David Taylor to Oklahoma State & related news

[Dogwelder]

… I mean that if every school put forth their best effort to have the best wrestling program possible, Penn State's will be the best program. This is due mainly (but not limited to) geography and financial commitment. …

Anyhow, the most important advantage is the best coach who can build a program, and no school has an enduring monopoly on the best coach. I believe that’s true because I believe that if Cael Sanderson had just left PSU for OSU, then OSU would be winning the team title within four years.

David Taylor (and his gang of recent world champs) can become a threat to Cael, more and more as time goes on, because David is younger and he can continue to wrestle his wrestlers even as Cael starts to slow down due to age. Of course, Cael can hire younger assistant coaches, but they would not be the face of the program as David Taylor is.

 

[Bob_Anderson]

Sad he didn't get a send off. But maybe he didn't want one.

I think he was stunned that it happened and didn't know it at the time, or even know how to react. If the rumblings are true that he (David) is the one that leaked AB's "situation" to Mineo and didn't leave on good terms, then you can see that there's many layers to this situation.

 

[donboy6499]

Anyhow, the most important advantage is the best coach who can build a program, and no school has an enduring monopoly on the best coach. I believe that’s true because I believe that if Cael Sanderson had just left PSU for OSU, then OSU would be winning the team title within four years.

David Taylor (and his gang of recent world champs) can become a threat to Cael, more and more as time goes on, because David is younger and he can continue to wrestle his wrestlers even as Cael starts to slow down due to age. Of course, Cael can hire younger assistant coaches, but they would not be the face of the program as David Taylor is.

I know this will be a massively uninvited opinion here but I don't necessarily agree here.

I think Cael wins more than other coaches would at Penn State, sure. I don't think he is the only one who would win a lot at Penn State, and I think there are people not named Cael who would win more at Penn State than Cael would at Oklahoma State.

 

[johnstownsteel]

Sad he didn't get a send off. But maybe he didn't want one.

He can ceremoniously do it prematch at Beaver Stadium this fall..

 

[donboy6499]

You must have started following wrestling in 2010.

I don't think anyone can honestly say that Penn State was attempting to win NCAA championships seriously on the level of Iowa and Oklahoma State and Iowa State until about that time. How do I know? They put up with not winning a title for 60 years.

 

[Nitlion1986]

I know this will be a massively uninvited opinion here but I don't necessarily agree here.

I think Cael wins more than other coaches would at Penn State, sure. I don't think he is the only one who would win a lot at Penn State, and I think there are people not named Cael who would win more at Penn State than Cael would at Oklahoma State.

There is a lot of history indicating winning at Penn State is nowhere as easy as Cael and staff have made it appear.
Oklahoma State has a history of winning and Cael has a history of being successful someplace else so I have to believe if Cael was the coach at Okie State it would not take long for the Cowboys to add to that 34 total.

 

[donboy6499]

There is a lot of history indicating winning at Penn State is nowhere as easy as Cael and staff have made it appear.
Oklahoma State has a history of winning and Cael has a history of being successful someplace else so I have to believe if Cael was the coach at Okie State it would not take long for the Cowboys to add to that 34 total.

That's fair. I said it would be an uninvited opinion.

But I do think there's a reason Cael, by all accounts, pursued Penn State as much as Penn State pursued Cael.

 

[McScoreley]

I think both point of views are right. There is a reason Cael seeked out PSU, he felt it should be extremely easy to win here and was confused why nobody wanted to "unlock" PSU. A school with great academics and alumni network (for life after) in the premier conference in a flagship state, with bordering states for talent. Kids don't mind going far from home for the best sports situation but when it's available CLOSE to home? Allegedly, the Ohio State job was his in 2006 if he wanted it and he gave the ultimatum that he was willing to take Iowa State instead. He however went out of the way to make sure he got PSU.

But on the flip side, winning at PSU isn't automatic, PSU can go very low (as we saw the year before Cael) if the program is left ignored. Like any other nonrevenue program, you get what you put into it, PSU didn't bother before Cael. But now that Cael has brought the program to a state where it won't be ignored ever again now that we see the potential. Does that mean any coach can do what Cael does here? Absolutely not.

But it's undeniable, history has changed and PSU is here to stay, doesn't mean dynasty will last forever but you sure as hell can expect whoever PSU's AD is to try to make PSU the gold standard going forward.

 

[El-Jefe]

I don't think anyone can honestly say that Penn State was attempting to win NCAA championships seriously on the level of Iowa and Oklahoma State and Iowa State until about that time. How do I know? They put up with not winning a title for 60 years.

How do I know? Because Cael actually had to tell some alum "I didn't come here to beat Lehigh."

 

[tullfan68]

I have a hard time seeing Frank taking a demotion from full assistant at ASU to take his old job at PSU as "volunteer assistant." I never really understood the nuances there though.

yea I don't know why they call it a volunteer assistant I read a while back they do get paid!

