2023 US Open

[82bordeaux]

It's quite possible that the only person that reads that post til the end is Goggles

 

[Used2BEerie]

It's quite possible that the only person that reads that post til the end is Goggles

 

[98lberEating2Lunches]

It's quite possible that the only person that reads that post til the end is Goggles

I stopped around the digression beginning with non-word "missques."

 

[nittinsc]

It's quite possible that the only person that reads that post til the end is Goggles

I made it all the way through "JS".

 

[mcpat]

JS - I am really starting to feel bad for you on this one. "It's been over a month.... ". REALLY? Not only is that stoakng the coals in the wrong fire, but it's as if you have no introspection when typing something so idiotic.

It's seems you are in for an very uncomfortable period my friend. How long is unknown, but it won't be brief. Maybe I can help, probably not. I remember some Steelers missques like a punt return after a penalty vs New England that probably cost them a trip to the Superbowl, that hung with me for years, until I matured and got a much stronger sense of the greatest perspective, especially as this applies to what are just games. I hope your journey there is quicker.

Some self reflection is in order, before helping the rest of the wrestling world getting over it's "obsession" with Spencer Lee.

When you think about it, it's been 50 years, and Dan Gable's last match is still brought up here an there on the all of the more prominent boards and venues, at least every now and then. I am sorry my friend but this one ain't just going away, and Spencer did it twice to help reinforce the point.

I first heard of Spencer when he was still a freshman in highschool, and my fandom was brought to a crescendo that came crashing down with the revelation he chose Iowa. I remained a fan, granted less emotionally involved with that decision.

Spencer was and remains arguably the most prominent and provactaive (in some respects) 'personality' in folkstyle wrestling over the past couple of decades, more so than Gable S, Yanni, DT, and other GOATS, with better records by the way. Some of this due to a carefully crafted Rambo like persona. No doubt he is incredibly 'navy seal' like tough. What he has accomplished and what he has overcome is truly amazing.

However, when his very words result in the printing of Tee shirts, one can start to see the persona out pace the real thing. "Excuses are for wusses" probably can be copyrighted back to Spencer, if that hasn't already happened. You can't walk that kind of thing back, and that magical very public proclamation is as indelibly etched in the minds of wrestling fans, as much so is his mom's unfortunate meme. Both now are part of the Spencer Lee experience forever. Just as Tiger Wood's 7 iron to the head from his wife, remains at the forefront along with every Master's victory. For some the 7 Iron episode may be that very first thought when you hear the name Tiger Woods. Fair? Certainly not. 'With great power comes great responsibility'. You can't simply walk back the stuff that bites you in the ass when you walk in the spotlight.

Spencer gave credit where credit is due of course to Ramos which was excellent, but he and his surrogates have also continued to reinforce the notion he is injured and not 100%. So even though Ramos earned it, a fully healthy Spencer would have easily taken him out. Probably so. Personally I don't think he has been 100% his whole college career, certainly this past year he was far from optimal. I also think he came back too early, and should have taken a medical.

That said he has pulled all excuses off the table with his famous words. His even allowing his father to go out with this interview in an attempt to do god knows what, was simply foolish. Bailing out on two straight tourneys was both a bad idea and a bad look, probably not quite as bad on the idea front of having ever entered them in the first place.

Unfortunately for Spencer and his legacy, being a 4xer in the State and then Nationally is not his truth, not his story. A testment in some respects to just how difficult that achievement is, even if someone like Yanni got there via a seemingly less spectacular path. I also think it dissrespectful and disingenuous to think this Spencer Lee would have and should have been a 4xer and arguably the GOAT if not for Covid. This claims he is good enough for the 'label' in the face of this year's failure, but no matter it would have been good enough for them since this year should never have never happened?

Could Spencer have been good enough to get there? Given the right timing and circumstances I think Spencer had the foundation to have gone both undefeated and be a 4xer, but those same circumstances coupled with the decisions he made, eliminated both possibilities.

So back to 'it's been a month'.... In my youth my obsession and fervor for the Steelers was very intense and as a result unhealthy. For more than a decade, when they lost and it affected my life far too materially. When I was really young, I used to go to the games with my dad, and not so many years later after he died, that team served as my strongest connection to him in those days.

Today there are parts of me where I am still the same little kid who had to stand on the seat just to get a glimpse over the heads of the fans in front to experience glimpses of Franco Harris's immaculate reception live and in person with my dad. Today when they win, I really appreciate it, but when they lose it doesn't bother me so much. It's part of the game, and I no longer let games hold so much power over me.

