Bowl guru Jerry Palm now projects us to Citrus

Mufasa94

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G5 teams messed up by being a G5 team?
That’s a general description, not a team. Nothing about 2020 is worth discussing, F’d up season with minimal OOC games and all the G5 teams that dominated their little fiefdoms to the point of a perfect record lost their bowl games.

If you are getting at UCF, debatable situation as there are a couple points to ponder. On one hand, they won all their games. Think the CFP messed up by matching them with Auburn in ‘17 allowing for the opportunity of a worst case scenario to come about.

On the other hand, UCF had no interest in a competitive P5 opponent during their two seasons, going as far as to publicly act righteously indignant at a 2-1 UF offer in the midst of it. What should be the appropriate treatment of a team like that?

My preference at the time was to include them so they’d get the loss like Cincy did last year. I controlled that as much as I could stop expansion.
 
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LandoComando

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That’s a general description, not a team. Nothing about 2020 is worth discussing, F’d up season with minimal OOC games and all the G5 teams that dominated their little fiefdoms to the point of a perfect record lost their bowl games.

If you are getting at UCF, debatable situation as there are a couple points to ponder. On one hand, they won all their games. Think the CFP messed up by matching them with Auburn in ‘17 allowing for the opportunity of a worst case scenario to come about.

On the other hand, UCF had no interest in a competitive P5 opponent during their two seasons, going as far as to publicly act righteously indignant at a 2-1 UF offer in the midst of it. What should be the appropriate treatment of a team like that?

My preference at the time was to include them so they’d get the loss like Cincy did last year. I controlled that as much as I could stop expansion.
I never said anything about UCF
Why does the MAC exist?
 

lazydave841

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Sounds to me like some here like the days when ND finished 9-1-1, got voted National champion by the AP poll December 1st, then played somebody New Years Day and got beat 31-14.

Hey, if you were a fan of the teams who benefit from that setup and or just enjoyed it, be my guest.

I don't see how any Penn State fan could have liked it. It took 10 years and 3 undefeated teams to even get a shot at being crowned MNC.

I'm betting Ivan wishes they crowned the Patriots NFL champs that one year when Brady had them 18-0. Ya know, before they lost the Super Bowl to the Giants.
 

CJFisJoePaII

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Sounds to me like some here like the days when ND finished 9-1-1, got voted National champion by the AP poll December 1st, then played somebody New Years Day and got beat 31-14.

Hey, if you were a fan of the teams who benefit from that setup and or just enjoyed it, be my guest.

I don't see how any Penn State fan could have liked it. It took 10 years and 3 undefeated teams to even get a shot at being crowned MNC.

I'm betting Ivan wishes they crowned the Patriots NFL champs that one year when Brady had them 18-0. Ya know, before they lost the Super Bowl to the Giants.

Well that's the thing - often times the AFC Champ won't even have seen the NFC Champ during the Regular Season (not sure if Giants and Pats saw each other that year). Heck, not even all the AFC Teams play all other AFC teams outside their Division. But this is precisely why Playoffs are structured the way they are - to make sure the best teams from the Conference and League level have faced one another and won their Championship on the field. The reason Wild Cards are used is to make sure that the two best teams at the Conference Level are not in the same Division. But a true Playoff Structure is different than the "Invitational Structure" being used by CFB - not as good as a true Playoff, but way better than the old bullshit pure "Beauty Pageant" system.
 
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wilbury

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As will a ton of other games--including far more in G5
A few games versus lower quality teams.

I'm hoping that they standardize scheduling - the same number of conference games for each conference. Then, get rid of the conference championship game. It's meaningless. Hopefully, that will loosen things up so some of these SEC and Big Ten teams play more and higher quality out of conference games. They should be willing to do that now that they don't necessarily need to be concerned about losing.
 

Mufasa94

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I never said anything about UCF
Then just say who you mean. I requested you name a team and you answer with G5 teams. Now you respond this way?
The importance of the regular season greatly increases with an expanded playoffs.
If a contending team plays a game, and it is known that the outcome has no bearing on their ability to make a playoff, there is absolutely no way the importance is increased.
Penn State would have meaningful games the rest of the year.
This is the gist of it all. This reads like “Me me me. Make me happy.” Who cares what is right or wrong, you just want to feel included right now.
How is it not weighted differently? See literally every other college sport
Really? Wrestling surely does things differently. I’d imagine there are numerous other sports that do so also.
The regular season is currently a joke--people are clinging to the past and don't like change. This weekend there's less than a dozen meaningful games--the season is over for everyone has and has been for weeks.
It has as much meaning as one wants it to matter.

