All About Recruiting

[El-Jefe]

He's only a sophomore and announced last year he would go to Arizona State. That is obvious a connection between his Dad and Jones from their West Virginia days. A lot can happen in 3 years.

Unless something dramatic happens, we can forget it. "He was my dad (Whitey's) coach at West Virginia. I didn't really look anywhere else because I was always going to go where Zeke was."
http://blog.lehighvalleylive.com/le...d/2016/07/northamptons_julian_chlebove_c.html

 

[Dogwelder]

I was banned from HR for more or less pointing out that the Emperor has no clothes. ...

And, probably, for sleeping with the enemy.

 

[jtothemfp]

I don't know Cael or Tom Brands personally, so my comment is based on opinions formed from watching and/or reading interviews they have done. A most recent example was provided immediately following the Penn State vs. Iowa match on 1/20. Cael came across as cool, calm, and collected, very much in control and radiating confidence during his interview. Tom Brands looked wild-eyed, frenetic, and on the verge of completely losing his composure. Albeit this was immediately following a difficult loss, but even during the OK State and many other matches compare his demeanor with that of Cael and his staff.

Interestingly, Gilman seems to mirror many of the characteristics that Tom Brands displays, and even his interview following the match revealed the character of someone who is consumed totally by wrestling much as it appears to be the case of his mentor. Compare and contrast that with Cael's philosophy of wrestling simply being one aspect of the desire to maximize one's potential in life and how that is mirrored by so many of his proteges. In my opinion, that is the larger issue that has the greatest impact on the unparalleled success Cael has had not only in recruiting, but developing terrific young men. So when you look at the bigger picture, I don't see Tom Brands ever closing the gap on Cael. He will continue to attract and replicate mini me versions of himself like Thomas Gilman.

Hi! I like the thoughtfulness of your post, but I noticed something that I'm emphasizing by separating it into two paragraphs. In the first, you're talking primarily about Personality Type differences. Outwardly, Cael is relaxed and Brands is intense. They've always been this way, and nobody who's watched even one dual between them would dispute it.

But I think that starting point often evolves unfairly to Brands when fans get to postulating, using those Personality Type differences as a springboard to assert philosophy differences.

I'm certainly interested in reading arguments for or against either in a debate about life balance or well-roundedness in their wrestlers, but I'd like to see us approach it with a huge concession / asterisk on the Personality Type differences. Because I think Brands & his Intensity personality get an unfair shake vs Cael & his Relaxed one.

 

[bwfight]

That is certainly a fair rebuttal and as I indicated in the opening caveat, since I don't know either of them personally, I am really stretching to suggest that snippets of interviews and articles provide enough evidence to draw conclusions about their philosophies.

 

[PSUAllTheWay]

Does Cael win because he out recruits others or does he out recruit others because he wins? I believe the answer is Yes ...

 

[kingslayer_85]

Hi! I like the thoughtfulness of your post, but I noticed something that I'm emphasizing by separating it into two paragraphs. In the first, you're talking primarily about Personality Type differences. Outwardly, Cael is relaxed and Brands is intense. They've always been this way, and nobody who's watched even one dual between them would dispute it.

But I think that starting point often evolves unfairly to Brands when fans get to postulating, using those Personality Type differences as a springboard to assert philosophy differences.

I'm certainly interested in reading arguments for or against either in a debate about life balance or well-roundedness in their wrestlers, but I'd like to see us approach it with a huge concession / asterisk on the Personality Type differences. Because I think Brands & his Intensity personality get an unfair shake vs Cael & his Relaxed one.

Think you hit on this. The fact is you are crazy if you don't think Cael is an intense and driven individual, just as the Brands are. I am guessing they are more similar than a lot of folks envision. If you think you can be a NCAA ,Olympic and world champ by being laid back I think you are crazy. I think they just show their intensity and drive differently. Bottom line I feel they are both incredible competitors and focus on doing things the right way but as said one approach is wearing your emotions on your sleeve while the other doesn't. Important for everyone to be who there are

 

[Franklin_Restores_TheTradition]

Interesting website relative to this discussion - HIT THIS LINK. The link lists PA-bred NCAA National Champions. Since Cael's arrival after the 2009 Season, Pennsy products have won 10 NCAA National Titles.....7 of the 10 wrestled for PSU under Cael Sanderson. Coincidence? I think not - as the link demonstrates, PA has always produced National Champion wrestlers, but nobody has kept them in-state like Cael.....