Wrestling is just a game, and there has only been one to never lose. Only one, Nonetheless, all wins and losses are indelibly recorded in history. They can not be altered, asterisked, or obliterated. Spencer will forever be amongst a forever growing collection of the many 3xers. Here's a secret, every 3xer has a woulda, coulda, shoulda story that makes them a 4xer, the line between 3 and 4 is both razor thin and as wide as the grand canyon at the same time.

Bo Nickal tosses Miles to his back for what should be a 6 point lead or maybe fall like in their prior match, only to have Miles roll though for his own 6. A 12 point swing in the blink of an eye, which ended up being much larger than the difference in that championship match. Bo shoulda been a 4xer. He was certainly a LOT closer than Spencer. That said, he's not, Bo is one hell of a 3xer and he and his fans bask in that achievement. None of us fans look at Bo as if that loss signaled his failure. When I look at Bo and Yanni, I am confident today Bo is the better wrestler. Does being a 2xer or 3xer or 4xer matter that much? Not unless that's how you choose to define the person. Who doesn't think DT isn't one of the best wrestlers on this planet? Does it really matter he only got 2 instead of 4? It certainly doesn't matter to me when I see those gold medals around his neck.

At the end of the day Spencer got 3, at his peak he was the best 125 lber I have ever seen. I hope his knees are up to the challenge of putting him on a path to a World or Olympic gold. From where I stand I have doubts about both.

In the end, there can be no regrets. Sure he lost two of the biggest matches in his life, as did David Taylor. Don't let those matches define him in your mind. People will talk about those matches and some of his failures for years to come.

Thinking the bad will just fade away in a month is just plain silly. Don't wait for HVI to move on, you should do so first.

PS - that has to be my longest one. To those who made it though, we need to talk about Internet addiction. Noone sits on the toilet that long without the wife banging on the door.

 

[El-Jefe]

JS - I am really starting to feel bad for you on this one. "It's been over a month.... ". REALLY? Not only is that stoakng the coals in the wrong fire, but it's as if you have no introspection when typing something so idiotic.

It's seems you are in for an very uncomfortable period my friend. How long is unknown, but it won't be brief. Maybe I can help, probably not. I remember some Steelers missques like a punt return after a penalty vs New England that probably cost them a trip to the Superbowl, that hung with me for years, until I matured and got a much stronger sense of the greatest perspective, especially as this applies to what are just games. I hope your journey there is quicker.

Some self reflection is in order, before helping the rest of the wrestling world getting over it's "obsession" with Spencer Lee.

When you think about it, it's been 50 years, and Dan Gable's last match is still brought up here an there on the all of the more prominent boards and venues, at least every now and then. I am sorry my friend but this one ain't just going away, and Spencer did it twice to help reinforce the point.

I first heard of Spencer when he was still a freshman in highschool, and my fandom was brought to a crescendo that came crashing down with the revelation he chose Iowa. I remained a fan, granted less emotionally involved with that decision.

Spencer was and remains arguably the most prominent and provactaive (in some respects) 'personality' in folkstyle wrestling over the past couple of decades, more so than Gable S, Yanni, DT, and other GOATS, with better records by the way. Some of this due to a carefully crafted Rambo like persona. No doubt he is incredibly 'navy seal' like tough. What he has accomplished and what he has overcome is truly amazing.

However, when his very words result in the printing of Tee shirts, one can start to see the persona out pace the real thing. "Excuses are for wusses" probably can be copyrighted back to Spencer, if that hasn't already happened. You can't walk that kind of thing back, and that magical very public proclamation is as indelibly etched in the minds of wrestling fans, as much so is his mom's unfortunate meme. Both now are part of the Spencer Lee experience forever. Just as Tiger Wood's 7 iron to the head from his wife, remains at the forefront along with every Master's victory. For some the 7 Iron episode may be that very first thought when you hear the name Tiger Woods. Fair? Certainly not. 'With great power comes great responsibility'. You can't simply walk back the stuff that bites you in the ass when you walk in the spotlight.

Spencer gave credit where credit is due of course to Ramos which was excellent, but he and his surrogates have also continued to reinforce the notion he is injured and not 100%. So even though Ramos earned it, a fully healthy Spencer would have easily taken him out. Probably so. Personally I don't think he has been 100% his whole college career, certainly this past year he was far from optimal. I also think he came back too early, and should have taken a medical.

That said he has pulled all excuses off the table with his famous words. His even allowing his father to go out with this interview in an attempt to do god knows what, was simply foolish. Bailing out on two straight tourneys was both a bad idea and a bad look, probably not quite as bad on the idea front of having ever entered them in the first place.