 

[El-Jefe]

That's fair. I said it would be an uninvited opinion.

But I do think there's a reason Cael, by all accounts, pursued Penn State as much as Penn State pursued Cael.

Perhaps the luckiest stroke of all was that Hellickson retired from Ohio State in 2006, while Cael was still an assistant at Iowa State. Had he waited a couple more years ... shudder.

 

[donboy6499]

How do I know? Because Cael actually had to tell some alum "I didn't come here to beat Lehigh."

Great point!

And how do I know that Cael thinks he can win more at Penn State than he could ever at Oklahoma State? The plane for Stillwater carried back David Taylor and not Cael. He knows it.

 

[tullfan68]

hell when I was in high school as a 103 lb I wrestled with everyone no matter the weight as you can learn from everyone!

 

[Nitlion1986]

That's fair. I said it would be an uninvited opinion.

But I do think there's a reason Cael, by all accounts, pursued Penn State as much as Penn State pursued Cael.

Heck, I have no problem with you offering your opinion. I was just pointing why I don't necessarily agree.

Usually it takes the RIGHT person in the RIGHT place at the RIGHT time to make it work.
I don't think other good coaches could have duplicated Paterno at PSU. Duplicating Russ Rose is proving difficult. It took 8 coaches to bridge the Bear to Saban, and only Stallings was very good at it.

 

[donboy6499]

Heck, I have no problem with you offering your opinion. I was just pointing why I don't necessarily agree.

Usually it takes the RIGHT person in the RIGHT place at the RIGHT time to make it work.
I don't think other good coaches could have duplicated Paterno at PSU. Duplicating Russ Rose is proving difficult. It took 8 coaches to bridge the Bear to Saban, and only Stallings was very good at it.

For sure, nothing personal taken. We’re all fans, just wanting (I hope) good banter and discussion. Anything more, it’s just not that serious right?!

 

[98lberEating2Lunches]

he isn't an OSU alumnus

But his wife is!!

 

[pawrestlersintn]

I have thought about hanging around Lorenzo to try and catch him--or shooting an email--but nothing official will be set up again by Penn State until October/November.

 

[Nitlion1986]

I think both point of views are right. There is a reason Cael seeked out PSU, he felt it should be extremely easy to win here and was confused why nobody wanted to "unlock" PSU. A school with great academics and alumni network (for life after) in the premier conference in a flagship state, with bordering states for talent. Kids don't mind going far from home for the best sports situation but when it's available CLOSE to home? Allegedly, the Ohio State job was his in 2006 if he wanted it and he gave the ultimatum that he was willing to take Iowa State instead. He however went out of the way to make sure he got PSU.

But on the flip side, winning at PSU isn't automatic, PSU can go very low (as we saw the year before Cael) if the program is left ignored. Like any other nonrevenue program, you get what you put into it, PSU didn't bother before Cael. But now that Cael has brought the program to a state where it won't be ignored ever again now that we see the potential. Does that mean any coach can do what Cael does here? Absolutely not.

But it's undeniable, history has changed and PSU is here to stay, doesn't mean dynasty will last forever but you sure as hell can expect whoever PSU's AD is to try to make PSU the gold standard going forward.

When Lorenzo was offered the job he demanded several guarantees. Fully funded, fully staffed and mid west trips annually (Iowa, ISU, OSU and OU). Lorenzo was a darn good coach who was able to put PSU into the top tier conversation. Bill Koll was Dan Gable and Cael Sanderson before Gable was Gable and Cael was Cael, yet he couldn't elevate the program above eastern power.

 

[RandyL]

speaking of Jordan Conaway .. havent heard of or seen him in ages. forgot he was still part of NLWC.
Seems like he would make a good coach somewhere someday

How important do you guys think it really is that a coach be the same weight as those he is coaching.
e.g. - Nick Lee could roll around wit 149-157s.
Someone posted that his mom indicated he wold be retiring from competition soon.

 

[Chickenman Testa]

Perhaps the luckiest stroke of all was that Hellickson retired from Ohio State in 2006, while Cael was still an assistant at Iowa State. Had he waited a couple more years ... shudder.

Don’t even put that thought in my mind.

 

[amattaro]

 

[railbirrd]

speaking of Jordan Conaway .. havent heard of or seen him in ages. forgot he was still part of NLWC.
Seems like he would make a good coach somewhere someday

How important do you guys think it really is that a coach be the same weight as those he is coaching.
e.g. - Nick Lee could roll around wit 149-157s.
Someone posted that his mom indicated he wold be retiring from competition soon.

I believe Conaway was in some of the photos taken this week in Istanbul, Turkey. https://www.rimmelpics.com/USA-Wres...rld-Olympic-Games-Qualifier/Team-USA-Practice

 

[PSUbluTX]

He can ceremoniously do it prematch at Beaver Stadium this fall..

