned joke teller. Not all his jokes went over well, but he didn't get too flustered about that. One of his staffers told me about a visit to a retirement home near Mesa called Leisure World when he made a joke about it being Seizure World that didn't go over too well with the elderly residents.

Anyway, in 2000 I was at a small event where he was speaking during his first campaign for president and he made a joke about the Democratic frontrunner (and eventual nominee) Al Gore. He had been speaking for a while already and was in full bombastic McCain mode. He started the joke by saying "You've heard about Roswell, right?" That's a paraphrase, but it's not off by more than a word or two. But then, his tone shifted down, his voice became much softer, he lowered his eyes and looked down, and said again "Everyone knows about Roswell, right?" He may have used the words "crash" and something like "alien" or "flying saucer" in conjunction with the word "Roswell," but I don't remember specifically. I'm very familiar with the story so that part didn't stick with me. Then he looked back up at the crowd gathered around him (and I do mean around; this was in the backyard of a private house in the Virginia suburbs of DC and there was no stage or arranged focal point for a speaker, people just surrounded him on all sides while he spoke), raised his voice to the previous volume and said you can check for yourself, but "Al Gore was born nine months to the day after the Roswell crash!"

I have checked, and Gore was actually born 8 months and 24 days later, but who's counting?

Why this joke has stuck with me for more than 20 years is the way he lowered his eyes and his voice when he repeated the "everyone knows" part. The only way I can explain it is that it seemed obvious to me that he was reassuring himself that he wasn't improperly divulging classified information, that the story was so well known that he wasn't saying anything not already in the public domain.

Just one small data point in a very large subject, but I found it compelling and still do so I thought I'd share.

 

[jabba2]

I've seen a UFO so I know they exist. Not sure what they are though. I saw a glowing green tic tac shape move a short distance under cloud cover at night. It wasnt a meteor because it appeared to be moving slowly and horizontally. It was a perfectly illuminated Tic Tac shape. I did a search on Tic Tac UFO's and apparently its a phenomenon because Tic Tac the company is sponsoring a trip to space to celebrate Tic Tac UFO's. But they're out there. They just appear and disappear with no reason given.

 

[Zenophile]

Course on the history of the phenomenon offered by Atlas Obscura (taught by PSU history prof)

 

[diontechristmas]

I’ve recently became aware of these sightings from very credible people. I am always a skeptic, but now believe.

I feel there is no doubt that military personal pick up UFO’s on the regular on radar and those sightings cannot be just explained away. We are being visited regularly.

 

[indynittany]

This is an interesting take on the subject from Barry Goldwater, who during his 30 years in the Senate chaired both the Armed Services Committee and the Intelligence Committee:

View embedded media

I think Goldwater's avoidance of the words "Roswell" and "crash" was intentional.

That clip reminds me of a joke told by John McCain that has stuck with me for many years. For those of you who don't know this about him, he was smartass and renowned joke teller. Not all his jokes went over well, but he didn't get too flustered about that. One of his staffers told me about a visit to a retirement home near Mesa called Leisure World when he made a joke about it being Seizure World that didn't go over too well with the elderly residents.

Anyway, in 2000 I was at a small event where he was speaking during his first campaign for president and he made a joke about the Democratic frontrunner (and eventual nominee) Al Gore. He had been speaking for a while already and was in full bombastic McCain mode. He started the joke by saying "You've heard about Roswell, right?" That's a paraphrase, but it's not off by more than a word or two. But then, his tone shifted down, his voice became much softer, he lowered his eyes and looked down, and said again "Everyone knows about Roswell, right?" He may have used the words "crash" and something like "alien" or "flying saucer" in conjunction with the word "Roswell," but I don't remember specifically. I'm very familiar with the story so that part didn't stick with me. Then he looked back up at the crowd gathered around him (and I do mean around; this was in the backyard of a private house in the Virginia suburbs of DC and there was no stage or arranged focal point for a speaker, people just surrounded him on all sides while he spoke), raised his voice to the previous volume and said you can check for yourself, but "Al Gore was born nine months to the day after the Roswell crash!"

I have checked, and Gore was actually born 8 months and 24 days later, but who's counting?

Why this joke has stuck with me for more than 20 years is the way he lowered his eyes and his voice when he repeated the "everyone knows" part. The only way I can explain it is that it seemed obvious to me that he was reassuring himself that he wasn't improperly divulging classified information, that the story was so well known that he wasn't saying anything not already in the public domain.

