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Ohio State dual thread - Feb 14

To be honest, I thought every single PSU guy from 165 to HWT looked tiny in comparison to the tOSU guys and that includes a 157 wrestling up at 165 pounds. Obviously, since HWT is unlimited, being undersized there is a bigger deal than it would be at any other weight class. (A couple of the PSU guys (Haines and Barr especially) were taller than their opponents, but still, some of the tOSU guys dwarfed their PSU opponent).
Messenbrink looks smaller (slighter in build) than most of his opponents. But agree that Hermann of anOSU did not look like a 157 wrestling up a weight.

Kharchla is jacked and looked quite a bit bigger than Haines.

Feldman is a tank (albeit a compact tank) and Cole Mirasola (222 lb) currently IS a small heavyweight.

Didn't notice any size disparities at 184 and 197. Shumate is thicker than Barr, but also appeared shorter. But Staroccci and Barr did not appear dwarfed by their opponents, at least to my eye.
 
Good comparison. Hadn't thought of it that way. But yeah, he seems to hit the gas in the third.
He gets a siphon going from his opponent's gas tank, and then:
Take Off Fire GIF by European Space Agency - ESA
 
Good comparison. Hadn't thought of it that way. But yeah, he seems to hit the gas in the third.
Common misconception here. Barr hits the gas in the first. The problem for everyone else is they run out before 7 minutes.

Was really, really working the head hard on Shumate last night and you could tell by the reactions he was getting that it would pay off
 
I know Ant the Champ wasn’t a big Hwt and he beat the unbeatable Gable TWICE. But if after a year of trying to bulk up, Cole is only 221…I just don’t see him being a legitimate hwt. Feldman is a not a big hwt and he looked like a giant next to Cole.
If Cole Mirasola has not gained 1 lb since last year at this time, why do people think he has spent a year trying to bulk up?
 
If Cole Mirasola has not gained 1 lb since last year at this time, why do people think he has spent a year trying to bulk up?
Yeah I think reading into last night too much is a bit silly but for the folks saying he needs to put on weight, the most reasonably question is “where” and “how.”

Cassar was able to get to 230+ because he had the frame for it. At some point Cole just doesn’t have the frame to add anymore good weight before really slowing himself down. (See: Feldman, Nick)
 
Yeah I think reading into last night too much is a bit silly but for the folks saying he needs to put on weight, the most reasonably question is “where” and “how.”

Cassar was able to get to 230+ because he had the frame for it. At some point Cole just doesn’t have the frame to add anymore good weight before really slowing himself down. (See: Feldman, Nick)
I think he probably can add 5-10 lb, maybe get up to 235. But not necessarily all at once. And this year seems to have been more of a technique year than a bulk year.

And your point is absolutely correct -- there is a limit. Extreme example here, but 275-lb SR Spencer Myers was a statue compared to 215-lb FR Myers. And the FR version was the one who made the podium.
 
Last night was his 3rd competition (Black Knight, Scuffle, anOSU). He can go 2x more without burning his shirt.
Scuffle would be 2 competition dates, right? Still ok though.

I didn’t see mass as the separation last night. It was in part strength to finish Cole’s shots, but was primarily Feldman’s quickness and readiness on the reshots that lead to his scores, IMO.
 
Scuffle would be 2 competition dates, right? Still ok though.

I didn’t see mass as the separation last night. It was in part strength to finish Cole’s shots, but was primarily Feldman’s quickness and readiness on the reshots that lead to his scores, IMO.
Believe Scuffle is considered one event date. Also agree on the quickness.
 
Scuffle would be 2 competition dates, right? Still ok though.

I didn’t see mass as the separation last night. It was in part strength to finish Cole’s shots, but was primarily Feldman’s quickness and readiness on the reshots that lead to his scores, IMO.
"Competition dates" are non-consecutive calendar days to allow for events like the Scuffle, Journeymen, CKLV, etc.

Cole also made a pretty big mistake on Feldman's 2nd takedown: he shot from space immediately after reaching up to touch his headgear. Feldman easily stuffed that shot and spun behind for 3. (BTW, Barr also did this on a shot from space, but without the consequence.)
 
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"Competition dates" are non-consecutive calendar days to allow for events like the Scuffle, Journeymen, CKLV, etc.