 

[dropster45]

Does Cael win because he out recruits others or does he out recruit others because he wins? I believe the answer is Yes ...

Absolutely!
As to some of the other posts above relating to intensity or "arousal level" as it's referred to in sports psychology, I would say Cael has mastered the command of his on/off switch. The Brands Bros. haven't and given that they're pushing 50, probably never will.

 

[James P. Whitters III]

Exactly- It isn't about who has an intense competitive spirit- all champions have this. I would say the difference is more approach. Cael is less combative than Tom, and way less than Terry. Watch the "Terry" doc. from Flo and notice him trying to start something with the big guy. Cael wouldn't act that way ever. I have spent plenty of time around all three of them, and it is not an imagined thing. I will say both Brands brothers are big heart kind of guys. They love the guys they coach- that is the same between Cael and themselves.

It all comes down to civility. I value this more than others I suppose.

 

[Franklin_Restores_TheTradition]

Interesting website relative to this discussion - HIT THIS LINK. The link lists PA-bred NCAA National Champions. Since Cael's arrival after the 2009 Season, Pennsy products have won 10 NCAA National Titles.....7 of the 10 wrestled for PSU under Cael Sanderson. Coincidence? I think not - as the link demonstrates, PA has always produced National Champion wrestlers, but nobody has kept them in-state like Cael.....

BTW, that is a combination of both selecting the correct ones to use his scholies on, as well as keeping them in state. PA produces bushels upon bushels of DI wrestlers, but Cael has shown that he knows which ones to offer and how to develop them.

 

[Dogwelder]

... Cael has shown that he knows which ones to offer ...

That is Cael's most impressive advantage, to me, given the 9.9 limit. Warren Buffet reputedly has this same people-judging skill. (Of course, no one bats 1000.)

 

[PSUAllTheWay]

Cael recruits not only on talent but fit and values. I'm a big believer that this approach works in business as well as on the mat. You get kids that are humble, hard working, seeking to constantly improve, and STAY OUT OF TROUBLE. This is a recipe for success.

 

[Callthestall]

Once you build a foundation of solid character kids, your recruits will be less likely to go down the wrong path. Many 18 year olds have a wild gene in them. The college environment can bring out the crazy in a lot of kids. The same kid that goes to PSU wrestle would probably be less likely to find trouble than the same kid that goes to Pitt.

 

[RoarLions1]

2 guys I really respect for doing the student-athlete thing all the right way (academics, wrestling, social, etc.) are Nico and Tank. Now we have others. Anyone that comes into the PSU program has excellent role models to follow...in addition to the environment the coaches have created. Leadership has been a big part of our success.

NOTE: There's so many of these wrestlers that deserve mention here. All those I know are awesome, just noting 2 graduated guys that were great role models recently.

 

[a_mshaffer]

We also know a little luck is involved... staying healthy being the biggest part. I say this about the recruiting classes as well. Looking back we may say 'so and so fizzled out' but it may have been, or was, caused by some type of injury. Before anyone jumps on this, I know you can create an environment to reduce injuries, etc., etc. Hell, take some genetic tests as well!

 

[KidNittany]

2 guys I really respect for doing the student-athlete thing all the right way (academics, wrestling, social, etc.) are Nico and Tank. Now we have others. Anyone that comes into the PSU program has excellent role models to follow...in addition to the environment the coaches have created. Leadership has been a big part of our success.

Second this but I will say that of everyone that has come through recently, Q is my dude

 

[Franklin_Restores_TheTradition]

We also know a little luck is involved... staying healthy being the biggest part. I say this about the recruiting classes as well. Looking back we may say 'so and so fizzled out' but it may have been, or was, caused by some type of injury. Before anyone jumps on this, I know you can create an environment to reduce injuries, etc., etc. Hell, take some genetic tests as well!

Cael's had some bad luck with the injury bug though - if the Altons stay healthy, Cael is probably trying for 7 consecutive National Championships this year.

