He doesn't seem to understand this - he keeps talking about LSU beating Bama while ignoring that their losses are worse than Bama's.... LSU lost to a beyond pedestrian FSU and got utterly blown out by Tenn - and has had near miss losses to several just plain bad teams like yesterday's game against Arkansas (and Auburn). Meanwhile, Bama lost to Tenn on a last second FG (after missing their own easier FG less than a minute earlier) and LSU by a point. He seems to think that if LSU losses again, they won't fall in the rankings....
Is it time for PSU fans to admit that we're actually pretty good?
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He doesn't seem to understand this - he keeps talking about LSU beating Bama while ignoring that their losses are worse than Bama's.... LSU lost to a beyond pedestrian FSU and got utterly blown out by Tenn - and has had near miss losses to several just plain bad teams like yesterday's game against Arkansas (and Auburn). Meanwhile, Bama lost to Tenn on a last second FG (after missing their own easier FG less than a minute earlier) and LSU by a point. He seems to think that if LSU losses again, they won't fall in the rankings....
Yes, I'm sure the line will favor PSU by at least +10 if not more. I just think it's dangerous for a team to expect a certain result versus being confidant in their own abilities.
How does Penn State go 2-10 playing 10 opponents?
You were already given a link to show why they may not/likely wouldn't. Palm also projects they wouldn't. Please learn the sport.
There are promising signs everywhere, except WR. The LIons really, really need someone to step up to be a game breaker in the Dotson mold, and looking at the roster it's hard to see who it could be.
I know that he was never strongly interested in PSU, but one pick up that tOSU got at WR that would have made a difference is Marvin Harrison JR.......Pa. Guy, who would stretch defenses. Next year we are going to need a space eater at DT.......
I feel better about our OL, our LBs, DBs and RBs will be very good, DEs seem like they should be very good. Get a big DT......and a number 1 WR. If we can do that it will come down to Allar at QB..........
I feel better about our OL, our LBs, DBs and RBs will be very good, DEs seem like they should be very good. Get a big DT......and a number 1 WR. If we can do that it will come down to Allar at QB..........
And other Media-affiliated "Experts" are projecting they will fall and PSU to Orange. Just because you're having a bro-mance with Jerry Palm means squat ASWPer.
I rely on history and who has proven they are correct
You continually say that LSU can't stay ahead of Bama which is false
Your belief doesn't make it true.
I don't know why we can't just accept reality here
Penn State has had a strong season. They lost to two teams better than them and they beat the teams they've played that are worse than them. That's a huge step in the right direction. The future is bright with Allar, the backs and the countless other young players that are already showing us a lot or at least glimpses. At the same time, the quality of our wins is underwhelming and the double-digit losses (especially Michigan) show that we still have a long way to go. No one should be angry about this season. If you want to celebrate a step forward that's great. I want to see more and hopefully we see that next year.
Penn State has had a strong season. They lost to two teams better than them and they beat the teams they've played that are worse than them. That's a huge step in the right direction. The future is bright with Allar, the backs and the countless other young players that are already showing us a lot or at least glimpses. At the same time, the quality of our wins is underwhelming and the double-digit losses (especially Michigan) show that we still have a long way to go. No one should be angry about this season. If you want to celebrate a step forward that's great. I want to see more and hopefully we see that next year.
I really like this Penn State team. Well balanced. Can run and pass. Aren't totally dependent on the whims of the QB like the last few seasons. Very athletic on defense. OL better than the past few years. Possibly the best recruiting class in Penn State history. Young and improving every week. Fun to watch. Probably the best defensive backfield in PSU history. Well coached. Yurcich and Diaz are having a great year.
I like this team better than any other since the 2005 team that finished 11-1 and beat Bowden in the Orange Bowl. Also, we can expect that the team will be even better next year. It is great being a Penn State football and wrestling fan!
I like this team better than any other since the 2005 team that finished 11-1 and beat Bowden in the Orange Bowl. Also, we can expect that the team will be even better next year. It is great being a Penn State football and wrestling fan!
If you think there are only 8 teams better than PSU, then by your analysis, PSU is the 9th best team (which makes them top 10, BTW).
Has anyone else noticed how straight legged and upright that Allar stands in the pocket when calling the plays? He runs pretty upright as well.
Hope the staff works with him this off season on getting into a more athletic position that will allow him to escape the rush quicker and also run with more ability to change direction.......
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Where exactly would you believe that hitting the portal will improve the team, other than at WR?
The lines have a better chance of improving by getting the young returning players, about everyone other than Tarburton, Mustipher and Fashanu, to add as much muscle as possible in the S&C program this coming off season.
The OL already has plenty of strength and size given how young it is other than Effner if he returns. No reason the OL can't come back much better if each returning player gets stronger.