Cole also made a pretty big mistake on Feldman's 2nd takedown: he shot from space immediately after reaching up to touch his headgear. Feldman easily stuffed that shot and spun behind for 3. (BTW, Barr also did this on a shot from space, but without the consequence.)
Thanks for clarifying that. I had it quite backwards.
 
No reason for Lilledahl to avoid bottom and give up a chance for the escape point. Against most opponents he's done fine from the bottom position.

McCrone is unusual in that his best position (by far) is top. And if the opponent chooses top (as McCrone did against LL), not much you can do about it. Need to be able to avoid giving up back points, even if it ends up as a 2-minute ride-out. A quick escape is even better, but easier said than done against a guy like McCrone.
Gotta feel it once or twice to beat it later. He was gonna maul him on his feet - only so much to learn from there.
 
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Can Mirasola wrestle tomorrow or would that blow his RS?
You get 5 dates and I only remember him wrestling the Black Knight tournament, the Southern Scuffle and last night so he should still have a date to use. I don’t know if the Scuffle counts as 2 since it was a 2 day tournament.
 
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Scuffle would be 2 competition dates, right? Still ok though.

I didn’t see mass as the separation last night. It was in part strength to finish Cole’s shots, but was primarily Feldman’s quickness and readiness on the reshots that lead to his scores, IMO.
If your going to bring hips to the party , you have to have hips to bring. Needs to become a squat monkey in the weight room to add strength and bulk to his lower half.
 
"Does anyone want to break the bad news to hopeful Buckeye fan?"

Nah, let him soak in false hope for a year. The crushing will be sweeter.
Ohio State this year has been pretty unique. Everyone knew they weren't going to top Penn State but I think many people reasonably thought they'd compete for #2. Instead they're just kinda meh.

They remind me of the 2011 Eagles. That was supposed to be a really good team many figured would eventually lose to the Packers in the NFC Championship game. Instead they went 8-8. Not bad, but definitely not very good.
 
That’s fair and inarguably true.

My question is why don’t those differences show up so drastically in more guys with world class pedigree?
Sealeys handfight is actually quite good. He’s beaten plenty of good D1 kids and held his own against some great ones. He will be fine. I think he is behind because he was injured early in the season and doesn’t have much time on the mats. He is deficient on bottom but going with Levi, Kasak, SVN, MM, etc he will get better quickly. Not a good debut at all but he will bounce back. Kid is a stud and loves wrestling by all accounts
 
Sealeys handfight is actually quite good. He’s beaten plenty of good D1 kids and held his own against some great ones. He will be fine. I think he is behind because he was injured early in the season and doesn’t have much time on the mats. He is deficient on bottom but going with Levi, Kasak, SVN, MM, etc he will get better quickly. Not a good debut at all but he will bounce back. Kid is a stud and loves wrestling by all accounts
Yeah that all makes sense.
 
My wresting experience is limited to grade school and I never encountered wrestling anyone with a leg brace and sleeve. The question I have is whether that gives a wrestler like Kharchlas an unintended advantage?

Is it harder to grab a leg or are you less inclined to want to since these braces hurt when you get a leg or arm in there? I’m not talking getting caught, just that they are hard and any impact can be painful. I wonder too about grip which may go either way, but the non-uniformity has to be an odd feel. My personal perspective is soccer and playing against someone wearing a heavy brace. Any and all contact is painful and cumbersome to the normal feel of a tackle or leg contact.
If there was any advantage to be gained you would see most everyone wearing knee braces.
 
I was thinking during the sequence leading up to the cradle that he may be better off going prone and starting over because he was stuck in a bad position otherwise. Was I wrong to think that?

Just seemed like Luke was too committed to his position rather than taking a step back and starting over. Or is that too simplistic?

That was my opinion as well. Belly out. Crawl in a circle when you can, to demonstrate activity and not get banged for fleeing the mat. Head off the mat. Wrists free. Keep your f-ing knee away from your head. Give up a stall call or three.

Luke is good enough from neutral that he could afford to get cheap tilted for 4-8 points and still win that match going away. Unfortunately he put himself in a situation where, obviously, he had no chance to win.
 