For the students in school, should all the grades during the semester get wiped out and only their grade on the final exam matter?
For 10-12 teams it's win to get in, teams playing them can be a spoiler, for everyone else it's just about trying to get better or improve your draft status. The outcome of the game doesn't actually impact anything.
Then they should have played better in September and October when the games those months decided their fate.
 

CJFisJoePaII

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Then just say who you mean. I requested you name a team and you answer with G5 teams. Now you respond this way?

If a contending team plays a game, and it is known that the outcome has no bearing on their ability to make a playoff, there is absolutely no way the importance is increased.

This is the gist of it all. This reads like “Me me me. Make me happy.” Who cares what is right or wrong, you just want to feel included right now.

Really? Wrestling surely does things differently. I’d imagine there are numerous other sports that do so also.

It has as much meaning as one wants it to matter.

For the students in school, should all the grades during the semester get wiped out and only their grade on the final exam matter?

Then they should have played better in September and October when the games those months decided their fate.

Wrestling does not do it differently. Individual Weight Champions are determined by a seeded Championship "Wrestle-Off" Bracket. They don't determine Wrestling Champions via regular season record - the regular season record determines their seeding in the "Playoff Bracket" (which in the case of Wrestling would be called a "Wrestle-Off" Bracket). What are you talking about?

BTW, Wrestling uses a 32 Wrestler Bracket w/ a "wrestle-in" slot (i.e., 33 wrestlers make the Championships from a much smaller field - 78 teams [IOW, there are only 78 wrestlers at each weight so 40% of the universe makes the Post-Season Championship Playoff]).
 
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Mufasa94

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Wrestling does not do it differently. Individual Weight Champions are determined…
Blah blah blah. The topic is a team championship, not individual, so it isn’t close. Please stay on topic.
They don't determine Wrestling Champions via regular season record…
Stop with the regular season champion BS, there’s only one other poster who brought that up, take it up with her/him. You’ve done it multiple times with me now.
 

CJFisJoePaII

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Blah blah blah. The topic is a team championship, not individual, so it isn’t close. Please stay on topic.

Stop with the regular season champion BS, there’s only one other poster who brought that up, take it up with her/him. You’ve done it multiple times with me now.

You're a real nut-job. Wrestling is an individual sport - not a team sport genius (just like gymnastics). The Team Championship is determined by an aggregation of the points generated by the Wrestlers in each weight bracket. But to say wrestling does not determine their Champions via a Post-Season Playoff Bracket is utterly wrong. You're the idiot that said they don't so don't come at me with your bullshit (yea, no shit - wrestling is an "Individual Sport" not a "Team Sport", we all know that idiot, it has nothing to do with your claim that Wrestling does not determine it's Champions via a Post-Season Playoff Bracket which is utterly wrong.). Wrestling determines its Champions via a Post-Season Playoff Bracket (i.e., on the field of play, not via opinion).
 

fastlax16

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Then just say who you mean. I requested you name a team and you answer with G5 teams. Now you respond this way?

If a contending team plays a game, and it is known that the outcome has no bearing on their ability to make a playoff, there is absolutely no way the importance is increased.

This is the gist of it all. This reads like “Me me me. Make me happy.” Who cares what is right or wrong, you just want to feel included right now.

Really? Wrestling surely does things differently. I’d imagine there are numerous other sports that do so also.

It has as much meaning as one wants it to matter.

For the students in school, should all the grades during the semester get wiped out and only their grade on the final exam matter?

Then they should have played better in September and October when the games those months decided their fate.

This is exactly how you read. You're quite obviously in the minority in your mindset but its all about you you you. Going to suck for you when College Football stops doing it the way you like, because you're going to have nothing else to fall back on because literally no other sport on earth does it this way, because it's asinine.

Games in November with seeding and home field advantage on the line will absolutely have meaning.

Enjoy this season and next I guess. Then be bitter and bitch about the good old days for the rest of time.
 

CJFisJoePaII

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This is exactly how you read. You're quite obviously in the minority in your mindset but its all about you you you. Going to suck for you when College Football stops doing it the way you like, because you're going to have nothing else to fall back on because literally no other sport on earth does it this way, because it's asinine.

