HAVE YOU HEARD???
- Thread starter IRONBIRD
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The truly great ones - the ones that get the absolute best out of themselves - live the lifestyle fully without burnout. And that takes a love for the sport that the others don’t have. Don’t get me wrong, talent can win over dedication, but those that reach the pinnacle of their talent live the way it requires and are happy doing so.
Iowa fans (and coaches) mistakenly believing that money is the reason people keep running away from Iowa (and other programs) to train at PSU/NLWC has to be one of the most reassuring things a PSU fan can look at when it comes to expecting continued success.
Iowa. Just. Doesn’t. Get. It. And it’s glorious.
Iowa. Just. Doesn’t. Get. It. And it’s glorious.
I'll bite on this one. What quality Iowa posters got banned here? (The few that I know of were definitely not quality and definitely not for nothing.)
Please tell us more? You saying there was job opening and he is at Iowa st. and makes a call? I mean at the time, this would not seem likely because he is at "his" school and again at the time a better wrestling school.
You can say what you want and CALL ME OUT as much as you like. The thing is, I will back 100% what I have said!!!
See, I knew you could do it!!!! A very good post. I agree and like what you have said here. Maybe the other factors all coming together and the an extreme dedication and focus on training, and becoming the best is what separates them?
I look at Jordan Burroughs as another example to me at least that kinda drives me crazy at times. Yes avery high quality wrestler, but he just went off after college!!! I mean nothing would have pointed to the kind of international success that he has had,
This however could maybe explain it. He possessed all the "tools" and maybe realized he was not giving it everything he had and just made up his mind to get to another level of dedication to the sport?
There are a bunch of other younger kids now many from PA who are blowing my mind. Bo Bassett being one who instantly comes to mind. Obviously a fine looking wrestler, but not one who you might look at on the side of the mat and say, "yea he can beat many college wrestlers!"
Certainly seems to TRAIN like a madman so again, you could have hit the nail on the head here!
please explain. Other teams have GREAT coaches. Other teams have GREAT tradition. Other teams have 9.9 to offer. Other teams may have location that is more desirable? So tell ALL us IOWA fans what we are missing please????
I know of a few that have said they were banned. Can only think of one, the GREAT poster GRIP said he was on here and was banned? I know there was others but I did not pay too much attention. Someone alerted me to my FAME here and i decided to check it out.
You mean your brother, Grip220?
I think vodka has been banned. Do you consider him a great poster? Or do you prefer sabula?
Against all objective evidence, I refuse to believe even you are this dim.
I think it’s coaching mindset mostly. The “us vs world”, hit yourself on the head before the match, wrestle angry, always go 110% every day mindset of the 80s doesn’t resonate with most athletes today.
Don’t get me wrong - I think it still resonates with some - but for the most part, it’s time has passed.
Brands coaches that mindset. Terry especially. Spencer ate it up. So did ADS. Nick S prob should have gone to Iowa for that coaching mindset. But I think guys like Kemerer and even Marinelli would have been better in the Cael coached mindset.
The Brands special said it all. Tom said “ You want to win. But you really hate to lose.” And emphasized the latter repeatedly. That’s the Brands coaching mindset.
Cael coaches taking chances and being willing to risk losing if it makes you better in the long run.
I think old timers probably gravitate to the Brands mindset. And they probably think the Cael mindset is that of wussies. But that’s what resonates with the majority of athletes today.
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Grip is a moron, but that didn't get him banned.
What got him banned was carpet-bombing threads with "No Dice" because he couldn't handle that @dicemen99 knows what he's talking about, unlike Grip.
Grip wanted to be martyred, so he could whine to GIA about being martyred, and got his wish. Well earned, and good riddance.
BTW, Jammen is #1 in the PFP Troll rankings, and hasn't been banned.
Turk's current mission of victimhood has him rocketing up those rankings.
No you're not. He had repeat grades 2 through 6, twice!
In my observation, the “Iowa style” approach is now antiquated and obsolete for most kids. Especially the high level ones who have senior level aspirations.
Competing as a college athlete at the D1 level is F’n HARD. Now, tack on a style of wrestling that is extremely hard on your body and a coaching style that borders on militarian and you have a recipe for burnout and/or major fatigue. It turns a lot of kids off nowadays. Some kids still seek it out of course, but by and large, a lot of kids just don’t respond to the kind of approach.
Furthermore, as a coach, one of your biggest responsibilities is to understand what style of coaching your athletes respond best to. Some kids you can go nose to nose with and they’ll thrive, most require tact and finesse. It seems that Cael and his staff seem to understand that whereas the Brands Bros. don’t. IMO, that difference of philosophy and approach is the reason PSU seems to keep lapping the field both on the national stage and internationally.
Competing as a college athlete at the D1 level is F’n HARD. Now, tack on a style of wrestling that is extremely hard on your body and a coaching style that borders on militarian and you have a recipe for burnout and/or major fatigue. It turns a lot of kids off nowadays. Some kids still seek it out of course, but by and large, a lot of kids just don’t respond to the kind of approach.
