Yikes! Is this the kind of post Penn State fans will be tempted to make once Cael graduates and the program comes down to Earth?
Spencer Lee forfeiting out the rest of the tourney.
- Thread starter PSUWrestlingFanSince2011
- Start date
He is a three time National Champion and, if healthy, will be a top contender for the Olympics and a Gold Medal. To be that elite at wrestling, wrestling has to be your life. The cliche that "there has to be more to life than sports" applies to the casual fan or even average college athletes. That cliche does not apply to the elite in any sport. Any elite wrestler who has the potential to be an Olympic champion has necessarily made the sport the most important thing in their life. Everything else important in life has to exist in a consistent manner with the sport if the athlete is going to become the best in the world.
I understand how crushing the defeat was to Spencer, his family and the Iowa fans and do not revel in their pain. I am happy for the success of our wrestlers, I am not happy for the pain experienced by those who do not reach their goals. I think it is terrible that Spencer's mother had her reaction to this pain exposed on National TV.
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You beat me to it JS. There is no evidence that Spencer's parents did not instill proper values in how they raised him. To set high goals, have high expectations, and put the work in necessary to reach them is not bad parenting by any stretch.
But nothing hurts a parent more than seeing their child suffer. I'm sure that was what her reaction involved. She wasn't disappointed in him. She was disappointed for him.
That said, you can't blame PSU fans for mocking that visceral reaction. Blame ESPN. They showed it repeatedly to millions. They did a segment on the 10 greatest meltdowns after a loss. It wasn't PSU fans. Everywhere we went in Tulsa after Friday fans from every school were reveling in the loss and his mother's reaction. Specifically that I recall were fans from Rider, Navy, NC State, SDSU, Lock Haven, Lehigh, OKST and others I'm sure. Probably tOSU and Rutgers fans were too, but I don't talk to those people.
The reaction was all based in the reasoning that Iowa self-annointed him the G.O.A.T before he ever reached his goals. Those are just the facts. Shake your fist at the clouds, not PSU fans.
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If either of these guys lose next year the arena will erupt. And I'll be fine with that reaction. I won't enjoy it, but it's the price of admission as a fan.
Very fair post. You can enjoy the upset - and you should, it was historic - without trying to do all the weird psychologizing about how he has emotionally abusive parents who only care about winning and spencer is a bad person. outside of the one blip with Ayala, spencer has been nothing but class his entire 6 years at Iowa.
lol wasn't a brag. just saying it's not spencer's fault the largest fanbase in the country deified him.
Just as they erupted when RBY lost this year and he was “only” going for three.
It would have been disappointing if the arena hadn't erupted. Ramos hit an absolutely filthy move in crunch time to beat a legend. Then wasn't satisfied with the win and stepped over to finish it. He deserved a ground shaking ovation.
No, mostly anecdotal. The way they travel everywhere and sell out Carver every year. It's definitely getting closer as more PSU fans hop on the bandwagon (not a bad thing that's how Iowa's got so big too). Either way, it's either the biggest or 2nd biggest.
When the largest fan base diefies someone, expect the second largest fan base to defile them.
The eye batting isn't because people don't understand the injury issue. It is because most believe he is healthy enough that had he won Friday night there would not have been a microscopic thought of "boy, it sure is hurting can you make it tomorrow night." The belief, right or wrong, is that wrestling in the wrestle backs is so beneath Spencer.
That’s great to hear. Spencer is one of the all-timers. I sincerely hope that, as a family, they can recover from this and move on.
And that belief is wrong imo. He's done it before. It just didn't make sense for him last weekend. I would have loved to see him finish with two wins, but idk what kind of physical condition he's in so I'm not going to pretend I know enough to judge him. He would have done the same thing if he lost the year he had the torn ACL's too.
As a well known poster from this board pointed out, the excuses will begin to leak out soon enough.
Everyone loses eventually or our career ends. This match was straight out of Vision quest, when you're as good as Lee people are gunning for you. And when you're as great as he is you often have holes in your game few can really exploit. Ramos and other saw it and he got to him. Ramos was down by 2 late, took Lee down , got back points, then the pin.
Any competitor has to be ready for this happening, everyone eventually loses.
What seems to be lost in all of this…after hearing Spencer pooh pooh folk style wrestling as being inferior, he got stuck with a freestyle move.
Then we would have won 11 of the last 12 championships. Hawkeye Nation would have beat him up worse than PSU fans.
Since you're so offended, without looking it up, tell us some things about the Muslim religion. Otherwise, you're just faking outrage.
If only there was already a dumpster fire of a message board specifically for all this super-productive, relevant conversation...