Games in November with seeding and home field advantage on the line will absolutely have meaning.

Enjoy this season and next I guess. Then be bitter and bitch about the good old days for the rest of time.

No shit! He comes on here telling me wrestling doesn't determine their Champions via seeded playoff brackets and when I point out he is dead wrong about this, he starts lecturing me about how wrestling is an individual sport, not a team sport as if I wasn't well aware of this (what difference this makes anyway is well beyond me - you said "no other sport" and he cited wrestling which is wrong - they absolutely do use seeded Playoff Brackets with seedings based on regular season.). Agree with you that it is utterly asinine to conduct a 4-Team Invitational from a universe of 131 teams spead across 11 Conferences (including IND as a Conference) to determine your Champion.
 

CJFisJoePaII

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Did PSU not win the title last year? Was that title based on a bracketed dual meet format with seeded teams having PSU on one end and Iowa at the other? No, it was a different format.

Going to take it in this direction?

No, genius because Wrestling is an Individual Sport at the "field of play" level, not a Team Sport (as you yourself have already pointed out). The Team Crown is determined by aggregating points earned by Individuals within each weight class (i.e., the "field of play" level). Again, Individual Champions, which is the "field of play" level, are contested via seeded Playoff Brackets with seeding determined based upon Regular Season records.

BTW, inter-season duals are scored the exact same way - an aggregation of individual match results - as are inter-season tournaments, so why would they score the Post-Season NCAA Championships any differently???
 
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Mufasa94

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This is exactly how you read. You're quite obviously in the minority in your mindset but its all about you you you.
Explain how it is about me. Or is this just another baseless accusation from your crew?
Going to suck for you when College Football stops doing it the way you like, because you're going to have nothing else to fall back on because literally no other sport on earth does it this way, because it's asinine.
I think “suck” is rather extreme. Certain things will be missed. I may not set aside time to watch an early season national game that will no longer impact one of the teams playoff chances.
Games in November with seeding and home field advantage on the line will absolutely have meaning.
Show one statement of mine where I claimed otherwise
Enjoy this season and next I guess.
That will all be dependent on how PSU does. While this year isn’t great, it has been exceeding some bad scenario thoughts from summer. If they end bowl season with 2 losses I will certainly be satisfied.
 

LandoComando

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Then just say who you mean. I requested you name a team and you answer with G5 teams. Now you respond this way?

If a contending team plays a game, and it is known that the outcome has no bearing on their ability to make a playoff, there is absolutely no way the importance is increased.

This is the gist of it all. This reads like “Me me me. Make me happy.” Who cares what is right or wrong, you just want to feel included right now.

Really? Wrestling surely does things differently. I’d imagine there are numerous other sports that do so also.

It has as much meaning as one wants it to matter.

For the students in school, should all the grades during the semester get wiped out and only their grade on the final exam matter?

Then they should have played better in September and October when the games those months decided their fate.
For the top teams they're playing for seeding and byes--hence 24 teams. That bye is crucial to win a title.

"me me me"??? I like all of college football not just Penn State. That doesn't alter the fact Penn State's remaining games would be meaningful. Hell, I'll watch some of Tulane/UCF tomorrow even though it's meaningless. It would be an even greater game if their champ made the playoffs.

Wrestling is a joke--do you want a list of teams that have won a title in the past 50 years? Few schools have it and there set up is still open to allowing multiple teams to win a title not 4 assuming there were more than 1-3 competitive teams.

Yes, some classes drop the lowest exam
 

Mufasa94

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For the top teams they're playing for seeding and byes--hence 24 teams. That bye is crucial to win a title.
I’m not insinuating in any way those games would be meaningless. But, comparatively speaking, they wouldn’t carry the same importance.
"me me me"??? I like all of college football not just Penn State. That doesn't alter the fact Penn State's remaining games would be meaningful.
Of course these November games would have more meaning (and fun unless they lose) for PSU (but the sept/Oct games less). But, would it be right/ethical/whatever appropriate term for them to have an opportunity to play to be the most successful for the whole season + postseason combo? Even if PSU won it all, they’d have more losses than the UM/tOSU winner and have also lost to said team.
Wrestling is a joke
Just listing a sport where the championship team is determined by a different method.
Yes, some classes drop the lowest exam
It would be like dropping multiple lowest exams.
 

LandoComando

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I’m not insinuating in any way those games would be meaningless. But, comparatively speaking, they wouldn’t carry the same importance.

