I don't think they'll boo, but the place will erupt, in support of Krone/Lil' Pfarr.
POLL - Should Mark Hall's Redshirt Be Pulled
- Thread starter Flying_Tiger
- Start date
I thought my point was easy. My point was from a selfish point of view I want as many opportunities as possible to watch the kid.
If the shirt is pulled I miss half a season of watching the kid wrestle.
As far as what is a priority. Since I believe Penn State is winning the championship as things are, on a wresting message board and participating in a group "what if" I do not see an issue with stating I would like to see him redshirt so I can watch him compete as a member of Penn State's regular line up for 4 full season's.
If by chance Cael calls me up and asks me what do I think about Mark's redshirt status. I will prioritize the points of consideration from a different point than "what do I want as a fan".
I voted no because with Hall I don't see anybody beating PSU this year. 
There really is no right or wrong answer here at this point unless someone has a crystal ball and the coaches don't even have that. Example, Hall redshirts, PSU wins the championship, redshirt correct decision, right, then Hall gets injured early next season and misses a year of eligibility. You just don't know how things will play out in the future.
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Future injury is a concern that is rightly brought up and needs considered. Mark doesn't appear to be a dare devil like Bo but he wrestles a LOT and at the highest level of skill and physicality, each time puts him closer to an unforseen issue.
Or, you could pull his shirt and he gets injured in the next match.
Coaches can't think like that, unless the rules are changed to prohibit shirts except in case of injury. You can mitigate his risk, but you can't say "what if a guy who doesn't get hurt, gets hurt next year?" In which case, get rid of the singlet and bubble wrap the guys.
"What-if's" can turn any discussion about anything into a chaotic mess.
Or an opportunity. Gentlemen, my card. - tikk10, esq.
I voted "yes", but with two AA capable guys at the weight, and given that he could use a little more time in the oven, am guessing that Hall will remain redshirted. In Cael's recent interview there is no indication of him being put into the lineup, only some verbiage about bringing him along on the MN/Nebraska loop for acclimation purposes. I'm sure he and Jammen will get together for lunch out in Mn.
No matter the decision, I would like to see Hall wear a red-colored shirt, sweater, pullover, or whatever every minute of every day that he is in public, up until he competes for PSU.
Just to mess with people and have some fun with the insanity.
Just to mess with people and have some fun with the insanity.
Doubt it will come up (anything remotely related to the Hall redshirt), but one never knows...this is a reminder that there is a Coaches Radio Show this evening at 6:00pm. You can listen from goPSUsports if you're not local to the State College area.
Endless entertainment if Hall would wear a 2014 Goofers National Champions t-shirt. Maybe Jammen can dip into his stash for one.
Agreed. And OSU also. I'd like to see the 'pokes fans change their blog name from '34 and Counting' to '34 and Still Counting'
[because I've always loved beating this drum]
They should change the blog name to "31 and Counting 3 Titles That We Made Up Even Though They Weren't Officially Scored and Iowa State Also Claims One."
Tikk studying hard at the School of Cael!
"You do the best you can with the circumstances you have,'' Sanderson said Tuesday. "It's really not a big deal in the scheme of things. You make a negative into a positive with your attitudes, so we're not too worried about it.''
That's just another reason why we need an eastern branch of the National Wrestling Hall of Fame built in PA. Put it by State College, and fans will visit on their way to meets. OK has one and IA has one - you can't tell me there's absolutely no inherent decision-making bias with these locations. No one has produced more high level wrestlers than the Eastern US. Period. We need to build this!
At the company where I worked, our outside law firm had a full action team ready to go when the calendar turned to 2000, and planes and elevators were supposed to fall out of the sky. They must've had a sheepish laugh afterward.
True to a degree. But decisions have to be made (later, not now), and a good blackjack player will do better than a bad one by playing the odds better.
When it really becomes time to decide, one tool I sometimes like is the Regret-o-meter or even the Blame-o-meter. These meters help answer the question: If I choose A and it turns out bad, will my regret (or, the blame) be higher than if I choose B and it turns out bad? Based on the Regret-o-meter (and the Blame-o-meter), if Hall redshirts and PSU narrowly misses winning the team title, the regret and blame will be huge. (One other poster pointed this blame aspect out before, but I can't find it to give credit.)
And by huge blame, I am talking one hundred years of "I told you so" from Spyker in ALL CAPS!
All those vitals are accurate, except I haven't seen 180 lbs since that movie came out. Oh, and I married and divorced an actual Griswold. So you're close.And here I thought it was
Voted No.
Rasheed and Geno are owed the opportunity, after the past couple years, to compete for 174. To this point, neither has had enough matches to determine what they might be able to do in March. Unless they both go down hill from here, then we MIGHT see Hall. How might you want to take either one out of the lineup when both might be top 10 kids? Ok, Hall could be #1, but if everyone in the lineup is healthy, we can win without him.