That was my opinion as well. Belly out. Crawl in a circle when you can, to demonstrate activity and not get banged for fleeing the mat. Head off the mat. Wrists free. Keep your f-ing knee away from your head. Give up a stall call or three.

Luke is good enough from neutral that he could afford to get cheap tilted for 4-8 points and still win that match going away. Unfortunately he put himself in a situation where, obviously, he had no chance to win.
And the biggest thing..hand control. Even when the legs are in. As soon as McCrone starts looking cradle you have to control his top side hand. Grab it both hands and don’t let go until he starts looking for something else. Give up a stall or 2 but always control those hands
 
That was my opinion as well. Belly out. Crawl in a circle when you can, to demonstrate activity and not get banged for fleeing the mat. Head off the mat. Wrists free. Keep your f-ing knee away from your head. Give up a stall call or three.

Luke is good enough from neutral that he could afford to get cheap tilted for 4-8 points and still win that match going away. Unfortunately he put himself in a situation where, obviously, he had no chance to win.
Other great champions who got pinned early in their career...

Spencer Lee: cradle against a veteran
David Taylor: cradle against a veteran

I'm going to take a wild guess and say that they will have a plan in place next month for LL to minimize danger on bottom
 
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He gets a siphon going from his opponent's gas tank, and then:
Take Off Fire GIF by European Space Agency - ESA
Barr seems to have the ability to exhaust his opponents to the point where they can no longer keep good position and then he just takes them down and then stands them up and practice dummy’s them for his TF.
 
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125 - #7 Luke Lilledahl VS #21 Brendan McCrone

Period 1:
Here we go! Straight to a tie up. Luke reaches for an ankle, but no luck. Back to circling & tying up. Luke with some snaps & head tapping. Luke shoots, gets a leg & then the other for the TD, 3-0. Luke is riding & gets McCrone bellied out. McCrone gets back to his base, then his feet, but Luke trips him back down & they go out of bounds, restart. McCrone is still down. He gets to his feet, then drops back down & Luke gets him bellied out again. Luke goes over 1-min of RT. Luke cuts McCrone, 3-1. Luke with a quick ankle pick for another TD, 6-1. McCrone gets another escape, 6-2. Luke drops back in on a leg. McCrone comes over the top in the waterfall position. Luke is trying to come up through McCrone's legs & time expires. 6-2 Luke, +1:17 RT

Period 2:
McCrone selects top. McCrone tries to throw in a boot, but Luke fights it off. McCrone gets a boot in. Luke is still fighting & gets to a quadpod for a moment, but then McCrone locks up a cradle, rolls Luke over & gets the fall. Wow. That sucks. Luke was in control there until he wasn't.

Brendan McCrone FALL Luke Lilledahl (3:58)

Team Score

PSU: 0
OSU: 6
This might not be such a bad loss. Ohio insiders saying McCrone is a win or two away from Ryan deciding he was the 2020 NCAA Champion
 
I was picking my son up from college, he's home for the long weekend, so I had to watch the recording of this dual. I peeked at the results so I was prepared for 125. No worries there, we will just have an even more locked in "take no prisoners" LL moving forward. Obviously the match of the night was BB's win. I have watched several times and I want to say that BB was truly in charge of that match from beginning to end in every aspect:
1) Physically he looked stronger and with a slight conditioning edge
2) He imposed his will on every situation (which is speaking volumes because there were a LOT of situations) a match like this can only be wresltled by an elite wrestler from an elite room, with our coaches.
3) He got in on the only deep shots of the match and won or broke even on every scrample.
4) As always his composure was impeccable but it cast a bad light on Mendez who looked like he was struggling a little to find his footing.
5) If you only had this match to go by 54/45 advantage BB going into the conference tournament 🔥
 
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Siap, but if Beau wins B10s, would he be the likely #1 seed?
Yes. The only hiccup would be if the coaches somehow ranked Alirez ahead of him -- and Alirez is ahead of him now, but Beau should be ranked #1 if he beats Mendez 2x. And Beau would have a better RPI and Quality Wins.

If Mendez wins B10s, then the seeds will most likely be 1 Alirez, 2 Mendez, 3 Bartlett.

Though that's without doing the seeding math -- Alirez is 9-0 in D1 competition with 2 duals remaining, therefore at risk of not getting an RPI. In which case, somebody else do the seeding math.
 
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