Just one small data point in a very large subject, but I found it compelling and still do so I thought I'd share.

For those of us who no longer believe in coincidences, Tommy Lee Jones of MIB fame, was Gore's roommate at Harvard

 

[cntblvitsbutter]

The universe is so old and so vast that I think anything is possible, from the multiverse to time travel, which in turn makes me believe that the existence of alien life is a pretty benign assumption. The most compelling theory of these UAPs is that they're either from somewhere on earth that we can't see, deep oceans, etc., or that they're time travelers.

 

[diontechristmas]

The universe is so old and so vast that I think anything is possible, from the multiverse to time travel, which in turn makes me believe that the existence of alien life is a pretty benign assumption. The most compelling theory of these UAPs is that they're either from somewhere on earth that we can't see, deep oceans, etc., or that they're time travelers.

Yup, the inter dimension travel theory really blew my mind.

 

[tullfan68]

LOL if you dont think there is life on other planets well you better think again!I have never seen an alien but have seen spaceships twice they flew to fast to be from this planet!not to mention the shape like I have never seen before or since well maybe in the movies!

 

[psu00]

LOL if you dont think there is life on other planets well you better think again!I have never seen an alien but have seen spaceships twice they flew to fast to be from this planet!not to mention the shape like I have never seen before or since well maybe in the movies!

We’ll that settles it then! 😜

 

[Lattner]

I’ve recently became aware of these sightings from very credible people. I am always a skeptic, but now believe.

I feel there is no doubt that military personal pick up UFO’s on the regular on radar and those sightings cannot be just explained away. We are being visited regularly.

The same was said in 1960.
They can't get enough of us, yet are afraid to say hello.
Maybe they are embarrassed because they don't speak the language.
Maybe our runways are too short.
Maybe oxygen makes them nauseous.
Right.

 

[MacNit07]

The same was said in 1960.
They can't get enough of us, yet are afraid to say hello.
Maybe they are embarrassed because they don't speak the language.
Maybe our runways are too short.
Maybe oxygen makes them nauseous.
Right.

Most likely answer: Top secret military research.

 

[cntblvitsbutter]

The same was said in 1960.
They can't get enough of us, yet are afraid to say hello.
Maybe they are embarrassed because they don't speak the language.
Maybe our runways are too short.
Maybe oxygen makes them nauseous.
Right.

Well if they were historians from the future, that would explain their interest as well as their desire to avoid contact.

 

[KnightWhoSaysNit]

Most likely answer: Top secret military research.

Is there top secret military research trying to reverse engineer craft that are "not of this planet?"

Yep.

 

[Flying_Tiger]

Here is my UFO experience. A little background, aside from being an attorney I am part time flight instructor with some knowledge in aerodynamics and experience with various aircraft, both civilian and military.

Several years ago I was driving (not flying) to the New Jersey shore for our annual family vacation. We were traveling on a two lane highway (most likely Garden State Parkway) and I estimate the time was somewhere between 10:00 and 11:00 pm when a V Shaped object passed from our right to left at tree top level about 500-600 yards in front of us. It had the wingspan of a B-52 but made no sound and was probable only traveling 75-100 kts. I know people in front of me saw it also because of all the brake lights.

I thought to myself that was interesting and that is was most likely military. My only real question was whether it was out in the public or was it still top secret. I planned on looking into it further, but in the end I just forgot about it in the excitement of starting our vacation. In other words, it did not have any profound effect on me and I didn't start making sculptures from mash potatoes.

It wasn't until recently that I started to revisit this encounter. Between the Navy acknowledgement of the existence of UAPs (formerly UFOs) and the excellent documentary on UFOs by Netflix, I realized perhaps, just perhaps this was not military. As it turns out, apparently this type of craft has been seen many, many times and there is a classic photo of what I saw during the Phoenix lights event. I had been aware of the Phoenix lights, but the only thing I remembered was the video of lights over the city, but didn't see this photo until just recently.

What really got my head turning was that some sightings have these crafts moving at hyper sonic speeds, not at the slow speed I witnessed which at least raises the question on them being military.

 

[diontechristmas]

I believe we still understand very little about our universe. Our feeble senses and technology is only able to grasp or observe an exponentially small slice of it. We theorize already that other dimensions exist via black holes. I think this is the tip of the iceberg.

500 years ago, a mere fraction of a second of the universe’s existence, the human race believed the sun revolves around the earth. In 500, 1000, 2000 years, humans will invent technologies allowing us to understand things we cannot even comprehend today.

