Id call someone who uses new evidence to revise their opinions smart. Shame there isn’t more of that these days.js8793 is too good a poster to hang. Instead, let’s just call him flippity floppity.#compromise
2021 Olympic Wrestling Match Thread and USA Wrestlers.
- Thread starter Hotshoe
- Start date
Yazdani absolutely did not lunge forward.
Taylor pulled him in with the underhook + collar tie, then immediately shot underneath before Yazdani could recover.
I agree that Yaz seemed tired, and that the tiredness probably caused him to have bad stance. In particular, his bad stance was that his weight was too far forward and his legs too straight.
Where I disagree is that you call his bad posture a lunge, which seems plausible because that’s what a lunge would also look like. But I would say his bad stance came about because he did *not* want to lunge forward. He wanted to pull back, and he tried to pull back by stepping his left foot back. But he was too tired to maintain cohesion between his left foot and his body weight. The left foot went back, but the upper-body weight did not. And that’s what caused his lunge-like position, which is made even worse immediately by the snapdown.
Watch the video again and see Yaz pull his left foot back without pulling his upper-body weight back and without lunging his upper-body weight forward, just before David’s snapdown.
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Yea, I agree he didn't lunge in the sense of a shot - what I'm saying is that he had his upper-body weight forward (and was initially laying on DT with his upper-body - when DT initially took a small step back (feigning that he was going to break contact by going backwards), Yaz kept his upper body weight "forward" in a desperate attempt to maintain contact and maintain a tie position(albeit a defensive tie) with DT (in other words, his feet were not following his shoulders as would happen in an aggressive offensive attempt to maintain a tie on a retreating wrestler... IOW, such that your shoulders and overall weight are "in-balance" with your feet and anckles). IMO (based on competitive situations), that is a sign of fatigue in your opponent.
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I unfortunately took way too long to write my post and missed much of the conversation regarding the specifics of the takedown before I actually posted. Regarding the takedown, my lay opinion is that, as is often the case, the wrestler ahead in the last seconds gets overly cautious and reactionary, and as we all know, action is always quicker than reaction. I believe that even though Yazdani was not nearly as winded as he was in the previous two matches, he was still more tired than David during that last 30 seconds. I also think the pressure of the moment might have been affecting him. I imagine being the face of Iranian wrestling in such a wrestling crazy nation carries many burdens with it. I believe the opposite was true for David. When he entered the wrestling area he was smiling, waving and pumping his fists. He looked like a man was who ready to go out and achieve his lifelong dream. I didn't see any hint of him being nervous.
The above factors in my mind form the foundational background (matrix?) to best explain that last sequence. Specifically, I see David driving in a solid underhook, which causes Yazdani to step back. David then quickly pulls out his underhook, executing a really nice snap down in the process. It was an excellent snapdown and caused Yazdani to fall forward. At the same time, and I believe this is crucial, David takes a deep step back, quickly lowering his level (David's ability as a big man to execute such a low double that late in the match just shows how phenomenally physically prepared he was). By this point Yazdani is off balance and out of position. David then shoots that low blast double, driving through Yazdani's face in the process (no doubt helped by Yazdani's more upright stance, which was a byproduct of him being tired from having to weather David's pace all match and also his reaction to the snapdown). In summary, underhook, snapdown, step back and blast double all completed almost simultaneously did the trick! At least that is how I see it
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Then I agree completely with you. (Except that maybe Yaz was just too tired and too in reactive-mode to disengage from maintaining contact. I can’t tell.) Good points. Thank you for making me look at how Yaz was already weight-forward even before the snapdown.
From my very novice perspective DT used wrestling 101 stuff to win a gold medal. What a great learning experience for all young wrestlers out there! You never know when the stuff you learn at 5 years old might pay off.
David jacks Yaz up with the under hook. Yaz’s reaction to resist the hook is to fight with downward pressure. David then hits him with a club to the back of the head (more downward pressure) Yaz’s reaction to resist the club is to stand up just a bit. David feels the upward resistance and shoots under it for gold.
It probably isn’t much of an over reaction to say he has practices that sequence tens of thousands of times over the years.
David jacks Yaz up with the under hook. Yaz’s reaction to resist the hook is to fight with downward pressure. David then hits him with a club to the back of the head (more downward pressure) Yaz’s reaction to resist the club is to stand up just a bit. David feels the upward resistance and shoots under it for gold.
It probably isn’t much of an over reaction to say he has practices that sequence tens of thousands of times over the years.
Now that CJF has made me look at the video so much, I would say (2) plus (3), with (2) pretty much including (1). In other words, David moved Yaz around in very intentional ways until he made Yaz (step a foot back and) become weight-forward, and [at some point] David noticed something and pulled the trigger on his snapdown-to-shot, which he probably would have had to try even had Yaz maintained a better stance. Masterful!