Of course these November games would have more meaning (and fun unless they lose) for PSU (but the sept/Oct games less). But, would it be right/ethical/whatever appropriate term for them to have an opportunity to play to be the most successful for the whole season + postseason combo? Even if PSU won it all, they’d have more losses than the UM/tOSU winner and have also lost to said team.

Just listing a sport where the championship team is determined by a different method.

It would be like dropping multiple lowest exams.
It's absolutely the same importance
The Sept/Oct games wouldn't have less meaning
Wrestling is just a horrible example though
How? You still have to win at least 9 games to get in or win your conference. Undefeated should never be a requirement. It's insane to think that.
 

LandoComando

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How can you say that if you are a PSU fan? They are realistically eliminated now with the 4 format based on Oct games, but definitely would still be alive with the future 12 format.

Who said it was?

I don't even understand the first part. Sept/Oct games wouldn't have less meaning--far more games in Sept/Oct would be meaningful. You continue to focus on 1-2 games instead of 40.

You're implication is considering you don't even accept a MAC school going 13-0 and them not being in the playoff makes the playoff legit. Some teams never play a meaningful game unless it's to ruin someone else's season. That must change. FBS as we know it is antiquated. The bowls are a joke.
 

LandoComando

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Just saw on 247 they have psu to orange vs UNC

although I see Clemson handling unc. The coastal is putrid

if PSU can land in the orange. A match up vs Clemson would be awesome
Let's hope LSU loses to A&M if we want the Orange.
 

CJFisJoePaII

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Just saw on 247 they have psu to orange vs UNC

although I see Clemson handling unc. The coastal is putrid

if PSU can land in the orange. A match up vs Clemson would be awesome

Very reasonable prediction if Tenn is 4th Playoff team (i.e., UGa, duhO$U/scUM Winner, TCU and Tenn).
 

LandoComando

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Not necessarily needed - Orange is unlikely to take a 3-loss LSU over PSU given that PSU moves the meter more in terms of Ratings.
You keep saying this but it's not true. The Sugar is very likely to take LSU because people won't have to travel to attend and they aren't going to get a ton of people from whatever G5 teams comes. If it wasn't in New Orleans I'd agree with you but then Alabama goes to the Orange. Alabama to the Sugar isn't nearly as safe as LSU which is why Palm keep projecting them there
 

CJFisJoePaII

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You keep saying this but it's not true. The Sugar is very likely to take LSU because people won't have to travel to attend and they aren't going to get a ton of people from whatever G5 teams comes. If it wasn't in New Orleans I'd agree with you but then Alabama goes to the Orange. Alabama to the Sugar isn't nearly as safe as LSU which is why Palm keep projecting them there

No, the Sugar is very likely to take Bama if LSU ends up with 3 losses.
 

CJFisJoePaII

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You keep saying this but it's not true. The Sugar is very likely to take LSU because people won't have to travel to attend and they aren't going to get a ton of people from whatever G5 teams comes. If it wasn't in New Orleans I'd agree with you but then Alabama goes to the Orange. Alabama to the Sugar isn't nearly as safe as LSU which is why Palm keep projecting them there

Bowls are every bit as concerned about "Ratings" as anything else. BTW boy-genius, I believe the Sugar is CONTRACTUALLY OBLIGATED to take the highest ranked SEC team in the Final CFP Rankings that is not selected for the CFP 4-Team Invitational. That team is going to be either Tenn or Bama, not a 3-loss LSU team regardless of how much bloviating you wish to do.
 

LandoComando

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Bowls are every bit as concerned about "Ratings" as anything else. BTW boy-genius, I believe the Sugar is CONTRACTUALLY OBLIGATED to take the highest ranked SEC team in the Final CFP Rankings that is not selected for the CFP 4-Team Invitational. That team is going to be either Tenn or Bama, not a 3-loss LSU team regardless of how much bloviating you wish to do.
You're right Palm's clueless. I've also explained how 10-3 LSU is still ranked higher than 10-2 Bama. You continually just live in your own world.

I don't care at all who goes to what bowl game--I don't see any difference between the Rose, Orange or Citrus but I also follow all of college football unlike you and understand how these things work. You never see the big picture. Remember Syracuse was legit and Central Michigan would win the MAC? Central Michigan wasn't even the best MAC team we played.
 

