Lets Talk Big 10 Expansion
- Thread starter PSU4U
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Nobody is arguing who comes in first off the list. I said GT is #2 on the presidents list and they are. Will they be the first on the list to be available? I don't know but they are not going off the president's wish list unless they just refuse to come onboard.
UNC is first, if not ND, Ga Tech would be a great fit, then UVa, and UM and Duke. All AAU schools. Conference goes to 24 and is locked and loaded. No better, football, BB, LAX, 3 schools have wrestling programs. Women’s programs are strong and all with good academics. Major markets galore.
I don't think Duke gets an SEC or B1G bid. Amd Pitt may be on the B1G list but they are way down and won't come anywhere close to a bid. Just my opinion.
It’s really tough to predict Duke. It is a relatively small school compared to the typical size of a Big 10 school and the football program is below average. Obviously, it checks off every box and more in terms of academics and the bball program is historically great. Personally I would love see them in the conference, but the dollars and cents may not be there for the TV executives. Another thing to consider is that Duke may be either conference’s only ticket into the state of North Carolina.
How would Duke be the conference's only ticket into North Carolina? Both NC and NCSU would jump at an invite by either the SEC or B10.
I don't think UNC and Duke get separated. I believe a package deal (the hoops rivalry is just too epic and steeped in tradition to throw away). And the fit is much better with the B10.
Duke in the SEC seems out of place. The presidents love it but Fox executives will struggle with letting Duke in due to poor ratings. I bet it happens though. This will happen before Ga Tech goes to the B10.
Clemson is SEC bound. FSU will be a death battle between both conferences but I think they will also go SEC. Tallahassee really is right in the SEC heartland.
B10 needs to nab the best of what's left in the west. Stanford and Utah are the top two. That puts the west contingent at 6 which is a good divisible number to 24. Not sure about separating Stanford and Cal but it is possible.
That adds to 22 then it is anybody's guess. I think the B10 goes south/mid atlantic and not north east so no on Syracuse, BC and Pitt. That leaves Miami, UVa, Va Tech, NC State, Ga Tech and Wake. Take your pick. Could be Miami for Florida inroads then UVA for academics/research credibility. Maybe they leave out Miami and go Ga Tech and UVA.
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Duke and UNC combo higher than Ga Tech. Then you go west. Stanford and Utah before Ga Tech.
Utah is in the Big 12 for the foreseeable future as the media deal expires in 2031 unless they are willing to pay the exit fee. I think Stanford and Cal are the only options in the next few years if the ACC collapses.
Good point but maybe they pay up for a better deal longer term. If not Utah then I guess it is Cal.
All of this could be a ways off until the ACC teams become available and ND is potentially available which in 2029 at the earliest (ND).
That might be a fan choice but those casting the votes won't see it that way. Duke and UNC will more than likely be off to the SEC but FOX will put up a fight for UNC I've heard of no interest in Duke by the Big 10. For me if we're getting ND then yes Stanford I think Utah is way down the list but for football I think they would be a good add and the new west coast teams would love that especially USC. USC does a lot of business with Utah in research and other things.
It really depends on how it all shakes out in the ACC for the BIG's top choices. 24 is the number but from a football perspective they have to get there with quality teams. sPitt is way down the list but on the list and could get in if other things go badly.
Amazingly the list has not changed since Delaney was Comish. This stuff has been on the planning table since he was here and in-fact he initiated it. No matter how it all shakes out they are not going to back away from their plans to get to 24, but they might not get there with all their top choices. At this point no one really knows how this will all shake out.
For the Big 10 ND is a big wild card in all of this realignment stuff. Recently ND went to the Big 10 and asked them not to offer a rash of teams saying they (ND) wanted to sort through somethings first.
Personally, I'm sick of the Big 10 kissing ND's ass but I get why the Big would wait and not do anything to rock the boat if ND was seriously considering joining the Big 10 anytime soon. But I don't think they are and I still think they are working hard behind the scenes trying to hold the ACC together. Never trust ND they've pulled this kind of crap before.
AAU is not quite as important to get in as it once was, but a university would have to working on that and be close to getting in and within a reasonable span of time. Some think it's not important at all, but it is to those who cast the votes. Things that are still important are relationships academic fit culture research and financial health of the university and the athletic department. Some want it to be all about football but it's not. No matter who they offer all will all have to meet some stringent requirements and the Big 10 will do their due diligence on those issues. I'll give you an example Oklahoma was a great football team with a hug history and brand, yet they never got an invite from the Big 10. The Big 10 never sent them any third-party feelers, the Big 10 just wasn't interested. By the way today no one except ND technically gets an written offer unless they already know that team is coming.
Utah looks like a B1G school, but for whatever reason they were not invited last year. I don’t recall reading that the B1G had any interest whatsoever. You and I certainly have them on a fan’s wishlist, but they may not be on a actual longterm list at all for the conference. I personally don’t think it’s good business to have only four schools out there in the conference. It’s not viable long-term. I think they need at least one or two more West Coast schools.