With all the young talent that will improve in the off season S&C as well as within Spring practice I expect less help from the portal this off season, other than possibly at WR and for positions where numbers may be too low such as QB if PSU loses 1 to the portal and possibly at RB with a player that is willing to get a PSU MBA and travel with the team as a backup to Singleton and Allen.......
Same with the DL. Especially the DE's, as Chop, DDS and Isaac all look like they could put on 15 lbs of muscle and still be quick enough to do their jobs in the pass rush while adding to their ability to hold their ground against the running of teams like UM.
Big, stout, top level war daddy DT's don't go into the portal. Olinemen that are better than what the improved PSU oline has don't either. They all go to the NFL......
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But OSU is one of the best teams in the country year after year, so why would there be shame in losing to them repeatedly?
.500 in the sense that they are 6-4. If they had lost 1 of those games they’d be 5-5. In any event, no matter how you want to classify it, trying to use beating two 6-4 teams as proof you’re close to being a playoff team just doesn’t fly IMO.
I guess it depends on where you want to set the bar.
I think most fans are willing to accept that they aren't a perennial top 4 team like OSU. But they do think PSU should be a top 10-12 team that should have sufficient talent to beat OSU 1 out of 3 years. Losing 10 out of 11 doesn't cut it, especially when PSU has been in a position to win many of those games in the 4th quarter.
And how many of these venues has OSU and Michigan played at? I actually think we beat OSU with a night white out , thanks FOX.
The whole deal with the 2, are scheduling, who they play early, where they play, and the divisions, which they still are keeping another year. Don't forget the game no one in the big plays opposite, and it's always noon. The best thing in the future is adding USC and UCLA , and if UCLA is denied then it will be Stanford, Oregon, Washington etc.
Franklin gets beat up here , but he has addressed the back up qb well this year. The players he lost to the portal have done as well or worse than here , but the ones he got here exceeded expectations.
Coach Traut has done a great job with the backups because they are HIS type linemen, not so much what he inherited.
Harrison to OSU , Joe burned that bridge with Syracuse ( where his dad played) long time ago.
I've been watching PS since the mid sixties and as far as defense this is the most promising unit since the early 80's. The offense is building depth , but agree we need that Godwin, type receiver.
Just a foot note i think Liam Clifford is going to be a sure handed receiver , he's showing it already.
okay...I'll bite. Short answer is that IDK, but here's me playing devils advocate.
PSU is abysmal against OSU and Mich during JF's tenure and this year was not close.
It's very possible, that at the end of the season, PSU will not have beat a team that finishes in the Top 25.
PSU has skill players and a very good defense, but as the announcers said on saturday, PSU doesn't have the lines to match up against the top teams.
Regarding current rankings, they mostly go by W-L and not SOS.
TCU is 10-0 and #4. I suspect that Vegas would set them as underdogs against all of the 1 loss teams and most of the 2 loss teams.
Now apply that logic to PSU, our performance against OSU/Mich, and consider that no team we've beat is ranked. Ask yourself honestly, how many teams in the Top 25 would PSU be favored against?
At least 18, maybe even 20 if you're talking about them playing someone on their home field.
A lot of good points here but the defense. This is the worse front seven I have seen in Happy Valley. Now the caveat, the worst front seven is probably above average overall. But make no mistake, this is the easiest schedule we have played in the Big Ten era by a mile. The only games you can judge the defense against are Purdue in the opener (which didn't go well for that side of the ball), Michigan, which really didn't go well and Ohio State who played uber safe football for three quarters before blowing the doors off in the fourth as soon as they opened up the offense. That is not a promising unit. That is a unit based on poor competition and smoke and mirrors, mostly due to the phenomenal secondary. The secondary has proven to be very good and has allowed them to send 6, 7 or 8 defenders against bad teams. The line still doesn't win individual battles, they win with numbers.
Sagarin has us at #7 so we'd be favored on a neutral field to all but 6 teams currently. Meanwhile some psu "fans" have spent several pages trying to argue that we are not pretty good. 6 teams
Sagarin's ratings are rather simplistic heavily relying on a poor strength of schedule calculation. I would argue his strength of schedule is complete rubbish is most instances. Our SOS per Sagarin is in the 30s, however, more nuanced metrics that weight teams based on conference (Per Sagarin, a game against Liberty is equal to a game against Alabama) rate it down near the bottom of all power five conferences. The best performing retrospective SOS calculations don't simply take opponents win/loss records like Sagarin but take several extra measurements into account such as winning percentage against power five, non-power five and lower division opponents and weights them accordingly so you don't get a situation where a 9 and 3 non-power five win biases SOS compared to a similar record power five team. At the end of the day, when you account for qualitative data (Tanner Morgan not playing, Indiana playing what would have been their third, fourth and fifth string QBs had Penix not transferred, injury situations etc) the teams we have beaten are pretty bad and we were not competitive against the only two that are actually good.
I don't know much about how Sagarin works, but the PSU schedule sure doesn't pass the "look test."