 

[pawrestlersintn]

AZ: "You guys still think this is a knock on Cael...Hell, should be a compliment because Brands is trying to copy him or at least mitigate the damage as much as possible."

To be fair, several guys over there do use it to knock on Cael, and that includes some Minnesota guy that's a Husker fan or vice versa, that, for some reason, you guys keep around. And, with regard to your second sentence, imitation is the sincerest form of flattery, whether your cohorts over there ever admit it or not.

 

[Azchief32]

AZ: "You guys still think this is a knock on Cael...Hell, should be a compliment because Brands is trying to copy him or at least mitigate the damage as much as possible."

To be fair, several guys over there do use it to knock on Cael, and that includes some Minnesota guy that's a Husker fan or vice versa, that, for some reason, you guys keep around. And, with regard to your second sentence, imitation is the sincerest form of flattery, whether your cohorts over there ever admit it or not.

Even if Tom is better at development, so what? If he is not winning titles, it's akin to a participation ribbon. Years from now, if things go as you guys are planning, will it matter? Here lies Cael Sanderson: Undefeated NCAA Four time champ, Olympic Champ, and coach of a gazillion titles.* Nobody is saying that Cael is like: "Ok young Nolf, welcome to the team...you're locker is over there. See you in a few months for the Scuffle and uh, try to stay out of trouble. Welp...I got a pressing game of Madden to get back to...any questions?"

You guys can claim that Cael has some sort of Zen/force balance thing going on being able to look into the soul of a wrestler after meeting him once and deciding if he's a right fit or whatever but nothing beats talent. The Chiefs were 12-4 this year with Alex Meyer at the helm...oops, meant Alex Smith. If Andy Reid has Tom Brady, all of a sudden he's a coaching genius instead of being known as a bad clock manager and KC is one super model hotter. The St Louis Cardinals are great at development, picking talent, and doing it at a far lower total salary level than the Yankees, Red Sox, Cubs and Dodgers. As good as they are though, Cubs just have more talent...winning despite their skipper screwing the pooch a couple of times in the WS. Talent and character trumps all. Cael is great at getting both.




*Only because he recruited top talent

 

[Flying_Tiger]

Az you continue to ignore the fact Iowa has placed behind at least one team other then Penn State since 2010. You also ignore the fact Iowa has had two #1 recruiting classes over that time frame. There's certainly an argument that the only think keeping Brands from going full Zalesky is that he has had a lot more talent then the vast majority of other programs.

Could you imagine what the reaction would be on HR if a Nebraska or Missouri fan came over to lecture you guys about how the only reason Iowa places ahead of their program is because of better recruiting and how their coach is actually better.

 

[El-Jefe]

Az you continue to ignore the fact Iowa has placed behind at least one team other then Penn State since 2010. You also ignore the fact Iowa has had two #1 recruiting classes over that time frame. There's certainly an argument that the only think keeping Brands from going full Zalesky is that he has had a lot more talent then the vast majority of other programs.

Could you imagine what the reaction would be on HR if a Nebraska or Missouri fan came over to lecture you guys about how the only reason Iowa places ahead of their program is because of better recruiting and how their coach is actually better.

I'm surprised their/our resident Nebraska fan hasn't done that.

 

[pawrestlersintn]

Even if Tom is better at development, so what? If he is not winning titles, it's akin to a participation ribbon. Years from now, if things go as you guys are planning, will it matter? Here lies Cael Sanderson: Undefeated NCAA Four time champ, Olympic Champ, and coach of a gazillion titles.* Nobody is saying that Cael is like: "Ok young Nolf, welcome to the team...you're locker is over there. See you in a few months for the Scuffle and uh, try to stay out of trouble. Welp...I got a pressing game of Madden to get back to...any questions?"

You guys can claim that Cael has some sort of Zen/force balance thing going on being able to look into the soul of a wrestler after meeting him once and deciding if he's a right fit or whatever but nothing beats talent. The Chiefs were 12-4 this year with Alex Meyer at the helm...oops, meant Alex Smith. If Andy Reid has Tom Brady, all of a sudden he's a coaching genius instead of being known as a bad clock manager and KC is one super model hotter. The St Louis Cardinals are great at development, picking talent, and doing it at a far lower total salary level than the Yankees, Red Sox, Cubs and Dodgers. As good as they are though, Cubs just have more talent...winning despite their skipper screwing the pooch a couple of times in the WS. Talent and character trumps all. Cael is great at getting both.