Unfortunately for Spencer and his legacy, being a 4xer in the State and then Nationally is not his truth, not his story. A testment in some respects to just how difficult that achievement is, even if someone like Yanni got there via a seemingly less spectacular path. I also think it dissrespectful and disingenuous to think this Spencer Lee would have and should have been a 4xer and arguably the GOAT if not for Covid. This claims he is good enough for the 'label' in the face of this year's failure, but no matter it would have been good enough for them since this year should never have never happened?

Could Spencer have been good enough to get there? Given the right timing and circumstances I think Spencer had the foundation to have gone both undefeated and be a 4xer, but those same circumstances coupled with the decisions he made, eliminated both possibilities.

So back to 'it's been a month'.... In my youth my obsession and fervor for the Steelers was very intense and as a result unhealthy. For more than a decade, when they lost and it affected my life far too materially. When I was really young, I used to go to the games with my dad, and not so many years later after he died, that team served as my strongest connection to him in those days.

Today there are parts of me where I am still the same little kid who had to stand on the seat just to get a glimpse over the heads of the fans in front to experience glimpses of Franco Harris's immaculate reception live and in person with my dad. Today when they win, I really appreciate it, but when they lose it doesn't bother me so much. It's part of the game, and I no longer let games hold so much power over me.

Wrestling is just a game, and there has only been one to never lose. Only one, Nonetheless, all wins and losses are indelibly recorded in history. They can not be altered, asterisked, or obliterated. Spencer will forever be amongst a forever growing collection of the many 3xers. Here's a secret, every 3xer has a woulda, coulda, shoulda story that makes them a 4xer, the line between 3 and 4 is both razor thin and as wide as the grand canyon at the same time.

Bo Nickal tosses Miles to his back for what should be a 6 point lead or maybe fall like in their prior match, only to have Miles roll though for his own 6. A 12 point swing in the blink of an eye, which ended up being much larger than the difference in that championship match. Bo shoulda been a 4xer. He was certainly a LOT closer than Spencer. That said, he's not, Bo is one hell of a 3xer and he and his fans bask in that achievement. None of us fans look at Bo as if that loss signaled his failure. When I look at Bo and Yanni, I am confident today Bo is the better wrestler. Does being a 2xer or 3xer or 4xer matter that much? Not unless that's how you choose to define the person. Who doesn't think DT isn't one of the best wrestlers on this planet? Does it really matter he only got 2 instead of 4? It certainly doesn't matter to me when I see those gold medals around his neck.

At the end of the day Spencer got 3, at his peak he was the best 125 lber I have ever seen. I hope his knees are up to the challenge of putting him on a path to a World or Olympic gold. From where I stand I have doubts about both.

In the end, there can be no regrets. Sure he lost two of the biggest matches in his life, as did David Taylor. Don't let those matches define him in your mind. People will talk about those matches and some of his failures for years to come.

Thinking the bad will just fade away in a month is just plain silly. Don't wait for HVI to move on, you should do so first.

PS - that has to be my longest one. To those who made it though, we need to talk about Internet addiction. Noone sits on the toilet that long without the wife banging on the door.

 

[District four]

It's been over a month. The obsession about Spencer here is weird and frankly pathetic. You guys talk about him twice as much as HR.

To be fair, the focus on him is self induced along with his dad who won't shut up and let the kid talk.

 

[PAHURDLER]

To be fair, the focus on him is self induced along with his dad who won't shut up and let the kid talk.

In tennis they call this an “unforced error.”

 

[HawkFan1986]

@js8793 @jmadden1998 @HawkFan1986

Could one of you post something that gets everyone all worked up? No one is posting anything and I’m bored.

Sure I’ll bite. But then I must return to the land of GIA where I am beloved….or so I tell myself.

Here goes….

“Karl” is a no good lying rat bastard that isn’t now, nor ever will be, as good as the great king Gable.

Spencer is far superior to RBY and quite frankly all other wrestlers and the vast majority of the human race.

Also, we didn’t land on the moon. The world is flat, and 9-11 was an inside job!!!

Now I will sit back and watch this site burn!

How’d I do?

 

[GogglesPaizano]

To be honest there is no way I can make it back through that manifesto, that started out as only a sentence.

I am on alternating/overlapping 4 hour cycles of Norco and Morphine from my TKR surgery. The pain is off the charts unless I am fully inebriated. I know not what I write but it takes the focus off of the pain a bit. I also haven't taken a dump since last Tuesday which might as an edge to the text.