Sure, but since PSU fans are the worst #$%@*&! morons as Willie taught us, those at Beaver Stadium will undoubtedly boo DT mercilessly and, in unison, rudely chant "your career is over!"

For the good of the sport, DT's ceremonial "shoes left on the mat" moment will have to occur at a more enlightened venue.

 

[McScoreley]

Guys - DT is the adversary now. He barely mentioned Cael's name in the presser. We aren't ever dualing them let alone offering DT a ceremonious retirement. I hope we are instead introducing AB as an Olympic Gold Medalist and reminding everyone who he beat to make the team.

 

[tullfan68]

Sure, but since PSU fans are the worst #$%@*&! morons as Willie taught us, those at Beaver Stadium will undoubtedly boo DT mercilessly and, in unison, rudely chant "your career is over!"

For the good of the sport, DT's ceremonial "shoes left on the mat" moment will have to occur at a more enlightened venue.

TX LOL

 

[WaffleShopper]

Sure, but since PSU fans are the worst #$%@*&! morons as Willie taught us, those at Beaver Stadium will undoubtedly boo DT mercilessly and, in unison, rudely chant "your career is over!"

For the good of the sport, DT's ceremonial "shoes left on the mat" moment will have to occur at a more enlightened venue.

 

[backdrft76]

Bassett feeling reminiscent today...

 

[Ski]

Heck, I have no problem with you offering your opinion. I was just pointing why I don't necessarily agree.

Usually it takes the RIGHT person in the RIGHT place at the RIGHT time to make it work.
I don't think other good coaches could have duplicated Paterno at PSU. Duplicating Russ Rose is proving difficult. It took 8 coaches to bridge the Bear to Saban, and only Stallings was very good at it.

Toward the end of their careers, Paterno and Rose had difficulty duplicating Paterno and Rose at PSU. Personally, I think the PSU WVB team is in good hands right now.

 

[pawrestlersintn]

 

[dicemen99]

I know this will be a massively uninvited opinion here but I don't necessarily agree here.

I think Cael wins more than other coaches would at Penn State, sure. I don't think he is the only one who would win a lot at Penn State, and I think there are people not named Cael who would win more at Penn State than Cael would at Oklahoma State.

Again, I'm guessing you started to follow wrestling in 2010.

 

[Hawky42]

OK State might eventually be a worthy rival. Good it's about time

 

[dicemen99]

speaking of Jordan Conaway .. havent heard of or seen him in ages. forgot he was still part of NLWC.
Seems like he would make a good coach somewhere someday

How important do you guys think it really is that a coach be the same weight as those he is coaching.
e.g. - Nick Lee could roll around wit 149-157s.
Someone posted that his mom indicated he wold be retiring from competition soon.

I believe someone connected on here posted that Nick Lee would be pursuing a career in law (like his father) when he was done competing (in the near future), not coaching.

 

[Ian]

Cael one of the best???? He seemed like he didn’t want to hurt Smiths feelings who was called the greatest American wrestler… come on. DT would be nothing if not for Cael and PSU wrestling. I sense this may have ended a little knarly.

 

[nerfstate]

I believe someone connected on here posted that Nick Lee would be pursuing a career in law (like his father) when he was done competing (in the near future), not coaching.

in Aaron’s interview with Basch today, he said he would personally like to see Nick or Zain get the job, but admitted he wasn’t really involved in the decision.

 

[Pitchfork Rebel]

Cenzo? He's an experienced D1 assistant coach, wants to coach, and is available.

And if he teaches that inside trip to Haines, Mesenbrink and Kasak...

 

[Pitchfork Rebel]

the bank i work for deletes you from the system on your last day. I worked for a guy who deleted a women the moment she resigned , I remember she was upset as she never got a chance to send a goodbye email on her last day. Was a bit funny seeing her say why couldn't you wait till i left the building.

Speaking as somebody who spent some time in public accounting at a bank, thanks to the numerous overlapping regulators, FED, OCC, SEC, FDIC, HUD...they leave absolutely nothing to chance, including the possibility that an irate employee might send out an email with a message similar to this.

 

[nerfstate]

Get your own material, DT!

 

[Cali_Nittany]

Cael one of the best???? He seemed like he didn’t want to hurt Smiths feelings who was called the greatest American wrestler… come on. DT would be nothing if not for Cael and PSU wrestling. I sense this may have ended a little knknarly.

Nah, John Smith was right there. DT was being polite.

 

[creamery freak]

I view this all as a clear win-win from a Penn State fan perspective. Taylor can get some solid on the job head coaching experience, rack up a long string of second-place team finishes, and return to be the head coach at Penn State in 12 to 15 years when Cael retires. How can anyone dislike that?

What if Sandy Barbour is named the new OSU Athletic director and signs DT to a 50 year contract? That could foil our plans.

 

[Pennstate1985]

Nah, John Smith was right there. DT was being polite.

Exactly. John Smith is a legend. Don’t piss on his coaching grave.