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Wisconsin Match Thread

Steen was a 2 time Pa state champ and 3rd twice I would call that elite!
Not in the big picture, on a national scale. When Steen committed to PSU, he was ranked #7 nationally at 120 pounds and #35 overall in his class (Open Mat rankings). IIRC correctly, other services had him ranked in the #50-60 range overall.

Overall, good recruit, but not elite nor super heralded on a national scale.
 
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Not in the big picture, on a national scale. When Steen committed to PSU, he was ranked #7 nationally at 120 pounds and #35 overall in his class (Open Mat rankings). IIRC correctly, other services had him ranked in the #50-60 range overall.

Overall, good recruit, but not elite nor super heralded on a national scale.
I would consider most Pa state champs elite,but thats just me!!
 
Yeah.

I expect his career to mimic that of someone like Brody Teske. Which is not a dig or anything, it’s a compliment. But will take time to develop and grow.
remember Bobby Weaver Olympic champ but really small in college was way to light he was good but not great but in the Olympics at his more correct weight he was great!
 
Steen's state titles were all at 113. The minute he went to 120 even he lost to guys like Gibson and Ungar. He's small for 125 and it seems even growing as big as he is has slowed him down (when he wasn't fast to begin with)

That being said, he's a fantastic kid to have in the room. He is figuratively and literally a coaches son. Guys like him definitely are huge in helping everyone else get better technically and sharing their knowledge. Bad Karma is growing big time and I love that PSU wrestling can continue to be a part of that (our guys are regularly clinicians now) and it could very well be a huge pipeline down the line.
 
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It's kind of funny, I swear every one of our 125s the last few years get called "the next Jordan Conaway" Maybe it's time to appreciate how good JC was actually and stop thinking everyone can be that good just because he was more of the "scrapper" type. He beat Tyler Graff for a reason as a freshman.
 
It is embarrassing that Steen is the best we can get. The top program has to be able to attract more talented smqll kids. Back in the day, Pennsylvania state teacher colleges like Lock Haven got better talent than him. It seems that he really lacks strength.
The biggest problem is that we're very spoiled with the number of elite wrestlers that we've got to watch perform during Cael's coaching tenure. Our 125 issues are well documented, save Nico and Suriano.

I don't know what the future holds at 125 with Robbie's injury or future recruits. What I know are two things. Gary Steen under this staff will continue to improve and if he's the starter going forward, he will receive my fan support win or lose.
 
Hindsight 20-20 but I think if we knew Robbie's shoulders are as bad as they are, we would have grabbed someone like Matt Ramos or Anthony Noto (who is a multi year starter) rather than Drew Hildebrandt (one year stop gap) from the portal.
 
Hindsight 20-20 but I think if we knew Robbie's shoulders are as bad as they are, we would have grabbed someone like Matt Ramos or Anthony Noto (who is a multi year starter) rather than Drew Hildebrandt (one year stop gap) from the portal.
I'm pretty sure Cael has gone after other blue chip 125s that ended up going elsewhere. i.e. Figs, MAM, there may be others. If Cael doesn't land Lilledahl or Davino, I'm afraid he might continue to have a hole 125 for some years to come.
 
Steen's state titles were all at 113. The minute he went to 120 even he lost to guys like Gibson and Ungar. He's small for 125 and it seems even growing as big as he is has slowed him down (when he wasn't fast to begin with)

That being said, he's a fantastic kid to have in the room. He is figuratively and literally a coaches son. Guys like him definitely are huge in helping everyone else get better technically and sharing their knowledge. Bad Karma is growing big time and I love that PSU wrestling can continue to be a part of that (our guys are regularly clinicians now) and it could very well be a huge pipeline down the line.
That's the thing about this program under Cael: it really ISNT all about top talent at every weight. It's more about guys like Steen, and how everyone gets better because the karma in the room is always balanced.
 
I'm pretty sure Cael has gone after other blue chip 125s that ended up going elsewhere. i.e. Figs, MAM, there may be others. If Cael doesn't land Lilledahl or Davino, I'm afraid he might continue to have a hole 125 for some years to come.
Isn't there a top 25 pounder coming in next year?
 
I'm pretty sure Cael has gone after other blue chip 125s that ended up going elsewhere. i.e. Figs, MAM, there may be others. If Cael doesn't land Lilledahl or Davino, I'm afraid he might continue to have a hole 125 for some years to come.
We have Braeden Davis and Mason Gibson who will both be 125 for at least a part of their college career. We're after Lilledahl hard.

As for after this year, I expect to look in the portal hard for 125/133 options that become available.
 
Sorry if I missed it.. Does any one have the takedown differential from last night? TIA
 
Steen was a 2 time Pa state champ and 3rd twice I would call that elite!
Just so this doesnt come across the wrong way, I never sniffed a section championship, so I view winning a state championship as rarified air indeed. This is also not meant to disparage Gary.

As for "Elite" at the NCAA level, let alone the Big 10, that is a whole different animal. I think Bo Pipher was a 3x champ and might have set an all time state record for pins, was it in Colorado? The majority of starters in the top 10 collegiate programs are all state champs if not multi-timers. There are oodles of state champs like Bo who can't even start at the highest level, or end up being NQs.