Sorry guys, even half baked I knew that one was way too long winded. How did I leave your my child good cat Saturn, I don't know.

 

[mcpat]

Sure I’ll bite. But then I must return to the land of GIA where I am beloved….or so I tell myself.

Here goes….

“Karl” is a no good lying rat bastard that isn’t now, nor ever will be, as good as the great king Gable.

Spencer is far superior to RBY and quite frankly all other wrestlers and the vast majority of the human race.

Also, we didn’t land on the moon. The world is flat, and 9-11 was an inside job!!!

Now I will sit back and watch this site burn!

How’d I do?

Lol! Thanks! (Just in time as I had deleted it too.)

 

[creamery freak]

Sure I’ll bite. But then I must return to the land of GIA where I am beloved….or so I tell myself.

Here goes….

“Karl” is a no good lying rat bastard that isn’t now, nor ever will be, as good as the great king Gable.

Spencer is far superior to RBY and quite frankly all other wrestlers and the vast majority of the human race.

Also, we didn’t land on the moon. The world is flat, and 9-11 was an inside job!!!

Now I will sit back and watch this site burn!

How’d I do?

🦝🦝🦝

 

[HawkFan1986]

🦝🦝🦝

I thought I understood this but I don’t.

 

[McScoreley]

Sure I’ll bite. But then I must return to the land of GIA where I am beloved….or so I tell myself.

Here goes….

“Karl” is a no good lying rat bastard that isn’t now, nor ever will be, as good as the great king Gable.

Spencer is far superior to RBY and quite frankly all other wrestlers and the vast majority of the human race.

Also, we didn’t land on the moon. The world is flat, and 9-11 was an inside job!!!

Now I will sit back and watch this site burn!

How’d I do?

I know you were trying to be cringey but you still managed to fall like several tiers short of IRONBIRD normal posts actually.

Oh my bad, I did say we shouldn't make fun of him but he had a few bad weeks referencing Cael as Krailure for some reason and kept talking about poop. I admittedly do read GIA, some good stuff on there and definitely some good posters.

 

[PSUbluTX]

I’ve posted and then deleted a few posts on Spencer. I don’t want to pile on. But I also want to share.

It’s very obvious that the Lee’s (or at least the Lee parents) are hurting. And for that alone, I feel terrible for them. No matter what I think about anything else, I hate to witness their obvious pain. It tugs at my heartstrings as a father, husband and son.

I continue to think Mom Lee should be off limits. Never before have I seen a mom’s reaction to her (adult) child’s loss in any sport filmed. Hope to never see it again. We all love / loved our Mom’s right? Off-limits IMHO.

But I’m not stupid enough to think everyone shares my views.

Again, I don’t want to pile on a clearly hurting Dad Lee. The fact that he felt the urge to request that interview tells me how bad he’s hurting. I didn’t watch but a few mins. Didn’t care for the “we” he used and tried not to use in those few minutes and decided it wasn’t going to do me any good to watch any more of it. I’ve never walked a mile in his shoes, so who am I to judge?

Spencer is a 24 year old professional athlete at or near the top of his sport. What he does is going to be talked about. Dissected even.

Will Levis, 23, was already mentioned. Media and social media were not kind to him last week.

LeBron was 25 when he was called a quitter in the Eastern Conference Finals and then destroyed a few months later for The Decision.

Remember Christian Laettner? My goodness, they sold tee-shirts, tons of them, saying the wearer hated him. While he was still in college. Booed him relentlessly too.

It’s wrong, but this is how America treats its star athletes.

I hope we all reach the point, soon, where we can talk about and dissect Spencer’s performances like any other senior level freestyle wrestler without mentioning the parents. At this point, though, the parents have a role in allowing that to happen.

mcpat takes a stab at a Goggles-esque lengthy post. Goggles immediately says "hold my beer."

JS - I am really starting to feel bad for you on this one. "It's been over a month.... ". REALLY? Not only is that stoakng the coals in the wrong fire, but it's as if you have no introspection when typing something so idiotic.

It's seems you are in for an very uncomfortable period my friend. How long is unknown, but it won't be brief. Maybe I can help, probably not. I remember some Steelers missques like a punt return after a penalty vs New England that probably cost them a trip to the Superbowl, that hung with me for years, until I matured and got a much stronger sense of the greatest perspective, especially as this applies to what are just games. I hope your journey there is quicker.

Some self reflection is in order, before helping the rest of the wrestling world getting over it's "obsession" with Spencer Lee.