It's really reductive to assert that anyone that doesn't wear blue tinted glasses and have a 100% pollyanna view of PSU football is not really a "fan."
I spent 22 years in DC, starting the year after Dan Snyder bought the team. No joke - literally for more than a decade, the Redskin fans thought they were Superbowl contenders EVERY year during the preseason. By week 7 it was "wait till next year." In week 10, after an ugly 3 point victory over a 3-6 team, it was "we have a chance." The next pre-season, they restarted the cycle. Hope springs eternal, I guess
Those were the dumbest football fans I've ever encountered. Literally no idea about football. Passionate and committed for sure, but dumb as a box of rocks as a football fan base.
Reading some of the assessments of where PSU is, makes me feel like I'm back in DC. PSU is 3rd in the Division yet again, but some still think "we have a chance," despite all the growing evidence that Franklin is not capable of competing with the top tier of CFB.
We all accept reality. We are basically like TA&M now. Big fan-base, big recruits, big expectations and may surprise every 5 years. We will never get over the hump and join the big boys of CFP. Some in the fan-base seem ok with that outcome. Some are not. I get the fear..the devil you know stuff. We look at Frost situation and become fearful that things could be worse. I think PSU recruiting territory, name, facilities and alumni support are way too fertile for us to be down 10 years like Nebraska. We can be fearful to get a coach who can bring to CFP level or stay in safe 8-10 win ceilings with CJF. I still think lines will not be fixed and we are on the clock with Allar, Nick, Kaytron. They will be pros in two seasons.
1) Our schedule is one of a handful in the nation that has 2 undefeated teams on it. Plus it has 6 of 10 opponents thus far with 6-4 or better records. We've played 5 of 10 games against teams that either lead or are tied for their division lead right now. When every published strength of schedule measure out there says our schedule is in the top third of all teams in the country, why can't you accept it?
2) No one is calling everyone who doesn't wear blue tinted glasses not a fan. However, it is 100% clear that we do have a few "fans" who use nearly every post to tear down nearly all things Penn State in what is looking like a 10 win regular season, a likely top 10 record, and a NY6 bowl appearance. Sometimes you have to call a spade a spade.
1) Let's dissect this. PSU is 0-2, and was not competitive vs the undefeated teams you reference. PSU is undefeated against teams on the schedule that are not ranked. Humbly, you are adding a lot of SOS weight for losing badly to very good teams. Aside from that, 6-4 in CFB likely means that teams are no better than .500 in their conference. Neither of those are exactly a glowing endorsement.
2) You have literally created multiple threads doing this....And if there are people who "tear down" PSU, there are others that can't see the forest through the trees on the state of PSU football. Humbly, no one cares about a NY6 bowl. Not even the teams playing in them. JF has put PSU squarely in the distant 2nd tier of CFB. The spade to call a spade here is that Franklin is 0-10 against top 10 teams since 2016. PSU is not competitive with the top tier of CFB. If that is "pretty good," then I guess PSU is pretty good. If that is what you want, then life is good. If 3rd in the division and "pretty good" is what you think the expectation for JF's salary is, then everything is going according to plan.
Saunders? Although not a good sign he never has seen the field. Has he redshirted?
yes we're exactly like 3-7 Texas A&M
How is 8-10 wins CJF’s ceiling when he’s won 11 games in three of the past six seasons?
Aren't we averaging app 31 a game or so? I think our D would keep us in most games , cough cough OSU.
I'm sure you recall the end of the fourth quarter . We gave up one long td run against maybe the best offensive team in the country .
Don't count bowl games--they mean 8-10 in the regular season
2016 was the only time he exceeded 10 so it's not fair to say ceiling but most years he'll be between 8-10 with the occasional 11 or less than 8 like last year
What a joke of a post - PSU is 11th in the AP Poll, on a neutral field, PSU would probably be favored over 14 teams in the Top 25. You do realize there are 5 3-loss teams in the Top 25 - 2 from the laughably weak B12, 1 from the Pac12 and 1 from the laughably weak ACC and ND. You also have 9-1 CCU and 8-2 Cincinnati and UCF ranked. You have a bunch of weak-ass 8-2 ACC, B12 and Pac12 teams ranked.... and you're going to claim PSU plays a weak schedule??? LMFAO, nice try ASWPer.
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For those who keep saying we need to beat UM and OSU for the playoff, we may not have to in a few years. Aren’t they working to expand to 12 by 2024. Also Big Ten alignment has worked against us and likely set to change when expansion occurs. Doesn’t mean I don’t think we need to compete with OSU and UM but we may get some chances at other schools in games that will mean something in the CFP soon. Then everyone can shift to what a horrible CFP record Franklin has…or hopefully not.
lol ok...a 10 win "regular" season ceiling isn't getting PSU into the playoffs (possibly until expanded playoffs). So, regardless, it's not good enough for many at the current CFP structure.