Being a multi time state champ is an incredible achievment at the highschool level, and doing it in Pennsylvania is yet one tier higher. That said 'Elite' has a different denotation in my dictionary. Elite means the best of the best. Gary won't qualify for nationals. Sure he could be undersized which is a really big deal at this level. Given a few more years in the program, maybe he could become a blood round guy.

When I hear elite, I think of top 4 with a chance to be an NCAA champ. Although it sounds obsurd, when you think about it, even the bottom 4 AAs at certain weight classes really can not be considered elite, if being the best of the best is the real measure.

I won't do the research, but if you take the top 20 programs in the NCAA, with 10 weight classes, that's 200 wrestlers. I would be surprised if 150 (75%) of them were not at least 1x state champs somewhere. Think about this, 50 states 5-6 years of eligibility, 10-12 weight classes, some states with multiple tiers = literary thousands of state champs at any one time available to test their metal at the collegiate level of they so choose

When I see Jason Nolf on 1 leg, completely dismantle in almost an embarrassing way, an tOSU star (multi time AA, 4x state champ) in the semis of nationals, I come away with a clear picture. I watched only 1 "elite" wrestler.
 
We have Braeden Davis and Mason Gibson who will both be 125 for at least a part of their college career. We're after Lilledahl hard.

As for after this year, I expect to look in the portal hard for 125/133 options that become available.
I think the portal is a bit over rated.

Granted Iowa has had some great success. To make it worth while in terms of disruption to team chemistry and whomever is already in the room, only a blood round or better guy is really worth it. How many of those are really looking to transfer?

I quiped about Noto being a logical candidate (nearby, a position of need, a far lesser program, several years of eligibility left), and that won't happen.

What does surprise me is our long running hole/curse at 125 is glaring for all to see, and one would think the chance to wrestle for Cael and the experience of national championship would attract some real talent. Last year didn't work out for a variety of reasons.

All the while I see Courtney and Figs overlapping at Az state, why couldn't one of them have seen the light a year ago?

Unfortunately, the portal isn't like going down to the store and picking up what you need off your grocery list.

I guess the heavier weights must just have bigger brains. I am ecstatic with Max and Kerk, but I think 125 will have to be filled the old fashioned way.
 
yep, at 15-18 was elite at the time and weight. People grow, mature, develop all differently.
 
For Robbie Howard’s sake, I hope he gets an injury free year or two at 125. If the kid can string together two years, regardless of results, I’ll be ecstatic for him.
At this point I think it is more likely that we count on Davis and if Robbie ever wrestles again, it's a nice big surprise....too many injuries and to the wrong places for a wrestler.
 
Do you think Howard will outgrow 125 or do you think injury does him in. Initially I didn't think Robbie would be a career 125 but he didn't look big to me like he's pulling a lot of weight.
I think it's more like you have a great kid and a great wrestler that simply can't get healthy in 4 years, so expecting him to get healthy for a 5th is probably a long shot at best.
 
well he starts for iowa so what do you think?was Cassar elite??
At the point in our lives where many of us spend a considerable amount of time reading and posting to a college wrestling forum associated with a team that has produced 70 All Americans and 32 National Champions since 2010, the definition of “elite” has a bit higher bar than it did when we were in high school and some of us were in awe of the guys winning matches at states.
 
At the point in our lives where many of us spend a considerable amount of time reading and posting to a college wrestling forum associated with a team that has produced 70 All Americans and 32 National Champions since 2010, the definition of “elite” has a bit higher bar than it did when we were in high school and some of us were in awe of the guys winning matches at states.

It’s amazing what used to wow me back in the day vs now. Perspective is a crazy thing.
 
Room guy
The vast majority of wrestlers on a highly ranked D1 team. Room guys fulfill an invaluable service; they are the practice partners that produce All-Americans and National Champions. Almost all were multi-time state placers in their own right; many were non-PA multi-time state champions. All would have kicked my a$$ at my very best.

Starter
On a highly ranked D1 squad, almost all these wrestlers won at least one, and often multiple, state championships, along with winning or placing very high at tournaments like cadet nationals (and even worlds), Powerade, Beast of the East and/or Ironman.

There are exceptions, but not many.

Good
National qualifying level wrestler.

Great
All-American level wrestler.

Elite
National title threat.
 
Room guy
The vast majority of wrestlers on a highly ranked D1 team. Room guys fulfill an invaluable service; they are the practice partners that produce All-Americans and National Champions. Almost all were multi-time state placers in their own right; many were non-PA multi-time state champions. All would have kicked my a$$ at my very best.

Starter
On a highly ranked D1 squad, almost all these wrestlers won at least one, and often multiple, state championships, along with winning or placing very high at tournaments like cadet nationals (and even worlds), Powerade, Beast of the East and/or Ironman.

There are exceptions, but not many.

Good
National qualifying level wrestler.

Great
All-American level wrestler.

Elite
National title threat.
You left out:
Beast
Hammer
The Real Deal
Animal
Must Get
Stud
Cant Miss
 
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