*Only because he recruited top talent

I have to read your posts several times, or else I miss the little gems you throw in there. "One super model hotter."

It's funny you mentioned the participation trophy. I was going to mention that in my post. I also was going to suggest that the guys over on HR might want to gather a meeting with Tom to ask him to propose a rule to the NCAA that would prevent a team who has won three championships in a row (or some number) from accepting/recruiting any overall top 10 recruits for two year, to level the playing field and make it more fair, and see how Tom takes it.

 

[James P. Whitters III]

When top talent isn't coming to a college program it is usually one of three things.
1. No tradition
2. Poor facilities
3. Poor coaching from the recruiting standpoint.

Which do you think it is at Iowa Chief? I know the facilities are really good and tradition is outstanding. I now Brands can coach, but isn't recruiting kind of the #1 job in coaching if what you say about talent is true? Is it ok to say Brands hasn't been doing his job? At what point do you make a change? Is top 3-4 every year good enough? It would be anywhere else except Iowa I'm thinking.

 

[KidNittany]

When top talent isn't coming to a college program it is usually one of three things.
1. No tradition
2. Poor facilities
3. Poor coaching from the recruiting standpoint.

Which do you think it is at Iowa Chief? I know the facilities are really good and tradition is outstanding. I now Brands can coach, but isn't recruiting kind of the #1 job in coaching if what you say about talent is true? Is it ok to say Brands hasn't been doing his job? At what point do you terminate for lack of results?

This question has puzzled me as well - when is it time to make a change in Iowa? Hard question. Do you throw out one of the best coaches in the game for fresh blood? Also, what coach do you go after? Smith? Pop? Dresser?

They are likely not going to be realistically in it until two years from now. If they can't win one in three years I think it might be time to move on. Change can be good.

 

[James P. Whitters III]

I don't think Brands will or should go anywhere. I do wonder as I always have if you let Terry head off and build a powerhouse somewhere else (Pitt?) and hire a young assistant with recruiting as his main job. Morning* somewhat has done this and the results are starting to pour in. It may be a simple as wait a couple years and see if it worked.

Iowa high school wrestling taking a nosedive nationally has really hurt Iowa,ISU, and UNI. I have no idea how to help this problem, but it isn't good.

 

[matter7172]

Cael recruits not only on talent but fit and values. I'm a big believer that this approach works in business as well as on the mat. You get kids that are humble, hard working, seeking to constantly improve, and STAY OUT OF TROUBLE. This is a recipe for success.

I recall Cael's quote from 2013 (I believe) wherein he said he doesn't want to have kids he needs to babysit. He is definitely focusing on character when recruiting.

On the question of Terry (or Tom for that matter) going somewhere and building a program, essentially from scratch, I look to the Virginia Tech experience. That saw finishes of 42 and 29 at Nationals and bailing. So I don't see them taking on that kind of challenge again.

To me, the most incredible part about Cael's success at Penn State was how quickly it came. For those around PSU in 2008-9, we remember that the program had basically bottomed out, winning ONE of its last 11 dual meets (http://www.pennstatewrestlingclub.org/history/index.php?view=seasonduals&season=2009) . ONE. The biggest bright spot was a local kid who may not have been the most talented but who had a ton of heart and desire and fought his way to a second place finish at BIGs and sixth at Nationals by, seemingly, sheer force of will. Throw in a kid from NJ who went 1-4 at BIGs and somehow went on a run of sorts to finish 8th at Nationals.

Ed Ruth may have been a top recruit, but he never won a state title while in PA. Taylor looked to be a great recruit, but he was in such a state of flux physically, I don't know if you could be sure about him.

Yet, in his second year, Cael led PSU to a national championship, which is a LOT better than finishing 29th (in my mind at least). I believed on the day Cael's hiring national championship would be coming, but a title in 2011 and four in the five years following were not in my consideration. I thought there was an outside chance at 2012 at the very best. The job Cael has done so far is mind-boggling and should get a lot more credit from objective wrestling fans. At least imo.

 

[dropster45]

Good discussion fellas. Does anyone have the score from the Penn State vs. Iowa match?

