fC: San Jose State not going back to campus in fall. Psu plays San Diego state

[Fayette_LION]

I don't know what you're referring.......50k + students on campus, I don't know if this will happen. Speculation.

Bring the football team in and set them up in a dorm and have their online classes so they can complete their academic requirements while there. They can have practice in the evening. Almost just like fall camp used to be. Surely someone can figure out how to do this. Everyone else takes classes on line from home.

 

[PSUcup1]

I don't know what you're referring.......50k + students on campus, I don't know if this will happen. Speculation.

he is saying set up the dorm for the football teams (or fall sport athletes) only, keep it cleaned and contained & have online courses so they cant compete in the fall

 

[Lyons212]

SDSU president (yes, I really we play SJSU) has just said that they have not ruled out sports for the fall (per Brett McMurphy on twitter)

I have to imagine if one CSU is considering it many (all?) are.

I think no fall sports would be a death blow to all of those athletic departments.

It would also impact winter sports, those start practicing in early October with competition starting in early November.

 

[Parkland Fan]

Whelp. There goes one home game.

Playing games in the fall without other students on campus would look too much like a minor league for football. And then somebody might get an idea. CREATIVE DESTRUCTION of college football.

 

[Player2BNamedL8r]

not sure why this is in this thread but Lord Huron is pretty good lol

It’s in here because I’m old and sometimes don’t realize I’m mixing posts from various topics .

 

[massimoManca II]

What is the rationale behind announcing on May 12th that you will not start school (check calendar) in 3.5 months (!!)?

Why not assume you will be on campus and make contingency plans (regarding online classes, tuition, on campus support staff, etc) if you cannot return to campus?

Why make this decision so early?

Having worked for multiple universities (and worked closely with many others) I do not understand this logic at all.

duh... the writing is on the wall

A) because thousands of families are planning on not sending their kids off to school / not paying fall tuition... my son is a college junior and will take a semester/year off in lieu of another virtual/remote learning semester - the value isn’t there at full-tuition... he’s not alone
B) because schools don’t know how to assign residence hall space in the event doubles/triples/quads are suddenly converted to singles
C) because schools are concerned what dining services will look like in August and if they will be able to staff auxiliary operations

college administrations , particularly auxiliary services - are modeling so many different scenarios right now that they are crippled.... it’s like trying to prepare for a lunar landing mission this fall and not knowing if you will be using a lunar orbit rendezvous vs earth orbit rendezvous vs direct-mission

 

[interrobang]

Oh the writing is on the wall alright.

 

[PSU2UNC]

duh... the writing is on the wall

A) because thousands of families are planning on not sending their kids off to school / not paying fall tuition... my son is a college junior and will take a semester/year off in lieu of another virtual/remote learning semester - the value isn’t there at full-tuition... he’s not alone
B) because schools don’t know how to assign residence hall space in the event doubles/triples/quads are suddenly converted to singles
C) because schools are concerned what dining services will look like in August and if they will be able to staff auxiliary operations

college administrations , particularly auxiliary services - are modeling so many different scenarios right now that they are crippled.... it’s like trying to prepare for a lunar landing mission this fall and not knowing if you will be using a lunar orbit rendezvous vs earth orbit rendezvous vs direct-mission

I can't believe anyone (including students) have made any decisions about fall semester at this point. We have literally no idea what the state of play will be in September. It could be much worse or it could be (mostly) back to normal. Making any decisions of this magnitude this early are beyond premature.

 

[Madsol]

I can't believe anyone (including students) have made any decisions about fall semester at this point. We have literally no idea what the state of play will be in September. It could be much worse or it could be (mostly) back to normal. Making any decisions of this magnitude this early are beyond premature.

You have to wonder if the SUNY system will soon announce that they are going to online only classes for the entire 2020/2021 academic year. They have to show how much they care, right?

 

[fastlax16]

I can't believe anyone (including students) have made any decisions about fall semester at this point. We have literally no idea what the state of play will be in September. It could be much worse or it could be (mostly) back to normal. Making any decisions of this magnitude this early are beyond premature.

3 and a half months isn’t really a long time to be making decisions of magnitude. Pushing off decisions of magnitude until the last possible moment is worse than making them a bit premature.