It isn't the loss, but rather the reaction to the loss. He got up, shook hands, calmly gathered his stuff and walked out shoulders back and head high. Then the excuses are for wusses guy announced "no mas". If he truly had some sort of injury some will feel like idiots, many will forget they hammered on him. I personally believe wrestling back for third is too much to ask of Spencer, injuries or not. Wrestling back with injuries is more for guys like Matt McDonough. Wrestling back for third when healthy is for those other people who have lower standards, I mean come on Spencer was wrestling for his 4th, legend status. When going for your 4th, adjusting to compete for third place is just too tough of an ask.
I was glad to see him show up and accept his medal though.
Leave Iowa off the team trophy podium for several consecutive years and see how long TnT retain their jobs. Finishing in the top 4 is a big deal, whether their idiotic fans realize it or not. The Iowa Administration, coaching staff and athletes know it.
This is an excellent point. For instance Luggie Bear only lost his first one. Insert huge smiley face here.
I hope both win next year, but I won't necessarily think they are the best ever because of the number of titles won. So they don't have the same pressure as Spencer did. David Taylor even with 2 finals losses is still right up there - he was like 2 wrestlers at nationals. Zain and Nolf were both great. And my personal favorite is probably Bo NIckal. "That's what we do!"
I saw that. At his level everything he says will be magnified and he became Shute. Pat Glory became Finland lol.
He was fired up and credited his victory to Jesus Christ and said the Holy Spirit was helping him out there and called Mohammed a false prophet, something along those lines.
Thanks. Honestly missed it.
So that's the route they're taking with AB huh? But these are rational people, I am to suppose?
I seriously have to wonder if he'll be back at that level in freestyle. Guess we'll find out.
I don’t think you can argue this point credibly, either. Neither he nor his parents were strangers to the cameras, he did not keep the nature of his injuries to himself when he had the mic on national TV, and in fact, he subsequently attempted to promote his wrestling injured for financial considerations via NIL deals. He essentially became a professional athlete on a basis of being someone who does not give-in to injury.
You pretty much have to expect people to take that into consideration when forming an opinion about his forfeiting his last 2 matches, when there was no evidence of a new (in-match or post-match) injury presented.
That is not necessarily true. You know she has at least one female friend who, while looking out for Mrs. Lee's best interest, will tell her to make sure you don't read what those terrible Penn State fans are writing about your glasses on that disgusting message board. They are just sooo hateful dear. Do you need anything, can I help?
@js8793
Some of it is haters. But Iowa nation are also quite pleased RBY lost, are they not? Many dislike him passionately. Almost as much as they dislike Bo.
But some of it is also:
- Iowa wrestling fans booing and coaches believing every injury time for an opposing wrestler is a lunger
- Iowa football fans booing PSU injured players and to this day insisting they were all faking
- Iowa football coach unequivocally stating that PSU football players faked injuries
- Terry telling Spencer to tell the world he won his title injured
- “excuses are for wusses”
- A documentary in which Tom tells the world Terry wrestled injured at the olympics
- A documentary in which Terry tells the world that the Iowa way is to wrestle for the next best thing when you don’t get what you want.
- Etc.
When you are constantly telling everyone else that they are faking injury or not tough enough and that the Iowa way is tougher and better than that, then expect to be called out when, by current appearances, you show something different. Even Ironside had something to say about it, did he not?
I’m convinced that if Spencer had wrestled Saturday morning, he’d be getting a ton of support and respect all around instead of this.
Some of it is haters. But Iowa nation are also quite pleased RBY lost, are they not? Many dislike him passionately. Almost as much as they dislike Bo.
But some of it is also:
- Iowa wrestling fans booing and coaches believing every injury time for an opposing wrestler is a lunger
- Iowa football fans booing PSU injured players and to this day insisting they were all faking
- Iowa football coach unequivocally stating that PSU football players faked injuries
- Terry telling Spencer to tell the world he won his title injured
- “excuses are for wusses”
- A documentary in which Tom tells the world Terry wrestled injured at the olympics
- A documentary in which Terry tells the world that the Iowa way is to wrestle for the next best thing when you don’t get what you want.
- Etc.
When you are constantly telling everyone else that they are faking injury or not tough enough and that the Iowa way is tougher and better than that, then expect to be called out when, by current appearances, you show something different. Even Ironside had something to say about it, did he not?
I’m convinced that if Spencer had wrestled Saturday morning, he’d be getting a ton of support and respect all around instead of this.
No no, has to be jealousy from 6 years ago.
You think Coe College is buying it? I don't see Iowa's slum Lord spending his own money to seek revenge for a worthless turd who is out of eligibility and couldn't even win 4 trophies for "me!"
