Team USA / Yasar Dogu / July 11-14

[El-Jefe]

I get it. I do. It's not a good thing for Zain and your avatar is Zain, so I understand you are a fan.

Have we seen something formal from USA Wrestling on the results of the protest committee? One must assume based on Koll's comments, it was formally filed.

I pulled this from the 2019 World Team Trials Qualification & Procedures Men’s Freestyle document on their website.

Protests concerning eligibility of a contestant, adherence to the terms of this document, and other matters of procedure shall be reviewed by a Protest Committee comprised by the following individuals: a. President of USA Wrestling, or his designee, who shall act as chairperson. b. One or more members of the USA Wrestling Board of Directors appointed by the chairperson of the Protest Committee. Sport Committee members of the style being protested are ineligible to serve on the Protest Committee. i. Any member of the Protest Committee shall disqualify him or herself from a protest hearing if they have personal ties to any contestant in the same weight. ii. Any situation not specifically addressed in this document shall be resolved under standard procedures of USA Wrestling.

I point to ii. and if the committee wants to see more since this is such a convoluted situation, so be it. I see nothing that points to the exact process the protest committee has to follow. If someone pulls that, I'll walk back on everything I'm saying.
You keep saying this isn't reasonable and Nickal/Woodley is "by the rules" and "rules on the fly". I just don't see it that way. I see it as such a difficult situation where a minute of wrestling was or was not counted. That's all.

My avatar is irrelevant. Zain won the best-of-3 two matches to none. That is the official fact.

That remains the fact until/unless there is an official ruling otherwise. Not some fans" wishes. Not some other unrelated matches at some other event.

If such a ruling occurs, it must specify how to determine the World Team rep. No matter the ruling on Match 2, Yianni is still not that person because Zain won Match 1.

Since that ruling has no occurred -- we don't even know if or when an appeal will be reviewed -- Zain is still the USA rep. By rule.

I think you need to read some more of the chain and my comments with all due respect. We are saying the same thing. I'm advocating for Yianni to be able to wrestle at Dogu because it doesn't matter in the overall process. El Jefe's argument is that it does matter and he should never be there.Which I don't see anything that says it could or would. It's the best thing for USA Wrestling to have him compete there and to keep getting better for the same exact reason I think Bo should have his chance. It's what is best for the whole.

I never said Yianni shouldn't be at Dogu -- though I do think it's very curious that USA sent no second wrestlers at any other weight.

I said that this match was a perception problem -- that the fans and perhaps the media would treat it as another trials despite the rules. If Zain won, it would've "legitimized" his Final X result. If he lost, it would've "delegitimized" Final X. Rules be damned, people would act as if this were the true trials.

This thread proves that assertion.

 

[dbldoofus]

I am not alone in my assessment. Check the internets

C'mon Turk, I have "defended' you on this board...but looking at the internets to determine the best or what is correct is total horseshit. Just because the Ford Escort was a great seller, does not mean it is the best car. Popularity and noise do not equal facts.

 

[El-Jefe]

C'mon Turk, I have "defended' you on this board...but looking at the internets to determine the best or what is correct is total horseshit. Just because the Ford Escort was a great seller, does not mean it is the best car. Popularity and noise do not equal facts.

Just because Myles Martin was the best wrestler, does not mean he beat Max Dean when it counted.

Or maybe we should re-wrestle the NCAA Championships at some later tournament. In Aruba if Tan Tom has any say.

 

[tikk10]

A bit similar to the Dake Ringer debate on another thread, where some are happy to give Dake a pass for skirting the rules on the idea that getting the best team is the only thing that matters, rules be damned. Not that Yianni's gaming the rules, but it was interesting to see how quickly the internet was wiling to make up new rules on the fly, like Calvinball.

It is a bit disappointing that the relevant powers couldn't resolve the appeal already. It's a ten-minute long video, not Judgment at Nuremberg. Watch it, get everyone's arguments on tape or paper, and write a few paragraphs deciding the issue. It shouldn't have dragged out this long b/c both wrestlers are prejudiced by the delay.

 

[GogglesPaizano]

Just because Myles Martin was the best wrestler, does not mean he beat Max Dean when it counted.

Or maybe we should re-wrestle the NCAA Championships at some later tournament. In Aruba if Tan Tom has any say.