 

[KnightWhoSaysNit]

Here is my UFO experience. A little background, aside from being an attorney I am part time flight instructor with some knowledge in aerodynamics and experience with various aircraft, both civilian and military.

Several years ago I was driving (not flying) to the New Jersey shore for our annual family vacation. We were traveling on a two lane highway (most likely Garden State Parkway) and I estimate the time was somewhere between 10:00 and 11:00 pm when a V Shaped object passed from our right to left at tree top level about 500-600 yards in front of us. It had the wingspan of a B-52 but made no sound and was probable only traveling 75-100 kts. I know people in front of me saw it also because of all the brake lights.

I thought to myself that was interesting and that is was most likely military. My only real question was whether it was out in the public or was it still top secret. I planned on looking into it further, but in the end I just forgot about it in the excitement of starting our vacation. In other words, it did not have any profound effect on me and I didn't start making sculptures from mash potatoes.

It wasn't until recently that I started to revisit this encounter. Between the Navy acknowledgement of the existence of UAPs (formerly UFOs) and the excellent documentary on UFOs by Netflix, I realized perhaps, just perhaps this was not military. As it turns out, apparently this type of craft has been seen many, many times and there is a classic photo of what I saw during the Phoenix lights event. I had been aware of the Phoenix lights, but the only thing I remembered was the video of lights over the city, but didn't see this photo until just recently.

What really got my head turning was that some sightings have these crafts moving at hyper sonic speeds, not at the slow speed I witnessed which at least raises the question on them being military.

I think the military would tend to stay out of populated areas, so what you saw was probably alien.

Here are some videos that suggest only a select few in our military are given a need to know, while others are given a position for show.

The Admiral Wilson leak

Follow up

There is much more in the Dolan library, including the Wilson topic. Dolan always provides a reasonable, well-balanced, and sometimes skeptical view of the unexplained.

 

[maypole]

I think the military would tend to stay out of populated areas, so what you saw was probably alien.

Here are some videos that suggest only a select few in our military are given a need to know, while others are given a position for show.

The Admiral Wilson leak

Follow up

There is much more in the Dolan library, including the Wilson topic. Dolan always provides a reasonable, well-balanced, and sometimes skeptical view of the unexplained.

Dolan making a lot of money from you suckers.

 

[KnightWhoSaysNit]

Dolan making a lot of money from you suckers.

Not from me.

You think it is all bunk? Do I need to start linking more evidence, or will you have your usual blinders affixed?

 

[PSUEngineer89]

I there is intelligent life in this universe, what would be the consequences?

One consequence would be that we’d detect electromagnetic waves.

We have been looking for more than 40 years…..nothing.

 

[maypole]

Not from me.

You think it is all bunk? Do I need to start linking more evidence, or will you have your usual blinders affixed?

He’s paid for each view, doofus. Charges extra for newsletters, lectures and memberships.
$ is his motive.
Maybe there is intelligent life elsewhere but Dolan doesn’t know about it.

 

[cntblvitsbutter]

I there is intelligent life in this universe, what would be the consequences? One consequence would be that we’d detect electromagnetic waves. We have been looking for more than 40 years…..nothing.

In terms of our knowledge of the universe, we might be at the stage that we don't know what we don't know.

 

[maypole]

In terms of our knowledge of the universe, we might be at the stage that we don't know what we don't know.

Doesn’t mean that there aren’t charlatans peddling garbage for $.

 

[PSUEngineer89]

In terms of our knowledge of the universe, we might be at the stage that we don't know what we don't know.

We understand the laws of the universe pretty well.

If a civilization was generating radio waves, shouldn’t have we detected it.

 

[KnightWhoSaysNit]

He’s paid for each view, doofus. Charges extra for newsletters, lectures and memberships.
$ is his motive.
Maybe there is intelligent life elsewhere but Dolan doesn’t know about it.

He is not paid by me any more than he is paid by you. Youtube advertising clicks? That's all you've got?

Where do you get the basis that forms your beliefs, for or against, on this subject? You have expressed an opinion. Surely you have a better source than MSNBC.

 

[cntblvitsbutter]

We understand the laws of the universe pretty well.

If a civilization was generating radio waves, shouldn’t have we detected it.

We don't know what comprises 95% of the observable universe.

 

[PSUEngineer89]

We don't know what comprises 95% of the observable universe.

Doesn’t matter where the signal originates….should be detected here.

 

[KnightWhoSaysNit]

Doesn’t matter where the signal originates….should be detected here.