You have a ton of company with your feelings towards those arrogant a-holes. I think ND sees the writing on the wall as major CF will be about the expanded B1G and SEC going forward after those conferences complete their expansions. The possibility of both of the conferences locking ND out of their future schedules is realistic.
Being a Northwestern grad and Chicago native, I absolutely hate the publicity those a-holes get in this area. They think everyone else should bow down to them. Eff-them
Won't happen. I could be wrong, but I think it's all about TV-markets and big money and a good chunk of the Pittsburgh market are already watching teams like PSU (a lot) and maybe OSU a little - especially PSU. If you look at the conference's expansion strategy, it's all about getting into new markets and bringing in new eyeballs.
That's why the people the laugh at Rutgers being admitted into the conference need to look deeper. Yes, Rutgers will probably never be a major CF player, but the strategy was to start bringing in some eyeballs - in a pro sports NYC-NJ area - when teams like PSU, OSU and Michigan play them. In fact, I read that one of the Urban Meyer-OSU teams set an estimated all-time NYC CF eyeball record when OSU played at Rutgers a few years back. The B1G is not run by dummies
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Doesn't this kind of make the Nebraska add look like a misfire since they were booted from the AAU and had just an average to OK football program since 2010? Unless they simply bring massive TV numbers and the B1G doesn't care about their record. Kind of like what PSU does.
Here’s a name you all are forgetting: Kansas. They make sense for a few reasons:
- They bring a “brand” (albeit in basketball) and are investing heavily in football
- AAU institution with good academics
- Carries the Kansas City market and plants a B1G flag near SEC territory (Mizzou)
- Helps bridge the gap between the midwest and west coast and provides Nebraska an old Big 8/12 rival
Any discussions about a big 12 school jumping ship in the next several years is pure fantasy considering their media deal. Some of your logic does make a lot of sense, but Kansas would have to pay an enormous penalty to get out of the big 12.
And a research school as well. As much as people want to totally write them off, I laugh. They aren't 3rd party talking to the Big 10 and the SEC because they are content at this time. As for Kansas and the Big 10 it will boil down to how the ACC defections shake out. But Kansas CO Utah AZ ASU Stanford are all considerations. Also don't forget that the Big 10 might still like to get a foothold in the state of TX. Lots of possibilities out there at this time. If the Big 10 gets shutout of the ACC teams they desire those teams mentioned along with sPitt would come into play. I hope that doesn't happen.
If the Big and the SEC go above 24 teams or something like 30-32 teams the Big 12 will be in trouble and they will get raided and not just for a couple of choice teams. But they better get to 20 first and then 24 at some point.
You're seeing how that is playing out now in the ACC these contracts are basically the same. When FSU and Clemson win or negotiate their way out it will be Katy Bar the Door on those contracts because it's going to become a jail break. Those payoffs if that's the route it goes will be nothing like what's in the contract or what's been suggested. Teams like Kansas are conservative and wealthy schools. Unlike ND and other their Alums actually donate big money too. They are making huge improvements because they want to make themselves more attractive so they can make the move sooner rather than later. The new projects don't actually have to be completed but merely in the works with the financial commitment. Kansas has actually done that. I think the SEC wants them and as soon as the ACC shakes out Kansas will get their SEC offer.
There are teams and markets that are greatly undervalued GT and Kansas are two of those teams. Kansas actually has all the things which the Big 10 presidents look for. That is 75% of the battle for a team to make it in. I'm not saying that either will get in but no one can write them off as this expansion thing continues to playout.
As for Nebraska they are not getting booted. They do have some issues that they have admitted too and they are concerned about those issues.
There is a fairly sized and vocal group who are calling for Nebraska to move back to the Big 12. Will they? Can they financially? Finances have never been a problem for Nebraska. I would be more worried (but I'm not) about Nebraska bolting than any other consideration.
Any Big XII team would pay the penalty for the long-term gain.
If you're not in the Big Ten or SEC you're a program that is in deep danger of dying.
That said, I don't see the Big Ten going after any Big XII teams at this time
Never trust ND they have left the Big 10 waiting at the alter on at least 3 separate occasions and maybe 4 times.
Recently ND contacted the Big 10 and asked them to hold off on inviting/considering a rash of ACC teams stating that they needed some time to work through somethings.
Now I can't prove what I'm about to say but I think those clandestine Effers are simply working behind the scenes to help hold the ACC together and Butt Pound the Big 10 once again. NEVER TRUST ND !!!!!
as history is the best predictor of the future. I hope those assholes never make it to the Big 10 and die a slow financial death on their independence sword. If I had my way no Big 10 would ever play ND going forward.
This is a bit older but read some sports writers saying the B1G said they’d like to have a presence in Texas by 2026.