Furthermore, as a coach, one of your biggest responsibilities is to understand what style of coaching your athletes respond best to. Some kids you can go nose to nose with and they’ll thrive, most require tact and finesse. It seems that Cael and his staff seem to understand that whereas the Brands Bros. don’t. IMO, that difference of philosophy and approach is the reason PSU seems to keep lapping the field both on the national stage and internationally.
Wrong again. The article is here.
The paragraph you want to read follows:
Iowa State athletic director Jamie Pollard knew his prized wrestling coach was taking the interview. So did Sanderson’s assistant coaches and confidants, Cody Sanderson, his brother, and Casey Cunningham. The assistants had known of Sanderson’s interest in the job since earlier that winter, when rumors of Penn State parting ways with coach Troy Sunderland intensified. Cael Sanderson, 29 years old at the time, even reached out to then-Penn State athletic director Tim Curley to express interest should the job open, he told The Athletic in an email.
100%. Basically what I wrote but I wrote it less eloquently.
It is very well documented that Cael initiated contact with Penn St for its coaching vacancy and that he had to do so not once but twice, before PSU started looking at him.
Interestingly the title of that image was "man after battle with a lion"
Correct me if I’m wrong, but my understanding is that the reason that Cael had to make a 2nd overture is that the PSU athletic department did not think he was really serious about taking the job. They thought he was just using it as leverage to boost his salary at ISU.
The “they must be cheating to be beating us” mindset is such a loser one. Speaking of what excuses are like.
It’s the Iowa style.
GIA is littered with this kind of thinking, and posters like IRONBIRD are the ones sowing the seeds.
Also from the previously referenced Athletic article...
How Penn State hired Cael Sanderson: Inside the origins of an NCAA wrestling dynasty
The stuff in parenthesis is added by me for context.
“He (Sanderson) said it (Penn State) had all the raw materials required to build a real dynasty,” Lubert (Ira, Nittany Lions wrestling alum, booster, trustee, a member of the wrestling coach search committee, and owner of a private jet) said. “Penn State is located in the middle of really a hotbed wrestling with New Jersey, Pennsylvania, New York. He said Penn State had a great history for academics and athletics. He said the facilities were really good and that he could bring the leadership with him and his coaching staff. He thought those four things were required.”
@IRONBIRD should read the article. It might help him understand the situation better.
It also substantiated the "extra" he referenced. There were private jets involved (although I do not think flying in a private jet for a high-profile job interview is that extraordinary) and "shockingly" the coaching staff got a salary increase 😮. Also, the Olympic Training Center designation was made in 2010 shortly after Cael was hired. (I do not know if that was already in the works or if it was a condition of Cael's acceptance).
From my point of view, all things being equal, money does make a difference. But rarely are all things equal. In this case it appears that Cael did not think all things were equal between ISU and PSU.
How Penn State hired Cael Sanderson: Inside the origins of an NCAA wrestling dynasty
The stuff in parenthesis is added by me for context.
“He (Sanderson) said it (Penn State) had all the raw materials required to build a real dynasty,” Lubert (Ira, Nittany Lions wrestling alum, booster, trustee, a member of the wrestling coach search committee, and owner of a private jet) said. “Penn State is located in the middle of really a hotbed wrestling with New Jersey, Pennsylvania, New York. He said Penn State had a great history for academics and athletics. He said the facilities were really good and that he could bring the leadership with him and his coaching staff. He thought those four things were required.”
@IRONBIRD should read the article. It might help him understand the situation better.
It also substantiated the "extra" he referenced. There were private jets involved (although I do not think flying in a private jet for a high-profile job interview is that extraordinary) and "shockingly" the coaching staff got a salary increase 😮. Also, the Olympic Training Center designation was made in 2010 shortly after Cael was hired. (I do not know if that was already in the works or if it was a condition of Cael's acceptance).
From my point of view, all things being equal, money does make a difference. But rarely are all things equal. In this case it appears that Cael did not think all things were equal between ISU and PSU.
@IRONBIRD if Cael is ruining the sport why is ESPN airing it for the first time in history this year?
Sounds like the donors of PSU And the great Krailure just made the Iowa and ISU a boat load of money!
These donors and Cael are both saying your welcome in advance.
Sounds like the donors of PSU And the great Krailure just made the Iowa and ISU a boat load of money!
These donors and Cael are both saying your welcome in advance.
This is the type of info that should be bookmarked when Hawkeye fans with convenient amnesia start with some of their typical BS.If this is the standard, then the Gable Era (1976-1997) was catastrophic for the sport.
Below is a partial list of D1 wrestling programs cut during that time. "Partial" because there are also a number of programs whose cut year is not available -- very likely some of them were also dropped during the Gable Era. (And those include some big names like Texas, Texas A&M, Florida State, etc.)