When you think about it, it's been 50 years, and Dan Gable's last match is still brought up here an there on the all of the more prominent boards and venues, at least every now and then. I am sorry my friend but this one ain't just going away, and Spencer did it twice to help reinforce the point.

I first heard of Spencer when he was still a freshman in highschool, and my fandom was brought to a crescendo that came crashing down with the revelation he chose Iowa. I remained a fan, granted less emotionally involved with that decision.

Spencer was and remains arguably the most prominent and provactaive (in some respects) 'personality' in folkstyle wrestling over the past couple of decades, more so than Gable S, Yanni, DT, and other GOATS, with better records by the way. Some of this due to a carefully crafted Rambo like persona. No doubt he is incredibly 'navy seal' like tough. What he has accomplished and what he has overcome is truly amazing.

However, when his very words result in the printing of Tee shirts, one can start to see the persona out pace the real thing. "Excuses are for wusses" probably can be copyrighted back to Spencer, if that hasn't already happened. You can't walk that kind of thing back, and that magical very public proclamation is as indelibly etched in the minds of wrestling fans, as much so is his mom's unfortunate meme. Both now are part of the Spencer Lee experience forever. Just as Tiger Wood's 7 iron to the head from his wife, remains at the forefront along with every Master's victory. For some the 7 Iron episode may be that very first thought when you hear the name Tiger Woods. Fair? Certainly not. 'With great power comes great responsibility'. You can't simply walk back the stuff that bites you in the ass when you walk in the spotlight.

Spencer gave credit where credit is due of course to Ramos which was excellent, but he and his surrogates have also continued to reinforce the notion he is injured and not 100%. So even though Ramos earned it, a fully healthy Spencer would have easily taken him out. Probably so. Personally I don't think he has been 100% his whole college career, certainly this past year he was far from optimal. I also think he came back too early, and should have taken a medical.

That said he has pulled all excuses off the table with his famous words. His even allowing his father to go out with this interview in an attempt to do god knows what, was simply foolish. Bailing out on two straight tourneys was both a bad idea and a bad look, probably not quite as bad on the idea front of having ever entered them in the first place.

Unfortunately for Spencer and his legacy, being a 4xer in the State and then Nationally is not his truth, not his story. A testment in some respects to just how difficult that achievement is, even if someone like Yanni got there via a seemingly less spectacular path. I also think it dissrespectful and disingenuous to think this Spencer Lee would have and should have been a 4xer and arguably the GOAT if not for Covid. This claims he is good enough for the 'label' in the face of this year's failure, but no matter it would have been good enough for them since this year should never have never happened?

Could Spencer have been good enough to get there? Given the right timing and circumstances I think Spencer had the foundation to have gone both undefeated and be a 4xer, but those same circumstances coupled with the decisions he made, eliminated both possibilities.

So back to 'it's been a month'.... In my youth my obsession and fervor for the Steelers was very intense and as a result unhealthy. For more than a decade, when they lost and it affected my life far too materially. When I was really young, I used to go to the games with my dad, and not so many years later after he died, that team served as my strongest connection to him in those days.

Today there are parts of me where I am still the same little kid who had to stand on the seat just to get a glimpse over the heads of the fans in front to experience glimpses of Franco Harris's immaculate reception live and in person with my dad. Today when they win, I really appreciate it, but when they lose it doesn't bother me so much. It's part of the game, and I no longer let games hold so much power over me.

Wrestling is just a game, and there has only been one to never lose. Only one, Nonetheless, all wins and losses are indelibly recorded in history. They can not be altered, asterisked, or obliterated. Spencer will forever be amongst a forever growing collection of the many 3xers. Here's a secret, every 3xer has a woulda, coulda, shoulda story that makes them a 4xer, the line between 3 and 4 is both razor thin and as wide as the grand canyon at the same time.

Bo Nickal tosses Miles to his back for what should be a 6 point lead or maybe fall like in their prior match, only to have Miles roll though for his own 6. A 12 point swing in the blink of an eye, which ended up being much larger than the difference in that championship match. Bo shoulda been a 4xer. He was certainly a LOT closer than Spencer. That said, he's not, Bo is one hell of a 3xer and he and his fans bask in that achievement. None of us fans look at Bo as if that loss signaled his failure. When I look at Bo and Yanni, I am confident today Bo is the better wrestler. Does being a 2xer or 3xer or 4xer matter that much? Not unless that's how you choose to define the person. Who doesn't think DT isn't one of the best wrestlers on this planet? Does it really matter he only got 2 instead of 4? It certainly doesn't matter to me when I see those gold medals around his neck.