 

[PSU2UNC]

You have to wonder if the SUNY system will soon announce that they are going to online only classes for the entire 2020/2021 academic year. They have to show how much they care, right?

I know your post is partially TIC, but one huge problem with online courses is for the many lab (or field) based STEM course requirements.

Taking History 101 via Zoom might work; Chem 113 not so much.

 

[PSU2UNC]

3 and a half months isn’t really a long time to be making decisions of magnitude. Pushing off decisions of magnitude until the last possible moment is worse than making them a bit premature.

Leave the tentative decision to be open in place. Make contingency plans. None of this is rocket science (from a university perspective).

 

[fastlax16]

Leave the tentative decision to be open in place. Make contingency plans. None of this is rocket science (from a university perspective).

And when is your deadline for making the final call? July 1? August 1?

Thats a ton of contingency plans to make.

 

[Madsol]

And when is your deadline for making the final call? July 1? August 1?

Thats a ton of contingency plans to make.

I think I agree with PSU2UNC. The way this thing is changing almost daily, we have no idea what it's going to look like in July. Plus, there will be tons more data available on which to make a decision come July with more and more states opening by then. They made a decision blind when they didn't have to IMHO.

 

[kgilbert78]

I know your post is partially TIC, but one huge problem with online courses is for the many lab (or field) based STEM course requirements.

Taking History 101 via Zoom might work; Chem 113 not so much.

I actually was talking a bit with the chair of PSU's Chem department about that last week. It's not perfect--what they are doing is taping the experiment and then having students make observation and write reports from that. Not optimal, of course.But they are doing the best they can.

...and yes I did mention my concerns with the administration regarding how alums were thrown under the bus in 2011-12. I noted that reasonable folks could have reasonable differences over what happened with Joe, etc., but that we really needed an apology from the administration for allowing the NCAA to blame the alums (and really for doing it themselves).

 

[PSU2UNC]

And when is your deadline for making the final call? July 1? August 1?

Thats a ton of contingency plans to make.

Either of those dates would be better than May 12th.

 

[PSU2UNC]

I actually was talking a bit with the chair of PSU's Chem department about that last week. It's not perfect--what they are doing is taping the experiment and then having students make observation and write reports from that. Not optimal, of course.But they are doing the best they can.

.

As a chemist, I'd be very skeptical of this. Like any lab, the hands on component (weighing out reagents, measuring liquids in graduate cylinders, practicing proper safety) are all equally important to understanding the concepts.

 

[Dunkindonuts]

And when is your deadline for making the final call? July 1? August 1?

Thats a ton of contingency plans to make.

July 1st. This is the same lag time as mlb used.

 

[PSU_Nut]

A) because thousands of families are planning on not sending their kids off to school / not paying fall tuition... my son is a college junior and will take a semester/year off in lieu of another virtual/remote learning semester - the value isn’t there at full-tuition... he’s not alone

If you are looking a purely financial decision then this would be an extremely foolish decision. I hope thousands of families are not that stupid. What is he going to sit around all year playing video games? A kid will be luck to find a minimum wage job this year. Then two years later instead of being done starting a career he will still be in school. If he does decide to take a year off I suggest taking a economics course and learning about opportunity cost.

 

[AWS1022]

If you are looking a purely financial decision then this would be an extremely foolish decision. I hope thousands of families are not that stupid. What is he going to sit around all year playing video games? A kid will be luck to find a minimum wage job this year. Then two years later instead of being done starting a career he will still be in school. If he does decide to take a year off I suggest taking a economics course and learning about opportunity cost.

And since the supply of workers will far exceed the demand over the next few years, a college degree will be a minimum requirement for a job at McDonalds. So not getting a degree is setting someone up to never get a job unless they have some other unique skill.

 

[Nitwit]

You have to wonder if the SUNY system will soon announce that they are going to online only classes for the entire 2020/2021 academic year. They have to show how much they care, right?

I know that the SUNY system is planning for the fall semester to be done online. They probably won’t announce anything until sometime in June. I believe that Penn State may try to reopen for the second half of the summer semester but that’s just a rumor at this point. The fact that Centre County is a yellow status County may help them open quicker than colleges located closer to urban areas.