[Actually, I correct myself. Maybe David did not notice the weight-forward stance before pulling the trigger on the snapdown-to-shot. I suspect David noticed that Yaz was *susceptible* to being made weight-forward, and initiated the entire sequence that somehow made Yaz step back and also the snapdown-to-shot ...]
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I agree he is incredible as a commentator. I thought he would struggle but he's good. Actually funny at times
Dake and Winchester up first, and at the same time, in half an hour (10:00 EDT).
He's no rookie at commentary. Smith is one of the best.
The thing that makes the least sense in regards to Yaz's actions (if he weren't severely fatigued) IMO, was his desire to stay in a tie as a defensive position - he seems almost desperate to maintain contact with DT at the end... again, even losing control of his body weight by getting so far forward. If he had decent energy, he would have taken the more conservative route of pushing DT away when he backed up maintaining his weight over his feet such (i.e., bending his knees so his shoulders, hips and feet stayed in alignment) and gotten in a solid defensive position (this is hard to do if your fatigued which often results in an attempt to cling to your opponent to hang on for the closing seconds). But give Yaz was in the lead, his actions don't make a lot of sense unless he was beginning to get seriously gassed.
Smith said something last night, can’t remember the match, but it was basically “if it’s gonna be tough, you gotta make it tough.” I was so fired up by that statement that I picked the old lady off the couch and blast doubled her into the fireplace.
Eyeball Observations:
what attacks are scoring most? What positions are Americans winning? Any that aren’t traditional? Where are we losing? Are there specific positions that you’ve seen be critical in a repetitive manner, technique or tactic-wise?
I have a few thoughts, but trying to also use this period to be better for my guys and whatnot.
what attacks are scoring most? What positions are Americans winning? Any that aren’t traditional? Where are we losing? Are there specific positions that you’ve seen be critical in a repetitive manner, technique or tactic-wise?
I have a few thoughts, but trying to also use this period to be better for my guys and whatnot.
If you admit your old lady is an inflatable doll, then we won’t have to call the police.
If she is, then it was an explosive double.If you admit your old lady is an inflatable doll, then we won’t have to call the police.
If you admit your old lady is an inflatable doll, then we won’t have to call the police.
Or maybe a sheep. Maybe he wanted mutton for dinner.
I also appreciate that the squares in the groups of commentators are telling us background knowledge like Bekzod went to Clarion and now trains at the NLWC. Or when certain athletes transferred. It’s a bit inside-baseball, but I think the average fan can get an accessible glimpse into how our sport works at the professional level, and that’s rad.
if Smith explained the RTC system, I don’t think anyone would get it as well. He has his own niche in the booth. No disrespect.
if Smith explained the RTC system, I don’t think anyone would get it as well. He has his own niche in the booth. No disrespect.
I think JB could master that skill very easily though. I agree, Smith is the color guy. I really enjoy his mid-match coaching.
Dake match is over, but maybe they will show it after Winchester on the Olympic Channel (so I won't give any details now).
Winchester with a 2-0 lead after 1.
Pushout makes it 3-0 for the American.
Winchester with the 5-0 win. She’ll wrestle for Bronze.
Pushout makes it 3-0 for the American.
Winchester with the 5-0 win. She’ll wrestle for Bronze.
You will be awarded the Ranger Dan Medal of Honor!!
Dake tech'ed the Cuban 10-0. Took him about 4 min if I remember correctly (TD, 3 gut rolls, TD).
Dake vs. Chamizo for bronze.
Bekzod also won, will be in the other 74 kg bronze match.
Bekzod also won, will be in the other 74 kg bronze match.
She should have brought her hips to the party!If you admit your old lady is an inflatable doll, then we won’t have to call the police.
The match on TV is about to start. So I will wait a few minutes. Or someone else can spill the beans and be a spoiler if they choose.
Dake gets a quick TD and three turns. Up 8-0 after 45 seconds. Looks like the old Dake we know.
Okay, the cat is out of the bag. Dake gets the 10-0 tech in the first period. Finishes it with a second TD in the first period over the Cuban.
Now he gets the other Cuban (Italian) Chamizo in the bronze medal match in the morning (EST).
Okay, the cat is out of the bag. Dake gets the 10-0 tech in the first period. Finishes it with a second TD in the first period over the Cuban.
Now he gets the other Cuban (Italian) Chamizo in the bronze medal match in the morning (EST).
Dake bout, indeed, is being broadcast after the fact.
A quick takedown and 3 turns for Dake. It’s 8-0.
And another takedown with about a second to go in the period for a 10-0 tech for Dake.
Gets Chamizo for Bronze.
A quick takedown and 3 turns for Dake. It’s 8-0.
And another takedown with about a second to go in the period for a 10-0 tech for Dake.
Gets Chamizo for Bronze.