 

[El-Jefe]

I do wonder as I always have if you let Terry head off and build a powerhouse somewhere else (Pitt?) and hire a young assistant with recruiting as his main job.

Cant expect you to know this since you're from Iowa ... but this is unintentionally hilarious. Even if Terry were inclined to leave Tom, there is zero chance of Pitt, because Pitt. Their athletics program is unstable right now, with their AD leaving for Oregon State. (Oregon State is a better job than Pitt?) Their fans aspire to be top 15-20 when they should be top 5, and they don't know any better.

Plus the administration doesn't support the program, or it would be further along even with Peters. For example, the Pitt Wrestling Club is still not an RTC, has no post-graduate athletes -- it's basically a youth program with a little budget to send some varsity wrestlers to the USOTC for a week or to a freestyle tourney here and there.

Good for them for competing the job now -- when they have no choice. But they promoted Peters without competing the job when Stottlemyer retired, and the program was historically underachieving then. If that sounds familiar, see Michigan State.

That's what passes for leadership there.

 

[James P. Whitters III]

Cant expect you to know this since you're from Iowa ... but this is unintentionally hilarious. Even if Terry were inclined to leave Tom, there is zero chance of Pitt, because Pitt. Their athletics program is unstable right now, with their AD leaving for Oregon State. (Oregon State is a better job than Pitt?) Their fans aspire to be top 15-20 when they should be top 5, and they don't know any better.

Plus the administration doesn't support the program, or it would be further along even with Peters. For example, the Pitt Wrestling Club is still not an RTC, has no post-graduate athletes -- it's basically a youth program with a little budget to send some varsity wrestlers to the USOTC for a week or to a freestyle tourney here and there.

Good for them for competing the job now -- when they have no choice. But they promoted Peters without competing the job when Stottlemyer retired, and the program was historically underachieving then. If that sounds familiar, see Michigan State.

That's what passes for leadership there.

Dang- It sounds like worse than our situation at ISU. Scratch my foolish thoughts.

 

[jtothemfp]

Cant expect you to know this since you're from Iowa ... but this is unintentionally hilarious. Even if Terry were inclined to leave Tom, there is zero chance of Pitt, because Pitt. Their athletics program is unstable right now, with their AD leaving for Oregon State. (Oregon State is a better job than Pitt?) Their fans aspire to be top 15-20 when they should be top 5, and they don't know any better.

Plus the administration doesn't support the program, or it would be further along even with Peters. For example, the Pitt Wrestling Club is still not an RTC, has no post-graduate athletes -- it's basically a youth program with a little budget to send some varsity wrestlers to the USOTC for a week or to a freestyle tourney here and there.

Good for them for competing the job now -- when they have no choice. But they promoted Peters without competing the job when Stottlemyer retired, and the program was historically underachieving then. If that sounds familiar, see Michigan State.

That's what passes for leadership there.

I could read Jefe On Pitt for days. Do you have a newsletter I can sign up for?

 

[Just another PSU Fan]

Wow, interesting thread! I don't know anything about Cael or Tom's recruiting ability!

What I do know, these guys, Tom and Cael - are doing what they feel is best with the kids they watch compete, the parents they talk to, and the way these high school kids handle themselves!

Imagine your career being dependent on 17-18yr old kids decisions ... freaks me out

 

[James P. Whitters III]

I recall Cael's quote from 2013 (I believe) wherein he said he doesn't want to have kids he needs to babysit. He is definitely focusing on character when recruiting.

On the question of Terry (or Tom for that matter) going somewhere and building a program, essentially from scratch, I look to the Virginia Tech experience. That saw finishes of 42 and 29 at Nationals and bailing. So I don't see them taking on that kind of challenge again.

To me, the most incredible part about Cael's success at Penn State was how quickly it came. For those around PSU in 2008-9, we remember that the program had basically bottomed out, winning ONE of its last 11 dual meets (http://www.pennstatewrestlingclub.org/history/index.php?view=seasonduals&season=2009) . ONE. The biggest bright spot was a local kid who may not have been the most talented but who had a ton of heart and desire and fought his way to a second place finish at BIGs and sixth at Nationals by, seemingly, sheer force of will. Throw in a kid from NJ who went 1-4 at BIGs and somehow went on a run of sorts to finish 8th at Nationals.