CJFisJoePaII

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I just explained this but you're ignoring what the experts are saying to fit what you want to see happen

You didn't "explain" anything Jackass - the Sugar is taking the highest ranked SEC team in the Final CFP Rankings not selected for the 4-Team Invitational. That team is going to be Tenn or Bama, not a 3-loss LSU team.
 

LandoComando

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You didn't "explain" anything Jackass - the Sugar is taking the highest ranked SEC team in the Final CFP Rankings not selected ffg or the 4-Team Invitational. That team is going to be Tenn or Bama, not a 3-loss LSU team.
Keep ignoring reality/the past. LSU beat Bama head-to-head. Both will have 10 wins. Championship games rarely move teams down much if at all. If LSU is 5 going into the SECCG and Bama at 6/7 it likely won't change.
 

bison13

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Just saw on 247 they have psu to orange vs UNC

although I see Clemson handling unc. The coastal is putrid

if PSU can land in the orange. A match up vs Clemson would be awesome
I would love a game versus Clemson and I would love a game versus North Carolina. Both very winnable ball games. We know what Clemson has done recently but Mac Brown is starting to get some mid-Atlantic recruits from Penn State so it would be nice to knock him down a bit too.
 
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Mufasa94

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While the Sugar and Orange are obligated to take the highest ranked team, nobody can say how those rankings will shake out should LSU lose to UGA.

In 2019, neither Baylor or UW dropped a single position by losing their CCG.
 

CJFisJoePaII

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Keep ignoring reality/the past. LSU beat Bama head-to-head. Both will have 10 wins. Championship games rarely move teams down much if at all. If LSU is 5 going into the SECCG and Bama at 6/7 it likely won't change.

It likely won't change - you're such a moron. Yeah, it won't change when LSU gets blown out by UGa to add to their loss to beyond mediocre FSU and multiple loss 'Ole Miss. And this presumes LSU even beats aTm (which is not a given as everyone knows after the latest egg LSU laid yesterday. LMAO). You are so delusional in your attempts to root against PSU going to a NY6 Game, it's positively hysterical. Why don't you grow-up with all you're posing-fan bullshit and just STF up idiot.
 

LandoComando

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While the Sugar and Orange are obligated to take the highest ranked team, nobody can say how those rankings will shake out should LSU lose to UGA.

In 2019, neither Baylor or UW dropped a single position by losing their CCG.
Correct--history has proven those games aren't held against them
 

LandoComando

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It likely won't change - you're such a moron. Yeah, it won't change when LSU gets blown out by UGa to add to their loss to beyond mediocre FSU and multiple loss 'Ole Miss. And this presumes LSU even beats aTm (which is not a given as everyone knows after the latest egg LSU laid yesterday. LMAO). You are so delusional in your attempts to route against PSU going to a NY6 Game, it's positively hysterical. Why don't you grow-up with all you're posing-fan bullshit and just STF up idiot.
See the link right above this nonsense
This started with me saying "hope A&M beats LSU"
The top 12 teams should be in the NY6/playoffs...we should be this year as we're a top 10 team. It's just stupid that the Pac XII could easily get two, a G5 must be included and any ACC team is going. This isn't anti-Penn State--this is accepting the process is moronic.
 

CJFisJoePaII

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While the Sugar and Orange are obligated to take the highest ranked team, nobody can say how those rankings will shake out should LSU lose to UGA.

In 2019, neither Baylor or UW dropped a single position by losing their CCG.

Neither Baylor or Washington had 2-losses going into the CCG... nor did they repeatedly lay eggs leading up to the game like LSU has done - with yesterday being a good example (they should have lost to Auburn as well or did we forget about that one too???).
 

LandoComando

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Neither Baylor or Washington had 2-losses going into the CCG... nor did they repeatedly lay eggs leading up to the game like LSU has done - with yesterday being a good example (they should have lost to Auburn as well or did we forget about that one too???).
The committee sees wins over Bama and Ole Miss and will comparing them to Bama who will have the same number of wins with a loss to that team. You're overthinking this. It's not that complicated.
 

CJFisJoePaII

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The committee sees wins over Bama and Ole Miss and will comparing them to Bama who will have the same number of wins with a loss to that team. You're overthinking this. It's not that complicated.

No ASWPer, I'm not "over-thinking" it - the Sugar Bowl is taking the highest ranked SEC team in the Final CFP Ranking that is not selected for the 4-Team Invitational and that team is not going to be LSU dope.