I can’t imagine that all the Big10 schools will reopen for the fall semester so that will cause some upheaval for conference play. Rutgers for example is likely to remain closed. Md and Northwestern might both be inclined to remain closed. I think if we see college football at all, this is going to be an asterisk year. If I were making these decisions I’d aim to have the fall sports delayed until the winter/spring period.

 

[Harrisburg Dave]

If you are looking a purely financial decision then this would be an extremely foolish decision. I hope thousands of families are not that stupid. What is he going to sit around all year playing video games? A kid will be luck to find a minimum wage job this year. Then two years later instead of being done starting a career he will still be in school. If he does decide to take a year off I suggest taking a economics course and learning about opportunity cost.

My son, with the right wing father, took a year and volunteered for Americorps. His job was working at a grade school in NE Philly keeping drug dealers away from little kids.

When you are young you can spend time. It’s the one thing you have in abundance. It’s how you spend it that counts.

 

[Ski]

Bring the football team in and set them up in a dorm and have their online classes so they can complete their academic requirements while there. They can have practice in the evening. Almost just like fall camp used to be. Surely someone can figure out how to do this. Everyone else takes classes on line from home.

NASCAR did the eNASCAR iRacing Series and even brought back retired drivers to participate. The NCAA should set up an eNCAA iFootball league. PSU can pull Jay out of retirement to operate the Madden. It would be good to see the SpreadHD again...........

 

[fastlax16]

July 1st. This is the same lag time as mlb used.

University systems have slightly more contingencies to plan for than major league baseball. This isn't all about getting athletes back on the field.

 

[fastlax16]

Either of those dates would be better than May 12th.

Better for who?

 

[step.eng69]

he is saying set up the dorm for the football teams (or fall sport athletes) only, keep it cleaned and contained & have online courses so they cant compete in the fall

Thank you PSU cup1..at my age, I occasionally become impatient if I can't interpret the post.

 

[kgilbert78]

As a chemist, I'd be very skeptical of this. Like any lab, the hands on component (weighing out reagents, measuring liquids in graduate cylinders, practicing proper safety) are all equally important to understanding the concepts.

Which we all understand and agree with. One of the reasons I did not get my Ph.D. is that I wasn't all that great in the lab. I'm a bit clumsy. But sometimes you just have to do the best you can--which is the case here.

At least PSU, I think, still has the lab separate from the lecture (different course numbers). At tOSU, where I was a TA, lab and lecture were part of the same class. That caused some waste, as it was rare for a student to flunk the lab (almost impossible, if you did the work). The lecture portion? Not so much. But my experiences are 40 years old.

 

[PSU2UNC]

Better for who?

Everyone involved, but especially students.

 

[RCS-PSU70]

Be careful jumping to conclusions. Not all programs at CSU schools are going online, some like nursing and science courses requiring labs and selected other courses which require hands on in person teaching will continue in residence. So the campuses will be open but with a small fraction of students on site. Does that open the door for fall sports? Perhaps.

 

[Nitwit]

University systems have slightly more contingencies to plan for than major league baseball. This isn't all about getting athletes back on the field.

One of their biggest challenges is how to protect the professors and university staffers from contracting the virus. There are a lot of older employees on campus. The facilities will need rigorous cleaning and dorms and dining halls reconfigured. Even the CATA bus service will need new precautions. If they open, there are a myriad of issues to deal with including students with asthma or other health conditions, foreign students unable to travel to return, class sizes, cultural and athletic events, etc. Business as usual would be a mistake and have many consequences.

 

[fastlax16]

Everyone involved, but especially students.

Yup keeping people in limbo about living situations, jobs etc until the last possible second is better for everyone.

 

[PSU2UNC]

Yup keeping people in limbo about living situations, jobs etc until the last possible second is better for everyone.

Having your university go bankrupt because of loss of income when you could have actually had fall semester doesn't seem like a super great option either. Limbo seems like the better alternative.

 

[PSU2UNC]

One of their biggest challenges is how to protect the professors and university staffers from contracting the virus. There are a lot of older employees on campus. The facilities will need rigorous cleaning and dorms and dining halls reconfigured. Even the CATA bus service will need new precautions. If they open, there are a myriad of issues to deal with including students with asthma or other health conditions, foreign students unable to travel to return, class sizes, cultural and athletic events, etc. Business as usual would be a mistake and have many consequences.