At the end of the day Spencer got 3, at his peak he was the best 125 lber I have ever seen. I hope his knees are up to the challenge of putting him on a path to a World or Olympic gold. From where I stand I have doubts about both.

In the end, there can be no regrets. Sure he lost two of the biggest matches in his life, as did David Taylor. Don't let those matches define him in your mind. People will talk about those matches and some of his failures for years to come.

Thinking the bad will just fade away in a month is just plain silly. Don't wait for HVI to move on, you should do so first.

PS - that has to be my longest one. To those who made it though, we need to talk about Internet addiction. Noone sits on the toilet that long without the wife banging on the door.

 

[PAgeologist]

mcpat takes a stab at a Goggles-esque lengthy post. Goggles immediately says "hold my beer."

At least Goggles is on painkillers. Mcpat is on White Claws.

 

[mcpat]

At least we both used paragraph breaks.

 

[zzs006]

At least we both used paragraph breaks.

Uncalled for. I learned my lesson

 

[nerfstate]

 

[nerfstate]

 

[Psalm 1 guy]

At least Goggles is on painkillers. Mcpat is on White Claws.

I was at a birthday party this weekend and there were some White Claws in a cooler. I couldn't help but smile and think about this crazy Board : )

 

[Sportfan2017]

Internationally, Lindros represented Canada at the World Junior Championships three times (1990, 1991 and 1992), winning gold medals in 1990 and 1991. He was Canada's all-time points leader at the World Junior Championships with 31 points until surpassed by Connor Bedard in 2023, five points ahead of Jordan Eberle and Brayden Schenn. Lindros has also represented Canada's senior team at the World Hockey Championships, leading the squad in scoring at the 1993 tournament. In Olympic play, Lindros represented Canada three times (1992, 1998 and 2002), winning a silver medal in 1992 and gold in 2002.

As a Penguin fan....I guess I am supposed to bash Flyers like Lindros. The truth is Lindros has my respect. He got into a lot of fights obviously because he was big and the best player. I never noticed until it was pointed out to me that when Lindros got into a fight.......if his opponent wasn't wearing a helmet.....Lindros took his off before fighting. Probably not the wisest choice for someone with concussions but it says a lot about him that I questioned but also respected.

 

[AgSurfer]

How’d I do?

You left out the 60+ murders that were recorded as suicides committed by various people associated with Hillary. 😈

 

[HawkFan1986]

You left out the 60+ murders that were recorded as suicides committed by various people associated with Hillary. 😈

Or did I? Dun dun dun!!! Maybe if you read my post upside down, backwards, and at the correct angle that’s exactly what my post is talking about.

 

[backdrft76]

I thought I understood this but I don’t.

Here you go. This is the very first reference to our inside racoon joke. It quickly spiraled out of control, with the title of the thread later being changed from "Kerk injured".
https://pennstate.forums.rivals.com/threads/racoons-elephants-and-porcupines.329373/post-6251880

 

[slushhead]

I really like Spencer. Great wrestler and seems like a good guy. But his (or his "team's") media strategy does him no favors outside of the hopelessly devoted Hawkeye fans.

It's hard to get the timeline 100% nailed down, but it seems like Spencer's dad gave the interview (which is unusual in and of itself) before any announcement that he was withdrawing and that the social media clips were posted right as that announcement was made, which would indicate some kind of coordinated effort between the Lees, HWC, and FLO.

If that kind of media partnership/effort is what they think is best long term, that's OK. But they (and all their fans) need to realize there's some significant downside to that.

Yeah, there was nothing spontaneous about that interview. Lar forced a PR show in an effort to regain some control over the prevailing narratives about the family. If it didn’t happen during the Open, it would have happened soon after.

I suppose it is a noble intention for any father/husband to protect his family, but when you have a habit of inserting yourself into the scene, few are going to sympathize when the spotlight isn’t positive 100% of the time. You are either on the stage or not on the stage. Lar has been putting himself on the stage, and so he needs to just accept the bad with the good.

IMO, it would be better for Spencer if Lar got off the stage.

 

[slushhead]

1. Spencer Lee is the biggest star in NCAA wrestling.
2. Spencer being upset was the biggest story of the 2023 NCAA Championships

lmao

- Carter Starocci

 

[El-Jefe]

At least we both used paragraph breaks.

More like oxygen breaks.