Ed Ruth may have been a top recruit, but he never won a state title while in PA. Taylor looked to be a great recruit, but he was in such a state of flux physically, I don't know if you could be sure about him.

Yet, in his second year, Cael led PSU to a national championship, which is a LOT better than finishing 29th (in my mind at least). I believed on the day Cael's hiring national championship would be coming, but a title in 2011 and four in the five years following were not in my consideration. I thought there was an outside chance at 2012 at the very best. The job Cael has done so far is mind-boggling and should get a lot more credit from objective wrestling fans. At least imo.

All very true. VTech would have jumped up quickly, however, the next couple years when Metcalf,JBo, and Slaton joined the ranks. It was going to be a top 10 program very quickly.

 

[dropster45]

Wow, interesting thread! I don't know anything about Cael or Tom's recruiting ability!

What I do know, these guys, Tom and Cael - are doing what they feel is best with the kids they watch compete, the parents they talk to, and the way these high school kids handle themselves!

Imagine your career being dependent on 17-18yr old kids decisions ... freaks me out

Welcome to the board, "Just Another..."! You sound like I did when I first got on here - level headed and full of love!
And I know what you're saying...My own life is dictated by what are called "teenagers". To deal with that, I'm using the life skills I learned on the mat - perseverance, hope, and trying not to hit anyone with a baseball bat - so far, so good!

PS: Do you have the score from Iowa/PSU dual?

 

[Just another PSU Fan]

Welcome to the board, Just Another. You sound like I did when I first got on here - level headed and full of love!
And I know what you're saying...My own life is dictated by what are called "teenagers". To deal with that, I'm using the life skills I learned on the mat - perseverance, hope, and trying not to hit anyone with a baseball bat - so far, so good!

I don't post much, but I've been lurking around for years

 

[El-Jefe]

Dang- It sounds like worse than our situation at ISU. Scratch my foolish thoughts.

Not foolish at all -- they should be a program capable of hiring -- no, demanding (instead of spitballing) a Terry Brands or similarly able coach driven to win national titles and generate Olympians.

 

[Franklin_Restores_TheTradition]

When top talent isn't coming to a college program it is usually one of three things.
1. No tradition
2. Poor facilities
3. Poor coaching from the recruiting standpoint.

Which do you think it is at Iowa Chief? I know the facilities are really good and tradition is outstanding. I now Brands can coach, but isn't recruiting kind of the #1 job in coaching if what you say about talent is true? Is it ok to say Brands hasn't been doing his job? At what point do you make a change? Is top 3-4 every year good enough? It would be anywhere else except Iowa I'm thinking.

Great point JP. Another way of looking at this is what would the HR posters be saying about Cael if he squandered most of the talent he acquired after taking the PSU job in 2009 rather than winning 5 National Championships over the next 7 years.....4 consecutively from 2010/2011 season through the 2013/2014 season....and coming right back in 2015/2016 to make it 5 of the last 6??? Maybe they should apply the same analysis and determinations that they inappropriately and prematurely applied to Cael after he took the PSU job (i.e., great recruiter, but can't develop talent) and apply it where it rightly belongs based on the hard data since TB moved from VaTech to Iowa.....and CS moved to PSU.

 

[Dogwelder]

Interesting website relative to this discussion - HIT THIS LINK. The link lists PA-bred NCAA National Champions. Since Cael's arrival after the 2009 Season, Pennsy products have won 10 NCAA National Titles.....7 of the 10 wrestled for PSU under Cael Sanderson. Coincidence? I think not - as the link demonstrates, PA has always produced National Champion wrestlers, but nobody has kept them in-state like Cael.....

I'm curious. Does anyone remember whether there were other PA super-studs during the Q, Ruth, Mega, Gulibon, Zain, Haines, Nolf, Marsteller recruiting eras that went elsewhere and underperformed (whereas our guys came to PSU and mostly performed)?

Addendum: because Cael's 4/6 conversion rate, so far, of PA super-studs (from my list) to National Champs is unbelievable. And when Nolf wins it'll be 5/6. And it's not even mathematically impossible to get to 6/6 (Go Jimmy!). And the rate is already 6/6 if we're talking AAs instead if NCs.