It probably won't be business as usual. But here are some relatively easy changes that could be made (using PSU as an example):

1) For fall semester do not have large (300+) student classes like you see in the Forum. This shouldn't affect graduation requirements for seniors because most of those courses are lower level. Use larger classrooms for medium sized classes and medium sized classes for small classes. This allows for social distancing (if we still need that come Sept) during class. This will screw up scheduling somewhat, but it will (hopefully) only be for one semester. Much better alternative than not having fall semester at all (or only online)

2) Have expanded dining hall hours to allow for social distancing during meals on campus.

3) Many cities have already altered bus service (e.g. limiting number of riders, having riders enter via rear door); CATA/Loop can do the same.

Also, you make the point about students who are at high risk; there is nothing saying that anyone has to come back to school. if you do the cost/benefit analysis and decide you don't want to attend classes in person, that is your perogative, but don't shut everything down because 2% (or whatever) of students can't attend.

 

[fastlax16]

Having your university go bankrupt because of loss of income when you could have actually had fall semester doesn't seem like a super great option either. Limbo seems like the better alternative.

If shutting down for the semester right now equaled bankruptcy you'd be right. Something tells me they haven't said f* it lets take the bankruptcy route.

 

[manatree]

3) Many cities have already altered bus service (e.g. limiting number of riders, having riders enter via rear door); CATA/Loop can do the same.

CATA does not have enough buses to be able to get the students to campus with limits on riders.

 

[ChiTownLion]

University of Illinois President Timothy Killeen suggested Wednesday that another fixture of campus life might have to fall by the wayside in the fall: stadiums packed with fans cheering on the college’s Big Ten teams. During a virtual town hall meeting with students, Killeen said that social distancing, which is paramount to slowing the spread of the coronavirus, would be difficult to manage in that setting. For example, Memorial Stadium, where the school’s football team plays in Champaign, seats more than 60,000 people.

“We certainly don’t want to be in a situation where, because of large assemblies of people, there is an outbreak that we then have to manage and go into overdrive to control and tamp down,” Killeen said. “I think it’s undoubtedly true that the sports events in the fall will not resume as normal ... but we hope and are planning that they will resume (at some point).”

Revenue losses from canceled sporting events could continue to exacerbate the financial fallout at colleges that have already spent hundreds of millions of dollars refunding students for room and board fees and are facing other pandemic-related expenses. A recent estimate reported by USA Today predicted that universities in the Power Five conferences would lose an average of $78 million ― or more than 60% of their operating revenue ― if football is not played.

 

[PSU2UNC]

If shutting down for the semester right now equaled bankruptcy you'd be right. Something tells me they haven't said f* it lets take the bankruptcy route.

How about bankrupting the athletic departments? Are you cool with all non-revenue sports being cut? It's already starting to happen (see: Akron)

 

[PSU2UNC]

CATA does not have enough buses to be able to get the students to campus with limits on riders.

Then students can walk or ride bikes. Or the university can divert Loop buses to CATA routes (Loop always struck me as a luxury for most, not a necessity) Not rocket science.

 

[fastlax16]

How about bankrupting the athletic departments? Are you cool with all non-revenue sports being cut? It's already starting to happen (see: Akron)

So this should be done strictly through the lens of athletics?

Based on your argument, the only outcome you deem acceptable is announcing they will be open in the fall. An announcement to close in August has the same, if not worse outcome, then announcing several months in advance and giving you a chance to get all your ducks in a row.

How does an announcement in August vs May to stay virtual for the fall prevent an athletic dept from going bankrupt?

 

[PSU2UNC]

So this should be done strictly through the lens of athletics?

Based on your argument, the only outcome you deem acceptable is announcing they will be open in the fall. An announcement to close in August has the same, if not worse outcome, then announcing several months in advance and giving you a chance to get all your ducks in a row.

How does an announcement in August vs May to stay virtual for the fall prevent an athletic dept from going bankrupt?

Because if you announce in May, you are precluding the possibility of having classes on campus in the fall.

You are assuming there is no way that there will be on campus classes in the fall. We have no way of knowing that at this point.

It is possible there will be no one on campus for fall semester. But if is also possible that classes start on time in September. Since there is no way of knowing, why make the decision now that you are canceling classes?