 

[PSU Mike]

I sort of wonder whether they’ve come to the realization that Spencer may never make it back to the level he needs to be, and they felt — for whatever reason — this was an appropriate way to broach the subject, because Spencer was feeling too emotional to do it. Think about it: how many times has he taken to the mat without a visible limp without one or both ACLs? What if he’s damaged another and they know he’s down to his last of nine lives?

 

[jack66]

I don't know who is making the decisions, Spencer or the team assembled around him, but I thought it was a mistake for him to wrestle this season. Maybe with another 4 or 5 months of rehab, he could have been ready to go by April.

To then double down by going to the Open, still hobbled, made no sense at all.

It's no wonder they are in damage control.

 

[jmadden1998]

7. Iowa poster injects Spencer Lee into unrelated discussion. Other Iowa poster objects to Spencer Lee discussion.

8. Almost every thread on this board turns into Iowa bashing no matter how unrelated the subject. Definition of obsession.

 

[Agoodnap]

I sort of wonder whether they’ve come to the realization that Spencer may never make it back to the level he needs to be, and they felt — for whatever reason — this was an appropriate way to broach the subject, because Spencer was feeling too emotional to do it. Think about it: how many times has he taken to the mat without a visible limp without one or both ACLs? What if he’s damaged another and they know he’s down to his last of nine lives?

I wonder how many guys have said "I could have won it all if I hadn't been hurt"? The big difference is that the other guys say that only to close family who keep their mouths shut.

 

[Agoodnap]

8. Almost every thread on this board turns into Iowa bashing no matter how unrelated the subject. Definition of obsession.

You seem to have an obsession with our obsession. So, tell me your thoughts on the Iowa Messiah quitting at NCAA's? His mother loosing her freaking mind then going into hiding instead of standing up and stating she lost her mind, and simply ending the issue? How about Spencer being so hurt he had to quit instead of wrestling consolations yet showing up and competing at the US Open four weeks later? How about sending his father out with the most scripted interview I've ever seen to speak for him? How about his complete silence since that interview? Or perhaps the most ridiculous frown I've ever seen on person? Oh, and oddly, Pyles never asked the only question everyone wanted to know...What's wrong with Spencer?.

 

[82bordeaux]

You seem to have an obsession with our obsession. So, to tell me your thoughts on the Iowa Messiah quitting at NCAA's? His mother loosing her freaking mind then going into hiding instead of standing up and stating she lost her mind, and simply ending the issue? How about Spencer being so hurt he had to quit instead of wrestling consolations yet showing up and competing at the US Open four weeks later? How about sending his father out with the most scripted interview I've ever seen to speak for him? How about his complete silence since that interview? Or perhaps the most ridiculous frown I've ever seen on person? Oh, and oddly, Pyles never asked the only question everyone wanted to know...What's wrong with Spencer?.

 

[82bordeaux]

8. Almost every thread on this board turns into Iowa bashing no matter how unrelated the subject. Definition of obsession.

 

[WexfordWarrior]

 

[tullfan68]

ye

mcpat takes a stab at a Goggles-esque lengthy post. Goggles immediately says "hold my beer."

yea and after that 6 point throw by miles he did absolutely nothing the rest of the match!

 

[bourbon n blues]

You fellows definitely have an extensive GIF catalog.

 

[82bordeaux]

You fellows definitely have an extensive GIF catalog.

 

[js8793]

JS - I am really starting to feel bad for you on this one. "It's been over a month.... ". REALLY? Not only is that stoakng the coals in the wrong fire, but it's as if you have no introspection when typing something so idiotic.

It's seems you are in for an very uncomfortable period my friend. How long is unknown, but it won't be brief. Maybe I can help, probably not. I remember some Steelers missques like a punt return after a penalty vs New England that probably cost them a trip to the Superbowl, that hung with me for years, until I matured and got a much stronger sense of the greatest perspective, especially as this applies to what are just games. I hope your journey there is quicker.

Some self reflection is in order, before helping the rest of the wrestling world getting over it's "obsession" with Spencer Lee.

When you think about it, it's been 50 years, and Dan Gable's last match is still brought up here an there on the all of the more prominent boards and venues, at least every now and then. I am sorry my friend but this one ain't just going away, and Spencer did it twice to help reinforce the point.

I first heard of Spencer when he was still a freshman in highschool, and my fandom was brought to a crescendo that came crashing down with the revelation he chose Iowa. I remained a fan, granted less emotionally involved with that decision.

Spencer was and remains arguably the most prominent and provactaive (in some respects) 'personality' in folkstyle wrestling over the past couple of decades, more so than Gable S, Yanni, DT, and other GOATS, with better records by the way. Some of this due to a carefully crafted Rambo like persona. No doubt he is incredibly 'navy seal' like tough. What he has accomplished and what he has overcome is truly amazing.