Source: Jason Bryant
School Drop Year Akron Alabama Arizona Auburn Ball State Bowling Green Brigham Young Butler Central CT State Central Florida Cincinnati Clemson Colgate Colorado Colorado State Connecticut Dartmouth Dayton Delaware Drake East Carolina East Tennessee State Eastern Kentucky Eastern Washington Elon Evansville Fairleigh Dickinson Florida Furman George Washington Georgia Georgia State Georgia Tech Gonzaga Hampton Hartford Hawaii Idaho State Illinois State Indiana State Jacksonville State Kentucky Lafayette LaSalle Long Beach State Louisiana-Lafayette Loyola (MD) LSU Maine Manhattan Marshall Maryland-Eastern Shore Massachusetts (deleted -- outside Gable date range) Middle Tennessee State Montana Montana State New Hampshire Norfolk State North Carolina A&T Northern Arizona Notre Dame Oakland (MI) Rhode Island Richmond Sacramento State San Diego State San Jose State SE Missouri State South Carolina State Southern Illinois-Carbondale Stetson SUNY-Albany SW Missouri State Temple Tennessee Tennessee Tech Tennessee-Martin Toledo Towson State UC Berkeley UC Santa Barbara UCLA UNLV Utah Utah State Valparaiso Villanova Virginia Commonwealth Washington Washington State Weber State Western Carolina Western Illinois Western Michigan William & Mary Wright State Xavier Yale Youngstown State
This along with:
The Brands- Sheldon School District case citation
and
The NCAA ruling on Gable’s erroneous interpretation of in-state/out-of-state scholarship counting rules
When there were 200 or 300 D1 programs and Iowa was signing all the elite high schoolers, Iowa fans were; “the best want to wrestle for Gable.”
When there are 78 D1 programs and Penn State is signing all the elite high schoolers, Iowa fans are: “Cael cheats!”
When there are 78 D1 programs and Penn State is signing all the elite high schoolers, Iowa fans are: “Cael cheats!”
I for one believe BIRD is executing one of the most committed and extensive troll operations in the history of the Internet. Truly impressive if so, but he has definitely grown on me, perhaps like a tumor.
I'm quite surprised how well this thread has stayed on the tracks, but I'll be checking in for the inevitable derailment. Best of luck to you all.
I'm quite surprised how well this thread has stayed on the tracks, but I'll be checking in for the inevitable derailment. Best of luck to you all.
Nah - he didn’t get top 10 guys. Just unpolished farm boys he made great.
That’s another part of the myth making.
Thank god for you (and the rest of the hard core Iowa pack) and your delusional mind. You hold onto the IOWA WAY when it’s the very thing that keeps you from all the things you desire. The pushing, shoving, beat the shit out of each other, ”us against the word mentality“ IOWA STYLE is the very thing that’s the problem. Yes, you closed the gap on on money and have history. But that mindset and reluctance to change the IOWA WAY is the one thing that keeps high level recruits from Iowa and inhibits the growth of those who end up going to Iowa.
Another question…. What is stopping IOWA/TNT from establishing a world class free style program. There’s money, faculty, history, etc. Why? Cause there is no way any world class Olympic class athlete is going to put up with anything less than the best program, facilities, coaching …. And they certainly will not put up with that kind of TNT crazy.
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In chronological years, you are quite a bit older in mental years I would say.
ha! I was thinking the same thing... he has written a lot of words, let alone a lot of cut and paste. The sad thing is all the facts have been listed on here multiple times and he is bringing it back out
. It is always cool to reread the Cael chronicles and what he's done in his career!This is another good post! I do not believe you are 100% accurate on how the Brands Brothers coach, but there appears to be a more laid back approach at PSU.
YES THE IOWA WAY which I am not too sure most understand?
Very similar post to the above and again I believe this is the misconception that may be being pushed on purpose? Many Wrestlers from IOWA have said that the "BOOT CAMP" narrative being talked about is false.
There is however many things all coaches must learn to become great. How to adjust to different athletes is certainly one! GABLE talked about this in one of his books.
Not sure how I was wrong asking a question?
OK THE IOWA STYLE, I would love to hear what others think this is? My guess is many on here think it is pushing and shoving etc.....
TRUTH be told, ALL good programs use THE IOWA STYLE!!! Coach Gable forever changed wrestling!!! It is about MINDSET, IMPOSING YOUR WILL, CONDITIONING, FORCING ACTION, SCORING POINTS. That is what it is in a nut shell.
It may not always seem this way because an IOWA wrestler just is not good enough to get it done, but please watch IOWA wrestlers. There is NO playing the edge! They are almost always fighting to stay in. Also there is a huge difference compared to most other teams of MOVING FOWARD!
How does he have anything to do with current CYHAWK Match? What am I missing!?!?!
TY I think?
I believe I addressed most of this above. The current very good class of recruits and transfers tells a different story. The next year or two will be a good indicator to see if TOP kids are not going to come, which I believe they will come!
To have a World Class FS program, you have to have World Class Wrestlers!!! They are few and far between. PSU grabbed 3 top guys from other schools including IOWA!
Our current guys still wrestling ALL appear to be "out wrestling" expectations based on how they faired in college. The MONSTER who is Spencer Lee appears to be getting healthy and already made a statement winning the BF Tourn. He will be a HUGE part of the HWC and its revival in my opinion.
It’s “IRONBIRD”.
He didn’t swim 2.4 miles, bike 112 miles and then run a marathon (26.2 miles) to be called “BIRD”.
This guy is so reasonable and charming. Why does everyone call him Ironturd?
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