I totally agree and we should start with Bo vs Martin freshman year.

 

[dunkej01]

C'mon Turk, I have "defended' you on this board...but looking at the internets to determine the best or what is correct is total horseshit. Just because the Ford Escort was a great seller, does not mean it is the best car. Popularity and noise do not equal facts.

Hes trolling .....

 

[CropDuster507]

I got a new phone today for the first time since 2013.

 

[WildTurk]

C'mon Turk, I have "defended' you on this board...but looking at the internets to determine the best or what is correct is total horseshit. Just because the Ford Escort was a great seller, does not mean it is the best car. Popularity and noise do not equal facts.

You are twisting what I said. I didn't say to look at the internets for what is best or what is correct. I said I am not the only one with said opinion. You get that right?

 

[WildTurk]

Hes trolling .....

Weak from you. I am far from trolling. Look at my posts rationally and get back at me with your hashtags

 

[slushhead]

I got a new phone today for the first time since 2013.

Nice work. I'm still holding out w/ my 2012 iPhone5.

The screen is being held in by shipping tape, the home button barely works once ambient air temperature is above 75 degrees, discharge down to 39% battery power causes a sudden crash to zero and phone shutdown, and - as of a week ago - it cannot detect the local cell tower for more than 20 seconds at a time.

I'm still holding out hope Apple will make another model that is small enough to fit easily into my pocket . . . until then, I'm driving the wheels off this thing.

 

[WildTurk]

Nice work. I'm still holding out w/ my 2012 iPhone5.

The screen is being held in by shipping tape, the home button barely works once ambient air temperature is above 75 degrees, discharge down to 39% battery power causes a sudden crash to zero and phone shutdown, and - as of a week ago - it cannot detect the local cell tower for more than 20 seconds at a time.

I'm still holding out hope Apple will make another model that is small enough to fit easily into my pocket . . . until then, I'm driving the wheels off this thing.

Samsung S10+

 

[CropDuster507]

Turned the ol' Kyocera in for an iPhone XR. I feel like someone with blindness being exposed to sight for the first time.

 

[dbldoofus]

You are twisting what I said. I didn't say to look at the internets for what is best or what is correct. I said I am not the only one with said opinion. You get that right?

If I cared what the internet thought, I’d be Facebook user.

The opinion of the online hoards on things about which they know nothing about (me included) means as much as the lint I pulled off my toes today.

And maybe I misinterpreted what you meant, but volume of opinions (loudness and quantity) do not equate to rule of law/facts. It’s just noise.

 

[WildTurk]

If I cared what the internet thought, I’d be Facebook user.

The opinion of the online hoards on things about which they know nothing about (me included) means as much as the lint I pulled off my toes today.

And maybe I misinterpreted what you meant, but volume of opinions (loudness and quantity) do not equate to rule of law/facts. It’s just noise.

Then why are you on an anonymous internet message board??

 

[dmm53]

Retherford defaults out of the tournament. Must have been injury or injury concern. PSU guys have had the injury bug of late: DT, Zain, RBY, and others.

 

[west2east]

Retherford defaults out of the tournament. Must have been injury or injury concern. PSU guys have had the injury bug of late: DT, Zain, RBY, and others.

Hopefully he's ok and his knee isn't serious.

 

[psu_flip]

If Zain/Yianni IV was in folkstyle, would the sequence before the 4 point move have been blown dead as potentially dangerous?

 

[dunkej01]

Then why are you on an anonymous internet message board??

Example 5

 

[bowandarrow]

I apologize for not awaking this morning to write boneheaded recaps.

Burroughs, Snyder, Cox are all in the semi's (happening any minute now).

Downey lost 11-5 in the first round. Some controversy on a 4 call that went for the bad guys. The Magic Man is missed.

I am off to a kickball tournament. So I won't be able to recap further, either. Go USA.

 

[slushhead]

. . . I am off to a kickball tournament. So I won't be able to recap further, either. Go USA.

Nice! I hope you are competing. Even better than dodgeball.

 

[dbldoofus]

Then why are you on an anonymous internet message board??

This ain’t Facebook.

 

[tikk10]

Finals start at 10 am for YIanni (10th match), Ringer (12th), Gwiz (14th), all on Mat B.