You do know that we have large amounts of recorded radar information, correct? Most of it has been closely guarded.

And you are probably also assuming that travel would be through a detectable means that we currently understand, that radio waves would be emitted.

I doubt if ants understand how our airplanes work. And I doubt that ants could evolve to build an airplane in the span of a century.

What do you make of the 2004 Nimitz encounter? The radar operator on the Princeton was pretty clear about what he was observing, and not just for a brief period. The pilots all saw the same thing. There is other, similar testimony from the East Coast that you have probably missed.

These encounters are routine now.

 

[PSUEngineer89]

You do know that we have large amounts of recorded radar information, correct? Most of it has been closely guarded.

And you are probably also assuming that travel would be through a detectable means that we currently understand, that radio waves would be emitted.

I doubt if ants understand how our airplanes work. And I doubt that ants could evolve to build an airplane in the span of a century.

What do you make of the 2004 Nimitz encounter? The radar operator on the Princeton was pretty clear about what he was observing, and not just for a brief period. The pilots all saw the same thing. There is other, similar testimony from the East Coast that you have probably missed.

These encounters are routine now.

As Feynman said, “I believe it’s more likely that these reports are due to the extraordinary imaginings of terrestrial beings than the observations of extraterrestrial beings.”

There are 340 million people in this country. it would be truly amazing if none of them were making up reports of UFOs.

No one ever better:

 

[KnightWhoSaysNit]

As Feynman said, “I believe it’s more likely that these reports are due to the extraordinary imaginings of terrestrial beings than the observations of extraterrestrial beings.”

There are 340 million people in this country. it would be truly amazing if none of them were making up reports of UFOs.

No one ever better:

View embedded media

You are saying that Cmmdr Fravor and the other Nimitz officers are CIA misinformation plants? Did you even listen to what he said? Did you look at any of the documentaries on the History Channel? All of these trained observers were seeing things, and the radar data that backed it up was fabricated?

 

[PSUEngineer89]

You are saying that Cmmdr Fravor and the other Nimitz officers are CIA misinformation plants? Did you even listen to what he said? Did you look at any of the documentaries on the History Channel? All of these trained observers were seeing things, and the radar data that backed it up was fabricated?

I’m saying they’re lying or wrong.

 

[KnightWhoSaysNit]

I’m saying they’re lying or wrong.

You could not have reviewed this subject with any depth and then reach that conclusion.

 

[lowhandicapper]

Some old looking dude with a long white beard balled up some clay and made a human right before some other guy put all the male and female species on his boat because the guy who balled up the clay got mad and flooded the planet.
But yeah, those conspiracy theories about aliens.
Anyone who thinks we are alone in this space, is a damn fool. There are trillions of galaxies, the odds that life can only form on earth are tremendously low.
Our technology is so weak we can't even transport a human to another planet successfully.
We've been here for like 300,000 years and it only took 299,850 to figure out to fly.
But yeah we know everything about everything.

 

[johnmpsu]

Doesn’t matter where the signal originates….should be detected here.

Radio waves dissipate in space. If they are using radio we won't detect it. It would simply look like noise.

 

[Flying_Tiger]

Very true, a radio wave traveling over many light years is going to be extremely weak. The fact we haven't detected one yet is understandable, especially considering how short of time we have really been listening.

 

[Flying_Tiger]

Photo taken by Hannah McRoberts in 1981. She was focused on the mountain and didn't even see the UFO at the time. This was an old fashioned camera with film that had to be developed. The negatives were throughly scrutinized and considered unaltered. She was just a tourist on vacation and had absolutely no reason to lie. Never sought publicity and most likely didn't make any money from this photo.

 

[PSUEngineer89]

Very true, a radio wave traveling over many light years is going to be extremely weak. The fact we haven't detected one yet is understandable, especially considering how short of time we have really been listening.

You guys are just being silly.

The reason we haven't detected any life out there is because there apparently isn't any life out there.

The arrays are huge, we use software to filter out the noise.

 

[Flying_Tiger]

No, what's silly is how you think humanity has it all figured out in what is really just our technological infancy.

 

[PSUEngineer89]

No, what's silly is how you think humanity has it all figured out in what is really just our technological infancy.

Nope. Wrong.

We understand the physics of the universe. We understand electromagnetism "perfectly".

Each day that passes, it becomes more and more unlikely that we are alone for all intents and purposes.

It makes me sad to see people still buying into the George Nouri/Art Bell stuff.