 

[a_mshaffer]

I'm curious. Does anyone remember whether there were other PA studs during the Q, Ruth, Mega, Gulibon, Zain, Haines recruiting eras that went elsewhere and underperformed whereas our guys came to PSU and mostly performed?

just look at the AA list each year.... ~half or more are Pa kids

 

[Franklin_Restores_TheTradition]

I recall Cael's quote from 2013 (I believe) wherein he said he doesn't want to have kids he needs to babysit. He is definitely focusing on character when recruiting.

On the question of Terry (or Tom for that matter) going somewhere and building a program, essentially from scratch, I look to the Virginia Tech experience. That saw finishes of 42 and 29 at Nationals and bailing. So I don't see them taking on that kind of challenge again.

To me, the most incredible part about Cael's success at Penn State was how quickly it came. For those around PSU in 2008-9, we remember that the program had basically bottomed out, winning ONE of its last 11 dual meets (http://www.pennstatewrestlingclub.org/history/index.php?view=seasonduals&season=2009) . ONE. The biggest bright spot was a local kid who may not have been the most talented but who had a ton of heart and desire and fought his way to a second place finish at BIGs and sixth at Nationals by, seemingly, sheer force of will. Throw in a kid from NJ who went 1-4 at BIGs and somehow went on a run of sorts to finish 8th at Nationals.

Ed Ruth may have been a top recruit, but he never won a state title while in PA. Taylor looked to be a great recruit, but he was in such a state of flux physically, I don't know if you could be sure about him.

Yet, in his second year, Cael led PSU to a national championship, which is a LOT better than finishing 29th (in my mind at least). I believed on the day Cael's hiring national championship would be coming, but a title in 2011 and four in the five years following were not in my consideration. I thought there was an outside chance at 2012 at the very best. The job Cael has done so far is mind-boggling and should get a lot more credit from objective wrestling fans. At least imo.

Not to mention that Cael called it during his public statements as to why he was leaving ISU (his alma mater and a program that had placed light-years higher than PSU while Cael was HC there starting in 2007) -- IOW, Cael outright stated that PSU gave him some unique advantages in building a dynasty that he simply did not have at ISU.....numero uno among them the fact that Pennsylvania produced wrestlers like no other state in terms of both quantity and quality.....and PSU was smack-dab in the center of Pennsylvania. Cael's statements as to why he took the PSU job, what he was going to do after taking the job and how he was going to do it proved prophetic and are a testament to how well Cael knows and "understands" wrestling......and what kind of astute "visionary", strategist and tactician he is, which might be his greatest strength as a Head Coach. Cael saw what unique and insurmontable advantages the PSU job gave him and he immediately wielded it against his opponents like a lethal battle axe.....as in Cael did precisely what he said he was going to do - he released the "Pennsy Kraken" on them and simply vanquished them.

 

[yekrut321]

Not to mention that Cael called it during his public statements as to why he was leaving ISU (his alma mater and a program that had placed light-years higher than PSU while Cael was HC there starting in 2007) -- IOW, Cael outright stated that PSU gave him some unique advantages in building a dynasty that he simply did not have at ISU.....numero uno among them the fact that Pennsylvania produced wrestlers like no other state in terms of both quantity and quality.....and PSU was smack-dab in the center of Pennsylvania. Cael's statements as to why he took the PSU job, what he was going to do after taking the job and how he was going to do it proved prophetic and are a testament to how well Cael knows and "understands" wrestling......and what kind of astute "visionary", strategist and tactician he is, which might be his greatest strength as a Head Coach. Cael saw what unique and insurmontable advantages the PSU job gave him and he immediately wielded it against his opponents like a lethal battle axe.....as in Cael did precisely what he said he was going to do - he released the "Pennsy Kraken" on them and simply vanquished them.

Man....I feel like watching Conan the Barbarian now!!!!

 

[NittanyLion84]

From a recruiting standpoint, it has to be an up hill job for other coaches. When you have Cael who, in most occasions, gets the guys he wants. You are left with about ten others coaches, fighting for the guys that Cael did not have room for. Other coaches will get elite guys, like Lee, but it's a very tall task to get five of them, to level the playing field with Cael.