 

[pabison]

So i

Finals start at 10 am for YIanni (10th match), Ringer (12th), Gwiz (14th), all on Mat B.

So if Yianni wins, does Zain get to wrestle consys?

 

[rmg78]

I apologize for not awaking this morning to write boneheaded recaps.

Burroughs, Snyder, Cox are all in the semi's (happening any minute now).

Downey lost 11-5 in the first round. Some controversy on a 4 call that went for the bad guys. The Magic Man is missed.

I am off to a kickball tournament. So I won't be able to recap further, either. Go USA.

I guess Downey and his quest of World Champ or homeless is trending towards homeless. Not looking good for him. I know nothing of the guy he lost to but do know that the top guys in 86kg are not at the tournament either.

 

[tikk10]

So i

So if Yianni wins, does Zain get to wrestle consys?

Zain was pulled back in by virtue of Yianni reaching the finals, but he already MFF'd out, presumably precautionary but related to a knee injury suffered yesterday against Yianni.

 

[nerfstate]

Whew:

 

[El-Jefe]

Whew:

View embedded media

So we should expect to see him compete overseas in 7 days.

Wait, that's Dake. Never mind.

 

[Scryed]

Is that a real 12 to 14 days or a Penn state 12 to 14 days? Thinking suriano ankle injury reporting.

Do hope zain is ok and recovers from this quickly

 

[El-Jefe]

Yianni won by forfeit.

Ringer won 4-1.

 

[tikk10]

Gwiz down 5-1 at break vs Olympic champ Akgul, who is very good.

Gwiz with some nice shots and most of the action in the second, but Akgul is tough and will take it, 5-1. IIRC, Gwiz has been teched by Akgul, so it's nice to see him closing the gap.

I see Cody is in Gwiz's corner, first time I've noticed that.

 

[RandyL]

I got a new phone today for the first time since 2013.

A new phone !!
Please turn in your Luddite membership badge.

 

[ThePSUOutsider]

I hope they wrestle in first round, actually Im praying for it, then this bullshit appeal can be put to rest, and the real team member can focus on his international opponents.

Be careful what you wish for.

 

[ThePSUOutsider]

Im not against Zain meeting Yianni at all, but the fact that the only 2 Americans in the bracket meet in the first round is horseshit.

Nothing to do with horseshit. They draw numbers for bracket placement at weigh-ins.

 

[ThePSUOutsider]

If Zain/Yianni IV was in folkstyle, would the sequence before the 4 point move have been blown dead as potentially dangerous?

If the sequence occurred in folk, Yianni likely would have possibly been penalized a point due to an illegal move. It would depend the ref’s interpretation of Yianni’s airborne roll to Zain’s back.

Classic example is the Mack Reiter v Chris Fleeger NCAA QF bout, where Reiter jumped backward taking Fleeger to his back in an uncontrolled freefall. One point for Fleeger, who took an INJ DEF into the NCAA SF.

 

[ThePSUOutsider]

Gwiz down 5-1 at break vs Olympic champ Akgul, who is very good.

Gwiz with some nice shots and most of the action in the second, but Akgul is tough and will take it, 5-1. IIRC, Gwiz has been teched by Akgul, so it's nice to see him closing the gap.

I see Cody is in Gwiz's corner, first time I've noticed that.

Gwiz trains at NLWC. Not a surprise to see Cody in his corner. I believe he has ‘cornered’ Gwiz in the past.

 

[amalone]

 

[amalone]

https://unitedworldwrestling.org/ar...itles-akgul-locks-wrestlenursultan-third-seed

 

[El-Jefe]

https://unitedworldwrestling.org/ar...itles-akgul-locks-wrestlenursultan-third-seed

Buried in the article: Gwiz locked up the 4 seed at Worlds.

 

[nerfstate]

Gwiz trains at NLWC. Not a surprise to see Cody in his corner. I believe he has ‘cornered’ Gwiz in the past.

Casey, usually. But Casey didn’t make the trip, I don’t think, as Cody tends to be Zain’s main corner guy.

 

[pabison]

Zain was pulled back in by virtue of Yianni reaching the finals, but he already MFF'd out, presumably precautionary but related to a knee injury suffered yesterday against Yianni.

Thanks Tikk.