And, Hall is also the owed the opportunity to RS, as was agreed to, or determined by Cael and or Hall.
Rasheed and Geno are owed the opportunity, after the past couple years, to compete for 174. To this point, neither has had enough matches to determine what they might be able to do in March. Unless they both go down hill from here, then we MIGHT see Hall. How might you want to take either one out of the lineup when both might be top 10 kids? Ok, Hall could be #1, but if everyone in the lineup is healthy, we can win without him.
And, Hall is also the owed the opportunity to RS, as was agreed to, or determined by Cael and or Hall.
I just have to ask the question, and there's no sarcasm intended, but how does anyone know that we have enough points to win Nationals without so and so in the lineup? We're ranked 2nd or 3rd in the polls, yet there are a lot of people who say confidently that we don't need extra points! I'm having trouble understanding the logic being used.
Question for the board: if we happen to lose the title by 2 points this year, with Hall's shirt still on, would you be disappointed or just accept it as part of a larger, long-term plan?
It is hard to weigh the needs of the team and the treatment of your wrestlers. Not sure who starts this week but Either Shakur or Geno have the ability to be a mid level AA. Hall has shown he has a vulnerability on the bottom that he is working on.
Accept, because I fully submit to the fact that Cael Sanderson probably knows more about how to coach a Division 1 wrestling program, but I'd be disappointed.
Decisions are made and you move forward. If Hall redshirts this season and we lose by two points (assuming Morelli or Rasheed don't win the title, otherwise it is not an issue) then it will have been an exciting and probably very successful tournament.
Question presumes Hall > Morelli/Shakur by 2+ pts. What if that's not true?
I wouldn't predict either of them in the finals, but it wouldn't be unprecedented. Last year we had an 11-seed champ, a 14-seed runner-up, a 13-seed 3rd, and a 15-seed 4th. In 2015, a 13-seed champ, an unseeded runner-up, a 13-seed 3rd. In 2014, an 11-seed runner-up and a 16-seed 4th. Of them, only Brewer was even remotely conceivable (to anyone other than the wrestlers and coaches).
Schopp ended up doing pretty well as a low seed (think 9?)
Hall should/will shirt, end of story. Could win it sure, could also place 6. You pull him if he is consistently bonusing, which unfortunately he is not. Dominant decisions are great but the difference between Hall decisioning to a mid-AA and Morelli/Rasheed winning 3 matches is.....negligible???? Is that worth a fourth year and undeniable leap in production? No.
Board's gotta stop. Marky Mark will be the face of this funky bunch in 2 years, let him enjoy his time. Everyone else gotta be patient. It's going to be a parity year and we have two pretty much definite NC's and a guy who will at least bonus his way to the finals. That's a good enough recipe. You look to next year and that will probably not be the case.
I would be disappointed for the team and then get over it.
If it was Rasheed that went, I would be happy that he got a taste (or even a big-ass bite) of Nationals.
I would then look forward to Hall starting a historically dominant career the following season and growing into a team leader.
And to those who would blame the 2-pt shortfall on a redshirt decision, well, a TON of stuff happens at the National tournament. You can never blame such a narrow miss on any single circumstance.
[Well, there's a chance I would blame the officials for not hitting the Iowa corner with enough mat-area violations.]
I said NO. Morelli and Rasheed are both capable of helping out the team at NCAA's, I believe either of them could AA. I am sure they are both working extra hard to get that PSU spot. Cael's plan is to use Mark Hall as a motivation tool for them.
This team race is going to be insane.
This team race is going to be insane.
True. That is a presumption I'm comfortable making. Could be wrong, of course.
It always takes a combination of circumstances, such as: a long bus ride, the flu, and an average official.And to those who would blame the 2-pt shortfall on a redshirt decision, well, a TON of stuff happens at the National tournament. You can never blame such a narrow miss on any single circumstance.
[Well, there's a chance I would blame the officials for not hitting the Iowa corner with enough mat-area violations.]
Definitely agree here. There are a multitude of opportunities for any individual team at Nationals. To pin this on one of many decisions is not logical. It's like a football game that your QB throws an interception for a TD, your defense gives up a 90 yard TD run, your special teams gives up a kick off return for a TD and unbelievably you have a chance to win it, with a 45 yard FG, as time expires, but the kicker misses and now everyone wants the kicker to be cut from the team.
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One last thought and then I'm done. I bet if you polled OKST, tOSU and Iowa fans with the same question, it would be 90% in favor of keeping Hall's shirt on.
The polls don't reflect expected bonus points, and we expect a significant amount from 149, 157, and 184. No other team can expect similar production.