OK I have not heard of any dates, so I doubt there is a target date at this point. But just for the sake of discussion I would go with TCU and A&M.
It is interesting for sure like the other realignment news out there, but I just don’t see it with Texas A&M. It was reported they are upset that the SEC invited Texas despite verbal assurances in the past, but I can’t see them being that foolish to pay a huge exit fee to break the current contract to make roughly the same revenue in the B1G and make every road trip excruciating for their student athletes. At least with USC and UCLA there was the promise of a lot more revenue in their new Conference.
People need to stop thinking about "markets". Markets were important when Rutgers and Maryland were added because it pumped up B10 network subscribers including peolle who had no interest in those schools. That model is no longer in play due to streaming. The new model is all about actual viewers of games.
AAU is very important to the president's too.
The top schools in play by 2023 viewers are: Colorado, FSU, ND, OreSt, Clemson, Utah, Louisville, Miami, Duke, Kansas. Stanford is way down the list at 64th behind bc, pitt, Syracuse, army etc.
Ohio State — 5.55M
Alabama — 5.08M
Michigan — 4.78M
Colorado — 4.50M
Georgia — 3.95M
Texas — 3.61M
Florida State — 3.58M
Notre Dame — 3.46M
Penn State — 3.31M
LSU — 2.85M
Southern Cal — 2.83M
Washington — 2.68M
Tennessee — 2.67M
Oklahoma — 2.40M
Nebraska — 2.39M
Florida — 2.12M
Auburn — 2.074M
Oregon — 2.067M
Texas A&M — 2.062M
Oregon State — 1.74M
Mississippi — 1.71M
Clemson — 1.70M
Missouri — 1.63M
Iowa — 1.60M
Utah — 1.53M
Michigan State — 1.48M
Wisconsin — 1.45M
TCU — 1.42M
Maryland — 1.41M
Minnesota — 1.37M
Louisville — 1.36M
Miami FL — 1.33M
Duke — 1.32M
UCLA — 1.25M
Kansas — 1.24M
BYU — 1.21M
Indiana — 1.18M
Iowa State — 1.15M
Oklahoma State — 1.14M
Arkansas — 1.13M
West Virginia — 1.095M
Navy — 1.090M
Washington State — 1.08M
Kentucky — 1.04M
Rutgers — 977K
North Carolina — 966K
Texas Tech — 950K
South Carolina — 900K
Illinois — 862K
Mississippi State — 839K
Colorado State — 814K
Kansas State — 810K
Georgia Tech — 766K
Syracuse — 703K
Purdue — 694K
Pittsburgh — 690K
Army — 683K
Virginia — 663K
NC State — 661K
UCF — 621K
Boston College — 617K
Arizona State — 603K
Houston — 587K
Stanford — 549K
AAU is very important to the president's too.
The top schools in play by 2023 viewers are: Colorado, FSU, ND, OreSt, Clemson, Utah, Louisville, Miami, Duke, Kansas. Stanford is way down the list at 64th behind bc, pitt, Syracuse, army etc.
Ohio State — 5.55M
Alabama — 5.08M
Michigan — 4.78M
Colorado — 4.50M
Georgia — 3.95M
Texas — 3.61M
Florida State — 3.58M
Notre Dame — 3.46M
Penn State — 3.31M
LSU — 2.85M
Southern Cal — 2.83M
Washington — 2.68M
Tennessee — 2.67M
Oklahoma — 2.40M
Nebraska — 2.39M
Florida — 2.12M
Auburn — 2.074M
Oregon — 2.067M
Texas A&M — 2.062M
Oregon State — 1.74M
Mississippi — 1.71M
Clemson — 1.70M
Missouri — 1.63M
Iowa — 1.60M
Utah — 1.53M
Michigan State — 1.48M
Wisconsin — 1.45M
TCU — 1.42M
Maryland — 1.41M
Minnesota — 1.37M
Louisville — 1.36M
Miami FL — 1.33M
Duke — 1.32M
UCLA — 1.25M
Kansas — 1.24M
BYU — 1.21M
Indiana — 1.18M
Iowa State — 1.15M
Oklahoma State — 1.14M
Arkansas — 1.13M
West Virginia — 1.095M
Navy — 1.090M
Washington State — 1.08M
Kentucky — 1.04M
Rutgers — 977K
North Carolina — 966K
Texas Tech — 950K
South Carolina — 900K
Illinois — 862K
Mississippi State — 839K
Colorado State — 814K
Kansas State — 810K
Georgia Tech — 766K
Syracuse — 703K
Purdue — 694K
Pittsburgh — 690K
Army — 683K
Virginia — 663K
NC State — 661K
UCF — 621K
Boston College — 617K
Arizona State — 603K
Houston — 587K
Stanford — 549K
I think Coorado was a novelty last year with Coach Sanders. I expect that number falls way off in 2024.