However, when his very words result in the printing of Tee shirts, one can start to see the persona out pace the real thing. "Excuses are for wusses" probably can be copyrighted back to Spencer, if that hasn't already happened. You can't walk that kind of thing back, and that magical very public proclamation is as indelibly etched in the minds of wrestling fans, as much so is his mom's unfortunate meme. Both now are part of the Spencer Lee experience forever. Just as Tiger Wood's 7 iron to the head from his wife, remains at the forefront along with every Master's victory. For some the 7 Iron episode may be that very first thought when you hear the name Tiger Woods. Fair? Certainly not. 'With great power comes great responsibility'. You can't simply walk back the stuff that bites you in the ass when you walk in the spotlight.

Spencer gave credit where credit is due of course to Ramos which was excellent, but he and his surrogates have also continued to reinforce the notion he is injured and not 100%. So even though Ramos earned it, a fully healthy Spencer would have easily taken him out. Probably so. Personally I don't think he has been 100% his whole college career, certainly this past year he was far from optimal. I also think he came back too early, and should have taken a medical.

That said he has pulled all excuses off the table with his famous words. His even allowing his father to go out with this interview in an attempt to do god knows what, was simply foolish. Bailing out on two straight tourneys was both a bad idea and a bad look, probably not quite as bad on the idea front of having ever entered them in the first place.

Unfortunately for Spencer and his legacy, being a 4xer in the State and then Nationally is not his truth, not his story. A testment in some respects to just how difficult that achievement is, even if someone like Yanni got there via a seemingly less spectacular path. I also think it dissrespectful and disingenuous to think this Spencer Lee would have and should have been a 4xer and arguably the GOAT if not for Covid. This claims he is good enough for the 'label' in the face of this year's failure, but no matter it would have been good enough for them since this year should never have never happened?

Could Spencer have been good enough to get there? Given the right timing and circumstances I think Spencer had the foundation to have gone both undefeated and be a 4xer, but those same circumstances coupled with the decisions he made, eliminated both possibilities.

So back to 'it's been a month'.... In my youth my obsession and fervor for the Steelers was very intense and as a result unhealthy. For more than a decade, when they lost and it affected my life far too materially. When I was really young, I used to go to the games with my dad, and not so many years later after he died, that team served as my strongest connection to him in those days.

Today there are parts of me where I am still the same little kid who had to stand on the seat just to get a glimpse over the heads of the fans in front to experience glimpses of Franco Harris's immaculate reception live and in person with my dad. Today when they win, I really appreciate it, but when they lose it doesn't bother me so much. It's part of the game, and I no longer let games hold so much power over me.

Wrestling is just a game, and there has only been one to never lose. Only one, Nonetheless, all wins and losses are indelibly recorded in history. They can not be altered, asterisked, or obliterated. Spencer will forever be amongst a forever growing collection of the many 3xers. Here's a secret, every 3xer has a woulda, coulda, shoulda story that makes them a 4xer, the line between 3 and 4 is both razor thin and as wide as the grand canyon at the same time.

Bo Nickal tosses Miles to his back for what should be a 6 point lead or maybe fall like in their prior match, only to have Miles roll though for his own 6. A 12 point swing in the blink of an eye, which ended up being much larger than the difference in that championship match. Bo shoulda been a 4xer. He was certainly a LOT closer than Spencer. That said, he's not, Bo is one hell of a 3xer and he and his fans bask in that achievement. None of us fans look at Bo as if that loss signaled his failure. When I look at Bo and Yanni, I am confident today Bo is the better wrestler. Does being a 2xer or 3xer or 4xer matter that much? Not unless that's how you choose to define the person. Who doesn't think DT isn't one of the best wrestlers on this planet? Does it really matter he only got 2 instead of 4? It certainly doesn't matter to me when I see those gold medals around his neck.

At the end of the day Spencer got 3, at his peak he was the best 125 lber I have ever seen. I hope his knees are up to the challenge of putting him on a path to a World or Olympic gold. From where I stand I have doubts about both.

In the end, there can be no regrets. Sure he lost two of the biggest matches in his life, as did David Taylor. Don't let those matches define him in your mind. People will talk about those matches and some of his failures for years to come.

Thinking the bad will just fade away in a month is just plain silly. Don't wait for HVI to move on, you should do so first.

PS - that has to be my longest one. To those who made it though, we need to talk about Internet addiction. Noone sits on the toilet that long without the wife banging on the door.